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| Signed Up | February 12, 2013 |
| Last Posted | April 30, 2016 at 3:24 PM |
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atmoCould somebody with Valve's ear ( eXtine, Sal ... ?) ask Valve for advice as to how they would like us to proceed? Whatever Valve may say does not necessarily have to be followed, but it would be nice to know their thoughts, especially given a clean start with a break from ESEA.
I doubt valve will show any interest in our situation.
AloSecMr_PerfectI think that a TFTV League/ Community made league sounds intriguing and I bet a lot of people would be willing to try this out, hopefully...
I'm also in support of a TFTV league: it's the most centralized of all the current options. Almost everyone who plays comp TF2 has at least heard of TFTV or even visited it... it would be the easiest for people to transition into.
In my opinion, the best option is a merge of efforts between UGC, AG, and TFTV to create a centralized NA league.
I think that's a pretty good idea. Which leads to another.
Why not combine a bunch of these ideas? Have TFTV sponsor a community made league that is either made from, or made with tf2.gg? Have the competitive site, league, and pug system all together so we can be one strong community?
CHE_Let me throw a pipe bomb.....has any person that has or still is playing in invite cared to say anything about ESEA's shenanigans about the bitcoin issue but as well as their customer service towards accommodating a better outlook on resolving issues when we are technically paying money to support a business like that....
Where is brad?
We need a high level player to take a step in our direction, but I think they're afraid something will happen during the invite season.
thesupremecommanderBefore we start trying to narrow down our choices, I think it's important to realize that we have the rest of the ESEA regular season and playoffs to figure things out.
Personally, I think that we should allow leagues to submit their own bids and explain why they would be best suited to host the ESEA refugees. After all, if a league wants to be the future of competitive TF2, they should show that they have the dedication and ability to do so well.
If you see my post, I added the line in all caps to say that.
Mr_Perfectalso you forgot to put this in MLA format -20 points
I spent 45 mins writing this. Gimme a break
IcyWindSomeone explain to me why everyone shouldn't just move to CEVO for now. I don't know much about why they shut down a while ago but they seemed like they were willing to start over. Their client isn't too intensive and if I remember correctly you use your own server, so no more low quality ESEA style servers
For why not, check the cons that i put in the original post.
ss for client, I remember when I played CEVO that the client often did not work correctly and just made things worse. I also remember that since you were not playing on dedicated servers, you didn't have to join through the client and negated the necessity of it.
IARENOBODYI'm forming a team of players to try and make a new league. Anyone else who wants to join can do so. So far I have just 2 people. One of them is my friend, who is a web developer, and of course myself. If anyone has knowledge of website design, or programming, add me. I'm trying to recruit Lange, Blindsight, Roman Anderson and anyone else who is willing to help. I believe Alfunkso will help with some of the programming. Right now the plan is to create a league with a pug system, better stats, and server support. The proposed league wouldn't be free, but that's only because we need a way to have a prize pot, and a way of paying the people who put time into it.
I don't know if this was what you're looking for, but if you need a league admin or something that doesn't require coding experience, I'll volunteer.
Permzillaz4ch
NA ETF2L
Pros: Mods and admins are competitive TF2 players, listen to their league, good words from players from the EU scene. Willing to make a league as well (supposedly easy to setup?), Free. Possibly a LAN?
Cons: Not a definite choice yet, only one server in NA, no client (could be good or bad), EU rules (ew). No prizepool.
NA ETF2L is as good as confirmed as long as we get the interest. It's a definite choice for you.
As I said on the other thread we can easily get more servers from our sponsors, we just currently only have 1 because it's hardly ever needed.
thank you. ill update.
LKincheloeIGL is dead, Jim.
I heard it in a thread somewhere, so I thought I'd put it up.
nightwatchz4chCEVO
Pros: Has an NA league setup, has a client (could be good or bad), NA rule set, free league, dedicated staff(?).
Cons: Something happened years ago, which is why they stopped, then came back (I don't know much about it). Mostly associated with low level teams and teams that want to joke around. No prizepool(?), no LAN.
...
TF.TV league
...
Cons: Just an idea right now. Not even a statement about it from enigma is known.
DO RESEARCH.
enigma"we" gets thrown around a lot
it typically translates to "anyone but me" in regards to putting forth actual work
http://teamfortress.tv/forum/thread/14025-the-esea-abuse-thread/2#post-38
That's not a statement about whether TF.tv will make a league, that's a statement about everybody's thoughts about the subject.
As everybody knows, discussion about leaving ESEA to rot in the dust has exploded the past couple days. There's a lot of opinions, thoughts, and ideas going around. I thought it would be good to organize it all into a single post so people can make an educated decision.
I know I haven't been around as long as others, so if you see something wrong with something I say, please say something because I'm probably wrong.
Background:
ESEA is a pay to play TF2 league that has made itself the front runner for most competitive TF2 in NA. After 15 seasons, the league has 4 divisions, and somewhere around 200 teams. Part of the reason it's grandfathered into competitive TF2 is because it has made a name for itself in other competitive games as well.
Part of the money that you pay for playing in the league goes towards a client that a player must use to enter an ESEA server. Last season(?), the client was found to mine bitcoins while player's computers were idle (if you don't know about bitcoins, just know that the mining process can destroy expensive parts of your computer). It also created a backdoor for somebody from ESEA to get into your computer.
The co-owner of ESEA, LPKane, has also enraged the TF2 community by saying stupid things about TF2 and being cocky enough to say that TF2 has nowhere else to go (if somebody could find pictures or links to those, that would be great). Support of TF2, from updating servers, to listening to the community, has not come from ESEA.
So in the past few days, players have finally had enough with ESEA and want out. So, what choices do we have?
Choices:
Stay with ESEA
Pros:Has a client, dedicated servers, payed staff, and already setup TF2 league. LAN at the end of the season with high-skill TF2 to entertain us.
Cons:Not very popular. They continually disrespect us as a community and no longer have our trust. Who knows where our money is going there, anyway.
I HIGHLY SUGGEST WE STAY AWAY FROM THIS CHOICE.
NA ETF2L
Pros: Mods and admins are competitive TF2 players, listen to their league, good words from players from the EU scene. Willing to make a league as well (supposedly easy to setup?), Free. Possibly a LAN? definitely happening if we want it.
Cons: no client (could be good or bad), EU rules (ew). No prizepool for low levels.
CEVO
Pros: Has an NA league setup, has a client (could be good or bad), NA rule set, free league, dedicated staff(?). Good prizepool.
Cons: Something happened years ago, which is why they stopped, then came back (I don't know much about it). Mostly associated with low level teams and teams that want to joke around. No LAN.
UGC
Pros: Already very respected for HL. Has a 6s league with lots of teams and multiple divisions. Dedicated mods and admins that play competitive TF2. Free.
Cons: Mostly associated with low level teams (I think UGC platinum is = ESEA Open level). No client (could be good or bad), no dedicated servers. Small prizepool. No LAN. Matchcomms are difficult to use(?).
IGL
Pros: Has a TF2 league setup. Uses ladders?
Cons:
Someone post about IGL, because I don't know anything about them.
TF.TV league
Pros: A HUGE player in NA TF2. Run by top-level players, with articles written often and lots of good content. Big forum. Considered the "hub" of competitive TF2.
Cons: Just an idea right now. Not even a statement about it from enigma is known.
Community-made league
Pros: Made by players, for players. Anything is possible.
Cons: No clue who would step up to make this. I don't have the money or html skills to do this.
Conclusion:
We have lots of choices, and ideas are only developing now, so things can change quickly. The first decision we should make as a community is if we abandon ESEA. Then, we decide what we do for a league. WE DO NOT HAVE TO ABANDON ESEA RIGHT NOW. WE CAN FINISH THIS SEASON AND GET OUR MONEY'S WORTH.
My thoughts (nobody probably wants to hear it anyway, but I have time before work):
Let ESEA die in hell. They've proved time and time again that they don't want us. What we do after that will probably not be decided by the low level community, but by the top-level players. Wherever they go, the rest of us are likely to follow. My personal opinion is that we go to UGC. They have a league setup for the NA, with multiple divisions. I think it's a well run site.
New idea:
We've had multiple people come up and say that they are willing to help with a new league. My idea is that they all combine talents and work together, under the direction of Nahanni. Pascal said that TF2.gg is going towards a league website instead of just PUGs. IARENOBODY stepped forward and said that he and a couple others will help. fsXD stepped up with his photoshop skillz. With enough of a team and good coordination, it might be able to get done.
I will be making edits as much as I can, but I have to go to work soon. Be aware of that.
EDIT: Did some research on IGL. Still don't know alot.
EDIT: CEVO had a good prizepool
EDIT: IGL dead?
EDIT: Updated NA ETF2L
EDIT: Changed ETF2L prizepool and added a new idea
KRAKpharaoh__it isThat's sick. You and Thrones are the only other people I know that like hardcore on here.
Nobody even bothered to ask me about hardcore.
pascalz4chNot really something you can fix, but what originally pushed me away from tf2lobby was the players. I can't stand when people just fuck around when I'm trying to play well and get better.
I played the tf2center beta this weekend and I'm probably not gonna play there again, since in both lobbies I tried, people were messing around.
I will play here if it's more like pugs and less like lobbies.
I understand people wanna have fun. I wanna get better and losing when no one is doing what they're supposed to do is annoying.
Exactly. This is the point behind TF2.gg - it's made by competitive players for competitive players. Our point is not to replace TF2lobby, but to provide a new place where people more serious about competitive can actually get better.
Well that's good to know. I'll try some when I get the chance.
Not really something you can fix, but what originally pushed me away from tf2lobby was the players. I can't stand when people just fuck around when I'm trying to play well and get better.
I played the tf2center beta this weekend and I'm probably not gonna play there again, since in both lobbies I tried, people were messing around.
I will play here if it's more like pugs and less like lobbies.
I understand people wanna have fun. I wanna get better and losing when no one is doing what they're supposed to do is annoying.
I cant skip, and the file isnt corrupt since he watches it, uploads it, then i try it and it doesnt work.
and you might be right about the hud. ill try it later