It was.

But I spoke to dashner just now and got some of that information. I was largely unaware of how you tried to be part of i58 and TOTH but couldn't.

I reflected this morning on why I made this post, and it was largely to defend my friend Kurt. He wouldn't want or ask me to do it (in fact he'd probably rather I shut up). But I still feel burned-by-proxy on how all our talent in NA immediately fled for OW, while Kurt was breaking his back trying to find out who the hell could still do TF2 casts for Invite, and getting not even courtesy answers from people to say "I'm doing OW now sorry". Just getting silence, which I found completely rude and disrespectful.

Gonna cut it short there, but I welcome you to chat me up on Steam or wherever if you want to discuss it further. I offer you my heartfelt apologies. Much love.

In Overwatch there is a lot of spam though, due to big clip sizes, fast reloads and unlimited ammo. Projectiles are faster than in TF2 and also there are more light effects and shiny stuff.

can we just talk about how Thorin is asking a question about a game we love?
lol

I'm just curious as to why thorin wants to know, i doubt it's because he wants to compare it to overwatch because he's not the kind to jump on bandwagons like "overwatch new tf2" et cetera. It's very unlikely but i hope it's for a thorins thoughts video on tf2 matchmaking

Apparently he is cohosting a new Overwatch focused podcast, starting tonight https://twitter.com/MonteCristo/status/787524345287483392. My guess is he will be criticizing the spectator experience in OW and discussing ways to improve it maybe with some insight from the way it was done in TF2.

https://twitter.com/IAmKnew/status/787487773775257600
Is this guy serious?

it's okay he's knew

edit i missed the "than in." still happy to argue with earlier posts that "it's not as easy to sit down and watch as csgo is but its certainly no worse than tf2 is"

You're saying there's more shiny stuff in TF2? I don't see how that could possibly be true, the only shiny things in TF2 are the control points, ubercharges, and kritz. In OW it seems like almost every character has its own form of shiny thing. Mercy alone has 3 shiny things, between ult, damage and health boost. I think TF2 does a better job explaining those things visually as well.

I also strongly disagree that TF2 is just as hard to sit down and watch as OW. Fuck I was visiting my grandparents during the grand finals of i58. They were curious about what I kept glancing at on my phone, and I got them to understand the basic gist of what was going on within a few minutes: "Red and blue shoot each other, and they stand on the ground until it turns their color. When they have all the ground they win." Nothing else really needs explaining. You have some very basic weapons that sometimes do silly things based on cartoon logic. Shotguns and bombs and rockets are all self explanatory, and understanding rocket jumping is really just as simple as hearing the phrase "rocket jumping." Understanding the heal beam is easy when you realize it originates from the class called the medic (who has a big red cross on his back), ubercharge and kritz are clearly powerups based on visuals, and everything else is just fluff you don't need to know unless you are trying to play it yourself.

I don't know where I'd start with OW. You can kind of say "blue shoots red," except those colors switch off constantly for the spectator. KOTH is relatively easy to explain, but only getting the payload after capturing a point is weird. And each character, while most of them do the same thing as a few other characters, does it in a way that is so different that the similarities are completely invisible to a spectator. You just have a billion different combinations of heroes running around, and while they're clearly shooting at each other, a new spectator will not have any idea what's going on for more than a few seconds at a time. Every ult is something new they have to figure out, every team push there are 3 or 4 at a time they have to try to distinguish. I'm not saying OW is complicated; it's not, but there's so much shit going on, with such a variety, that there's no way you can just sit down and see what's happening.

TF2 has plenty of shit going on as well, but the complexity comes from how it's used and really isn't visible until you play with it yourself. Every time you see a rocket, you know exactly which type of character launched it, because there's only 1 type of guy with a rocket launcher. Sure, in OW the only guy with rockets is Pharah, but you're way less likely to figure that out with 11 other heroes on the field shooting their own whacky projectiles. For TF2, the most complicated thing I can think of from the spectator's view are the ubercharges, but I don't think those are difficult to figure out. That's not only because they're easy to explain verbally, but because the visual cue provided with it is so clear. A powered up dude is totally shiny. A powered up weapon shoots shiny projectiles. In no other situation will those guys and things be shiny.

he's saying there is more effects and shiny stuff in overwatch than in tf2

Why would anyone think he should talk to someone who only produced TF2 in recent times? The way the game is spectated has changed and evolved massively over the years, if you can't explain how we got to where we are now your information isn't as valuable.

I don't think that's true, other than mentioning that we moved away from Byte's classic 3rd person cams that zoomed around (which OW already has moved on from because it's obvious) and don't have the casters do the cam like Arx and Beta at iseries (OW also doesn't do because obvious) the producers have done or seen everything else. The reasons we do camerawork like this makes sense of itself, you don't have to prove it from first principles.

Anyone who has done camerawork in recent years has seen cheat feed developed, done online and offline work, experimented with static cams in statusspec, seen or tried the dual demo rollout cams, seen the rise of Jon's plugins to allow health/outlines/names etc. Anything before i49 is useless to discuss from an OW point of view, the tech was garbage and the camerawork in OW is already beyond that point.