I didn't knew you before this event, no offense. Neither does anyone of my friends barely know you, which play MvM regulary.

I do not. A shout out who wants to participate would have been enough. Those who would have responded could have been easily checked by all kinds of criteria which can be found on his steam profile and maybe even ingame. And i made the "dislike" against you because you are mentioned in the announcement as the teacher. Some informations and opinions that got shared in the stream weren't good. Even if it should teach a newbie.

Yes, the bare bones of MvM. And the bare bone shouldnt be based around the Meta. The "Meta" can be later used after your managed the basic loadouts and upgrade paths of a class. There are many teams that struggle even with the meta setup, because they do not comprehend the upgrades and roles they have.
Since you had a hour limit, you can cut it down to 6 Classes, those classes that gets commonly played in MvM. The others are simply no newbie material. Mentioning that they can be played is mandatory, but you should just stop at that. Giving small details what they can do is enough. Telling what to upgrade and for what roles may be overdone already.
I had to endure some sapper spies and aimless snipers after the stream strangely.

I didnt mentioned expert, i looked more at Steel Trap and Mecha Engine.
The setup in Expert is simply the lack of money, and soldier is one of those classes that rely quite a bit on money. Heavys simply are the most efficient class without upgrades. But still a soldier is fine as he is, even in expert. But thats not the topic.

Thats not all of my point. Mentioning a Spy can replace a Demoman, and upgrading his sapper was my worst fear.

Because i care about the gamemode and i highly enjoy it. Getting community events regarding MvM is great. But since it will teach newcomers, it will eventually come back to us, and we have to cope with it.

I am disappointed that people lash out if theres some heavier critic, and generally only accept positive feedback.
If it comes over as overly aggressive and personal insult, i am sorry.
The stream of MvM was the right way to go, the execution could have been better. Thats what i want to improve.

I talked with one of the teachers, and he made some suggestions to me. I will probably follow them, and help improve it.

I wont delete/rewrite my post, because the stream also explained advanced and experienced playstyles.
Also, you look to much into my post.
- I only explained that Airblast isnt working against giants, (which they said in the stream it would)
- I did not said he should buy weapon upgrades before resistance. The stream disregarded his damage capability. After upgrading the most important resistances and mobility upgrades, you can easily put something in the gun to deal damage. Many missions offer a good amount of money. That automatically indicates torwards late game, were money becomes less and less important.
- Maybe i did overboard with the splash damage, but still. Rocket specialist should be mainly used to have that base damage on every range bonus. That is already the most important part about it. Slowing Giants and stunning robots is a nice side effect.
- I did not say Heavy is shit. I said he just deals 75% less damage on a tank. Thats all about it. He can still dish out quite some damage, but can probably not keep up with other classes. In some cases, its even smart to have a Heavy following the tank. Hamlet Hostility and Bavarian Botbash can be a good example.

The Timezones are sometimes counterproductive, and i am not everywhere in the vast community TF2 has to offer.
Furthermore, after i got just bashed, i didnt regret doing it.

I can skim through if you want. Should i comment here, or do we do it over steam in a chat? So it we can discuss it a little better without spamming here to much.

Um.. we do not hinder anyone in completing tours.
- Either, we are 6 people pre made and join a Mann Up/Boot Camp, so there is no random that can be bothered
- We have actually some servers that run MvM Vanilla, and MvM fixed. (http://sigpipe.info is a player that hosts a mvm server with tweaks and fixes)

Testing will be done in enclosed servers.

Before Two Cities, the basic class setup was: Scout, Pyro, Soldier, Engineer, Heavy and Demoman. The community back then was quite loose back then if it comes to variety, because it worked all the same, and it was for fun.

After Two Cities got released, and with it the Australium hype and grinding quirk started, the more famous and comp players started with MvM. Since they weren't that experienced in the gamemode, and didnt played much before it, the Meta was invented. It replaced the Pyro.
The Medic became a massive failsafe for the whole team. Bad game play and upgrade paths began sprouting, individuality and adaptivity vanished nearly completely. Some teams are hopeless without a Medic.
But even with all that above, many teams would be better off with something that isn't the Meta. People get forced into classes and roles they are not familiar with. It creates a boring gameplay.

MvM is about roles, not classes.
Money collection (Mostly Spy and Scout)
Area control (Sniper, Demoman, Soldier, partway Pyro and Engineer)
Medic killing (Sniper, Demoman)
Ammo Supply (Engineer)
Single target (Heavy, Spy, Engineer, Pyro)
Optional Tank Duty (Soldier, Engineer, Pyro)

If you have the roles set, its a easy win.

God forbid having me a editing Error because english isn't my native language. Fixed it in the quote.
Why would you assume i would be jealous? I once again said i don't care being a teacher.

Never assumed nor implied he is following the Meta. He simply used the meta as base of his stream.
Bad advice in bad/inferior playstyles, that can hinder a team easily if wrongly used.

Is there any reason to be a complete jerk? If i come over as one, sorry, i didn't mean it. Am i not allowed to complain anymore? I have to bend to everyone others superiors will and be silent?

Neither did i mentioned that there is a right way to play MvM. I want a right way to teach players. Orientating on the Meta isn't the right way. People shouldn't be teached to a specific playstyle. Once again as explained above, Meta isnt the easiest way. And MvM is more about grinding tours and getting loot. Its about fun, but as it looks like, some have a different fun than me, i have to excuse myself.

And you ESPECIALLY strike me as a Two Citie players that doesn't know anything else than Two Cities. A Player, that would kick a Spy Sniper or Pyro on sight, and bitching about anything that differs to the Meta loadout.
Once F*CKING again, i do want them to be teached right.
I also do not force any kind of player on my playstyle. They can do whatever they wan't they simply require to carry theyre own weight in a game.
You also do not need to throw insults. I didn't do it either, and id hoped i would find mature people to discuss with, which you just completely ruined.

Some i will list out of my brain. Wont watch the stream again.

- Airblast is currently glitched. You cannot airblast Giants anymore. Even with full airblast force, you lift them barely up in the air, to a point where its simply not noticable.
- Beggars Bazooka should be used as tap firing. Its the most efficient way to play the weapon.
Loading up barrages and firing them is VERY money intensive and brings actually a lower sustained damage.
This may sound opinionated, but its a fact.
- Spy is a most powerful class in the game. Using him to sap robots and backstabbing small medics is a waste of class spot. Use a Sniper or Demoman for it. Much more effective and hell of a lot more reliable than a spy.
He can destroy Giants in seconds and take out high priority and tanky robots. (Gauntlet heavys, big huntsman sniper)
- Scout can use his gun excellent, and can be upgraded too. You can contribute much to the team if you actually shoot and deal damage as scout.
- Rocket specialist lets you deal Base damage, and that only to the target you directly hit. He said maximum damage, which isnt. You still have a 25% ramp up. Didnt even knew about that the splash damage is still suffering from fall off.
- Tanks Minigun damage is barely and bad explained. Easiest way is to say: "He deals 75% less damage on a tank with his Minigun"

Why would you assume i want to be a teacher? I never suggested one, i never suggest one of my "buddies". All i want is that there isn't false information, which unfortunately happened a lot.

And i want to really know where i contradict myself. Quote me on that.

I wondered myself why noone else did a complain. Now i know why.

I do play with 5 friends regulary, also i pub. You are just seeing it one sided, but think about all the other angles.

For people always going with friends, this may not matter, but going with 5 randoms its just going to be annoying. Having a game with people insulting and complaining because something doesn't matches the norm or the Master of classes stream said is infuriating.

The so called norm "Meta" isn't even the easiest and quickest way to play. The Meta exists because the medic was buffed. There was no thought about class setup and utilities. Just because medic buff.
I did watch the stream because i want to know what will happen if something like MvM gets a bit promoted by the community, which i probably regret the next year over.

I do play MvM a lot too, more than PvP, currently in progress making a MvM map, tracking down bugs with the small community i am part of that plague the Gamemode. That community also creates custom content for MvM.

I do not care a single bit if you "follow the meta". The argumentation "3 bison soldiers and no medic" isnt really impressing me. Having whole different setups in the game is routine for me.

If you want to make a promotion of MvM in such ways, simply do it right.

Go with the basics of MvM, and simply forgot and don't orientate on the Meta.

Since the MvM part is over, and i had time looking at it, i do have to make a small complaint.

The MvM section was more opinionated than informative. It mostly encourages inferior play styles and actually some false informations.

First, it was cool that some higher community does something for MvM. Some informations were nice and well explained, but it gets outweighed by bad information and opinions.

Picking a famous Streamer/Youtuber/Player/Trader wasn't the smartest idea. He may be known and praised and what else, but the quality of his MvM Master of Classes was just sufficient enough to please only the clueless players. You shouldn't pick someone because he is famous and sometimes plays MvM.

The argument "He has tours!" doesn't work. Tours are simply not a reflection of skill. Two Cities is just a grind. Expert with a premade team as well. And you can reset your tours with 2 clicks too.
The argument "Fastest MvM missions in the world" isn't pulling it either. If there is nobody else doing it, whats the point? I can too say: "I won 3 races in a row" but being the only driver on the racetrack.

It was just a blow into my gut after i saw the stream. I cringed many times, and i am not the only one.

Are there actually going to be more of the MvM Master of Classes? Or was it a "one time" thing.
Because if theres another, please search for people that have more knowledge about the game mode itself.
The MvM Subforum in the official discussion area actually has a good amount of people that are experienced in the game.