I don't think anybody feels that it's hopeless it's more that we know what works and we know what's fun to play with and against, can we please stop trying to make it more casual to play?
You just sound desperate and have yet given actual arguments except "it might not be shit"

https://streamable.com/gov6f

ya but at the same time you're unbanning this not because it's refreshing and fun to play against but because top teams can counter it and find it "meh its kinda pointless", its a gimmick weapon and imo theres no fucking point in having gimmick weapons unbanned, do you think a bunch of open, low and mid players are more keen to play when shit that is annoying to everyone but a highly skilled well coordinated team and it gets used against them when they're losing 4-0? the reason you wanna do this is to bridge the gap between casual and comp so more newbies will join but at the same time the whitelist protects them from being stomped to fuck shit in unfun ways by people who are better than them
the whitelist isn't why pubbers wont play comp, its because they dont want or have the drive to play comp in the first place, they cba dedicating time to getting better aim, understanding what they're doing is wrong and why it's wrong and etc

imagine if you are playing badlands, your demo has quickie launcher, you bonk onto point, sticks are gone, you might be slow but you're capping that fucker fast, it's a fucking free entry wtf ? where is the skill from the scout's part?

https://youtu.be/BQLEW1c-69c?t=2382 (youtube embed breaks time)
tell me if this story sounds similar, the top players have put more hours into the game than all the devs combined, there is no fucking reason to cater to what they want because they have no idea how good tf2 can be at its best
we can either keep making some mutant freak out of comp tf2 which meets our needs but also lines up with tf2 devs views OR we can embellish in what we've been building up for 11 years.

im not against allowing more weapons into the whitelist, but i am against allowing gimmick weapons, useless or not and trying to please devs who dont know how to play the game

yeah celebrating chtristmas the proper way, getting pissed at work before being done for the day then sleeping to 3 pm

new meta theory: spend the entire mid bonking about and then clean up when everyone is low and you're still 150 hp in their combo

im out here working 7 am to 8 pm on weekends, i deserve to get a sip of some drama.

yo who deletes a shittalking clip lmfao

they hated him because he told the truth

u realize that by studying jazz you're literally playing jazz right? ur dumb frfr

ur a fucking moron
jazz is one of the two most popular music programs you can study (classical is the other), it's music for musicians and it's fricking epic
(i am aware you can study folk music but nobody does that lets be honest folks)

ok now this is an epic post :D
loled out loud thanks :)

no but they do pay the bills :ppp

stock is like classical music and the original is like jazz

classical music relies on notesheet reading and mechanical muscle memory to have perfect intonation
stock relies on quickly calculating trajectory movement of classes and muscle memory of how the rockets will be fired from the right side (or left with flipped viewmodels) and at which angle it'll be flying out to hit a airshot so crisp

jazz relies on feeling, remembering scales and improvising
original relies on feeling the situation at hands, remembering how big your brain is and pretending that you're playing an intense quake duel and changing your game settings every fucking 10 minutes

sorry but im not leaving camsoda for soulja

alright thanks man