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OBS Causing hitches/mouse resistance
posted in Videos
1
#1
0 Frags +

Hey everyone!

I'm not sure if this is the correct subforum, and if it's not please remove it and let me know.

So I've been streaming TF2 for a while now, but every time I do I have this strange lag that I can't quite solve. It's not exactly stuttering, it's more of a hitch. For every X amount of frames that goes by, tf2 seems to "jump" a few frames. It's consistent and extremely annoying, and fucks with me badly. For example, walking in a straight line, I'll get a hitch every 1 or 2 seconds.

Also, when streaming, my mouse seems to resist me, as if the sensitivity was turned down quite a bit. I have to put quite a bit more effort into, for example, looking 90 degrees to the right, than I do when not streaming.

Both of these problems combined means I can't place my crosshair where I want it to be, turn properly, etc. I notice I tend to play a lot of medic while streaming because this makes it near impossible to aim properly with a sniper, scattergun, etc, and I can't land flares because when I turn or look around my crosshair jumps ahead or stays behind where I want it to be, like it's fighting me.

This happens both when previewing the stream and actually streaming. Also, there is no noticeable FPS loss (using steam FPS counter and net_graph) when streaming, which is strange.

I've tried so many different things already. Borderless windowed, lowering stream fps from 60 to 30, changing process priority, using different codecs, changing resolution/bitrate, multithreaded optimizations, different presets, etc.

Does anyone else experience this? Does anyone know of a fix, or at least some sort of test/diagnostic to see whats causing it?

For reference:

Specs:
i7-4790k
GALAX 980ti HoF
16GB RAM
Windows 10 Pro
Also, OBS is loaded on a 512GB SSD (in case that matters)

I stream at 720p 60fps, and I feel like my PC should be able to handle that no problem. Any help is much appreciated!

EDIT: To be clear this happens with both OBS and OBS Studio/Multiplatform. Although I have to actually be streaming with OBS studio for it to show, the preview only causes the same lag in OBS (non-studio), whereas the preview doesn't cause these issues in multiplatform.

Using OpenGL on OBS Studio will drop my FPS to about an unplayable 5-6, even when just using the preview (not streaming), so that's not a viable alternative.

Hey everyone!

I'm not sure if this is the correct subforum, and if it's not please remove it and let me know.

So I've been streaming TF2 for a while now, but every time I do I have this strange lag that I can't quite solve. It's not exactly stuttering, it's more of a hitch. For every X amount of frames that goes by, tf2 seems to "jump" a few frames. It's consistent and extremely annoying, and fucks with me badly. For example, walking in a straight line, I'll get a hitch every 1 or 2 seconds.

Also, when streaming, my mouse seems to resist me, as if the sensitivity was turned down quite a bit. I have to put quite a bit more effort into, for example, looking 90 degrees to the right, than I do when not streaming.

Both of these problems combined means I can't place my crosshair where I want it to be, turn properly, etc. I notice I tend to play a lot of medic while streaming because this makes it near impossible to aim properly with a sniper, scattergun, etc, and I can't land flares because when I turn or look around my crosshair jumps ahead or stays behind where I want it to be, like it's fighting me.

This happens both when previewing the stream and actually streaming. Also, there is no noticeable FPS loss (using steam FPS counter and net_graph) when streaming, which is strange.

I've tried so many different things already. Borderless windowed, lowering stream fps from 60 to 30, changing process priority, using different codecs, changing resolution/bitrate, multithreaded optimizations, different presets, etc.

Does anyone else experience this? Does anyone know of a fix, or at least some sort of test/diagnostic to see whats causing it?

For reference:

Specs:
i7-4790k
GALAX 980ti HoF
16GB RAM
Windows 10 Pro
Also, OBS is loaded on a 512GB SSD (in case that matters)

I stream at 720p 60fps, and I feel like my PC should be able to handle that no problem. Any help is much appreciated!

EDIT: To be clear this happens with both OBS and OBS Studio/Multiplatform. Although I have to actually be streaming with OBS studio for it to show, the preview only causes the same lag in OBS (non-studio), whereas the preview doesn't cause these issues in multiplatform.

Using OpenGL on OBS Studio will drop my FPS to about an unplayable 5-6, even when just using the preview (not streaming), so that's not a viable alternative.
2
#2
1 Frags +

I'd try a different x264 CPU Preset, beyond that I'm not too sure hopefully someone more knowledgeable comes along.

I'd try a different x264 CPU Preset, beyond that I'm not too sure hopefully someone more knowledgeable comes along.
3
#3
0 Frags +
BrenI'd try a different x264 CPU Preset, beyond that I'm not too sure hopefully someone more knowledgeable comes along.

I've tried everything from faster to ultrafast, with no change whatsoever. Also, I've tried NVENC (what I'm currently using) and most of those presets. Same deal.

[quote=Bren]I'd try a different x264 CPU Preset, beyond that I'm not too sure hopefully someone more knowledgeable comes along.[/quote]
I've tried everything from faster to ultrafast, with no change whatsoever. Also, I've tried NVENC (what I'm currently using) and most of those presets. Same deal.
4
#4
1 Frags +

I'd suggest fucking around with your graphics card/display settings in Nvidia control panel. Issues like this seem like they're more likely an issue with graphics card settings. Pre-rendered frames (lower if possible) might be something you want to look at as well as display scaling (No scaling might help). Also try updating or rolling back graphics card drivers.

I'd suggest fucking around with your graphics card/display settings in Nvidia control panel. Issues like this seem like they're more likely an issue with graphics card settings. Pre-rendered frames (lower if possible) might be something you want to look at as well as display scaling (No scaling might help). Also try updating or rolling back graphics card drivers.
5
#5
0 Frags +
ZestyI'd suggest fucking around with your graphics card/display settings in Nvidia control panel. Issues like this seem like they're more likely an issue with graphics card settings. Pre-rendered frames (lower if possible) might be something you want to look at as well as display scaling (No scaling might help). Also try updating or rolling back graphics card drivers.

Pre-rendered frames is set to 1 (lowest), and there is no scaling going on in game or via nvidia control panel. Also this has been an issue ever since I've been streaming, and numerous driver updates have happened since then, so I don't think rolling back would help.

Thank you for your input though! I'll continue to play with Nvidia CP and see if anything changes!

[quote=Zesty]I'd suggest fucking around with your graphics card/display settings in Nvidia control panel. Issues like this seem like they're more likely an issue with graphics card settings. Pre-rendered frames (lower if possible) might be something you want to look at as well as display scaling (No scaling might help). Also try updating or rolling back graphics card drivers.[/quote]

Pre-rendered frames is set to 1 (lowest), and there is no scaling going on in game or via nvidia control panel. Also this has been an issue ever since I've been streaming, and numerous driver updates have happened since then, so I don't think rolling back would help.

Thank you for your input though! I'll continue to play with Nvidia CP and see if anything changes!
6
#6
1 Frags +

It's also worth trying to stream in games that aren't tf2 and seeing if the frame skipping/input lag issue persists. If they don't it might be something to do with TF2. There are some optimization commands related to cpu/gpu usage. Might be worth checking those out or getting rid of your config and testing on default settings.
If you're really stumped, r0ach on overclock.net also has a guide to optimising mouse input for windows. A lot of this I think is placebo and doesn't actually help. I wouldn't reccomend fucking around with the bios settings, but the software section as well as the win 10 section might be worth looking into, don't count on it doing anything though.

It's also worth trying to stream in games that aren't tf2 and seeing if the frame skipping/input lag issue persists. If they don't it might be something to do with TF2. There are some optimization commands related to cpu/gpu usage. Might be worth checking those out or getting rid of your config and testing on default settings.
If you're really stumped, r0ach on overclock.net also has a [url=http://www.overclock.net/t/1433882/gaming-and-mouse-response-bios-optimization-guide-for-modern-pc-hardware]guide[/url] to optimising mouse input for windows. A lot of this I think is placebo and doesn't actually help. I wouldn't reccomend fucking around with the bios settings, but the software section as well as the win 10 section might be worth looking into, don't count on it doing anything though.
7
#7
0 Frags +
ZestyIt's also worth trying to stream in games that aren't tf2 and seeing if the frame skipping/input lag issue persists. If they don't it might be something to do with TF2. There are some optimization commands related to cpu/gpu usage. Might be worth checking those out or getting rid of your config and testing on default settings.
If you're really stumped, r0ach on overclock.net also has a guide to optimising mouse input for windows. A lot of this I think is placebo and doesn't actually help. I wouldn't reccomend fucking around with the bios settings, but the software section as well as the win 10 section might be worth looking into, don't count on it doing anything though.

So far it seems the only other game that gives me issues is the Division, but I've only tested a handful (BF4, Warframe, etc). Witcher 3 runs fine for example, the hitches/mouse resistance isn't there.

I'm also not sure how much that mouse guide will help, because my mouse is normally 100% perfect, at all times except when streaming. However, I will be giving it a read.

Thank you though! I appreciate the response!

[quote=Zesty]It's also worth trying to stream in games that aren't tf2 and seeing if the frame skipping/input lag issue persists. If they don't it might be something to do with TF2. There are some optimization commands related to cpu/gpu usage. Might be worth checking those out or getting rid of your config and testing on default settings.
If you're really stumped, r0ach on overclock.net also has a [url=http://www.overclock.net/t/1433882/gaming-and-mouse-response-bios-optimization-guide-for-modern-pc-hardware]guide[/url] to optimising mouse input for windows. A lot of this I think is placebo and doesn't actually help. I wouldn't reccomend fucking around with the bios settings, but the software section as well as the win 10 section might be worth looking into, don't count on it doing anything though.[/quote]

So far it seems the only other game that gives me issues is the Division, but I've only tested a handful (BF4, Warframe, etc). Witcher 3 runs fine for example, the hitches/mouse resistance isn't there.

I'm also not sure how much that mouse guide will help, because my mouse is normally 100% perfect, at all times except when streaming. However, I will be giving it a read.

Thank you though! I appreciate the response!
8
#8
0 Frags +

Definitely a TF2 issue then.

Are you running it in DX8?

If you're in DX9, do you have Aero Extensions enabled?

Do you run in full screen, windowed, or a borderless window?

Do you have multiple monitors? What's the refresh rate on each one?

Definitely a TF2 issue then.

Are you running it in DX8?

If you're in DX9, do you have Aero Extensions enabled?

Do you run in full screen, windowed, or a borderless window?

Do you have multiple monitors? What's the refresh rate on each one?
9
#9
0 Frags +
yttriumDefinitely a TF2 issue then.

Are you running it in DX8?

If you're in DX9, do you have Aero Extensions enabled?

Do you run in full screen, windowed, or a borderless window?

Do you have multiple monitors? What's the refresh rate on each one?

DX9, not sure about Aero because I was under the impression Aero wasn't a thing in windows 10, unless you mean Aero in reference to something tf2/OBS specific.

When streaming, I play in fullscreen. Borderless windowed while streaming is a nightmare.

I have 2 monitors. The main one (I play tf2 on) is a 165Hz 1440p Gsync IPS (ASUS PG279Q). Second one is a generic 46" LCD TV @ 1080p 60Hz.

[quote=yttrium]Definitely a TF2 issue then.

Are you running it in DX8?

If you're in DX9, do you have Aero Extensions enabled?

Do you run in full screen, windowed, or a borderless window?

Do you have multiple monitors? What's the refresh rate on each one?[/quote]

DX9, not sure about Aero because I was under the impression Aero wasn't a thing in windows 10, unless you mean Aero in reference to something tf2/OBS specific.

When streaming, I play in fullscreen. Borderless windowed while streaming is a nightmare.

I have 2 monitors. The main one (I play tf2 on) is a 165Hz 1440p Gsync IPS (ASUS PG279Q). Second one is a generic 46" LCD TV @ 1080p 60Hz.
10
#10
0 Frags +

Aero is in everything after 7. Aero isn't necessarily the theme - it's really called Desktop Compositing. Aero Extensions are an option in the TF2 advanced video options menu. They should be turned on at all times in DX9.

For the sake of testing, can you downclock the PG279Q to 120Hz, or disconnect the second monitor? One or the other, doesn't matter which.

Aero is in everything after 7. Aero isn't necessarily the theme - it's really called Desktop Compositing. Aero Extensions are an option in the TF2 advanced video options menu. They should be turned on at all times in DX9.

For the sake of testing, can you downclock the PG279Q to 120Hz, or disconnect the second monitor? One or the other, doesn't matter which.
11
#11
0 Frags +
yttriumAero is in everything after 7. Aero isn't necessarily the theme - it's really called Desktop Compositing. Aero Extensions are an option in the TF2 advanced video options menu. They should be turned on at all times in DX9.

For the sake of testing, can you downclock the PG279Q to 120Hz, or disconnect the second monitor? One or the other, doesn't matter which.

Downclocked the PG279Q to 120Hz and the problem persisted. Unplugged the second monitor and my PG279Q wouldn't even clock above 60Hz, strange.

[quote=yttrium]Aero is in everything after 7. Aero isn't necessarily the theme - it's really called Desktop Compositing. Aero Extensions are an option in the TF2 advanced video options menu. They should be turned on at all times in DX9.

For the sake of testing, can you downclock the PG279Q to 120Hz, or disconnect the second monitor? One or the other, doesn't matter which.[/quote]

Downclocked the PG279Q to 120Hz and the problem persisted. Unplugged the second monitor and my PG279Q wouldn't even clock above 60Hz, strange.
12
#12
0 Frags +

try using nvidia nvenc on encoding settings instead of x264

try using nvidia nvenc on encoding settings instead of x264
13
#13
0 Frags +
biscuitstry using nvidia nvenc on encoding settings instead of x264

see post #3

[quote=biscuits]try using nvidia nvenc on encoding settings instead of x264[/quote]
see post #3
14
#14
0 Frags +

Weird, this happens even when just previewing the stream, but not actually capturing any game.

I ran OBS (non-studio) preview with only twitchalerts, spotify (window, subregion capture), text file capture, but no game capture, and the issues persisted. Essentially I was playing tf2 with the stream running, but not capturing tf2 or any other game, and the issues were still there in tf2.

This is fucking with me on a whole other level now.

Weird, this happens even when just previewing the stream, but not actually capturing any game.

I ran OBS (non-studio) preview with only twitchalerts, spotify (window, subregion capture), text file capture, but no game capture, and the issues persisted. Essentially I was playing tf2 with the stream running, but not capturing tf2 or any other game, and the issues were still there in tf2.

This is fucking with me on a whole other level now.
15
#15
0 Frags +

Have you tried lowering the process priority of OBS?

TF2 is very CPU-bound and only actually utilizes a few threads. If OBS has a spike in usage and starts using the same core as TF2, it might cause those hitches that are short enough that the framerate doesn't seem to be affected because it's hurting frame times more than frame rates.

At this point it's very clearly an OBS issue that TF2 is more prone to being affected by than other games. All the other games you listed, while being CPU-bound, are fairly heavily multithreaded and wouldn't be affected by a spike in usage on one thread as much.

Have you tried lowering the process priority of OBS?

TF2 is very CPU-bound and only actually utilizes a few threads. If OBS has a spike in usage and starts using the same core as TF2, it might cause those hitches that are short enough that the framerate doesn't seem to be affected because it's hurting frame times more than frame rates.

At this point it's very clearly an OBS issue that TF2 is more prone to being affected by than other games. All the other games you listed, while being CPU-bound, are fairly heavily multithreaded and wouldn't be affected by a spike in usage on one thread as much.
16
#16
0 Frags +
yttriumHave you tried lowering the process priority of OBS?

TF2 is very CPU-bound and only actually utilizes a few threads. If OBS has a spike in usage and starts using the same core as TF2, it might cause those hitches that are short enough that the framerate doesn't seem to be affected because it's hurting frame times more than frame rates.

At this point it's very clearly an OBS issue that TF2 is more prone to being affected by than other games. All the other games you listed, while being CPU-bound, are fairly heavily multithreaded and wouldn't be affected by a spike in usage on one thread as much.

The thing is, these hitches are consistent. They are always exactly the same space apart and always happen. They don't go away/come back and they don't change their timing.

Lowered process priority class of OBS through all of them and the problem persists. This is what my CPU usage is with OBS process priority class of Idle (lowest), preview running, playing tf2 in fullscreen, while watching a stream. Problem is still there.

http://i.imgur.com/EQuu9Sw.png

I'm beginning to wonder if I should buy an XSplit license, or if this problem will persist through other streaming software.

[quote=yttrium]Have you tried lowering the process priority of OBS?

TF2 is very CPU-bound and only actually utilizes a few threads. If OBS has a spike in usage and starts using the same core as TF2, it might cause those hitches that are short enough that the framerate doesn't seem to be affected because it's hurting frame times more than frame rates.

At this point it's very clearly an OBS issue that TF2 is more prone to being affected by than other games. All the other games you listed, while being CPU-bound, are fairly heavily multithreaded and wouldn't be affected by a spike in usage on one thread as much.[/quote]

The thing is, these hitches are consistent. They are always exactly the same space apart and always happen. They don't go away/come back and they don't change their timing.

Lowered process priority class of OBS through all of them and the problem persists. This is what my CPU usage is with OBS process priority class of Idle (lowest), preview running, playing tf2 in fullscreen, while watching a stream. Problem is still there.


[img]http://i.imgur.com/EQuu9Sw.png[/img]

I'm beginning to wonder if I should buy an XSplit license, or if this problem will persist through other streaming software.
17
#17
0 Frags +

Are you always watching a stream while playing? Don't watch any vids/streams etc while playing, if you are.

Are you always watching a stream while playing? Don't watch any vids/streams etc while playing, if you are.
18
#18
0 Frags +
yukiAre you always watching a stream while playing? Don't watch any vids/streams etc while playing, if you are.

Nope, they are always paused/stopped. This time I left it on just to add some CPU usage.

[quote=yuki]Are you always watching a stream while playing? Don't watch any vids/streams etc while playing, if you are.[/quote]

Nope, they are always paused/stopped. This time I left it on just to add some CPU usage.
19
#19
2 Frags +

I wouldn't say this is a TF2 issue. To me it sounds like a streaming with one PC issue. Sure, an i7 will stream 720/60 "no problem" but what people fail to mention is that you'll still have this slight mouse input lag. Go ask any streamer on one PC and they'll admit that they have this issue. The only way to solve it right now is to get some kind of super computer or stream with two PCs. Most people who stream with one PC just put up with it because it's not THAT bad and it's worth it to stream with good quality. I did it myself for two years before buying the second computer.

I'm pretty sure this input lag is one of the reasons why a lot of the top TF2 players don't stream their big matches. They're willing to stream matches against easier opponents because the input lag won't make much difference on the outcome of the match.

I wouldn't say this is a TF2 issue. To me it sounds like a streaming with one PC issue. Sure, an i7 will stream 720/60 "no problem" but what people fail to mention is that you'll still have this slight mouse input lag. Go ask any streamer on one PC and they'll admit that they have this issue. The only way to solve it right now is to get some kind of super computer or stream with two PCs. Most people who stream with one PC just put up with it because it's not THAT bad and it's worth it to stream with good quality. I did it myself for two years before buying the second computer.

I'm pretty sure this input lag is one of the reasons why a lot of the top TF2 players don't stream their big matches. They're willing to stream matches against easier opponents because the input lag won't make much difference on the outcome of the match.
20
#20
1 Frags +
MR_SLINI wouldn't say this is a TF2 issue. To me it sounds like a streaming with one PC issue. Sure, an i7 will stream 720/60 "no problem" but what people fail to mention is that you'll still have this slight mouse input lag. Go ask any streamer on one PC and they'll admit that they have this issue. The only way to solve it right now is to get some kind of super computer or stream with two PCs. Most people who stream with one PC just put up with it because it's not THAT bad and it's worth it to stream with good quality. I did it myself for two years before buying the second computer.

I'm pretty sure this input lag is one of the reasons why a lot of the top TF2 players don't stream their big matches. They're willing to stream matches against easier opponents because the input lag won't make much difference on the outcome of the match.

I was kinda leaning toward this idea. I was wondering if maybe there was some sort of dedicated streaming hardware I could use, like a PCI-E card or something similar. Maybe a blackmagic or avermedia card, but I don't know much about them. I don't really have the cash to fork over for a new PC, especially since I'll be moving soon, but I might be able to come up with something.

Are there any specific reputable guides out there you could point me to, for configuring/using a dual PC streaming setup?

I might just end up sucking it up because I'm not sure if it's honestly worth the effort.

[quote=MR_SLIN]I wouldn't say this is a TF2 issue. To me it sounds like a streaming with one PC issue. Sure, an i7 will stream 720/60 "no problem" but what people fail to mention is that you'll still have this slight mouse input lag. Go ask any streamer on one PC and they'll admit that they have this issue. The only way to solve it right now is to get some kind of super computer or stream with two PCs. Most people who stream with one PC just put up with it because it's not THAT bad and it's worth it to stream with good quality. I did it myself for two years before buying the second computer.

I'm pretty sure this input lag is one of the reasons why a lot of the top TF2 players don't stream their big matches. They're willing to stream matches against easier opponents because the input lag won't make much difference on the outcome of the match.[/quote]

I was kinda leaning toward this idea. I was wondering if maybe there was some sort of dedicated streaming hardware I could use, like a PCI-E card or something similar. Maybe a blackmagic or avermedia card, but I don't know much about them. I don't really have the cash to fork over for a new PC, especially since I'll be moving soon, but I might be able to come up with something.

Are there any specific reputable guides out there you could point me to, for configuring/using a dual PC streaming setup?

I might just end up sucking it up because I'm not sure if it's honestly worth the effort.
21
#21
0 Frags +

Most of the dedicated capture cards do have their own encoders built in, but honestly the thing to do is to just put the capture card in a second computer like SLIN said.

Most of the dedicated capture cards do have their own encoders built in, but honestly the thing to do is to just put the capture card in a second computer like SLIN said.
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