the problem with this is even I agree with allowing everything that doesn't break competitive tf2, but what b4nny and co actually want is to allow everything full stop, as well as remove class limits, and possibly change a huge percentage of the map pool

you are underestimating what that side of things actually wants; we are pretty close to already having a whitelist that allows everything not game-breaking, which I'm fine with, and if people see the results of a poll like this and say "see it proves that we should have 3 medics!!!" then that's just SO far removed from what people actually want

What luc does with maps is definitely valuable but, again, refer to what I said about how we need to first agree that new maps are even necessary (and how often, and which maps to replace, and the system for doing so etc.) before any of the work on WHICH maps to pick becomes relevant

that would be true if you have already established that your league's goal is to introduce x number of new maps and it's a meeting to decide which ones to put in

but if the point is to actually decide what a new league ought to look like in general, you can't invite way more people who lean towards as much new shit as possible (luc b4nny and sigafoo) and not people who balance that out the other direction

what about people like me who would be perfectly fine keeping the same maps for pretty much every season? do our opinions count for nothing?

you could make an argument that froyo is leading to a more boring scene and people being less interested, but all of that has literally NOTHING to do with the death of ESEA tf2, I guarantee you that has much more to do with ESL buying ESEA over years ago and finally realizing that this little vestigial organ was hanging onto their NA division for some reason

why are b4nny and luc, possibly the two most stubborn people in the entire esea 'community', always the only two guys invited to these things

I just hope at least one of the leagues that emerges from this is the "normal" one- no experimental whitelist, no 20 new maps at a time, no overly hands-on admins, just a regular-ass league

if that league exists I guarantee you it wins (barring massive discrepancies in prize pool or whatever)

ah yes, team Oedipus and the Motherfuckers

popo might be a moron but I'm pretty sure he's telling the truth that he's not caspian

unless that s_b guy was also always caspian, cuz I remember him too

do I have time for this? I'd love to do a lil showmatch on sunday if I can wait that long between the vaati team and the bowl team

you said the raiders won last seasons draft too

and that arden key was gonna be a great pass rusher

I have my own opinions about which team is most deserving of the spot but it feels weird having it be entirely my decision

I like the big dick move by the steelers but at the same time it makes me extra bummed about shazier :(

I've seen people put bush above white

but they're always within like 2 picks of each other on peoples' boards, I think it's cuz of their names having a subconscious effect on people

giants always gonna giants

I'm happy we took best available with quinnen williams rather than fit with josh allen, I just think he's too talented to pass up