Adnuraktbh I feel perfectly comfortable in an environment where people can write words on a screen, doesn't really bother me. I feel a lot less comfortable in an environment where people feel justified in running around trying to get eachother banned because they fell out with eachother or somebody called someone a nigger or whatever. Feel free to call somebody a shitbag for acting like a shitbag but calling for league bans should be completely out of the question. It didn't have anything to do with the league or TF2 so why involve them? Dragging personal drama around in public is an ugly thing indeed.
we dont care about how you feel rn
[quote=Adnurak]tbh I feel perfectly comfortable in an environment where people can write words on a screen, doesn't really bother me. I feel a lot less comfortable in an environment where people feel justified in running around trying to get eachother banned because they fell out with eachother or somebody called someone a nigger or whatever. Feel free to call somebody a shitbag for acting like a shitbag but calling for league bans should be completely out of the question. It didn't have anything to do with the league or TF2 so why involve them? Dragging personal drama around in public is an ugly thing indeed.[/quote]
we dont care about how you feel rn
oyeaNickstonNow that Uberchain's been able to call this behaviour out; what can the other players from the community do to support her and others who are suffering from the same issues? It feels kind of bad to just sit here and watch threads like this come and go without no action being taken, like it has happened in the past.
Just have some sympathy and be a normal human being
Offer to help if u can in any way
Not much else u can do
You can call out the bullshit that happens in your day to day interactions:
Someone drop a hard R? Dont ignore it, dont act like its fine. Even if you just say "dude..." it starts to plant the seed that people ARENT cool with racism.
I played on a team where quite a few players dropped hard Rs regularly, I played a tryout for another team in the offseason, dropped one, and all it took was someone saying "dude..." for me to snap out of how desensitized I had become to it from the prior team. I'm pretty sure I haven't used it since then. It's small, but if everyone not OK with Homophobia, Racism etc actually called out any of that, people would start to think twice before doing it again.
[quote=oyea][quote=Nickston]Now that Uberchain's been able to call this behaviour out; what can the other players from the community do to support her and others who are suffering from the same issues? It feels kind of bad to just sit here and watch threads like this come and go without no action being taken, like it has happened in the past.[/quote]
Just have some sympathy and be a normal human being
Offer to help if u can in any way
[b]Not much else u can do[/b][/quote]
You can call out the bullshit that happens in your day to day interactions:
Someone drop a hard R? Dont ignore it, dont act like its fine. Even if you just say "dude..." it starts to plant the seed that people ARENT cool with racism.
I played on a team where quite a few players dropped hard Rs regularly, I played a tryout for another team in the offseason, dropped one, and all it took was someone saying "dude..." for me to snap out of how desensitized I had become to it from the prior team. I'm pretty sure I haven't used it since then. It's small, but if everyone not OK with Homophobia, Racism etc actually called out any of that, people would start to think twice before doing it again.
OmbrackAdnurak
we dont care about how you feel rn
speak for yourself
[quote=Ombrack][quote=Adnurak][/quote]
[b]we[/b] dont care about how you feel rn[/quote]
speak for yourself
Pred is an idiot but can't see why this is an ETF2L issue.
Pred is an idiot but can't see why this is an ETF2L issue.
HildrethPred is an idiot but can't see why this is an ETF2L issue.
I Cannot Play This Videogame If This Person Is Ideologically Opposed To Me Please Remove From The Premises
[quote=Hildreth]Pred is an idiot but can't see why this is an ETF2L issue.[/quote]
I Cannot Play This Videogame If This Person Is Ideologically Opposed To Me Please Remove From The Premises
fooqpOmbrackAdnurak
we dont care about how you feel rn
speak for yourself
You're the only one speaking for yourself.
[quote=fooqp][quote=Ombrack][quote=Adnurak][/quote]
[b]we[/b] dont care about how you feel rn[/quote]
speak for yourself[/quote]
You're the only one speaking for yourself.
why cant we all be friends
why cant we all be friends
So can we agree to stamp this kind of shit out? Since the rational people seem to agree
Call people out on it and don't pick them up for your teams.
So can we agree to stamp this kind of shit out? Since the rational people seem to agree
Call people out on it and don't pick them up for your teams.
HildrethPred is an idiot but can't see why this is an ETF2L issue.
Can’t speak for ETF2L, but esea actually has personal conduct bans, and hands them out.
Around Christmas PTrip from team Rival in ESEA Main was hit with his second conduct ban resulting in a 30day esea ban for using a hard R on stream.
Not suggesting ETF2L has a similar rule or anything, but as far as gaming leagues go, there is precedent for bans related to personal conduct.
[quote=Hildreth]Pred is an idiot but can't see why this is an ETF2L issue.[/quote]
Can’t speak for ETF2L, but esea actually has personal conduct bans, and hands them out.
Around Christmas PTrip from team Rival in ESEA Main was hit with his second conduct ban resulting in a 30day esea ban for using a hard R on stream.
Not suggesting ETF2L has a similar rule or anything, but as far as gaming leagues go, there is precedent for bans related to personal conduct.
Have a nerd essay about this
I do agree tho that league bans are not necessary unless things like this happen in-game, at which point they break league rules.
This is something we should take care of as a community, call shit like this out, cut off people that support it, let them live in their circlejerk that thinks it's funny
EDIT: ondkaja's comment makes a fair point as well, this behavior can very well damage the look of the league so I guess there's a valid reason there
[url=https://twitter.com/surny_/status/1026428391996760064]Have a nerd essay about this[/url]
I do agree tho that league bans are not necessary unless things like this happen in-game, at which point they break league rules.
This is something we should take care of as a community, call shit like this out, cut off people that support it, let them live in their circlejerk that thinks it's funny
EDIT: ondkaja's comment makes a fair point as well, this behavior can very well damage the look of the league so I guess there's a valid reason there
WafufooqpOmbrackAdnurak
You're the only one speaking for yourself.
ur comment doesnt make any sense
[quote=Wafu][quote=fooqp][quote=Ombrack][quote=Adnurak][/quote] [/quote] [/quote]
You're the only one speaking for yourself.[/quote]
ur comment doesnt make any sense
The people who do this kind of dumb shit should just be treated the same way, treat them the way they treat others.
Also isn't uberchain like literally one of the nicest people in the community
The people who do this kind of dumb shit should just be treated the same way, treat them the way they treat others.
Also isn't uberchain like literally one of the nicest people in the community
RazielThe people who do this kind of dumb shit should just be treated the same way, treat them the way they treat others.
Also isn't uberchain like literally one of the nicest people in the community
Even if she wasn't (she totally is), the behaviour against her for speaking out on being harassed to extreme degrees is just ridiculous.
[quote=Raziel]The people who do this kind of dumb shit should just be treated the same way, treat them the way they treat others.
Also isn't uberchain like literally one of the nicest people in the community[/quote]
Even if she wasn't (she totally is), the behaviour against her for speaking out on being harassed to extreme degrees is just ridiculous.
HildrethPred is an idiot but can't see why this is an ETF2L issue.
They are prem players and represent the league. Not punishing public racism and public harassment gives the league a bad image and it makes the harassment problem worse. This also makes it harder for them (EDIT: ETF2L) to get sponsorships as I'm pretty sure sponsors are not happy about paying prize money to people who are publicly harassing other people and are proud of it.
[quote=Hildreth]Pred is an idiot but can't see why this is an ETF2L issue.[/quote]
They are prem players and represent the league. Not punishing public racism and public harassment gives the league a bad image and it makes the harassment problem worse. This also makes it harder for them (EDIT: ETF2L) to get sponsorships as I'm pretty sure sponsors are not happy about paying prize money to people who are publicly harassing other people and are proud of it.
Not surprised at all. These are the same people from the bin/nunya circlejerk who kept calling me "the spanish trannie".
Not surprised at all. These are the same people from the bin/nunya circlejerk who kept calling me "the spanish trannie".
Stop getting baitied by these retards. This thread is exactly what they want. Yep i know what the said is wrong and awful but you just gotta ignore them.
Stop getting baitied by these retards. This thread is exactly what they want. Yep i know what the said is wrong and awful but you just gotta ignore them.
StylaxLet's be honest, you hear this kind of shit nearly every day on prem/invite player streams and nobody ever calls it out.
Someone even played an etf2l prem official with the name nig of the nog or something like that, and nobody batted an eyelid.
It's bizarre
If you mean knig, he is French and I asked him 3 times if his name is meant in a racist way. Answer = no. The French are really bad when it comes to English
[quote=Stylax]Let's be honest, you hear this kind of shit nearly every day on prem/invite player streams and nobody ever calls it out.
Someone even played an etf2l prem official with the name nig of the nog or something like that, and nobody batted an eyelid.
It's bizarre[/quote]
If you mean knig, he is French and I asked him 3 times if his name is meant in a racist way. Answer = no. The French are really bad when it comes to English
martenStylaxLet's be honest, you hear this kind of shit nearly every day on prem/invite player streams and nobody ever calls it out.
Someone even played an etf2l prem official with the name nig of the nog or something like that, and nobody batted an eyelid.
It's bizarre
If you mean knig, he is French and I asked him 3 times if his name is meant in a racist way. Answer = no. The French are really bad when it comes to English
Nah I didn't mean him.
[quote=marten][quote=Stylax]Let's be honest, you hear this kind of shit nearly every day on prem/invite player streams and nobody ever calls it out.
Someone even played an etf2l prem official with the name nig of the nog or something like that, and nobody batted an eyelid.
It's bizarre[/quote]
If you mean knig, he is French and I asked him 3 times if his name is meant in a racist way. Answer = no. The French are really bad when it comes to English[/quote]
Nah I didn't mean him.
explain to me how is laughing at others people steam profiles is ok if this community tend to care so much about every persons feelings
explain to me how is laughing at others people steam profiles is ok if this community tend to care so much about every persons feelings
I cba to read all this drama
Did she end up naming the people who abused her or no?
I cba to read all this drama
Did she end up naming the people who abused her or no?
fooqpexplain to me how is laughing at others people steam profiles is ok if this community tend to care so much about every persons feelings
It's almost like someone posting something dumb and being told it's dumb, and someone being discriminated based on their heritage are completely incomparible things.
[quote=fooqp]explain to me how is laughing at others people steam profiles is ok if this community tend to care so much about every persons feelings[/quote]
It's almost like someone posting something dumb and being told it's dumb, and someone being discriminated based on their heritage are completely incomparible things.
I don't think it's really the job of ETF2L to act on such comments that happen "outside" of the game (not in official games, on stream etc.).
Then again, what ondkaja says is also very true, prem players simply are a face of etf2l and should be treated differently as such.
The question would be where to draw the line. Would this apply to prem only? All divs?
It's way more a job of us, the community, to not let such things pass by and be forgotten after a week or two.
Its also a job of the orgs that are a part of TF2 (se7en, svift etc.) to not pick up players that make such public statements. Or if they do, for us to not support them for this.
Are they part of of a team that tries to fundrais for a lan? Don't fucking support them.
Are they streaming? Don't watch it.
And so on, we as the community have the option to act on it.
I don't think it's really the job of ETF2L to act on such comments that happen "outside" of the game (not in official games, on stream etc.).
Then again, what ondkaja says is also very true, prem players simply are a face of etf2l and should be treated differently as such.
The question would be where to draw the line. Would this apply to prem only? All divs?
[b]It's way more a job of us, the community[/b], to not let such things pass by and be forgotten after a week or two.
Its also a job of the orgs that are a part of TF2 (se7en, svift etc.) to not pick up players that make such public statements. Or if they do, for us to not support them for this.
Are they part of of a team that tries to fundrais for a lan? Don't fucking support them.
Are they streaming? Don't watch it.
And so on, we as the community have the option to act on it.
Am I retarded or are you retards giving more of a shit to the dumb comments posted by two weebs than you are to the (apparently unnamed??) abusers who made Uberchain suffer?
Am I retarded or are you retards giving more of a shit to the dumb comments posted by two weebs than you are to the (apparently unnamed??) abusers who made Uberchain suffer?
StylaxmartenStylaxLet's be honest, you hear this kind of shit nearly every day on prem/invite player streams and nobody ever calls it out.
Someone even played an etf2l prem official with the name nig of the nog or something like that, and nobody batted an eyelid.
It's bizarre
If you mean knig, he is French and I asked him 3 times if his name is meant in a racist way. Answer = no. The French are really bad when it comes to English
Nah I didn't mean him.
Reminds me of a nations cup game where one of the opponents literally was called "fucking austria" in a game that was even casted
[quote=Stylax][quote=marten][quote=Stylax]Let's be honest, you hear this kind of shit nearly every day on prem/invite player streams and nobody ever calls it out.
Someone even played an etf2l prem official with the name nig of the nog or something like that, and nobody batted an eyelid.
It's bizarre[/quote]
If you mean knig, he is French and I asked him 3 times if his name is meant in a racist way. Answer = no. The French are really bad when it comes to English[/quote]
Nah I didn't mean him.[/quote]
Reminds me of a nations cup game where one of the opponents literally was called "fucking austria" in a game that was even casted
Community input only goes so far without actual repercussions (e.g. league bans) being provided. These people don't care about fundraising, sponsorships, or how they come across over the Internet. If they did, they would vastly change their behavior.
Act accordingly. If people won't cooperate (i.e. act with a single shred of human decency), get rid of them. It's not hard, it's not complicated, and it doesn't remove anything valuable from the scene.
Community input only goes so far without actual repercussions (e.g. league bans) being provided. These people don't care about fundraising, sponsorships, or how they come across over the Internet. If they did, they would vastly change their behavior.
Act accordingly. If people won't cooperate (i.e. act with a single shred of human decency), get rid of them. It's not hard, it's not complicated, and it doesn't remove anything valuable from the scene.
people were banned on etf2l for racism before btw e.g. darn and taimou
people were banned on etf2l for racism before btw e.g. darn and taimou
gotta admit i was on the fence about the league ban argument until i saw ondkaja's comment. top players being allowed to behave like this with no repercussions is very damaging for tf2's image as it appears to both sponsors and new players in general. i'm not saying prem and invite should be held to professionalism standards that are akin to other esports events since we're a small scene and it doesnt make sense to do that, but the people representing tf2 at its top level should have a responsibility to not act like complete idiots imo.
gotta admit i was on the fence about the league ban argument until i saw ondkaja's comment. top players being allowed to behave like this with no repercussions is very damaging for tf2's image as it appears to both sponsors and new players in general. i'm not saying prem and invite should be held to professionalism standards that are akin to other esports events since we're a small scene and it doesnt make sense to do that, but the people representing tf2 at its top level should have a responsibility to not act like complete idiots imo.
So
Do we know the names of the people who, you know, actually physically and emotionally abused Uberchain, sexually even, so that we can ban them too?
I'm just asking because, like, I don't know if I'm just living in a different reality or something but where's the naming and shaming for actual sexual predators?
So
Do we know the names of the people who, you know, actually physically and emotionally abused Uberchain, sexually even, so that we can ban them too?
I'm just asking because, like, I don't know if I'm just living in a different reality or something but where's the naming and shaming for actual sexual predators?
FuxxSo
Do we know the names of the people who, you know, actually physically and emotionally abused Uberchain, sexually even, so that we can ban them too?
I'm just asking because, like, I don't know if I'm just living in a different reality or something but where's the naming and shaming for actual sexual predators?
https://twitter.com/uberchain/status/1026240692102676485 Uberchain's mentioned she's not ready to do so yet.
Please understand it takes a tremendous amount of courage to speak up about something like this even anonymously.
[quote=Fuxx]So
Do we know the names of the people who, you know, actually physically and emotionally abused Uberchain, sexually even, so that we can ban them too?
I'm just asking because, like, I don't know if I'm just living in a different reality or something but where's the naming and shaming for actual sexual predators?[/quote]
https://twitter.com/uberchain/status/1026240692102676485 Uberchain's mentioned she's not ready to do so yet.
Please understand it takes a tremendous amount of courage to speak up about something like this even anonymously.