Thoughts after the great western shuffle has pretty much unfolded completely. I predict EG to suffer mostly in the support department as I think Aui is a definite downgrade. I also think that Sumail will probably make a decent amount of "greedy" mistakes however I think they might resemble the older EG when arteezy played more morph, sf, etc. New Secret roster I think will be very strong as much as I am disappointed that Arteezy and zai left EG (I'm an EG fanboy). The new c9 roster I think is an upgrade for the most part. I think misery fits in well filling in for the farming support role that aui left a gap for. I think notail is also a straight upgrade to pld. Just I wanna know everyone elses thoughts
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Thoughts after the great western shuffle has pretty much unfolded completely. I predict EG to suffer mostly in the support department as I think Aui is a definite downgrade. I also think that Sumail will probably make a decent amount of "greedy" mistakes however I think they might resemble the older EG when arteezy played more morph, sf, etc. New Secret roster I think will be very strong as much as I am disappointed that Arteezy and zai left EG (I'm an EG fanboy). The new c9 roster I think is an upgrade for the most part. I think misery fits in well filling in for the farming support role that aui left a gap for. I think notail is also a straight upgrade to pld. Just I wanna know everyone elses thoughts
am sad notail left secret, but happy arteezy joined, my heart is confused :<
am sad notail left secret, but happy arteezy joined, my heart is confused :<
Team secret grand finals for ti5 but first we have to see this mini international first to see how they perform
Team secret grand finals for ti5 but first we have to see this mini international first to see how they perform
lol what c9 is a straight downgrade. PLD and Aui made that team and as much as people like to suck notail's dick he's not gonna fill the gap. Misery has had 1 successful tournament in his entire Dota2 career and from what I hear he's incredibly toxic. This is the end of c9 being the 2nd best western taem.
Secret looks good on paper but it all depends on how they play their roles. kky is a great support but I feel like part of the reason he wanted to make Secret was to play carry again. If Secret actually play to their max potential they are probably the best western team
EG is a bit of a mystery. imo Aui = Zai in skill and Aui's more proven, plus I don't think he has the same motivation issues as Zai. I don't know anything about Sumail but the last time EG brought in a young star we all saw how they dominated so I'm sure its possible for them to be good. Then again there was the pre-sadboys roster with MSS that was complete shit so who knows. If things aren't going good I expect Aui and Fear to swap roles before any other roster changes happen.
Anyways next few months of dota =
http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/293/590/6f6.gif
lol what c9 is a straight downgrade. PLD and Aui made that team and as much as people like to suck notail's dick he's not gonna fill the gap. Misery has had 1 successful tournament in his entire Dota2 career and from what I hear he's incredibly toxic. This is the end of c9 being the 2nd best western taem.
Secret looks good on paper but it all depends on how they play their roles. kky is a great support but I feel like part of the reason he wanted to make Secret was to play carry again. If Secret actually play to their max potential they are probably the best western team
EG is a bit of a mystery. imo Aui = Zai in skill and Aui's more proven, plus I don't think he has the same motivation issues as Zai. I don't know anything about Sumail but the last time EG brought in a young star we all saw how they dominated so I'm sure its possible for them to be good. Then again there was the pre-sadboys roster with MSS that was complete shit so who knows. If things aren't going good I expect Aui and Fear to swap roles before any other roster changes happen.
Anyways next few months of dota =
[img]http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/293/590/6f6.gif[/img]
Secret looks good on paper but it all depends on how they play their roles. kky is a great support but I feel like part of the reason he wanted to make Secret was to play carry again. If Secret actually play to their max potential they are probably the best western team
EG is a bit of a mystery. imo Aui = Zai in skill and Aui's more proven, plus I don't think he has the same motivation issues as Zai. I don't know anything about Sumail but the last time EG brought in a young star we all saw how they dominated so I'm sure its possible for them to be good. Then again there was the pre-sadboys roster with MSS that was complete shit so who knows. If things aren't going good I expect Aui and Fear to swap roles before any other roster changes happen.
Anyways next few months of dota =
[img]http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/293/590/6f6.gif[/img]
sleeepylol what c9 is a straight downgrade. PLD and Aui made that team and as much as people like to suck notail's dick he's not gonna fill the gap. Misery has had 1 successful tournament in his entire Dota2 career and from what I hear he's incredibly toxic. This is the end of c9 being the 2nd best western taem.
Secret looks good on paper but it all depends on how they play their roles. kky is a great support but I feel like part of the reason he wanted to make Secret was to play carry again. If Secret actually play to their max potential they are probably the best western team
EG is a bit of a mystery. imo Aui = Zai in skill and Aui's more proven, plus I don't think he has the same motivation issues as Zai. I don't know anything about Sumail but the last time EG brought in a young star we all saw how they dominated so I'm sure its possible for them to be good. Then again there was the pre-sadboys roster with MSS that was complete shit so who knows. If things aren't going good I expect Aui and Fear to swap roles before any other roster changes happen.
Anyways next few months of dota =
http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/293/590/6f6.gif
what c9 did wasn't a downgrade if anything its gonna turn out to be better for them because their supports will make more space in the early game instead of stacking and farming. just watch the 4 games tonight... granted the NA teams are tier 2 and no where near as good as c9 but the way they played speaks for itself
[quote=sleeepy]lol what c9 is a straight downgrade. PLD and Aui made that team and as much as people like to suck notail's dick he's not gonna fill the gap. Misery has had 1 successful tournament in his entire Dota2 career and from what I hear he's incredibly toxic. This is the end of c9 being the 2nd best western taem.
Secret looks good on paper but it all depends on how they play their roles. kky is a great support but I feel like part of the reason he wanted to make Secret was to play carry again. If Secret actually play to their max potential they are probably the best western team
EG is a bit of a mystery. imo Aui = Zai in skill and Aui's more proven, plus I don't think he has the same motivation issues as Zai. I don't know anything about Sumail but the last time EG brought in a young star we all saw how they dominated so I'm sure its possible for them to be good. Then again there was the pre-sadboys roster with MSS that was complete shit so who knows. If things aren't going good I expect Aui and Fear to swap roles before any other roster changes happen.
Anyways next few months of dota =
[img]http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/293/590/6f6.gif[/img][/quote]
what c9 did wasn't a downgrade if anything its gonna turn out to be better for them because their supports will make more space in the early game instead of stacking and farming. just watch the 4 games tonight... granted the NA teams are tier 2 and no where near as good as c9 but the way they played speaks for itself
Secret looks good on paper but it all depends on how they play their roles. kky is a great support but I feel like part of the reason he wanted to make Secret was to play carry again. If Secret actually play to their max potential they are probably the best western team
EG is a bit of a mystery. imo Aui = Zai in skill and Aui's more proven, plus I don't think he has the same motivation issues as Zai. I don't know anything about Sumail but the last time EG brought in a young star we all saw how they dominated so I'm sure its possible for them to be good. Then again there was the pre-sadboys roster with MSS that was complete shit so who knows. If things aren't going good I expect Aui and Fear to swap roles before any other roster changes happen.
Anyways next few months of dota =
[img]http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/293/590/6f6.gif[/img][/quote]
what c9 did wasn't a downgrade if anything its gonna turn out to be better for them because their supports will make more space in the early game instead of stacking and farming. just watch the 4 games tonight... granted the NA teams are tier 2 and no where near as good as c9 but the way they played speaks for itself
#7
Except that's not how c9 plays. Envy used to always ditch the lane and jungle as early as possible and give Aui room to farm. In return Aui has a much higher game impact than other supports in the mid and late game. c9 never won early.
Now you have 2 players who always played the 4 position. So who's gonna get the farm (and not use it as well as Aui as Aui > notail and Misery) and who's gonna play the PLD 6 position? If they keep the same style they won't be as good with the new lineup. If they change their style how does that impact the rest of the players? I just don't see how this c9 is better than the old one.
#7
Except that's not how c9 plays. Envy used to always ditch the lane and jungle as early as possible and give Aui room to farm. In return Aui has a much higher game impact than other supports in the mid and late game. c9 never won early.
Now you have 2 players who always played the 4 position. So who's gonna get the farm (and not use it as well as Aui as Aui > notail and Misery) and who's gonna play the PLD 6 position? If they keep the same style they won't be as good with the new lineup. If they change their style how does that impact the rest of the players? I just don't see how this c9 is better than the old one.
Except that's not how c9 plays. Envy used to always ditch the lane and jungle as early as possible and give Aui room to farm. In return Aui has a much higher game impact than other supports in the mid and late game. c9 never won early.
Now you have 2 players who always played the 4 position. So who's gonna get the farm (and not use it as well as Aui as Aui > notail and Misery) and who's gonna play the PLD 6 position? If they keep the same style they won't be as good with the new lineup. If they change their style how does that impact the rest of the players? I just don't see how this c9 is better than the old one.
sleeepy#7
Except that's not how c9 plays. Envy used to always ditch the lane and jungle as early as possible and give Aui room to farm. In return Aui has a much higher game impact than other supports in the mid and late game. c9 never won early.
Now you have 2 players who always played the 4 position. So who's gonna get the farm (and not use it as well as Aui as Aui > notail and Misery) and who's gonna play the PLD 6 position? If they keep the same style they won't be as good with the new lineup. If they change their style how does that impact the rest of the players? I just don't see how this c9 is better than the old one.
watch the games tonight and get back to me cause your currently talking out of your ass
[quote=sleeepy]#7
Except that's not how c9 plays. Envy used to always ditch the lane and jungle as early as possible and give Aui room to farm. In return Aui has a much higher game impact than other supports in the mid and late game. c9 never won early.
Now you have 2 players who always played the 4 position. So who's gonna get the farm (and not use it as well as Aui as Aui > notail and Misery) and who's gonna play the PLD 6 position? If they keep the same style they won't be as good with the new lineup. If they change their style how does that impact the rest of the players? I just don't see how this c9 is better than the old one.[/quote]
watch the games tonight and get back to me cause your currently talking out of your ass
Except that's not how c9 plays. Envy used to always ditch the lane and jungle as early as possible and give Aui room to farm. In return Aui has a much higher game impact than other supports in the mid and late game. c9 never won early.
Now you have 2 players who always played the 4 position. So who's gonna get the farm (and not use it as well as Aui as Aui > notail and Misery) and who's gonna play the PLD 6 position? If they keep the same style they won't be as good with the new lineup. If they change their style how does that impact the rest of the players? I just don't see how this c9 is better than the old one.[/quote]
watch the games tonight and get back to me cause your currently talking out of your ass
#9
Hey great job not responding to my points. I like how you used a 4 game sample size to judge a new roster, especially when they are 4 online games vs tier 2 NA teams. I think you should look into being an esports coach, I feel that there are many teams out there that could benefit from your extensive insight. Keep up the good work!
#9
Hey great job not responding to my points. I like how you used a 4 game sample size to judge a new roster, especially when they are 4 online games vs tier 2 NA teams. I think you should look into being an esports coach, I feel that there are many teams out there that could benefit from your extensive insight. Keep up the good work!
Hey great job not responding to my points. I like how you used a 4 game sample size to judge a new roster, especially when they are 4 online games vs tier 2 NA teams. I think you should look into being an esports coach, I feel that there are many teams out there that could benefit from your extensive insight. Keep up the good work!
sleeepy#9
Hey great job not responding to my points. I like how you used a 4 game sample size to judge a new roster, especially when they are 4 online games vs tier 2 NA teams. I think you should look into being an esports coach, I feel that there are many teams out there that could benefit from your extensive insight. Keep up the good work!
they are against tier 2 NA teams but if you watched the games or any games of n0tail you'd know that he can function easily at the 5 and misery has always played as the 4 and can be aggressive early while still keeping up on his farm. your acting like players know how to play 1 style and 1 way only.. they'll be better in the long run for making this change
[quote=sleeepy]#9
Hey great job not responding to my points. I like how you used a 4 game sample size to judge a new roster, especially when they are 4 online games vs tier 2 NA teams. I think you should look into being an esports coach, I feel that there are many teams out there that could benefit from your extensive insight. Keep up the good work![/quote]
they are against tier 2 NA teams but if you watched the games or any games of n0tail you'd know that he can function easily at the 5 and misery has always played as the 4 and can be aggressive early while still keeping up on his farm. your acting like players know how to play 1 style and 1 way only.. they'll be better in the long run for making this change
Hey great job not responding to my points. I like how you used a 4 game sample size to judge a new roster, especially when they are 4 online games vs tier 2 NA teams. I think you should look into being an esports coach, I feel that there are many teams out there that could benefit from your extensive insight. Keep up the good work![/quote]
they are against tier 2 NA teams but if you watched the games or any games of n0tail you'd know that he can function easily at the 5 and misery has always played as the 4 and can be aggressive early while still keeping up on his farm. your acting like players know how to play 1 style and 1 way only.. they'll be better in the long run for making this change
if there's anything c9 is good at doing it's pulling new shit out of their ass and making it work somehow (bone7 offlane spectre??????????)
if there's anything c9 is good at doing it's pulling new shit out of their ass and making it work somehow (bone7 offlane spectre??????????)
Saberif there's anything c9 is good at doing it's pulling new shit out of their ass and making it work somehow (bone7 offlane spectre??????????)
bone's super difficult to play against because he does unpredictable shit like that. this is the guy who made stacking nulls on furion and mom batrider work (to the point where teams will still respect ban bat against c9), dude's incredible at dota in a weird way.
[quote=Saber]if there's anything c9 is good at doing it's pulling new shit out of their ass and making it work somehow (bone7 offlane spectre??????????)[/quote]
bone's super difficult to play against because he does unpredictable shit like that. this is the guy who made stacking nulls on furion and mom batrider work (to the point where teams will still respect ban bat against c9), dude's incredible at dota in a weird way.
bone's super difficult to play against because he does unpredictable shit like that. this is the guy who made stacking nulls on furion and mom batrider work (to the point where teams will still respect ban bat against c9), dude's incredible at dota in a weird way.
c9 will never be a bad team as long as they have bone7 and FATA
c9 will never be a bad team as long as they have bone7 and FATA
I think c9 will remain the same level as Notail is a really fucking good support, PLD has been having a few off games and never really found the same form from Kaipi/Speedgaming where he was out of this world.
Misery is the main reason that will stop c9 being a top team, he might have a lot of experience but from people saying his attitude isn't right and I think his time in Alliance wasn't really anything amazing, he was pretty decent with LGD.Int though so who knows he might have found a team that will really let him shine.
EG I think will struggle at the start but will probably become dominant again, I think in some ways it might benefit them as Fear can actually play carry heroes and Sumail will play mid heroes, mason pretty much was restricted to potm, storm spirit, brewmaster on the safe lane whilst rtz played more farming oriented heroes in mid.
Secret seem pretty strong but I think it depends on who plays what role, I'd have to say kky would have to go back to support and have 1. rtz 2. s4 3.zai as I can't really see s4 trying offlane again and zai has experience playing offlane anyway.
I do kinda feel that these changes aren't really making any team that much stronger though, I can't see them really fighting against the top chinese teams but who knows.
Turns out my thoughts on secrets lineup was right (i swear i didnt see the announcement!).
Team Secret
1. Artour 'Arteezy' Babaev
2. Gustav 's4' Magnusson
3. Ludwig 'zai' Wåhlberg
4. Clement 'Puppey' Ivanov
5. Kuro 'KuroKy' Salehi Takhasomi
Only thing that concerns me with Secret now is #1 rtz being in NA and practice times and #2 whether or not Puppey will actually follow the more farmed support role.
I think c9 will remain the same level as Notail is a really fucking good support, PLD has been having a few off games and never really found the same form from Kaipi/Speedgaming where he was out of this world.
Misery is the main reason that will stop c9 being a top team, he might have a lot of experience but from people saying his attitude isn't right and I think his time in Alliance wasn't really anything amazing, he was pretty decent with LGD.Int though so who knows he might have found a team that will really let him shine.
EG I think will struggle at the start but will probably become dominant again, I think in some ways it might benefit them as Fear can actually play carry heroes and Sumail will play mid heroes, mason pretty much was restricted to potm, storm spirit, brewmaster on the safe lane whilst rtz played more farming oriented heroes in mid.
Secret seem pretty strong but I think it depends on who plays what role, I'd have to say kky would have to go back to support and have 1. rtz 2. s4 3.zai as I can't really see s4 trying offlane again and zai has experience playing offlane anyway.
I do kinda feel that these changes aren't really making any team that much stronger though, I can't see them really fighting against the top chinese teams but who knows.
Turns out my thoughts on secrets lineup was right (i swear i didnt see the announcement!).
Team Secret
1. Artour 'Arteezy' Babaev
2. Gustav 's4' Magnusson
3. Ludwig 'zai' Wåhlberg
4. Clement 'Puppey' Ivanov
5. Kuro 'KuroKy' Salehi Takhasomi
Only thing that concerns me with Secret now is #1 rtz being in NA and practice times and #2 whether or not Puppey will actually follow the more farmed support role.
Misery is the main reason that will stop c9 being a top team, he might have a lot of experience but from people saying his attitude isn't right and I think his time in Alliance wasn't really anything amazing, he was pretty decent with LGD.Int though so who knows he might have found a team that will really let him shine.
EG I think will struggle at the start but will probably become dominant again, I think in some ways it might benefit them as Fear can actually play carry heroes and Sumail will play mid heroes, mason pretty much was restricted to potm, storm spirit, brewmaster on the safe lane whilst rtz played more farming oriented heroes in mid.
Secret seem pretty strong but I think it depends on who plays what role, I'd have to say kky would have to go back to support and have 1. rtz 2. s4 3.zai as I can't really see s4 trying offlane again and zai has experience playing offlane anyway.
I do kinda feel that these changes aren't really making any team that much stronger though, I can't see them really fighting against the top chinese teams but who knows.
Turns out my thoughts on secrets lineup was right (i swear i didnt see the announcement!).
Team Secret
1. Artour 'Arteezy' Babaev
2. Gustav 's4' Magnusson
3. Ludwig 'zai' Wåhlberg
4. Clement 'Puppey' Ivanov
5. Kuro 'KuroKy' Salehi Takhasomi
Only thing that concerns me with Secret now is #1 rtz being in NA and practice times and #2 whether or not Puppey will actually follow the more farmed support role.
i think c9 is basically the same level with notail, i think he's a top end support along with aui2k.
EG should be pretty weak for a while, and im not sure if this trade is going to help them. rtz was genuinely an insanely good mid player who farmed well and all that. i don't doubt fear, but im not sure if EG will be at their same level as before
secret is much stronger. kky was a great carry but highly overrated, and rtz should do a lot better than kky. with zai on offlane(?) i would imagine is a huge upgrade from simbaaa, who could really only play tide and prophet from what i saw
i think all of these teams will either come out stronger or even, but i think none of them can beat Vici at the moment, they are incredibly scary
i think c9 is basically the same level with notail, i think he's a top end support along with aui2k.
EG should be pretty weak for a while, and im not sure if this trade is going to help them. rtz was genuinely an insanely good mid player who farmed well and all that. i don't doubt fear, but im not sure if EG will be at their same level as before
secret is much stronger. kky was a great carry but highly overrated, and rtz should do a lot better than kky. with zai on offlane(?) i would imagine is a huge upgrade from simbaaa, who could really only play tide and prophet from what i saw
i think all of these teams will either come out stronger or even, but i think none of them can beat Vici at the moment, they are incredibly scary
EG should be pretty weak for a while, and im not sure if this trade is going to help them. rtz was genuinely an insanely good mid player who farmed well and all that. i don't doubt fear, but im not sure if EG will be at their same level as before
secret is much stronger. kky was a great carry but highly overrated, and rtz should do a lot better than kky. with zai on offlane(?) i would imagine is a huge upgrade from simbaaa, who could really only play tide and prophet from what i saw
i think all of these teams will either come out stronger or even, but i think none of them can beat Vici at the moment, they are incredibly scary
unfdo you have a VOD link to these games?
they're being broadcast by BTS so some vods are on their youtube right now : https://www.youtube.com/user/beyondthesummittv
rest can be found on twitch: http://www.twitch.tv/beyondthesummit/profile/past_broadcasts
the NA qualifier grand final is starting in a half hour on that channel
didn't comment on the secret roster but it looks really freaking good on paper and should click instantly since all of those players are incredibly smart and flexible. i think the EG roster is gonna take some time for everyone to adjust but once it does it should be fine. i'd contend eg,c9, secret should be the 3 best western teams heading into ti5 as i dont think theres anyone else even close to them in the west at their best. tinkers new roster looks awful btw..
[quote=unf]do you have a VOD link to these games?[/quote]
they're being broadcast by BTS so some vods are on their youtube right now : https://www.youtube.com/user/beyondthesummittv
rest can be found on twitch: http://www.twitch.tv/beyondthesummit/profile/past_broadcasts
the NA qualifier grand final is starting in a half hour on that channel
didn't comment on the secret roster but it looks really freaking good on paper and should click instantly since all of those players are incredibly smart and flexible. i think the EG roster is gonna take some time for everyone to adjust but once it does it should be fine. i'd contend eg,c9, secret should be the 3 best western teams heading into ti5 as i dont think theres anyone else even close to them in the west at their best. tinkers new roster looks awful btw..
they're being broadcast by BTS so some vods are on their youtube right now : https://www.youtube.com/user/beyondthesummittv
rest can be found on twitch: http://www.twitch.tv/beyondthesummit/profile/past_broadcasts
the NA qualifier grand final is starting in a half hour on that channel
didn't comment on the secret roster but it looks really freaking good on paper and should click instantly since all of those players are incredibly smart and flexible. i think the EG roster is gonna take some time for everyone to adjust but once it does it should be fine. i'd contend eg,c9, secret should be the 3 best western teams heading into ti5 as i dont think theres anyone else even close to them in the west at their best. tinkers new roster looks awful btw..
speaking of dota rosters, look at this new chinese team...
speaking of dota rosters, look at this new chinese team...
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God
stonedchinamanspeaking of dota rosters, look at this new chinese team...
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God
holy shit that roster
and I thought TI4 DK was a super team
[quote=stonedchinaman]speaking of dota rosters, look at this new chinese team...
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God[/quote]
holy shit that roster
and I thought TI4 DK was a super team
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God[/quote]
holy shit that roster
and I thought TI4 DK was a super team
Lunacidestonedchinamanspeaking of dota rosters, look at this new chinese team...
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God
holy shit that roster
and I thought TI4 DK was a super team
they arent a serious team i think that was only for one event
[quote=Lunacide][quote=stonedchinaman]speaking of dota rosters, look at this new chinese team...
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God[/quote]
holy shit that roster
and I thought TI4 DK was a super team[/quote]
they arent a serious team i think that was only for one event
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God[/quote]
holy shit that roster
and I thought TI4 DK was a super team[/quote]
they arent a serious team i think that was only for one event
stonedchinamanspeaking of dota rosters, look at this new chinese team...
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God
How many times are they going to fucking retire?
[quote=stonedchinaman]speaking of dota rosters, look at this new chinese team...
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God[/quote]
How many times are they going to fucking retire?
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Big_God[/quote]
How many times are they going to fucking retire?
Bump for rtz's insights on stream (transcript is somewhere on reddit too) http://www.twitch.tv/arteezy
EDIT: http://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/2shbcx/live_transcript_arteezys_thoughts_on_the_drama/
Bump for rtz's insights on stream (transcript is somewhere on reddit too) http://www.twitch.tv/arteezy
EDIT: http://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/2shbcx/live_transcript_arteezys_thoughts_on_the_drama/
EDIT: http://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/2shbcx/live_transcript_arteezys_thoughts_on_the_drama/
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