If you got bummed about buying the best and then it being 2nd tier, don't buy technology lol

So my recommendations for changes to this map are to start with re-designing the routes from 2nd to mid, and re-considering the region below and above 2nd point. The mid point itself seems pretty interesting and worth a shot still, last seems serviceable if a bit wide at the moment.

2nd itself is a bit weird, it takes time to rotate up or down and those regions are just closed off enough that it's hard to engage someone in those areas.

The biggest issue is the transitions to mid. The main choke is pretty wide and boring really, it's a very simple level design choice that probably works well enough. The other two, not so much. The cave is really tight, puts you very far into mid, and is not a terribly interesting place to fight - other than the slope to mid, it's relatively flat. The lower exit that ends in the shutter is very wide and a big slope with not much variation - again, not a terribly interesting place to fight and anyone that would presently use it would either be going for some kind of surprise play on 2nd or sneak their way to mid rather than taking tons of spam at the main choke.

tl;dr I do think the mid and lobby are pretty cool, I wouldn't say it's time to scrap the whole map yet. I would work on the flanks/alternate routes.

Looks pretty good; my only immediate thought is that the one way door for red is maybe not the best solution. Now there is no flank at all between A and B - whether or not teams can crack defense at B (which looks much more defendable) might get interesting. It could work, but I'm not 100% sure on it. Plus, there's a bit after B where blue could get wrapped or more easily spawncamped by red team utilizing the door.

Perhaps you could place a flank route on the other side or re-route the current one that's been blocked by making it not dump out staring straight at last; or make it less direct or more choke-y to hinder blue players from just +forwarding into last.

Ok. So here are some of my thoughts now that I've booted it up and run around:

http://imgur.com/a/mD4kd

Additionally not covered in that album is the fact that there are tons of weird floor height mismatches, particularly below point. Stuff that misses by like, 16 units or whatever. Random steps. For competitive, that's annoying as they'll tend to make the areas difficult to splash.

As for the point structure and the areas leading to the point, it could be interesting. There's probably a large potential to fall off/get blown off to low ground and then get dicked on by someone so medics might not dig it but it would be fun to try this out.

Love to see all the data and how things came out, thanks so much for doing this. Bagel and Logjam for next ESEA season? :P

I do wonder how much the ranking for daytrip and tfcl is biased by people disliking the gamemode and not giving the map enough of a chance.

I believe it corresponds to turning something like 135° to the right for a jump; so the rockets are "biased" 45° one way. This means a lefty jump would take 225° for the same effect. I'm sure I've got the numbers wrong, but that should illustrate the point - you have to move much more to get a good lefty jump than righty unless you use the original.

Viaduct is the same way, so it might not be the biggest deal to use mirrored vs. rotational but it's really just annoying as hell for soldiers as if they want to jump off any walls one team has an advantage. If you want to "map for comp" these are things that are more important than mapping for pubs, but not necessarily a requirement.

tl;dr you're likely going to piss off roamer mains.

I'll check it out when I get home but just know that mirrored symmetry is annoying for comp vs. rotational symmetry because it changes the rocket jumps from righty to lefty and not everyone uses the original.

Shot you a request - I'm likely low open as I'm trying to get back into things, would love to MGE.

Thanks so much Saam, Snivy, and anyone else who worked on this! Great to see the community support new maps. To those who played, I'm certain that all of us mappers would like to hear your feedback! Shoot us some love (or hate) in our threads which are listed in the OP :D.

I didn't end up on a team, will sub soldier/demo if anyone needs. Or give Logjam coaching (lol)

Process
Badlands
Snakewater
Viaduct
Gullywash
Metalworks
Sunshine
Granary

I just realized that the times are set so I can play after work!

LFT Demo/soldier.

Plus if you pick me up I can give you all the sweet logjam strats.

I think this is honestly a really good option overall. I'd say start with cp_logjam but I'm biased as all hell. :P.

Rationally I think whichever map gets the best response from the cup but still needs some tweaks should get put in for further testing.

Phi's betas look better than my RC's! Jesus! Haha. Looks good, hope it plays good too. Loving all the community mapping going on these days.

cp_logjam_rc4
(Apparently the presence of invite players helps mapping productivity)

Download: https://tf2maps.net/downloads/cp_logjam.3835/

Changes:

Imgur album: http://imgur.com/a/7lgMH

Screens: