the weapon just seems like such a crutch for medics that couldn't previously handle keeping track of crit heals

just ready for the preemptive strike

quickfix is fun and different and we havent figured out how to auto-win with it yet so im not sure what the point of calling it blatantly op is

it's just real silly watching medics fly around

I think this is what you should be focusing on. It's like a completely new weapon now and should be reevaluated during the off season. The same thing happened with the Crit-a-cola after it was buffed.

besides the potential quickfix currently has is way higher than either kritz or uber.

As much as i'd like to see new meta game options, the quickfix would probably ultimately be the end of uber and kritz. there'd be no reason not to use it.

Quick fix is in a lot of ways much better than kritz when used properly not sure why anyone thinks kritz is the one step solution to beating quickfix, quickfix dominates medigun just like it would kritzkreig

I see this long term limiting the variability of the game

don't medics fly further than the person doing the jumping? i'm waiting for a slingshot medic pick

rock paper scissors isn't entirely a luck game. anticipating your opponents move is a skill. not to mention there is a large difference in tf2, in that you often know your opponents choice before you make yours.

except it's not even rock paper scissors, it's quickfix > medigun + kritz

11:42 PM - hooli: http://teamfortress.tv/forum/thread/10702-quickfix/2
11:42 PM - hooli: even tho  i agree with b4nny
11:42 PM - hooli: i was the first one who downfragged
11:42 PM - hooli: to see how powerful downfrags are
11:42 PM - hooli: and now he's at -4
11:42 PM - 22d.Vile: wOw
11:42 PM - hooli: sheep, man
11:42 PM - 22d.Vile: document this shit
11:42 PM - 22d.Vile: right now
11:42 PM - 22d.Vile: tf.tv
11:43 PM - hooli: b4nny is 100% right
11:49 PM - hooli: holy FUCK
11:49 PM - hooli: it's at -12 now
11:49 PM - hooli: GOD DAMN

http://i.imgur.com/UmpOi.gif

medic should get the market gardener

Kritz can easily dominate Quickfix. The faster heal rate does nothing to stop crit damage. Projectiles might have a harder time hitting quickfixed players, but I don't think that makes it OP.

nothing wrong with change yo

http://ttoes.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/obama_change_x_framed__poster.jpg

TF2 is a lot more dm orientated with the quick fix. No longer do you need to know about crit heals, or what class is good to flash during an uber, or who to lead a push.

rock/paper/scissors requires no thinking at all. Sounds more like luck?

However, if used correctly, kritz will not counter qf. If a team is smart enough, they will just jump away as the kritz come in.

Is there really any point in bombing roamers now?

The teams I see using it and doing well with it are (surprisingly) the teams with better dm.

On paper, it just sounds like a bad idea, and seems like it'd take away most parts of the metagame and replace them with, well, nothing at all.
We'll see how testing goes, but as b4nny/defy said, allowing these dramatic changes to the game at the end of the season is a bad idea.

I am personally not looking forward to this upcoming lan any more.

So what is the Quick-Fix OP in comparison to? A metagame that has remained much the same for 3 or 4 years? I remember several people crying foul about the Gunboats. Most roamers make their living off it now.

I believe we need to look long and hard at why we have a problem with the Quick-Fix as a weapon and if it has to do with OUR lack of adaptation, our stand may not be credible. Over time, players and teams will learn to adapt to the QF, counter it or even adopt it.

This is exactly what Robin Walker was talking about when he spoke of 6s needing a shake-up. (ref: Extine + Sal's convo at Valve) How have suddenly decided that 6s TF2 has already reached the pinnacle of evolution and needs no more tweaks? Valve forbid, they may release a map that changes the way 5 CP or Koth is played. So what? We adapt, adopt and learn. That's the only way this game will remain playable and sustainable.

11:42 PM - hooli: http://teamfortress.tv/forum/thread/10702-quickfix/2
11:42 PM - hooli: even tho  i agree with b4nny
11:42 PM - hooli: i was the first one who downfragged
11:42 PM - hooli: to see how powerful downfrags are
11:42 PM - hooli: and now he's at -4
11:42 PM - 22d.Vile: wOw
11:42 PM - hooli: sheep, man
11:42 PM - 22d.Vile: document this shit
11:42 PM - 22d.Vile: right now
11:42 PM - 22d.Vile: tf.tv
11:43 PM - hooli: b4nny is 100% right
11:49 PM - hooli: holy FUCK
11:49 PM - hooli: it's at -12 now
11:49 PM - hooli: GOD DAMN

ROFL

I never thought I would see the day when a b4nny post gets downfragged; I guess it just proves how much this community bandwagons.

Also, props to defy for being the master troll.

I disagree with the idea of Rock-Paper-Scissors for the mediguns. It just... doesn't work that way in match play. It would if you assume that both teams are full uber with 6 up. And if you look at that as a situation, stock wins over Quick-Fix and Kritz, Kritz wins over Quick-Fix, and Quick-Fix jumps out and heals its players up because now they have advantage.

However, that is a small sample situation. The more important thing to note is how using each gun affects your team. Kritz is used to get advantage with the faster heal rate, and sniping medics before they get the full 100%. So in theory, Uber does counter Kritz, but Kritzing into a team that has Uber is always a dicey idea and speaks of a mistake in building or uber counting (which is possible, we're all human). So the question we should be asking in relation to the meta is what does Quick-Fix do to your team play in relation to stock? I'd say (but I'm bad so probably wrong) that Kritz makes you pop before they get theirs or risk getting destroyed if you have to delay.

*in which I answer my own question* In my observation, Quick-Fix's strength is in non-uber team fights. You always have better heals, and a generally more mobile combo (medic can jump and more efficiently heal the damage to pockets). But the downside is that you get fucked if they have an Uber/Kritz. It is hard to burst down a Quick-Fix Ubered medic+heal target, but the Quick-Fix can't position themselves in such a fight so they have to kite. So the effect of running Quick-Fix seems to be that teams running it have to pick fights off Uber with more importance placed on forcing bad pops and denying a medic charge.

Disclaimer: I could be wrong and if I am would love to be corrected.

It's really not that OP. It's pretty situational IMO. It'll never replace regular uber or even kritz, nor will it break the game.

How is that rng?

Couldn't you just let your pocket jump away from a kritz charge?

Let's say you're holding spire and the other team has kritz. With the medigun, you'd hold near choke to hopefully outrun the crit stickies. Holding closer to gray bridge is impractical, because even though you'd see the kritzing demo earlier, you wouldn't be fast enough to get away from the stickies. With the quick fix, on the other hand, you could be holding closer and just get your pocket to jump away as soon as you see the kritz, which should be much earlier than if you were holding far away.

Of course, this is just theorycrafting, but still, I don't think the rock-paper-scissors dynamic is as clear-cut as you guys are suggesting.

Because in rock paper scissors neither player knows what the other is going to throw, which makes the game random. It's a stupid comparison because it's not hard to figure out what medigun the other team is using and react to it accordingly.

That shit you were pulling the other night. It's OP now that teams are starting to realize its potential

what have i left undone???

guys if we can all just get along that would be fantastic, bring it in for a big group hug. no more arguing we're all family i don't wanna see anyone get hurt or upset, here this will cheer u guyzzyzyz up it always wrks for me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fP4emqw7O4

Noone knows when/if the medic will change mediguns.

Example:
It's after a midfight...

Both medics went down.

Their med changes mediguns when he dies and spawns quickfix, your med spawns medigun.

Their charge builds faster and they wipe your team with it.

Yes

ya because people never fuck up pushes with kritz or uber (or qf rofl)

please stop talking about the gun like its in a vacuum, if youre going to claim its instawin because "you can pick it and they dont know and you kill them with it" then say why

just because as it fits into the game now is kinda clumsy (because nobody has fucking used it save a few matches) doesnt mean that people arent gonna get used to dealing with it

because people play tf2 the exact same way they did s3

Oh i gotcha, so your argument is that people might fuck up. That makes sense. Next time I play tf2 i'll just hold down w, because the enemy team might miss all of they're shots.

killing lost his marbles dawg ya dont just flail around all willy nilly not banning weapons like hes supposetah, do yer jawb killing in the name of

sidenote, i don;'t understand why people keep bringing up the mets game, they aren't even good yankees>mets

cuz mets stands for my entire team sucks l0l