I can't be fucked to compile it, here is the .vmf file so you can do it yourself: https://www.dropbox.com/s/lkllq255fko4zl1/cp_prolands_b5.vmf?dl=0

EDIT: Didn't mean it in an agressive way. I'm lazy and it takes like an hour to compile the map properly again.

Fair enough, I will make an official statement regarding the map: there will be no new major changes. From this point forward it will only be bug fixes, and possibly reverting some things. Only possible change for the future is to make the spire hitbox to be more accurate. Other than that I will leave the map as it is. With that said I overreacted to some of the criticism, please feel free to keep talking about the map.

don't get me wrong, i'm one of the last people who like the map and i'd like to see it played but changing everything that comes to mind won't make badlands popular again[/quote]
Well, I wouldn't agree with you. Default badlands is incredibly flawed in a multitude of ways. I personally don't care if the map changes slightly as long as it gets improved over its previous state. You comparing it to granary pro is quite silly really, as the changes there are way more drastic, without even looking at the most recent version where the control point is in yard. This all being said, I wish each individual change would be discussed on its own merits, and I believe it largely has.

I made props in ceiling nonsolid and made it easier to push in and out of last by expanding the doorways. (Removed ONE sticky trap)

Only hiding spot I removed is the lamps, and removing them has gotten positive feedback both because checking every lamp for hiders is silly and it's annoying to get stuck on them (they prohibit movement).

re-added in b4, please read patch notes folks.

The goal I set was to be able to push last when you wipe a team on second, and to push out of last when you wipe a team on last. As far as I'm aware these new spawn times accomplished that. If you think they can be fine tuned a bit, that's fine, but why people don't actually give out the feedback but instead post angry comments when I talk about the map baffles me.

Are you talking about ones that are already made, or the ones I'm considering?

I don't know if you realised, but in b4 I did revert some of the changes around spire that people didn't like. For some reason etf2l chose to keep playing b3 for the season.

B5 out!

(Dropbox) Download: https://www.dropbox.com/s/57kh7t1vn3dx765/cp_prolands_b5.zip?dl=0

cp_prolands_b4b -> cp_prolands_b5

- Fixed two instances of map not being properly mirrored.
- Replaced the disgraceful concrete block I put on spire, with a wooden platform.

The reason I delayed these (minor) changes is because I've been looking for a way to make the spire "hitbox" more accurate, and the only way to do that properly, is to redo the prop entirely, so it alligns with the hammer grid. This would not mean huge changes to how the prop actually functions in game, biggest difference would be that it would be accurate. If anyone here has 3D modelling skills who wants to help with this minor and fairly insignificant task, feel free to contact me.

On another note, I've been thinking about changing the elevation around the spire area slightly to make a small terrain "ramp" that you could rocket jump off, which also would serve the purpose to allow for smooth walking (without jumping) up the spire. I mean, these changes are fairly trivial so they are likely not worth the effort.

Also, does anyone have an opinion on how to make last a bit more easy to push? I've been thinking about doing something a bit more radical: Raising the roof on last and in top lobby by quite a lot. Imagine the height of the roof in last & lobby on a map like reckoner for instance. I think there might be a split opinion on this but I want to try new things to make it more possible to push last, especially when your opponents have 2-3 offclasses + loose cannon. Perhaps something similar could be done to bottom left? Ultimately I am not comfortable working on these changes without a large approval.

How do I update a map? If literally only know how to upload. Gonna roll out b5 thus weekend, only with minor bug fixes and a small change.

But they're practicing for the future shotgun roamer meta

I literally explained why your mainclass is relevant, and you also ignored my other points completely.

There's still a B-Pug now, just in amateur or beginner? Which means lesser skilled players don't have to wait for better drafts to end and pugs can go on continously.

EDIT: Trying to formulate the post better

Medic mains in PugChamp have been scarce, we all know that. Due to the fact medic mains who add up on medic almost always get picked, it means that you are used to actually playing in most pugs you add up to. As you rightfully pointed out, there is no way to get fatkidded on tf2pl, which sometimes leads to them getting the spot in the pug instead of you. You may miss out on the occational pugs, but the players who usually get fatkidded get to play a fair share of games. I do believe this is a more fair way for pugs to work, feel free to disagree.

Nonsense, almost nobody went to pugchamp the first 2 weeks. I think the community weren't split as much as the people who want to play for fun or with their mates didn't add up. (even though it's ez to play with mates, just add up at the same time lol)

Where did I guilt trip you into playing faceit? Please sprite

Maybe because medic mains almost always get picked? PugChamp only offers higher amount of games for the players who either A) always add up to captain or B) always get picked by captains.

EDIT: To clarify, for me personally, the experience was I got to play more pugs and they were all higher quality.

EDIT 2: To elaborate further, it's because people get fatkidded and have to wait for the current draft + server assigning to occur before even getting a chance at getting picked again. Where it starts to suck even more is if you get fatkidded in the second draft too and there's not enough players for a third draft. To some players this leads to getting fatkidded in almost every draft. The way people circumvent this is adding to pugs way above their skill level, ruining the game for everyone. I can't begin to tell you guys how often theres a mid player being the captain in a prem-level pug. Often he doesn't even know which players are best and his team gets rolled, or his own skill level is just enough to do that.

And even if there were enough players for the third draft, sometimes the second and first draft collectively take like 20 minutes because people kill or are really slow to pick. So if you don't get picked in the first draft you have to wait 10 minutes for the 2nd draft to start, then 5 minutes for draft to finish, then 3 minutes for server to get assigned, and then 15 minutes for the last asshole to join the server and ready up. So basically in the time you could have played an entire pug, you spend waiting for your pug to start. And pug quality is rather inconsistent as well, often being rolls due to incompetent captains (not me) or players from radically different skill levels playing. So instead of playing one bad pug every hour I prefer faceit where I can play one decent pug every 45 minutes.

EDIT 3:

This is in my opinion the most valid criticism of tf2pl. I don't know how to fix this issue though, and if tf2pl want to succeed it is something they will have to adress ASAP.

You're saying I'll be one of the biggest DJ acts in the world? cool

Premiership team 'LOWPANDER' mainclassed in Division 1 and I felt very ashamed and yes a little nauseated to be playing in the same league as such flagrant sandbaggers thankfully though we did not get rolled 5-0 on both maps.

Bugs to crush

I don't know if the issue is on my end but I cannot log into the site, tried it on different browsers so idk. Anyone got a solution?

NightOWL GOD