https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1051933925955612682/1195816518638911599/image.png?ex=65b55deb&is=65a2e8eb&hm=068b29b145433bd62aa8176f0a1fa0e061bd00d9c35520ef446e64f2d65d90be&;

Well fuck

Edit: Its working again 0_0

as of now 1/11, item servers are back up.

In addition, the pug site is currently working again with servers available at this time (servers weren't available earlier, assuming for maintenance).

Ty dolphin :D

bump.

Just saw this edit for the second quote if you guys didn't scroll up. Really excited to know that RGL PUGs will be receiving weekly updates! Hopefully, we'll get some people adding today... I got scrims though lol.

Assuming same time 10 pm est today? or tomorrow if things haven't been iron out yet.

Review for BETA RGL PUGs

Today's 'release', despite being considered a "shit-show" were still better then the previous attempts a month prior.

With emphasis on servers actually working, without issues regarding the incorrect map, bad password, or raid attempts.

Now, coming into the issues, there's a lot to unfold:

1. The server hosting the PUGs -- or NFO servers as dolphin mentions -- had major instability issues. Specifically, its constant lag spikes that would hit the entire servers, which would happen every min, more or less.

2. The Captain System. Its honestly needs an entire rework or a revamp, as it seems any player can captain -- leading to troll picks or unbalance teams.

2.1. The fix is simple -- the system should select the two highest elo players who toggled for captain.

3. The Site. In terms of design, I honestly really liked it. The UI and animations look really sleek now compared to its alpha. In terms of functionality, it was mixed baggage. Obviously, with today being the beta test release, the website was working hard to keep itself up with the amount of players trying to sign in. This lead to trying to add up the pugs being really buggy, to the point some couldn't queue or some couldn't pick players. In addition to that, the "sort" function not working as intended when trying to sort by elo.

Despite what major issues happen today, its definitely a step forward for its 2024 road-plan its full-release. Its always a matter of finding and fixing flaws or fine-tuning a part.

Any-case, hoping to see to fixes! see yall on the 10th!

Thought hard about some songs when in regards to 'contemplating life'. I feel what I like interchanges from time to time.

Any-case, made a list of some songs I often come back too -- hope you like them :)

SONGS WITHOUT VOCALS:

Woodnot - Shopan

Shook - You Were Bigger Than Life

oDDling & Eagle Eyed Tiger - Interference

SONGS WITH VOCALS:

Wings of Desire - Choose A Life

Nevermind · Foster The People

bump

Really excited to see RGL Pugs finally coming into beta! Especially the ability to spectate the current pugs -- would relevate the boredom when waiting for that pug to end or waiting for another one to start.

In addition to that, be able to fix servers issues that where previously discussed from the last attempt the community did a month prior.

Hoping to see if any major changes have been made to its "open" system and how it balance teams with the new elo recalculations.

Why is coalplant on this list -- this shit hasn't been on the 6s map rotation for almost a decade.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/314630582925524992/1185382937248661554/image.png?ex=658f68e3&is=657cf3e3&hm=2482fcf2f4794fcf9ee39a84f3bee15b080ada7497f092d327932a6164a92827&;

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/314630582925524992/1185382725214031974/WeirdDude.png?ex=658f68b1&is=657cf3b1&hm=7517cce56b5c7af46742b3864692d1d858545ed5e1d36084885d4e4ea255ba1d&;

The last time I've seen coalplant played was on tagg's channel:

https://youtu.be/LRDn3NPE0Jg

https://clips.twitch.tv/TastyFantasticJuiceFUNgineer-b-TE7eypYopZsqiG

Juustin
United States
https://www.twitch.tv/fancybuttler
RGL

Stream pugs and pugs (both 6s & HL)

I mean you can if you're talking about RGL PUGs, there is a queue called "6S CAPTAIN" -- below it a "captain" opt in option so it isn't RNG:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/314630582925524992/1174968931216281640/image.png?ex=65698617&is=65571117&hm=96a0f2db54128af0611af0bf3672010b86f48923d94472dc24a8c9dee601db76&;

But what we wanted to test yesterday was its "6s Open" System. I honestly think RGL can improve it, allowing for balanced automated pugs that are ready to play in that instance.

Recent review for "6s open" on the site "Pugs.tf.plus" or RGL Alpha Pugs. Don't see a "feedback" channel on the discord, plus the message is too long if I put it in the discussions, so I'm just dropping it here because several issues occurred.

1. First pug: https://logs.tf/3531187#76561198121922413

1.1. issues:

• When the pug started, the server wouldn't load, and giving us the message "bad password." We had to approx wait 10-15 minutes before an admin could get the server to restart. This set in low expectation, as when playing HL pugs, the servers would load immediately. Was it different when attempting to starts a 6s pug?

1.2. Pug Experience:

• Despite the intial servers issues, the pug went "smoothly" and no other server issues occuring. The pug ended on a 5-1 -- I guess in-relation to issues, EU players can add up to NA pug? as i saw two players with 130-150+ ping? Suprisingly, they joined VC and gave coms, so I didn't think too much of it in end -- started the pug anyways.

2. "Second Pug" : https://logs.tf/3531376#76561198121922413

2.1. issues:

• When picking maps, most if not everyone picked koth_bagel to start of this pug. But apparently when joining the server, it was stuck on pl_upward_f10. Again, we waited 10+ minutes for an admin before everyone just decided to just start pug anyways. It lasted 4 minutes until the server restarted.

2.2. Pug Experience:

• Mudane in the waiting experience. Those 4 minutes where unironically fun though....

3. Third Pug: https://logs.tf/3531379#76561198121922413

3.1. issues:

• When enough players added, the "picking system" started and it seemed, IMO, create a really unbalanced pug. I feel whatever "balancing system" -- if it does have one -- doesn't work at all. Also, some players apparently don't have elo, such as the player "happycool" before the pug started, despite being an invite player: https://rgl.gg/Public/PlayerProfile?p=76561198048694198
  

  https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/334443589402755082/1174822327750496406/RGLNOELO.png?ex=6568fd8e&is=6556888e&hm=daae30c4fa44d3de091a69dc199e03fdc07391afed344892804947c84febdc6a&;

  
  *example of happycool & others without elo*
  
  
• Begining the pug, it started as normal with players starting to join their teams UNTIL the server was raided. Despite having low expectation, I thought it would at least have some security similar to faceit to stop unauthorized players joining. But nope, it was too the point that players accepted it and just run with the pug to not get banned.

3.2. Pug Experience:

• it was 7v7... wow, I love prolander! Unironically, not the 6s experience I was looking for.

fellow pugmas, would you kindly add up to RGL PUGs? https://pugs.tf.plus/pug

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/334443589402755082/1174485368645615767/Would_You_Kindly.webp?ex=6567c3bc&is=65554ebc&hm=f4f8eccd055a27bf3f7b85822f0d43389f875caaec828d828ee8e9e920fbdf8b&;

Any current issues I have with RGL Pugs is that sometimes servers *appear* and *disappear* randomly. As example:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/334443589402755082/1174090101526122637/image.png?ex=6566539d&is=6553de9d&hm=bfc296a96587a256f5cbd4aebc332a8601572edad7caf8ebce10f3de849d8fc4&;

As of now currently, when joining the website, I don't seem this message above. So, my assumption is servers seem to be available now? -- though, typically from what I've seen is that its 1-2 servers max? which are typically held hostage by two HL queues lol.

I guess one of my current feedback to them is clarify how many servers they have available for X amount of PUGs?

Any-case, I'M willing to attempt to try RGL PUGs again today before and after scrims. Maybe earliest at 6-8 pm est?

I think a side note is how its kind of disappointing that top invite streamers haven't been incentivized to promote and play RGL pugs. You think when the alpha came out, people would be swarming... but no... I think it was again, because the server availability issue?

It might be more of an issue on RGL part in terms of self-promotion. You would think someone working on RGL PUGs, needing feedback, would create and push a TFTV thread: "RGL PUGs ALPHA -- NEED TESTERS AND FEEDBACK 11/X"
but nothing of the sort. Or even on its main-page for that matter. Pressing the "Pick-Up Games" I thought it would go to the alpha website, but it was just this:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/334443589402755082/1174431524897181746/image.png?ex=65679197&is=65551c97&hm=0948405cb7fdd117fa345eb0941bc7c35ed0fd7d207baff234cba28d63a977b1&;

I LOVE PROLANDER!!! :D

I decided to make this thread to see the communities ideas on what their ideal pug system would look like.

The other reason is that I've heard many frustrated players -- specifically here in NA -- that their hasn't been an ideal hub for 6s PUGs -- for both low, mid, and/or high division players alike.

While popular in-house pugs have been on the rise, such as PugHub -- which is open up for players between AM-INV -- I don't believe its what players are 'essentially' looking for.

I believe what players want is "automation". Essentially, players want to be able to add up with the convince of a button -- something similar to faceit.

To begin, this pug site/system would have (in no particular order):

1. The convenience of choosing your class -- something similar to RGL PUGs.
   
   
2. A vote for where the server is located; players shouldn't be inhibited to a certain location and be able to balance ping. (West Coast bias)
   
   
3. If servers are limited, players should be able to host a PUG on their own server, something similar to TF2center -- unless ELO / Rank MM is involved
   
   
4. This pug site/system should have both rank and unranked MM PUGs.
   
   4.1. unranked will perhaps work as a faceit/in-house pug system where two of the 12 will be chosen as medic but will receive a voucher to be able to player their combat class for the next pug.
   
   4.2. Rank should be divided into three or four divisions. HIGH [ INV/ADV(?)] / MID [ADV-IM] / OPEN [IM/AM/NC] / NEWCOMER
   
   
5. The pug picking system should go as the following: 1 (A) --> 1 (B) --> 1 (A) --> 1 (B) --> 1 (A) --> 2 (B) --> 2 (A) --> 1 (B)
   
   
6. Balancing system (unranked only?)
   
   
7. Report/behavior System
   
   7.1. Players can report players for misbehavior/misconduct. For the opposite, players can 'appraise' another player, highly regarded by their skill or communication.
   
   7.1.2. Players appraised would get specifically recommendations to captains choosing players -- both unranked and ranked
   
8. Global chat (?)
   
   8.1. [ Mixed feelings as its requires someone to moderate chat ]
   
   
9. Maps are pick/bans until 2 maps are left; all players should be able to vote which map they want to play. If votes are split, flip a coin system.
   
   
10. Mandatory voice-chat, specifically on discord; mumble as an alternative.
    
    10.1. [mixed opinions on mumble as I've seen past streams were the voice-chat gets raided easily]

Wish I can say more, but nothing else at my mind at the moment. Will edit more if I have any.

Apologies again if some seem out of order, vague, or just not further discussed. These, to emphasized, are far from the realm of reality and are instead fantasied expectations on what this theoretical site would have.

IMO, its just not an ideal pug system anymore -- and I feel its because of the following three reason:

1. Team balance is virtually impossible

You'll always find a trend of players adding up to stack the lobby, getting steamrolls. Don't even get me started on the lobbies "balancing" system if you were to even turn it on.
In addition, from time to time, the lobby host will just kick people at random, often trying to get a slot open for a friend.

I also don't think "hours" or "lobbies" stats doesn't really assess someones skills and I feel can be an intimation factor for new players when adding into a pug.

2. The "team environment" when the lobby starts

I have a mixed opinion on this; but general, its not a great experience. Its can be a resulting of many things, people throwing the pug, people not talking, players forcing their med to take random ubers, scouts NOT BUILDING ubers, players feeding for random picks when defending, no coordination in mids. I feel this is more common in lobbies then lets say a random in-house pug.

Sometimes it feels like a numbness DM match. I just want some type of team coordination man. Often more or not, people will just straight up leave a TF2lobby then trying to finish it at the end, killing the morale -- sometimes straight ending the pug.

3. Limitations

This part can be a lot of things, but in general to start of with is how med requires 10 lobbies -- IN COMBAT. I would rather have a newer medic play med then force them onto combat. Its why my friend who played medic could never get into 6s -- for him it seemed like a huge hurdle. You can argue that they can force through it and shit the bed, but that's still 10 lobbies getting ruined -- that or lobby owners just kicks/bans them next pug.

In addition to that, to even create a lobby, you need approx. 50 lobbies? To some, that isn't a lot, but when you're competing for a specific class slot you want to play on, its going to take a hot minute. Even IF YOU DO get to ability to create a lobby, iirc, there's a maximum numbers of NA lobbies that can be created? Like 2-3 max?

The only thing I feel is good about TF2center is the ability to host on your own server, the game mode type, and the maps. Emphasis on the map part because you can choose variety of maps -- even experimental ones -- versus the default of most in-house pugs. I played a granary pug earlier, while we lost, I had some cool moments.

Any-case, most pug players are just looking to play the default, so sometimes its impossible to run alternative maps.

Agree on the drafting part. I think to newer players, it was a foreign concepts. Many players I knew complained about captains -- specifically the newer players -- didn't know know which player to choose, leading to unbalance pugs. Despite that, faceit players at least put the effort/coordination in that pug comparative to a TF2center lobby.

Honestly, I just want a pug site where its just says "Add up" with two options, "combat" or "Med". When a pug starts, combat players can COMMUNICATE which classes they want play, instead of forced classes. That or a flip a coin system lol.