I totally get where you're coming from but how low of a skill do we have to go for that to not be true? There are newcomer teams out there with players with like 200 hours. What I was trying to say is that just because someone is on a team doesn't mean they even remotely understand how to play the game, rocket jump, or hit even 20% of their shots. We're not even talking about Silver Elite level in CS, we're talking Silver 1, UGC Iron level. I think you're underestimating how awful new players can be.

Honestly tho, you made some really good points and idk if arguing if they would be low open or mid open isn't an ultra valuable thing to nitpick on.

ok really the question would be like 2011/2012 team vs IM team

100% the 11/12 team, not even a question. That's like season 10-13 of ESEA and had a decently high skill level across multiple teams. The teams and players were probably a little worse than what we see at the very top level today, but by 2011/12 the game was understood to a decent level and invite teams were anything but bad. And honestly the game hasn't evolved that much since that time, yes we have different weapons and the pocket scout meta is different than the more soldier/demo centric play we saw, but the vast majority of the underlying fundamentals are the exact same. The only thing I could see making a difference is the crossbow and modern teams and medics understanding how to abuse it because that shit is mad broken.

i think the bigger difference is that soldiers play way faster and tighter mechanically (especially their movement/jumps) than they did in the past.

True, but only at the top level. I do not see current IM sollys massively out maneuvering Lansky, WW, Blaze, TLR, Seagull, Dave__AC etc. There were some fucking scary soldiers playing in 11/12.

Reptile's team would probably lose. There's an undeniable measure of competence and gamesense on Reptile's team that would be useful to reverse the momentum on some modern overtuned DM crackheads looking for flashy picks; but I don't think it would suffice in the long-run against the many years of rollout practice, jump maps, DM and MGE that the open players would be seasoned with. Given they haven't just started playing this season and have achieved generic mechanical mastery. If the open players are still learning the game too, it'd make it a lot more even.

Give the best old-heads a chance to scrim for a month in the current landscape to see what's changed and I think it would turn out to be a great match.

I think anything top 4 past 2011/2012 has a decent shot to be at the least a low/mid invite team... if they have a 1 month of prac they would probably do ok

If it was the old build if the game the oldies would do better due to medic speed and stickies, but if new build I think they would have a hard time adjusting

tf2 came out in late 07, how many hours do you think anyone on that era pandemic had?

200 hours on tf2, 4000 hours on quake

R there actual demos from 2007-8 and not frag vids?