both forward spawns on mid have big holes in the back and also have tiny gaps between the door and the wall
also this little line on the floor bounces stickies which can fuck up rollouts http://i.imgur.com/f9q5Xht.jpg
cp_granary_pro
posted in
Map Discussion
both forward spawns on mid have big holes in the back and also have tiny gaps between the door and the wall
also this little line on the floor bounces stickies which can fuck up rollouts http://i.imgur.com/f9q5Xht.jpg
also this little line on the floor bounces stickies which can fuck up rollouts http://i.imgur.com/f9q5Xht.jpg
KevinIsPwn everything else seems so subjective to me. I personally love granary because of the things that make it unique, and a lot of the things just seem like "well i don't like this particular nitpick thing, so i'm going to change it".
I don't think I've changed anything that defined what made granary unique as a map. Either than removing the rocket room; which is a lot more a nuisance than it is something unique; it still plays the same except both sides are a lot more even and it has better flow.
[quote=KevinIsPwn] everything else seems so subjective to me. I personally love granary because of the things that make it unique, and a lot of the things just seem like "well i don't like this particular nitpick thing, so i'm going to change it".[/quote]
I don't think I've changed anything that defined what made granary unique as a map. Either than removing the rocket room; which is a lot more a nuisance than it is something unique; it still plays the same except both sides are a lot more even and it has better flow.
I don't think I've changed anything that defined what made granary unique as a map. Either than removing the rocket room; which is a lot more a nuisance than it is something unique; it still plays the same except both sides are a lot more even and it has better flow.
I'm not sure what "it has better flow" means. I'm not sure you know what it means.
Those are just buzzwords that mean nothing without being expounded upon. Sorry, but that's just the truth.
What you're saying about both sides being even is 100% correct. The rest of it is what bugs me. you made a ton of changes to an absolute classic map with the intent to make it "flow better".
I'm not sure what "it has better flow" means. I'm not sure you know what it means.
Those are just buzzwords that mean nothing without being expounded upon. Sorry, but that's just the truth.
What you're saying about both sides being even is 100% correct. The rest of it is what bugs me. you made a ton of changes to an absolute classic map with the intent to make it "flow better".
Those are just buzzwords that mean nothing without being expounded upon. Sorry, but that's just the truth.
What you're saying about both sides being even is 100% correct. The rest of it is what bugs me. you made a ton of changes to an absolute classic map with the intent to make it "flow better".
KevinIsPwnI'm not sure what "it has better flow" means. I'm not sure you know what it means.
Those are just buzzwords that mean nothing without being expounded upon. Sorry, but that's just the truth.
What you're saying about both sides being even is 100% correct. The rest of it is what bugs me. you made a ton of changes to an absolute classic map with the intent to make it "flow better".
Better flow? As in the game of 6v6 plays a lot better on the map. Granary is notorious for bad spawn times and spawn locations and I'm trying to fix it. The problems with the map do not justify as its unique quirks, it just makes it bad.
[quote=KevinIsPwn]I'm not sure what "it has better flow" means. I'm not sure you know what it means.
Those are just buzzwords that mean nothing without being expounded upon. Sorry, but that's just the truth.
What you're saying about both sides being even is 100% correct. The rest of it is what bugs me. you made a ton of changes to an absolute classic map with the intent to make it "flow better".[/quote]
Better flow? As in the game of 6v6 plays a lot better on the map. Granary is notorious for bad spawn times and spawn locations and I'm trying to fix it. The problems with the map do not justify as its unique quirks, it just makes it bad.
Those are just buzzwords that mean nothing without being expounded upon. Sorry, but that's just the truth.
What you're saying about both sides being even is 100% correct. The rest of it is what bugs me. you made a ton of changes to an absolute classic map with the intent to make it "flow better".[/quote]
Better flow? As in the game of 6v6 plays a lot better on the map. Granary is notorious for bad spawn times and spawn locations and I'm trying to fix it. The problems with the map do not justify as its unique quirks, it just makes it bad.
@Kevin While I like granary, it was still one of the more unpopular maps in the rotation for a reason. You're being incredibly ignorant if you think mirroring the map is the only fix it needed. Some of the 'classic' things about the map is what made people dislike it, one of the big things being an incredibly chokey second point to which end removing the pillar and what ever other clutter you can is necessary.
@Kevin While I like granary, it was still one of the more unpopular maps in the rotation for a reason. You're being incredibly ignorant if you think mirroring the map is the only fix it needed. Some of the 'classic' things about the map is what made people dislike it, one of the big things being an incredibly chokey second point to which end removing the pillar and what ever other clutter you can is necessary.
granary definitely needed changes to spawns, granary is notorious for a mid-wipe leading to a last cap without any contention at all, because most of the players hadn't made it out of spawn yet or even spawned to begin with.
Granary is a very difficult last to push on even and usually involves the defending team losing their uber somehow before a successful push occurs.
I think cp_granary_pro_b7 in it's current form (without the mid changes) is a straight upgrade from the stock map and should be included in esea s19 in place of the stock map
even if I do miss the textures ; _;
granary definitely needed changes to spawns, granary is notorious for a mid-wipe leading to a last cap without any contention at all, because most of the players hadn't made it out of spawn yet or even spawned to begin with.
Granary is a very difficult last to push on even and usually involves the defending team losing their uber somehow before a successful push occurs.
I think cp_granary_pro_b7 in it's current form (without the mid changes) is a straight upgrade from the stock map and should be included in esea s19 in place of the stock map
even if I do miss the textures ; _;
Granary is a very difficult last to push on even and usually involves the defending team losing their uber somehow before a successful push occurs.
I think cp_granary_pro_b7 in it's current form (without the mid changes) is a straight upgrade from the stock map and should be included in esea s19 in place of the stock map
even if I do miss the textures ; _;
DaggerBetter flow? As in the game of 6v6 plays a lot better on the map.
That's what I'm saying is the issue to me. I still don't have a reason why it's objectively better.
DaggerGranary is notorious for bad spawn times and spawn locations and I'm trying to fix it.
I quite like the spawn times. As do other players that don't come to this thread. The issue with the map-change/_pro threads is that the majority of people that post on them are people that very much dislike the map. This is why you see inane changes being made based off subjective hoopla all the time. It's why you don't see a whole lot of _pro maps in the rotations.
DaggerThe problems with the map do not justify as its unique quirks, it just makes it bad.
My point isn't that your opinion of granary are incorrect. But they are your opinions of the map. Which is why it urks me that it's being released as "cp_granary_pro" and not "cp_granary_dagger". The pro should mean fixing things that are 100% completely bad such as broken sightlines, fps issues, splash issues, etc. Not whatever a small group of players feels will make the map "flow better".
Teapot_You're being incredibly ignorant if you think mirroring the map is the only fix it needed.
Just like you can say I'm being ignorant for thinking what I think, I could call you ignorant for assuming that my reasons are. If you want to discuss the map, please do so in a way that doesn't assume I'm an idiot that has no clue what he's talking about.
botmodegranary is notorious for a mid-wipe leading to a last cap without any contention at all, because most of the players hadn't made it out of spawn yet or even spawned to begin with.
Maybe JUST MAYBE if you wipe late on mid and the other team has enough people up to cap the point and send people to stack second you deserve to lose the round.
botmodeGranary is a very difficult last to push on even and usually involves the defending team losing their uber somehow before a successful push occurs.
Which is probably why it works out so well that the spawn times on the map are the way that they are.
I'd like to reiterate that I don't dislike everything about this map, but there are a lot of changes that have been made that a lot of people see as simply unnecessary or even a step backwards.
[quote=Dagger]Better flow? As in the game of 6v6 plays a lot better on the map.[/quote]
That's what I'm saying is the issue to me. I still don't have a reason why it's objectively better.
[quote=Dagger]Granary is notorious for bad spawn times and spawn locations and I'm trying to fix it.[/quote]
I quite like the spawn times. As do other players that don't come to this thread. The issue with the map-change/_pro threads is that the majority of people that post on them are people that very much dislike the map. This is why you see inane changes being made based off subjective hoopla all the time. It's why you don't see a whole lot of _pro maps in the rotations.
[quote=Dagger]The problems with the map do not justify as its unique quirks, it just makes it bad.[/quote]
My point isn't that your opinion of granary are incorrect. But they are [b]your opinions of the map[/b]. Which is why it urks me that it's being released as "cp_granary_[b]pro[/b]" and not "cp_granary_[b]dagger[/b]". The pro should mean fixing things that are 100% completely bad such as broken sightlines, fps issues, splash issues, etc. [b]Not whatever a small group of players feels will make the map "flow better".[/b]
[quote=Teapot_]You're being incredibly ignorant if you think mirroring the map is the only fix it needed.[/quote]
Just like you can say I'm being ignorant for thinking what I think, I could call you ignorant for assuming that my reasons are. If you want to discuss the map, please do so in a way that doesn't assume I'm an idiot that has no clue what he's talking about.
[quote=botmode]granary is notorious for a mid-wipe leading to a last cap without any contention at all, because most of the players hadn't made it out of spawn yet or even spawned to begin with. [/quote]
Maybe JUST MAYBE if you wipe late on mid and the other team has enough people up to cap the point and send people to stack second [b]you deserve to lose the round[/b].
[quote=botmode]Granary is a very difficult last to push on even and usually involves the defending team losing their uber somehow before a successful push occurs.[/quote]
Which is probably why it works out so well that the spawn times on the map are the way that they are.
I'd like to reiterate that I don't dislike everything about this map, but there are a lot of changes that have been made that a lot of people see as simply unnecessary or even a step backwards.
That's what I'm saying is the issue to me. I still don't have a reason why it's objectively better.
[quote=Dagger]Granary is notorious for bad spawn times and spawn locations and I'm trying to fix it.[/quote]
I quite like the spawn times. As do other players that don't come to this thread. The issue with the map-change/_pro threads is that the majority of people that post on them are people that very much dislike the map. This is why you see inane changes being made based off subjective hoopla all the time. It's why you don't see a whole lot of _pro maps in the rotations.
[quote=Dagger]The problems with the map do not justify as its unique quirks, it just makes it bad.[/quote]
My point isn't that your opinion of granary are incorrect. But they are [b]your opinions of the map[/b]. Which is why it urks me that it's being released as "cp_granary_[b]pro[/b]" and not "cp_granary_[b]dagger[/b]". The pro should mean fixing things that are 100% completely bad such as broken sightlines, fps issues, splash issues, etc. [b]Not whatever a small group of players feels will make the map "flow better".[/b]
[quote=Teapot_]You're being incredibly ignorant if you think mirroring the map is the only fix it needed.[/quote]
Just like you can say I'm being ignorant for thinking what I think, I could call you ignorant for assuming that my reasons are. If you want to discuss the map, please do so in a way that doesn't assume I'm an idiot that has no clue what he's talking about.
[quote=botmode]granary is notorious for a mid-wipe leading to a last cap without any contention at all, because most of the players hadn't made it out of spawn yet or even spawned to begin with. [/quote]
Maybe JUST MAYBE if you wipe late on mid and the other team has enough people up to cap the point and send people to stack second [b]you deserve to lose the round[/b].
[quote=botmode]Granary is a very difficult last to push on even and usually involves the defending team losing their uber somehow before a successful push occurs.[/quote]
Which is probably why it works out so well that the spawn times on the map are the way that they are.
I'd like to reiterate that I don't dislike everything about this map, but there are a lot of changes that have been made that a lot of people see as simply unnecessary or even a step backwards.
Kevin I really like you bro but
Calm pls, guy is obviously making changes people have recognized to be good, just because people don't post in the thread doesn't mean they also don't like the changes, map is obviously in the stage way better than the previous version.
and No, because you wipe on mid really shouldn't mean you lose the round almost automatically.
Kevin I really like you bro but
Calm pls, guy is obviously making changes people have recognized to be good, just because people don't post in the thread doesn't mean they also don't like the changes, map is obviously in the stage way better than the previous version.
and No, because you wipe on mid really shouldn't mean you lose the round almost automatically.
Calm pls, guy is obviously making changes people have recognized to be good, just because people don't post in the thread doesn't mean they also don't like the changes, map is obviously in the stage way better than the previous version.
and No, because you wipe on mid really shouldn't mean you lose the round almost automatically.
b8 is out, sorry for the holes in forward spawn, completely forgot about that, I also fixed the spawn doors so there's no cracks in them.
b8 is out, sorry for the holes in forward spawn, completely forgot about that, I also fixed the spawn doors so there's no cracks in them.
Every other map still allows the attacking team to fail in their execution of pushing last after wiping the other team on mid, it's debatable that they deserve to lose after wiping on mid but taking it completely out of their hands to even try on last isn't good map design.
You also ignored my other points and chose instead to focus on me calling you ignorant, which is what you're continuing to come across as.
Every other map still allows the attacking team to fail in their execution of pushing last after wiping the other team on mid, it's debatable that they deserve to lose after wiping on mid but taking it completely out of their hands to even try on last isn't good map design.
You also ignored my other points and chose instead to focus on me calling you ignorant, which is what you're continuing to come across as.
You also ignored my other points and chose instead to focus on me calling you ignorant, which is what you're continuing to come across as.
people dont like granary because it's harder to play than current maps. It's also the current map which is the worst for scouts at a time everyone says scout is the strongest class. No wonder they are if every non scout friendly map gets removed (hello metalworks)
You can't just WM1 into chokes or doors and expect to get away with it or even be a useful distraction for your team.
It promotes a different playstyle and most players can't be arsed to learn it.
I don't see a reason to alienate the stock map and make it play like other maps. Why not spend your time making a new map that would be your own in that case. It would only be good to get rid of the mid to yard stalemate, and i'm not sure if this will do whereas the old granary_pro did.
people dont like granary because it's harder to play than current maps. It's also the current map which is the worst for scouts at a time everyone says scout is the strongest class. No wonder they are if every non scout friendly map gets removed (hello metalworks)
You can't just WM1 into chokes or doors and expect to get away with it or even be a useful distraction for your team.
It promotes a different playstyle and most players can't be arsed to learn it.
I don't see a reason to alienate the stock map and make it play like other maps. Why not spend your time making a new map that would be your own in that case. It would only be good to get rid of the mid to yard stalemate, and i'm not sure if this will do whereas the old granary_pro did.
You can't just WM1 into chokes or doors and expect to get away with it or even be a useful distraction for your team.
It promotes a different playstyle and most players can't be arsed to learn it.
I don't see a reason to alienate the stock map and make it play like other maps. Why not spend your time making a new map that would be your own in that case. It would only be good to get rid of the mid to yard stalemate, and i'm not sure if this will do whereas the old granary_pro did.
KevinIsPwnThe pro should mean fixing things that are 100% completely bad such as broken sightlines, fps issues, splash issues, etc. Not whatever a small group of players feels will make the map "flow better".
great idea except every other pro map has made fundamental changes (warmfront last, tunnel in viaduct, new route to barnblitz last) to make the game "flow better"
KevinIsPwnJust like you can say I'm being ignorant for thinking what I think, I could call you ignorant for assuming that my reasons are. If you want to discuss the map, please do so in a way that doesn't assume I'm an idiot that has no clue what he's talking about.
Maybe JUST MAYBE if you wipe late on mid and the other team has enough people up to cap the point and send people to stack second you deserve to lose the round.
its not an assumption, its pretty clear you have no idea what you're talking about
theres a reason we play 5cp and not 1cp, and why heavy engie pyro don't have class limits of 0
its so 6v6 is something besides midfights
this is a good thing
[quote=KevinIsPwn]The pro should mean fixing things that are 100% completely bad such as broken sightlines, fps issues, splash issues, etc. Not whatever a small group of players feels will make the map "flow better".[/quote]
great idea except every other pro map has made fundamental changes (warmfront last, tunnel in viaduct, new route to barnblitz last) to make the game "flow better"
[quote=KevinIsPwn]Just like you can say I'm being ignorant for thinking what I think, I could call you ignorant for assuming that my reasons are. If you want to discuss the map, please do so in a way that doesn't assume I'm an idiot that has no clue what he's talking about.[/quote]
[quote]Maybe JUST MAYBE if you wipe late on mid and the other team has enough people up to cap the point and send people to stack second [b]you deserve to lose the round[/b].[/quote]
its not an assumption, its pretty clear you have no idea what you're talking about
theres a reason we play 5cp and not 1cp, and why heavy engie pyro don't have class limits of 0
its so 6v6 is something besides midfights
this is a good thing
great idea except every other pro map has made fundamental changes (warmfront last, tunnel in viaduct, new route to barnblitz last) to make the game "flow better"
[quote=KevinIsPwn]Just like you can say I'm being ignorant for thinking what I think, I could call you ignorant for assuming that my reasons are. If you want to discuss the map, please do so in a way that doesn't assume I'm an idiot that has no clue what he's talking about.[/quote]
[quote]Maybe JUST MAYBE if you wipe late on mid and the other team has enough people up to cap the point and send people to stack second [b]you deserve to lose the round[/b].[/quote]
its not an assumption, its pretty clear you have no idea what you're talking about
theres a reason we play 5cp and not 1cp, and why heavy engie pyro don't have class limits of 0
its so 6v6 is something besides midfights
this is a good thing
I love the spawn changes and how it looks better overall, but don't like how it's not possible to stand on any of the lights/windows like the original version.
I love the spawn changes and how it looks better overall, but don't like how it's not possible to stand on any of the lights/windows like the original version.
http://i.imgur.com/1XWaXUh.jpg
you can see through the crates on mid from a certain distance to see players behind them
http://i.imgur.com/1XWaXUh.jpg
you can see through the crates on mid from a certain distance to see players behind them
you can see through the crates on mid from a certain distance to see players behind them
TwiggyYou can't just WM1 into chokes or doors and expect to get away with it
Is this really a problem with other maps?
[quote=Twiggy]
You can't just WM1 into chokes or doors and expect to get away with it[/quote]
Is this really a problem with other maps?
You can't just WM1 into chokes or doors and expect to get away with it[/quote]
Is this really a problem with other maps?
Flow: the mental state of operation in which a person performing an activity is fully immersed in a feeling of energized focus, full involvement, and enjoyment in the process of the activity (psych definition). This means that a map with "Flow" results in more involvement. This is achieved through map tweaks that alter gameplay. Fixing sightlines is a mechanical change, which alters a fixed capability: whether or not you can see one place from another. Widening the mid or raising the chokes is a flow change, which alters player movement and positioning choices. One is static, the other is dynamic. Maps needs to consider both.
TLDR; it's a definition, not a judgement.
Flow: the mental state of operation in which a person performing an activity is fully immersed in a feeling of energized focus, full involvement, and enjoyment in the process of the activity (psych definition). This means that a map with "Flow" results in more involvement. This is achieved through map tweaks that alter gameplay. Fixing sightlines is a mechanical change, which alters a fixed capability: whether or not you can see one place from another. Widening the mid or raising the chokes is a flow change, which alters player movement and positioning choices. One is static, the other is dynamic. Maps needs to consider both.
TLDR; it's a definition, not a judgement.
TLDR; it's a definition, not a judgement.
I'm not sure if this is intended or not but at mid the two parts of the fence look different by choke, could be a lighting glitch or something.
I'm not sure if this is intended or not but at mid the two parts of the fence look different by choke, could be a lighting glitch or something.
[img]http://i.imgur.com/2UsEOs1.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/2UsEOs1.jpg[/img]
can we get a y/n from killing as to whether or not we're playing this or stock granary? ?
please
can we get a y/n from killing as to whether or not we're playing this or stock granary? ?
please
please
Did you fix it so that those stones no longer grant you immortality due to splash bug? If so then sure, keep 'em. But the splash bug thing is really dumb. I agree with almost everything xero pointed out except the sniper sightline, that was in original gran and isn't that bad.
Did you fix it so that those stones no longer grant you immortality due to splash bug? If so then sure, keep 'em. But the splash bug thing is really dumb. I agree with almost everything xero pointed out except the sniper sightline, that was in original gran and isn't that bad.
If you could push the spawn further back, and a bit smaller not into the original spawn, a bit nitpicky but, you spawn and youre staring at a wall.
If you could push the spawn further back, and a bit smaller not into the original spawn, a bit nitpicky but, you spawn and youre staring at a wall.
Sniping from left spawn door is actually insane. You can be scoped in and change class without moving. It's more of a problem than on process because you can see every entrance and most of last from left spawn. Maybe make it so you can only change class in the yellow taped area?
Sniping from left spawn door is actually insane. You can be scoped in and change class without moving. It's more of a problem than on process because you can see every entrance and most of last from left spawn. Maybe make it so you can only change class in the yellow taped area?
Gameplay:
http://puu.sh/hB70c/f4645c132c.jpg Remove this sniper sightline, especially since spawn is just a few meters away. Maybe it would promote more aggressive play from snipers.
http://puu.sh/hB7nK/44bc7d14e8.jpg Remove this pillar or make it bigger so you can use it to dodge.
http://puu.sh/hB7zn/4d05f0cc3e.jpg Remove this thing or make it a cover so you can use it to dodge
http://puu.sh/hB67Q/fde5d33191.jpg Make rooftops non-solid. Not just these rooftops, but all rooftops, like on viaduct.
http://puu.sh/hB6iF/6409bf9025.jpg These sticky spots are really obnoxious because you can't check them properly as pocket, make the door a normal door like on other maps.
http://puu.sh/hB74r/1e3d75b0b8.jpg Make light switch non-solid
http://puu.sh/hB7bv/6cdf8b4337.jpg Smooth out the movement on these sandbags
http://puu.sh/hB6GT/d60e37bc63.jpg Make ALL railings non-solid so they don't soak up bullets and rockets
http://puu.sh/hB6mZ/1b09ee2af6.jpg Remove this beam so you can rocket jump more freely
http://puu.sh/hB6rk/8c3ebf73f2.jpg Make all these diagonal supporters non-solid
http://puu.sh/hB7Cc/f9447ea8c4.jpg Remove this beam so you don't get stuck on it while rocket jumping
http://puu.sh/hB6Ir/784ad564a6.jpg Make window non-solid to rockets and bullets
Bugs:
http://puu.sh/hB6tv/594ce5f021.jpg Either remove the clipping here, or make the wall flat. The clipping doesn't make sense.
http://puu.sh/hB6uD/da3ca971ea.jpg Clipping doesn't make sense here
http://puu.sh/hB7j3/7fc4d9aa95.jpg Improve the clipping on this fence
http://puu.sh/hB7uo/377bcc5901.jpg Texture bug
http://puu.sh/hB7xm/fd25141b3f.jpg Ditto
Shadow bugs:
http://puu.sh/hB7Qm/54092c928d.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7U8/fd5bd6c79b.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7Vg/6a98d0524d.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB86g/d1ee605c61.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB87s/9734dcbf6d.jpg (also on the wooden things on the wall)
http://puu.sh/hB89G/e8ffdd4590.jpg
Fix all these splash bugs:
http://puu.sh/hB6MR/82d6ad2eb6.jpg (all pillars)
http://puu.sh/hB6Th/a061e86a03.jpg, http://puu.sh/hB6TT/e8a2531f1b.jpg etc.
http://puu.sh/hB6Wz/42cd368873.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB6X6/21ed8f8175.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB6Y0/10fd28c18b.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB6YG/d0b0b559f0.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB75U/89859204fc.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7h6/74252477f0.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7td/5ab7d14190.jpg
Gameplay:
http://puu.sh/hB70c/f4645c132c.jpg Remove this sniper sightline, especially since spawn is just a few meters away. Maybe it would promote more aggressive play from snipers.
http://puu.sh/hB7nK/44bc7d14e8.jpg Remove this pillar or make it bigger so you can use it to dodge.
http://puu.sh/hB7zn/4d05f0cc3e.jpg Remove this thing or make it a cover so you can use it to dodge
http://puu.sh/hB67Q/fde5d33191.jpg Make rooftops non-solid. Not just these rooftops, but all rooftops, like on viaduct.
http://puu.sh/hB6iF/6409bf9025.jpg These sticky spots are really obnoxious because you can't check them properly as pocket, make the door a normal door like on other maps.
http://puu.sh/hB74r/1e3d75b0b8.jpg Make light switch non-solid
http://puu.sh/hB7bv/6cdf8b4337.jpg Smooth out the movement on these sandbags
http://puu.sh/hB6GT/d60e37bc63.jpg Make ALL railings non-solid so they don't soak up bullets and rockets
http://puu.sh/hB6mZ/1b09ee2af6.jpg Remove this beam so you can rocket jump more freely
http://puu.sh/hB6rk/8c3ebf73f2.jpg Make all these diagonal supporters non-solid
http://puu.sh/hB7Cc/f9447ea8c4.jpg Remove this beam so you don't get stuck on it while rocket jumping
http://puu.sh/hB6Ir/784ad564a6.jpg Make window non-solid to rockets and bullets
Bugs:
http://puu.sh/hB6tv/594ce5f021.jpg Either remove the clipping here, or make the wall flat. The clipping doesn't make sense.
http://puu.sh/hB6uD/da3ca971ea.jpg Clipping doesn't make sense here
http://puu.sh/hB7j3/7fc4d9aa95.jpg Improve the clipping on this fence
http://puu.sh/hB7uo/377bcc5901.jpg Texture bug
http://puu.sh/hB7xm/fd25141b3f.jpg Ditto
Shadow bugs:
http://puu.sh/hB7Qm/54092c928d.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7U8/fd5bd6c79b.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7Vg/6a98d0524d.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB86g/d1ee605c61.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB87s/9734dcbf6d.jpg (also on the wooden things on the wall)
http://puu.sh/hB89G/e8ffdd4590.jpg
Fix all these splash bugs:
http://puu.sh/hB6MR/82d6ad2eb6.jpg (all pillars)
http://puu.sh/hB6Th/a061e86a03.jpg, http://puu.sh/hB6TT/e8a2531f1b.jpg etc.
http://puu.sh/hB6Wz/42cd368873.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB6X6/21ed8f8175.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB6Y0/10fd28c18b.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB6YG/d0b0b559f0.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB75U/89859204fc.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7h6/74252477f0.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7td/5ab7d14190.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB70c/f4645c132c.jpg Remove this sniper sightline, especially since spawn is just a few meters away. Maybe it would promote more aggressive play from snipers.
http://puu.sh/hB7nK/44bc7d14e8.jpg Remove this pillar or make it bigger so you can use it to dodge.
http://puu.sh/hB7zn/4d05f0cc3e.jpg Remove this thing or make it a cover so you can use it to dodge
http://puu.sh/hB67Q/fde5d33191.jpg Make rooftops non-solid. Not just these rooftops, but all rooftops, like on viaduct.
http://puu.sh/hB6iF/6409bf9025.jpg These sticky spots are really obnoxious because you can't check them properly as pocket, make the door a normal door like on other maps.
http://puu.sh/hB74r/1e3d75b0b8.jpg Make light switch non-solid
http://puu.sh/hB7bv/6cdf8b4337.jpg Smooth out the movement on these sandbags
http://puu.sh/hB6GT/d60e37bc63.jpg Make ALL railings non-solid so they don't soak up bullets and rockets
http://puu.sh/hB6mZ/1b09ee2af6.jpg Remove this beam so you can rocket jump more freely
http://puu.sh/hB6rk/8c3ebf73f2.jpg Make all these diagonal supporters non-solid
http://puu.sh/hB7Cc/f9447ea8c4.jpg Remove this beam so you don't get stuck on it while rocket jumping
http://puu.sh/hB6Ir/784ad564a6.jpg Make window non-solid to rockets and bullets
Bugs:
http://puu.sh/hB6tv/594ce5f021.jpg Either remove the clipping here, or make the wall flat. The clipping doesn't make sense.
http://puu.sh/hB6uD/da3ca971ea.jpg Clipping doesn't make sense here
http://puu.sh/hB7j3/7fc4d9aa95.jpg Improve the clipping on this fence
http://puu.sh/hB7uo/377bcc5901.jpg Texture bug
http://puu.sh/hB7xm/fd25141b3f.jpg Ditto
Shadow bugs:
http://puu.sh/hB7Qm/54092c928d.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7U8/fd5bd6c79b.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7Vg/6a98d0524d.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB86g/d1ee605c61.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB87s/9734dcbf6d.jpg (also on the wooden things on the wall)
http://puu.sh/hB89G/e8ffdd4590.jpg
Fix all these splash bugs:
http://puu.sh/hB6MR/82d6ad2eb6.jpg (all pillars)
http://puu.sh/hB6Th/a061e86a03.jpg, http://puu.sh/hB6TT/e8a2531f1b.jpg etc.
http://puu.sh/hB6Wz/42cd368873.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB6X6/21ed8f8175.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB6Y0/10fd28c18b.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB6YG/d0b0b559f0.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB75U/89859204fc.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7h6/74252477f0.jpg
http://puu.sh/hB7td/5ab7d14190.jpg
I definitely think that making it so you have to be inside the yellow lines to change class is a bad idea. It makes you have to walk an extra distance to the side, and you have no visual feedback without looking down. Not disagreeing with the fact that sniping is insane from that spot, but I don't think this is the way to fix it.
Also #175 I don't think that all railings should be made so they can be shot through necessarily. I think that changing that property could mean major changes to fights around the railings and that there should be some playtesting and some varied opinions going into whether this is changed or not. Maybe the right decision is to just make them all be able to be shot through, but I would like to see the opinions of some other people.
I definitely think that making it so you have to be inside the yellow lines to change class is a bad idea. It makes you have to walk an extra distance to the side, and you have no visual feedback without looking down. Not disagreeing with the fact that sniping is insane from that spot, but I don't think this is the way to fix it.
Also #175 I don't think that all railings should be made so they can be shot through necessarily. I think that changing that property could mean major changes to fights around the railings and that there should be some playtesting and some varied opinions going into whether this is changed or not. Maybe the right decision is to just make them all be able to be shot through, but I would like to see the opinions of some other people.
Also #175 I don't think that all railings should be made so they can be shot through necessarily. I think that changing that property could mean major changes to fights around the railings and that there should be some playtesting and some varied opinions going into whether this is changed or not. Maybe the right decision is to just make them all be able to be shot through, but I would like to see the opinions of some other people.
4812622KevinIsPwnThe pro should mean fixing things that are 100% completely bad such as broken sightlines, fps issues, splash issues, etc. Not whatever a small group of players feels will make the map "flow better".
great idea except every other pro map has made fundamental changes (warmfront last, tunnel in viaduct, new route to barnblitz last) to make the game "flow better"
KevinIsPwnJust like you can say I'm being ignorant for thinking what I think, I could call you ignorant for assuming that my reasons are. If you want to discuss the map, please do so in a way that doesn't assume I'm an idiot that has no clue what he's talking about.Maybe JUST MAYBE if you wipe late on mid and the other team has enough people up to cap the point and send people to stack second you deserve to lose the round.
its not an assumption, its pretty clear you have no idea what you're talking about
theres a reason we play 5cp and not 1cp, and why heavy engie pyro don't have class limits of 0
its so 6v6 is something besides midfights
this is a good thing
if you get shrekt on mids each time you can also not go to mid and keep playing the round..
[quote=4812622][quote=KevinIsPwn]The pro should mean fixing things that are 100% completely bad such as broken sightlines, fps issues, splash issues, etc. Not whatever a small group of players feels will make the map "flow better".[/quote]
great idea except every other pro map has made fundamental changes (warmfront last, tunnel in viaduct, new route to barnblitz last) to make the game "flow better"
[quote=KevinIsPwn]Just like you can say I'm being ignorant for thinking what I think, I could call you ignorant for assuming that my reasons are. If you want to discuss the map, please do so in a way that doesn't assume I'm an idiot that has no clue what he's talking about.[/quote]
[quote]Maybe JUST MAYBE if you wipe late on mid and the other team has enough people up to cap the point and send people to stack second [b]you deserve to lose the round[/b].[/quote]
its not an assumption, its pretty clear you have no idea what you're talking about
theres a reason we play 5cp and not 1cp, and why heavy engie pyro don't have class limits of 0
its so 6v6 is something besides midfights
this is a good thing[/quote]
if you get shrekt on mids each time you can also not go to mid and keep playing the round..
great idea except every other pro map has made fundamental changes (warmfront last, tunnel in viaduct, new route to barnblitz last) to make the game "flow better"
[quote=KevinIsPwn]Just like you can say I'm being ignorant for thinking what I think, I could call you ignorant for assuming that my reasons are. If you want to discuss the map, please do so in a way that doesn't assume I'm an idiot that has no clue what he's talking about.[/quote]
[quote]Maybe JUST MAYBE if you wipe late on mid and the other team has enough people up to cap the point and send people to stack second [b]you deserve to lose the round[/b].[/quote]
its not an assumption, its pretty clear you have no idea what you're talking about
theres a reason we play 5cp and not 1cp, and why heavy engie pyro don't have class limits of 0
its so 6v6 is something besides midfights
this is a good thing[/quote]
if you get shrekt on mids each time you can also not go to mid and keep playing the round..
deetrI definitely think that making it so you have to be inside the yellow lines to change class is a bad idea. It makes you have to walk an extra distance to the side, and you have no visual feedback without looking down. Not disagreeing with the fact that sniping is insane from that spot, but I don't think this is the way to fix it.
Also #175 I don't think that all railings should be made so they can be shot through necessarily. I think that changing that property could mean major changes to fights around the railings and that there should be some playtesting and some varied opinions going into whether this is changed or not. Maybe the right decision is to just make them all be able to be shot through, but I would like to see the opinions of some other people.
I don't think the yellow lines is such a bad idea, maybe you can make it more obvious visually with railings or something. It's the best way to solve having such an OP sniper sightline, since if people want to commit a person opening the spawn while the sniper shoots they're using two people that can't defend elsewhere.
[quote=deetr]I definitely think that making it so you have to be inside the yellow lines to change class is a bad idea. It makes you have to walk an extra distance to the side, and you have no visual feedback without looking down. Not disagreeing with the fact that sniping is insane from that spot, but I don't think this is the way to fix it.
Also #175 I don't think that all railings should be made so they can be shot through necessarily. I think that changing that property could mean major changes to fights around the railings and that there should be some playtesting and some varied opinions going into whether this is changed or not. Maybe the right decision is to just make them all be able to be shot through, but I would like to see the opinions of some other people.[/quote]
I don't think the yellow lines is such a bad idea, maybe you can make it more obvious visually with railings or something. It's the best way to solve having such an OP sniper sightline, since if people want to commit a person opening the spawn while the sniper shoots they're using two people that can't defend elsewhere.
Also #175 I don't think that all railings should be made so they can be shot through necessarily. I think that changing that property could mean major changes to fights around the railings and that there should be some playtesting and some varied opinions going into whether this is changed or not. Maybe the right decision is to just make them all be able to be shot through, but I would like to see the opinions of some other people.[/quote]
I don't think the yellow lines is such a bad idea, maybe you can make it more obvious visually with railings or something. It's the best way to solve having such an OP sniper sightline, since if people want to commit a person opening the spawn while the sniper shoots they're using two people that can't defend elsewhere.
xeroSideshowI don't think the yellow lines is such a bad idea, maybe you can make it more obvious visually with railings or something.Better to just block it with walls (anything else will be confusing). Maybe its better to just make it something like previous spawn but in rocket room?
Well then why not revert it? But that's silly because you would have the same problems as with normal granary, that it takes an age to get from spawn to the point. If you block it with a wall then there's a fat-ass wall in front of spawn which is really dumb.
The other option is to rotate the spawn doors 90 degrees like on a lot of other maps so that there isn't a sightline but it'd require a bit of a re-design of both the spawn and the rollout which isn't a good idea imo.
[quote=xero][quote=Sideshow]I don't think the yellow lines is such a bad idea, maybe you can make it more obvious visually with railings or something.[/quote]
Better to just block it with walls (anything else will be confusing). Maybe its better to just make it something like previous spawn but in rocket room?[/quote]
Well then why not revert it? But that's silly because you would have the same problems as with normal granary, that it takes an age to get from spawn to the point. If you block it with a wall then there's a fat-ass wall in front of spawn which is really dumb.
The other option is to rotate the spawn doors 90 degrees like on a lot of other maps so that there isn't a sightline but it'd require a bit of a re-design of both the spawn and the rollout which isn't a good idea imo.
Better to just block it with walls (anything else will be confusing). Maybe its better to just make it something like previous spawn but in rocket room?[/quote]
Well then why not revert it? But that's silly because you would have the same problems as with normal granary, that it takes an age to get from spawn to the point. If you block it with a wall then there's a fat-ass wall in front of spawn which is really dumb.
The other option is to rotate the spawn doors 90 degrees like on a lot of other maps so that there isn't a sightline but it'd require a bit of a re-design of both the spawn and the rollout which isn't a good idea imo.
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