Déjà vu.
ESEA Map Vote Season 20
posted in
TF2 General Discussion
gargleburryaim-I don't really think its an argument, I gave out my opinion and he took it offensive for a reason that's beyond memustardoverlordmemesur arguing with an open player about strategies look at ur self man ur letting urself go smh
cause you were very wrong
[quote=gargleburry][quote=aim-][quote=mustardoverlord]memes[/quote]
ur arguing with an open player about strategies look at ur self man ur letting urself go smh[/quote]
I don't really think its an argument, I gave out my opinion and he took it offensive for a reason that's beyond me[/quote]
cause you were very wrong
ur arguing with an open player about strategies look at ur self man ur letting urself go smh[/quote]
I don't really think its an argument, I gave out my opinion and he took it offensive for a reason that's beyond me[/quote]
cause you were very wrong
botmodegargleburrycause you were very wrongaim-I don't really think its an argument, I gave out my opinion and he took it offensive for a reason that's beyond memustardoverlordmemesur arguing with an open player about strategies look at ur self man ur letting urself go smh
not denying the fact that i was wrong, hell ill take his and your opinion over mine any day. the way he constructed him self was as if i hurt him personally. Ill stop commenting on it since its off the subject of the thread, but I didn't think the way he acted out on my opinion was the right way to go. You could of just told me I was wrong, listed why I was wrong, and I would of agreed with you. You didn't have to bitch about minus frags and call me stupid to prove that I was wrong.
[quote=botmode][quote=gargleburry][quote=aim-][quote=mustardoverlord]memes[/quote]
ur arguing with an open player about strategies look at ur self man ur letting urself go smh[/quote]
I don't really think its an argument, I gave out my opinion and he took it offensive for a reason that's beyond me[/quote]
cause you were very wrong[/quote]
not denying the fact that i was wrong, hell ill take his and your opinion over mine any day. the way he constructed him self was as if i hurt him personally. Ill stop commenting on it since its off the subject of the thread, but I didn't think the way he acted out on my opinion was the right way to go. You could of just told me I was wrong, listed why I was wrong, and I would of agreed with you. You didn't have to bitch about minus frags and call me stupid to prove that I was wrong.
ur arguing with an open player about strategies look at ur self man ur letting urself go smh[/quote]
I don't really think its an argument, I gave out my opinion and he took it offensive for a reason that's beyond me[/quote]
cause you were very wrong[/quote]
not denying the fact that i was wrong, hell ill take his and your opinion over mine any day. the way he constructed him self was as if i hurt him personally. Ill stop commenting on it since its off the subject of the thread, but I didn't think the way he acted out on my opinion was the right way to go. You could of just told me I was wrong, listed why I was wrong, and I would of agreed with you. You didn't have to bitch about minus frags and call me stupid to prove that I was wrong.
mustardoverlordhowever, the level of negative feedback for ALL the maps listed thus far pales in comparison to the feedback that logjam has received. I can barely think of a single prem eu player/team that liked it in the slightest. I don't care if hyce is a nice guy who is still updating it, some maps are fundamentally broken to begin with. if a drug unequivocally fails its first clinical trial, they aren't going to push it on more people before changing it or scrapping it for a new product. I don't see why we need to be lab rats for a map that the last set of lab rats already rejected.
I may be a bit biased but I don't think that the drug trial/lab rats analogy fits in this case. Logjam got thrown into ETF2L during mid beta and it was honestly a really bad move to do that. That's partially on me and partially on the ETF2L admins who chose/allowed to put it in. It was overyhyped by people playing mixes. Most didn't like it in the first season it got played. Most said it was better in the second season, with the glaring issue being the mid.
I completely rebuilt the mid after that season. I think it's a lot better. I know it needs a little tweaking but I'm not sure what it needs. I wouldn't say that it's just throwing the same map at a different group of people at all.
That being said it looks like granary is getting voted back in and I only hope that they will choose to make it the pro version instead. Maybe there will be a chance for Logjam next season. If not I've wasted a large amount of time for next to nothing.
[quote=mustardoverlord]
however, the level of negative feedback for ALL the maps listed thus far pales in comparison to the feedback that logjam has received. I can barely think of a single prem eu player/team that liked it in the slightest. I don't care if hyce is a nice guy who is still updating it, some maps are fundamentally broken to begin with. if a drug unequivocally fails its first clinical trial, they aren't going to push it on more people before changing it or scrapping it for a new product. I don't see why we need to be lab rats for a map that the last set of lab rats already rejected.[/quote]
I may be a bit biased but I don't think that the drug trial/lab rats analogy fits in this case. Logjam got thrown into ETF2L during mid beta and it was honestly a really bad move to do that. That's partially on me and partially on the ETF2L admins who chose/allowed to put it in. It was overyhyped by people playing mixes. Most didn't like it in the first season it got played. Most said it was better in the second season, with the glaring issue being the mid.
I completely rebuilt the mid after that season. I think it's a lot better. I know it needs a little tweaking but I'm not sure what it needs. I wouldn't say that it's just throwing the same map at a different group of people at all.
That being said it looks like granary is getting voted back in and I only hope that they will choose to make it the pro version instead. Maybe there will be a chance for Logjam next season. If not I've wasted a large amount of time for next to nothing.
however, the level of negative feedback for ALL the maps listed thus far pales in comparison to the feedback that logjam has received. I can barely think of a single prem eu player/team that liked it in the slightest. I don't care if hyce is a nice guy who is still updating it, some maps are fundamentally broken to begin with. if a drug unequivocally fails its first clinical trial, they aren't going to push it on more people before changing it or scrapping it for a new product. I don't see why we need to be lab rats for a map that the last set of lab rats already rejected.[/quote]
I may be a bit biased but I don't think that the drug trial/lab rats analogy fits in this case. Logjam got thrown into ETF2L during mid beta and it was honestly a really bad move to do that. That's partially on me and partially on the ETF2L admins who chose/allowed to put it in. It was overyhyped by people playing mixes. Most didn't like it in the first season it got played. Most said it was better in the second season, with the glaring issue being the mid.
I completely rebuilt the mid after that season. I think it's a lot better. I know it needs a little tweaking but I'm not sure what it needs. I wouldn't say that it's just throwing the same map at a different group of people at all.
That being said it looks like granary is getting voted back in and I only hope that they will choose to make it the pro version instead. Maybe there will be a chance for Logjam next season. If not I've wasted a large amount of time for next to nothing.
Hyce without taking an unnecessary amount of energy into breaking down what's wrong with logjam, I'd say easily the biggest flaw is the way mid -> 2nd plays out. First of all there's no real place to hold mid. In the last version I played (this may have changed) there were 5 entrances to mid and 2 of which were like in a separate room that made no sense. Then, in order to push into 2nd you have to walk into 6 people standing on top of a spire that can see everything and just have to jump over a wall to escape because chasing around that wall takes ~5 seconds.
Hyce without taking an unnecessary amount of energy into breaking down what's wrong with logjam, I'd say easily the biggest flaw is the way mid -> 2nd plays out. First of all there's no real place to hold mid. In the last version I played (this may have changed) there were 5 entrances to mid and 2 of which were like in a separate room that made no sense. Then, in order to push into 2nd you have to walk into 6 people standing on top of a spire that can see everything and just have to jump over a wall to escape because chasing around that wall takes ~5 seconds.
Does killing know that people want granary pro as a choice? I didn't see a news post about the vote from any admin...
Does killing know that people want granary pro as a choice? I didn't see a news post about the vote from any admin...
tetrominoDoes killing know that people want granary pro as a choice? I didn't see a news post about the vote from any admin...
[quote=tetromino]Does killing know that people want granary pro as a choice? I didn't see a news post about the vote from any admin...[/quote]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/YEkWEVo.png[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/YEkWEVo.png[/img]
mustardoverlordDeerWhatever happened to coalplant?
mixup hated it so it got voted out
for the koth map: uhhhh point was on lowground. cap, move to high ground, ???, profit.
for the 5 cp: shit was like 11.3 miles long.
aside from getting gran_pro in we really should spend more time w the map makers fixing sunshine/metalworks so they can get to process/snake/gully level of enjoyment/non shittiness
[quote=mustardoverlord][quote=Deer]Whatever happened to coalplant? [/quote]
mixup hated it so it got voted out[/quote]
for the koth map: uhhhh point was on lowground. cap, move to high ground, ???, profit.
for the 5 cp: shit was like 11.3 miles long.
aside from getting gran_pro in we really should spend more time w the map makers fixing sunshine/metalworks so they can get to process/snake/gully level of enjoyment/non shittiness
mixup hated it so it got voted out[/quote]
for the koth map: uhhhh point was on lowground. cap, move to high ground, ???, profit.
for the 5 cp: shit was like 11.3 miles long.
aside from getting gran_pro in we really should spend more time w the map makers fixing sunshine/metalworks so they can get to process/snake/gully level of enjoyment/non shittiness
As the map stands what is the major complaints about Sunshine if so many people dislike it apparently. Bc after the sniper sightline on right spawn was fixed in this last update I don't really know what is so bad about the map and personally enjoy it.
As the map stands what is the major complaints about Sunshine if so many people dislike it apparently. Bc after the sniper sightline on right spawn was fixed in this last update I don't really know what is so bad about the map and personally enjoy it.
AvastAs the map stands what is the major complaints about Sunshine if so many people dislike it apparently. Bc after the sniper sightline on right spawn was fixed in this last update I don't really know what is so bad about the map and personally enjoy it.
I agree. From my standpoint it plays very similarly to process. The mid is wide open with some key high points on either side, the second point has a fairly easy to defend spire-like structure and the last has a lot of entrances that all funnel toward the point
[quote=Avast]As the map stands what is the major complaints about Sunshine if so many people dislike it apparently. Bc after the sniper sightline on right spawn was fixed in this last update I don't really know what is so bad about the map and personally enjoy it.[/quote]
I agree. From my standpoint it plays very similarly to process. The mid is wide open with some key high points on either side, the second point has a fairly easy to defend spire-like structure and the last has a lot of entrances that all funnel toward the point
I agree. From my standpoint it plays very similarly to process. The mid is wide open with some key high points on either side, the second point has a fairly easy to defend spire-like structure and the last has a lot of entrances that all funnel toward the point
Knuckles_I agree. From my standpoint it plays very similarly to process. The mid is wide open with some key high points on either side, the second point has a fairly easy to defend spire-like structure and the last has a lot of entrances that all funnel toward the point
yeah but why play shitty process when you can play normal process
[quote=Knuckles_]
I agree. From my standpoint it plays very similarly to process. The mid is wide open with some key high points on either side, the second point has a fairly easy to defend spire-like structure and the last has a lot of entrances that all funnel toward the point[/quote]
yeah but why play shitty process when you can play normal process
I agree. From my standpoint it plays very similarly to process. The mid is wide open with some key high points on either side, the second point has a fairly easy to defend spire-like structure and the last has a lot of entrances that all funnel toward the point[/quote]
yeah but why play shitty process when you can play normal process
Knuckles_tetrominoDoes killing know that people want granary pro as a choice? I didn't see a news post about the vote from any admin...
http://i.imgur.com/YEkWEVo.png
Im famous :]
[quote=Knuckles_][quote=tetromino]Does killing know that people want granary pro as a choice? I didn't see a news post about the vote from any admin...[/quote]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/YEkWEVo.png[/img][/quote]
Im famous :]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/YEkWEVo.png[/img][/quote]
Im famous :]
tetrominoDoes killing know that people want granary pro as a choice? I didn't see a news post about the vote from any admin...
i dont know if you actually read what i wrote but i was hoping for at least some admin communication i.e.:
[quote=tetromino]Does [b]killing[/b] know that people want granary pro as a choice? I didn't see [b]a news post about the vote from any admin...[/b][/quote]
i dont know if you actually read what i wrote but i was hoping for at least some admin communication i.e.:
[img]http://i.imgur.com/yi5B2n1.png[/img]
i dont know if you actually read what i wrote but i was hoping for at least some admin communication i.e.:
[img]http://i.imgur.com/yi5B2n1.png[/img]
CS is A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?
The dynamic strategies people come up with for CS is crazy, I would love to be able to watch different 'executes' and different adaptations from either teams on an easy to understand/fun/good map.
CS [i]is[/i] A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?
The dynamic strategies people come up with for CS is crazy, I would love to be able to watch different 'executes' and different adaptations from either teams on an easy to understand/fun/good map.
The dynamic strategies people come up with for CS is crazy, I would love to be able to watch different 'executes' and different adaptations from either teams on an easy to understand/fun/good map.
riot124CS is A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?
Completely different game mechanics and meta?
[quote=riot124]CS [i]is[/i] A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?[/quote]
Completely different game mechanics and meta?
Completely different game mechanics and meta?
Screwballriot124CS is A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?Completely different game mechanics and meta?
ok ban pyro anything else?
make it work
the beauty of cs is that everyone makes new things work for them, if you do the same thing in tf2 and do it right the meta can be changed.
the word 'meta' really sucks
[quote=Screwball][quote=riot124]CS [i]is[/i] A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?[/quote]
Completely different game mechanics and meta?[/quote]
ok ban pyro anything else?
make it work
the beauty of cs is that everyone makes new things work for them, if you do the same thing in tf2 and do it right the meta can be changed.
the word 'meta' really sucks
Completely different game mechanics and meta?[/quote]
ok ban pyro anything else?
make it work
the beauty of cs is that everyone makes new things work for them, if you do the same thing in tf2 and do it right the meta can be changed.
the word 'meta' really sucks
i feel like if we voted logjam in it would be so much better than hearing people complain about normal gran for another season.
i feel like if we voted logjam in it would be so much better than hearing people complain about normal gran for another season.
kounterpartsi feel like if we voted logjam in it would be so much better than hearing people complain about normal gran for another season.
pro gran>gran>any of the other choices
[quote=kounterparts]i feel like if we voted logjam in it would be so much better than hearing people complain about normal gran for another season.[/quote]
pro gran>gran>any of the other choices
pro gran>gran>any of the other choices
riot124the word 'meta' really sucks
It just means 'what works'
Also you can't equate de_ maps in cs to a/d here they're totally different.
[quote=riot124]
the word 'meta' really sucks[/quote]
It just means 'what works'
Also you can't equate de_ maps in cs to a/d here they're totally different.
the word 'meta' really sucks[/quote]
It just means 'what works'
Also you can't equate de_ maps in cs to a/d here they're totally different.
riot124Screwballok ban pyro anything else?riot124CS is A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?Completely different game mechanics and meta?
make it work
the beauty of cs is that everyone makes new things work for them, if you do the same thing in tf2 and do it right the meta can be changed.
the word 'meta' really sucks
i like the part where cs made insane amts of bhopping work for them without reducing the max speed...oh wait!!
[quote=riot124][quote=Screwball][quote=riot124]CS [i]is[/i] A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?[/quote]
Completely different game mechanics and meta?[/quote]
ok ban pyro anything else?
make it work
the beauty of cs is that everyone makes new things work for them, if you do the same thing in tf2 and do it right the meta can be changed.
the word 'meta' really sucks[/quote]
i like the part where cs made insane amts of bhopping work for them without reducing the max speed...oh wait!!
Completely different game mechanics and meta?[/quote]
ok ban pyro anything else?
make it work
the beauty of cs is that everyone makes new things work for them, if you do the same thing in tf2 and do it right the meta can be changed.
the word 'meta' really sucks[/quote]
i like the part where cs made insane amts of bhopping work for them without reducing the max speed...oh wait!!
it's still surprising to me that people like metalworks more than granary
it's still surprising to me that people like metalworks more than granary
riot124Screwballok ban pyro anything else?riot124CS is A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?Completely different game mechanics and meta?
make it work
the beauty of cs is that everyone makes new things work for them, if you do the same thing in tf2 and do it right the meta can be changed.
the word 'meta' really sucks
if u actually think cs is just tf2 without pyro then you are fucking retarded
[quote=riot124][quote=Screwball][quote=riot124]CS [i]is[/i] A/D maps so why can't TF2, the superior game, have them?[/quote]
Completely different game mechanics and meta?[/quote]
ok ban pyro anything else?
make it work
the beauty of cs is that everyone makes new things work for them, if you do the same thing in tf2 and do it right the meta can be changed.
the word 'meta' really sucks[/quote]
if u actually think cs is just tf2 without pyro then you are fucking retarded
Completely different game mechanics and meta?[/quote]
ok ban pyro anything else?
make it work
the beauty of cs is that everyone makes new things work for them, if you do the same thing in tf2 and do it right the meta can be changed.
the word 'meta' really sucks[/quote]
if u actually think cs is just tf2 without pyro then you are fucking retarded
Looks like we're stuck with Granary for at least another season. Hopefully it will be Granary Pro. If anyone who voted against logjam wants to say something I'd appreciate any feedback here: http://www.teamfortress.tv/14370/cp-logjam-5cp
Looks like we're stuck with Granary for at least another season. Hopefully it will be Granary Pro. If anyone who voted against logjam wants to say something I'd appreciate any feedback here: http://www.teamfortress.tv/14370/cp-logjam-5cp
Ma3laaThe map pool is fine as it is but changing granary to the pro version should definitely happen.
Also I have to say I think it would be really great to try to incorporate some good attack defend maps if any mapper would ever be willing to give it a shot.
- A/D provides comp tf2 something that it really doesn't have at all, that being prepared strats. There really is no opportunity right now for a lesser team in individual DM/skill to ever upset a better team through preparing with some new strategies or new ways to play a map to outplay an "on paper" better team.
- A/D provides without question some really exciting matches just from the nature of the gamemode, forcing people to push etc. Not to mention new strategies are cool to see in action.
- Valve will surely include A/D maybe even payload in MM, payload really wouldn't work but A/d could if good maps were made. With the steam workshop any good maps we like to play could become popular enough that valve would definitely put them into a contract mission or something like that officially adding them to the game.
- It's way easier of a game mode to understand to people that aren't extremely familiar with how 5cp/comp tf2 works as an outside viewer on twitch.
It doesn't necessarily have to be in the gpit style of A/D with multiple points it could be the dustbowl style of it as well, would just be fun to try and it has always been really fun to watch. It would add the ability for teams to use different strategies with other classes and potential for worse on paper teams to beat "better" teams with research and preparation.
Probably a good idea for A/D, I know this is repeated a lot, but now is the time to try and help Valve help us, in this case, by trying to add another game mode that lots of players enjoy.
[quote=Ma3laa]The map pool is fine as it is but changing granary to the pro version should definitely happen.
Also I have to say I think it would be really great to try to incorporate some good attack defend maps if any mapper would ever be willing to give it a shot.
- A/D provides comp tf2 something that it really doesn't have at all, that being prepared strats. There really is no opportunity right now for a lesser team in individual DM/skill to ever upset a better team through preparing with some new strategies or new ways to play a map to outplay an "on paper" better team.
- A/D provides without question some really exciting matches just from the nature of the gamemode, forcing people to push etc. Not to mention new strategies are cool to see in action.
- [b]Valve will surely include A/D maybe even payload in MM[/b], payload really wouldn't work but A/d could if good maps were made. With the steam workshop any good maps we like to play could become popular enough that valve would definitely put them into a contract mission or something like that officially adding them to the game.
- It's way easier of a game mode to understand to people that aren't extremely familiar with how 5cp/comp tf2 works as an outside viewer on twitch.
It doesn't necessarily have to be in the gpit style of A/D with multiple points it could be the dustbowl style of it as well, would just be fun to try and it has always been really fun to watch. It would add the ability for teams to use different strategies with other classes and potential for worse on paper teams to beat "better" teams with research and preparation.[/quote]
Probably a good idea for A/D, I know this is repeated a lot, but now is the time to try and help Valve help us, in this case, by trying to add another game mode that lots of players enjoy.
Also I have to say I think it would be really great to try to incorporate some good attack defend maps if any mapper would ever be willing to give it a shot.
- A/D provides comp tf2 something that it really doesn't have at all, that being prepared strats. There really is no opportunity right now for a lesser team in individual DM/skill to ever upset a better team through preparing with some new strategies or new ways to play a map to outplay an "on paper" better team.
- A/D provides without question some really exciting matches just from the nature of the gamemode, forcing people to push etc. Not to mention new strategies are cool to see in action.
- [b]Valve will surely include A/D maybe even payload in MM[/b], payload really wouldn't work but A/d could if good maps were made. With the steam workshop any good maps we like to play could become popular enough that valve would definitely put them into a contract mission or something like that officially adding them to the game.
- It's way easier of a game mode to understand to people that aren't extremely familiar with how 5cp/comp tf2 works as an outside viewer on twitch.
It doesn't necessarily have to be in the gpit style of A/D with multiple points it could be the dustbowl style of it as well, would just be fun to try and it has always been really fun to watch. It would add the ability for teams to use different strategies with other classes and potential for worse on paper teams to beat "better" teams with research and preparation.[/quote]
Probably a good idea for A/D, I know this is repeated a lot, but now is the time to try and help Valve help us, in this case, by trying to add another game mode that lots of players enjoy.
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