I forgot to mention but it's not a debate, it's a discussion to clear things up from this side of the fence.

I agree with mak and springrolls, and these comments are things that casual players would not think of imo so they would treat this whole community the same way they have before blindly.

Everyone here knows how this all turns out but it gets recycled in these threads and casual players are none the wiser.

Looking for a prem player that is smart, articulate, that can be bothered to speak on behalf of all prem/invite players and won't say the n-word

My bad guys, maybe casual gamers being more toxic than comp players are more common than I thought

Also just confirmed ZestyJesus is willing to debate, DrHappiness is probably gonna do it if he finds the time
Anyone wanna join in? My discord is: rahmed

That's fine, I'm not trying to sell the idea of 6s to all pubbers - just defending some outrageous claims they get from other people that don't know as much

Let's face it, some youtubers/streamers like ZestyJesus are biased against comp from their personal experiences against players or by the Meet your Match update failing to provide for both communities at launch.

Because of this, these content creators will advocate for their opinions, never challenged against btw, in their videos and tf2 viewers slop it up without a second thought.

Which results in 6s looked down upon, often making casual players look more toxic than the game's comp community which is rare, and 6s players just don't care to bother with them - which means less players would want to join in the first place, and so the community very slowly dies out

I think we should have a public formal discussion video to challenge the casual communities ideas that the comp community universally disagree, or show the understanding of what the respective league's decision is (e.g. certain weapon bans, even basic stuff like class bans, etc.)

Just have team Zesty vs team DrHappiness debate in a discord or something idk

Had a cuppa
1 sugar and milk

https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1YfHdoTR74ajSAM8zEMae0?si=2be27ce3b8974b55

I put it on during mge/dm
need to add some more, feel free to suggest anything similar or whatever gets you pumped

Had a cup of tea

yak's comment on the tf2easy fiasco

headshot rocketing people

https://clips.twitch.tv/YummyIgnorantMagpieResidentSleeper-x5j6yqnaY5puhvbT

This is my opinion, as a med-main, non-prem player:

Only one that caters towards high-div players that rewards serious play and not trolling.
Even those who wouldn't play, this would encourage more prem players playing and streaming - generating hype around the game and giving content to the rest of us low div players

tf2.online:
+ More frequent higher-skilled, serious games
+ More frequent balanced games
+ Metrics
- Pugs took forever to start sometimes
- Not used as much because people got fat-kidded in the A pug and leave, instead of making a B or C pug

tf2pickup.eu:
+ Pug starts in 5m or less
+ Guaranteed playtime if the pug starts
- No higher-skilled, serious games
- Less frequent balanced games

B for sure, we already have A.

Now this is a tricky one. I would have said Mumble, since we're already used to it and realistically everyone who would play the new pickup site already has it installed and knows how to use it. However, I do remember the times jeven/malarz would troll the channels and tbh who really knows mumble that well to bother stopping them if they started again?

You could use discord the same way RGL pugs do it. They make 2 new red and blu discord vc's per pug, and only you and your teammates can join it during the game. Basically, removes external trolls altogether. The stigma that discord has bad voice quality/bad hardware usage isn't common as much anymore imo, more like a placebo at this point.

It's going to be tough but I think you can bring the benefits of tf2pickup and tf2online together. I think you should really take all the time you need copperr and thoroughly work through what this new site will bring.
If you half-ass it this time, it's only inevitable that it will die within a year. Seriously look at all the pros and cons of pugchamp, tf2pickup, tf2online, rgl pugs - hell even rahmix - as long as everything is thought out rigorously this time.

One thing I want on this new site is some form of repercussions for being late or troll picking or whatever. You can copy the pickup system of joining the server within 5m, and also have a vetting system for captains. I.e. you have to apply to be a captain by submitting your ETF2L and you admins can verify them to captain up or not.

I don't think this will harm the existing player base, of puggers that is. If anything, the success of a new site can be fruitful towards non-puggers playing with their friends in a chill, non-serious way in tf2pickup as all the prem players would be adding up on the new site. Pretty much all the prem players that don't play pickup will play on the new site anyway, and that will leave pickup either empty or all filled with low/mid players - which is fine! This could make the site more balanced, becoming a haven for these players, instead of playing god-awful matches on tf2center where they don't even communicate.

I know I won't be picked in the A or even B pugs on the new site if it ever goes up, but the benefits of having more prem players playing - and old players returning - is definitely a net positive for the community. I honestly believe EU is lacking behind NA, simply because of the pugging culture here literally died out.

Truth is, pugs are great because of the people. The new site needs to reward good, high-skilled, serious players in a way that trickles down to other players playing like that too.

Is this the same kiwi we're talking about?
https://logs.tf/3695536

Thanks for coming back to the project
I would say that it looks confusing to look at the maps, if I were learning for the first time
Maybe have the circles and arrows dynamic when u hover over them or click?

Who are you anymore