Yeah I'm honestly not certain on that roof either. In one way it could seem OP but at the same time if you try and hide up there by surfing infinitely you're still quite visible and have limited motion until you rocket jump away, which won't get you terribly far.
I don't know if those roofs add much, or if they really take away anything either.
Yeah I'm honestly not certain on that roof either. In one way it could seem OP but at the same time if you try and hide up there by surfing infinitely you're still quite visible and have limited motion until you rocket jump away, which won't get you terribly far.
I don't know if those roofs add much, or if they really take away anything either.
The surfing is fun, don't you take my fun away!
The surfing is fun, don't you take my fun away!
xeroIf Hyce`s idea was to make it similar to shacks on snakewater then better to make it unsurfable but stayable like on snake.
In think it will be too op if you can stay on it everywhere
Doesnt sound like a good idea. I think it should be like it is right now
Keep up the good work Hyce :)
I love logjam and hopefully its gonna be in the season 20 mappool
[quote=xero]If Hyce`s idea was to make it similar to shacks on snakewater then better to make it unsurfable but stayable like on snake.[/quote]
In think it will be too op if you can stay on it everywhere
Doesnt sound like a good idea. I think it should be like it is right now
Keep up the good work Hyce :)
I love logjam and hopefully its gonna be in the season 20 mappool
What you're suggesting makes literally 0 sense. You want it to either be like snake or blocked completely?
If it was like snakewater, those areas of the mid would open up a lot more and it'd be a really strange mechanic to have, highground up there. It would make it even easier to hold choke, and the flank route could be shut down more on mids.
As it is, you cannot use it as a "gay spot" like above gullywash big doors because it's so open and visible. This is simply not an issue. If people you're playing against are consistently using it then they're leaving other areas wide open, not holding mid properly and you can check it and kill them easier than them standing in pretty much any other place.
If you block it completely, you block all the "airspace" above that area. It stops you airstrafing into that zone, surfing on the roof to escape/dodge/rollout, makes random invisible walls appear. It's a bad idea that I hate on every map whenever it occurs at a RJable level. Leave it as is.
What you're suggesting makes literally 0 sense. You want it to either be like snake or blocked completely?
If it was like snakewater, those areas of the mid would open up a lot more and it'd be a really strange mechanic to have, highground up there. It would make it even easier to hold choke, and the flank route could be shut down more on mids.
As it is, you cannot use it as a "gay spot" like above gullywash big doors because it's so open and visible. This is simply not an issue. If people you're playing against are consistently using it then they're leaving other areas wide open, not holding mid properly and you can check it and kill them easier than them standing in pretty much any other place.
If you block it completely, you block all the "airspace" above that area. It stops you airstrafing into that zone, surfing on the roof to escape/dodge/rollout, makes random invisible walls appear. It's a bad idea that I hate on every map whenever it occurs at a RJable level. Leave it as is.
xeroSideshowwords
Dont turn it into war. I want them blocked because they make no sense. Simple as that.
Let Hyce decide. Its just my opinion.
It makes 10x more sense than everything you said so far.
[quote=xero][quote=Sideshow]words[/quote]
Dont turn it into war. I want them blocked because they make no sense. Simple as that.
Let Hyce decide. Its just my opinion.[/quote]
It makes 10x more sense than everything you said so far.
I'm leaning more towards leaving it as is. I think that making it more snakewater esque does not work with the rest of the mid. Clipping it off is shitty because of what sideshow said. If I were to go that route, I'd modify the building to reflect the clipping instead.
The question is more about whether or not the airspace around that roof is beneficial or not. I'd imagine it does something- whether or not that something is anything other than giving soldier mains a hard on I do not know.
I'm leaning more towards leaving it as is. I think that making it more snakewater esque does not work with the rest of the mid. Clipping it off is shitty because of what sideshow said. If I were to go that route, I'd modify the building to reflect the clipping instead.
The question is more about whether or not the airspace around that roof is beneficial or not. I'd imagine it does something- whether or not that something is anything other than giving soldier mains a hard on I do not know.
Okay guys- I’d like some quick feedback on this. I made a quick mock up of what banana/logroom could be sans detailing/props in it, just doors and general layout, vs. how it currently (b17) is.
The first images (blue side) are the way I have logroom set up for b17. The second set are an alternate setup that might prove better. Yes, you can still do the fast roamer rollout in the second setup but it’s a bit harder (took me, non-soldier main who’s not good at the game 10 minutes to figure out).
http://imgur.com/a/UA2mP
I appreciate any and all feedback, I’m trying to make this map as good as I can so you guys have an enjoyable time playing it.
Okay guys- I’d like some quick feedback on this. I made a quick mock up of what banana/logroom could be sans detailing/props in it, just doors and general layout, vs. how it currently (b17) is.
The first images (blue side) are the way I have logroom set up for b17. The second set are an alternate setup that might prove better. Yes, you can still do the fast roamer rollout in the second setup but it’s a bit harder (took me, non-soldier main who’s not good at the game 10 minutes to figure out).
http://imgur.com/a/UA2mP
I appreciate any and all feedback, I’m trying to make this map as good as I can so you guys have an enjoyable time playing it.
cp_logjam_b17
This is pretty much a test version for the new logroom. The new logroom is not fully detailed as it may not be sticking around. I think it's better than what it used to be, but I want to know what you people think as always- you play the map, not I.
In my play through I did notice a few small bugs but they're nothing too big- a few tiny gaps (some that are rather perplexing), some in displacements as usual. Shouldn't affect anything.
download: https://www.dropbox.com/s/3fkcsw6zv4nkapd/cp_logjam_b17.bsp?dl=0
Full changelog:
Removed a rock under mid and replaced it with a small hp
Modified the ground just in front of each house and made the bridge on mid a touch wider
Fixed paint splotches that were missing on blue spire
Moved the big fence just a touch at 2nd so that things don't clip weirdly
Fixed a doubled displacement from blue choke to cave
Updated clip brushes in choke to actually match choke's geometry
Added some clipping in the choke-cave connectors to fix an issue with players getting stuck
Modified clipping on the railings in lobby to make it so medics/scouts can crouch jump off the pallet over the railing
Removed a crate at last that was blocking a sightline to a door that no longer exists
Re-thought logroom/banana to make more sense, and open up flank fighting.
Fixed an issue where health and ammo at last were not in the same spot on each last point
Made the dirt piles at 2nd smaller
cp_logjam_b17
This is pretty much a test version for the new logroom. The new logroom is not fully detailed as it may not be sticking around. I think it's better than what it used to be, but I want to know what you people think as always- you play the map, not I.
In my play through I did notice a few small bugs but they're nothing too big- a few tiny gaps (some that are rather perplexing), some in displacements as usual. Shouldn't affect anything.
download: https://www.dropbox.com/s/3fkcsw6zv4nkapd/cp_logjam_b17.bsp?dl=0
Full changelog:
Removed a rock under mid and replaced it with a small hp
Modified the ground just in front of each house and made the bridge on mid a touch wider
Fixed paint splotches that were missing on blue spire
Moved the big fence just a touch at 2nd so that things don't clip weirdly
Fixed a doubled displacement from blue choke to cave
Updated clip brushes in choke to actually match choke's geometry
Added some clipping in the choke-cave connectors to fix an issue with players getting stuck
Modified clipping on the railings in lobby to make it so medics/scouts can crouch jump off the pallet over the railing
Removed a crate at last that was blocking a sightline to a door that no longer exists
Re-thought logroom/banana to make more sense, and open up flank fighting.
Fixed an issue where health and ammo at last were not in the same spot on each last point
Made the dirt piles at 2nd smaller
xeroHyceShouldn't affect anything.
Its possible to get outside of the map on blue side.
I like the idea of the new logroom more. But i think there is too much space.
I like the idea too, and as you said its too spacious, but it also destroys the roamer rollout, making roamer even more useless on this map
Time to perma snipe
[quote=xero][quote=Hyce]Shouldn't affect anything.[/quote]
Its possible to get outside of the map on blue side.
I like the idea of the new logroom more. But i think there is too much space.[/quote]
I like the idea too, and as you said its too spacious, but it also destroys the roamer rollout, making roamer even more useless on this map
Time to perma snipe
uhhhhhhhhhh I have no idea why you can get outside the map on blue side. I'll look into it. Must be another pesky missing clip brush.
Part of the reason that I don't care that you can't do the roamer rollout through logroom is that you can do a better one with more options through choke. It's harder and you have to go faster, but I can do it and I suck at jumping.
uhhhhhhhhhh I have no idea why you can get outside the map on blue side. I'll look into it. Must be another pesky missing clip brush.
Part of the reason that I don't care that you can't do the roamer rollout through logroom is that [b]you can do a better one with more options through choke.[/b] It's harder and you have to go faster, but I can do it and I suck at jumping.
HycePart of the reason that I don't care that you can't do the roamer rollout through logroom is that you can do a better one with more options through choke. It's harder and you have to go faster, but I can do it and I suck at jumping.
Yeah I know about it and it's pretty much the same thing but harder and slightly slower, the demo has more time to position himself now that the only viable/fast rollout is through choke.
[quote=Hyce]Part of the reason that I don't care that you can't do the roamer rollout through logroom is that [b]you can do a better one with more options through choke.[/b] It's harder and you have to go faster, but I can do it and I suck at jumping.[/quote]
Yeah I know about it and it's pretty much the same thing but harder and [i]slightly[/i] slower, the demo has more time to position himself now that the only viable/fast rollout is through choke.
To those of you who say I killed the rollouts...
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWskqg6RVOM&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]
http://youtu.be/-GvQEuebVGw
Made this video just to build on the previous one and show that they really aren't broken. You can still do everything the same, and the fact it's a little harder is only a good thing. One thing I would suggest is that the ramp going into mid from logroom actually meet the mid at an angle, instead of having that flat bit. Would make bumping your head on the roof happen less often.
EDIT: I would post on etf2l as well but the mods are nazis and banned me for releasing a flock of toucans.
[youtube]http://youtu.be/-GvQEuebVGw[/youtube]
Made this video just to build on the previous one and show that they really aren't broken. You can still do everything the same, and the fact it's a little harder is only a good thing. One thing I would suggest is that the ramp going into mid from logroom actually meet the mid at an angle, instead of having that flat bit. Would make bumping your head on the roof happen less often.
EDIT: I would post on etf2l as well but the mods are nazis and banned me for releasing a flock of toucans.
Sideshow, thanks so much for posting that. That's what I wanted to show in my video but I'm shit tier at demoman and even worse at soldier, so I appreciate it greatly.
I did realize that the flat bit can go away. It was a remnant from an idea before an idea and changes and things and stuff happened and then it wasn't necessary but it stayed. Oh well. I fix.
Sideshow, thanks so much for posting that. That's what I wanted to show in my video but I'm shit tier at demoman and even worse at soldier, so I appreciate it greatly.
I did realize that the flat bit can go away. It was a remnant from an idea before an idea and changes and things and stuff happened and then it wasn't necessary but it stayed. Oh well. I fix.
Thanks so much to the ozfortress production crew for running the summer cup on logjam and having me on the cast! It was a lot of fun to watch and I'm glad I was a part of it.
b18 should be out pretty soon as well!
Thanks so much to the ozfortress production crew for running the summer cup on logjam and having me on the cast! It was a lot of fun to watch and I'm glad I was a part of it.
b18 should be out pretty soon as well!
your map is in the mappool for etf2l season 20 again
congratz :D
your map is in the mappool for etf2l season 20 again
congratz :D
Thanks for the heads up, Raptor!
Great to see Logjam sharing a season with Sunshine. Sad to see a classic map like Granary go but I think a change for new, fresh maps is a good one.
Glad to see Logjam is still around! Maybe people will actually learn the map this time around and not immediately call it "Aidsjam" because they hate being flanked from "literally everywhere" because they don't know the map...
Thanks for the heads up, Raptor!
Great to see Logjam sharing a season with Sunshine. Sad to see a classic map like Granary go but I think a change for new, fresh maps is a good one.
Glad to see Logjam is still around! Maybe people will actually learn the map this time around and not immediately call it "Aidsjam" because they hate being flanked from "literally everywhere" because they don't know the map...
Hyce's detailing sucks. Hyce why don't you have someone like phi detail your map.
This is not RC, but it's a good start for a beta.
[img]http://i.imgur.com/ndw7XJl.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/NOAwfO7.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/TJlxwsN.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/ObAtsUO.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/Oi046Pn.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/JG4rybe.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/v7gZ8kP.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/k5LYAot.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/d4Ns2qQ.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/JmyJipz.jpg[/img]
Hmm, I'm not sure I'm really a fan of having those corrugated metal plates in the center of the room. It looked better as a wall in my opinion. Other than that the last looks awesome!
Hmm, I'm not sure I'm really a fan of having those corrugated metal plates in the center of the room. It looked better as a wall in my opinion. Other than that the last looks awesome!
Looks good Hyce, I'm also in agreement with fireindaarcade that you should be able to fairly easily walk on the corrugated metal plates at last, something more similar to the current version would be more agreeable.
From the screens you provided it doesn't have the same logroom aesthetic and more industrial, it think maintaining aspects of the logroom look is important.
Looks good Hyce, I'm also in agreement with fireindaarcade that you should be able to fairly easily walk on the corrugated metal plates at last, something more similar to the current version would be more agreeable.
From the screens you provided it doesn't have the same logroom aesthetic and more industrial, it think maintaining aspects of the logroom look is important.
Alrighty- back to a wall it is.
As far as the industrial aesthetics- there's a sort of idea in the TF2 universe that they use a business as a front for a secret-world-domination-kill-the-other team deal- so lobby is metal and wood trim, a bit of concrete, and last is all smooth concrete. Out at 2nd it looks more like it's a lumber mill.
Alrighty- back to a wall it is.
As far as the industrial aesthetics- there's a sort of idea in the TF2 universe that they use a business as a front for a secret-world-domination-kill-the-other team deal- so lobby is metal and wood trim, a bit of concrete, and last is all smooth concrete. Out at 2nd it looks more like it's a lumber mill.
Hm. Extending house over the raised bit of mid is not something I've thought about, but it's not a half bad idea. I'm going to try and get a quick test version of it ready and see if I can get a doublemix for feedback tonight.
Hm. Extending house over the raised bit of mid is not something I've thought about, but it's not a half bad idea. I'm going to try and get a quick test version of it ready and see if I can get a doublemix for feedback tonight.
Here's a pre beta 18 to try- I'm not sure if what I've done on mid is good or not so if anyone wants to test it tonight I would appreciate it.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/693evsm36dq10db/cp_logjam_b18pre1.bsp?dl=0
Here's a pre beta 18 to try- I'm not sure if what I've done on mid is good or not so if anyone wants to test it tonight I would appreciate it.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/693evsm36dq10db/cp_logjam_b18pre1.bsp?dl=0
cp_logjam_b18
Download:
This version, barring any serious issues I may have missed (pretty sure I got everything for once though), will be your version for ETF2L S20.
Changes: https://www.dropbox.com/s/d2oh08d9qwcxl3d/cp_logjam_b18.bsp?dl=0
Changes made b18pre1 to b18
Removed the truss bridge on mid
Raised the bridge in the middle
Added ramps by lower exit from logroom to the corners of mid
Added planks up the rocks to the bridge on mid
Modified the terrain below mid
Changes made for b18pre1
Fixed a clip brush being missing at blue second
Added a bit of detail outside of last's windows
Added mashed potato's final resting place
Removed an extra plank pile on mid
Made it so the ramp in logroom comes up to mid all the way as a ramp at the same angle
Added a grate that you can see through but can't shoot through to look into sneaky/secret.
Moved the entrance from sneaky away from the point by a smidge.
Added a small lip around the glass on last that you can walk on.
Detailed/retextured last.
Modified mid to add a truss bridge design on the bridge, and adjusted the bridge's size and shape a bit.
Made grates render at last and made sure you could not splash/shoot through them.
Made choke a touch wider at mid
Screens:
http://i.imgur.com/34IAxcJ.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ulSTWJA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/g8XJxmB.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/f5pnqPq.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/pFaweFW.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/EhJrTzn.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/iMddnDZ.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/JQJqf1l.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/cbIPFLn.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Jn2aC4V.jpg
Edit: And for those of you in ETF2L- here's the difference between S19's logjam and S20's logjam:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6m6gS3Ah4Vg&feature=youtu.be
cp_logjam_b18
Download:
This version, barring any serious issues I may have missed (pretty sure I got everything for once though), will be your version for ETF2L S20.
Changes: https://www.dropbox.com/s/d2oh08d9qwcxl3d/cp_logjam_b18.bsp?dl=0
Changes made b18pre1 to b18
Removed the truss bridge on mid
Raised the bridge in the middle
Added ramps by lower exit from logroom to the corners of mid
Added planks up the rocks to the bridge on mid
Modified the terrain below mid
Changes made for b18pre1
Fixed a clip brush being missing at blue second
Added a bit of detail outside of last's windows
Added mashed potato's final resting place
Removed an extra plank pile on mid
Made it so the ramp in logroom comes up to mid all the way as a ramp at the same angle
Added a grate that you can see through but can't shoot through to look into sneaky/secret.
Moved the entrance from sneaky away from the point by a smidge.
Added a small lip around the glass on last that you can walk on.
Detailed/retextured last.
Modified mid to add a truss bridge design on the bridge, and adjusted the bridge's size and shape a bit.
Made grates render at last and made sure you could not splash/shoot through them.
Made choke a touch wider at mid
Screens:
[img]http://i.imgur.com/34IAxcJ.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/ulSTWJA.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/g8XJxmB.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/f5pnqPq.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/pFaweFW.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/EhJrTzn.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/iMddnDZ.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/JQJqf1l.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/cbIPFLn.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/Jn2aC4V.jpg[/img]
Edit: And for those of you in ETF2L- here's the difference between S19's logjam and S20's logjam:
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6m6gS3Ah4Vg&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]
The new last is awesome! Great job
The new last is awesome! Great job