I like it but with 10 players it's just an absolute clusterfuck.

best rocket jumper + market gardener map ever

Meh.

"Let's remove maps because they're cluster fucks"

some time later

"Let's add Turbine back in because it's a good DM map"

Dunno what people are thinking sometimes.

hop on to the 12310031023010491820491840921841948 (6?) other DM servers when turbine comes up.

Yea seriously.

Well from a scout's perspective, turbine isn't all that bad. Between the crates, the stairs and those turbine things, it's actually pretty good for a scout to jump around on.

Granary mid on the other hand...

Or you could play DM properly and it wouldn't feel nearly as bad.

turbine is a lot of fun to play, as any class. I think the people who complain about it don't really get the fun of dm :/

yeah, you die a lot but you get a lot of kills too. its just really fast paced and is the best map for getting airshots. its still good practice too

the classic dm maps like turbine and freight are awesome. turbine is great because its not really spread out so its really chaotic in a good way. you can rape as any class on it

It has nothing to do with not having fun. I have fun with any other DM map. It's more about it taking away from what DM servers are meant to be used for. Improving movement on Turbine isn't probable, unless if you're a scout, maybe. There's a more likely chance you'll improve your aim quicker than your movement on Turbine, but that's only when you're not busy being shot from 3 other directions. I don't do bad on Turbine, but I still think it needs to go.

If you're concerned about movement in DM you should probably find a different mod.

So a part of having good DM isn't having good movement? I guess trying to learn how to dodge better in a mod where people are shooting at you is silly.

this is true of every dm arena if you're bad (like me for instance)

i think turbine is kind of fun, it's probably the most chaotic of the arenas and as such presumably prepares your concentration better for actual midfights

turbine is neat but it's a lot better at 6 or 8 players than 10

that's isn't to say it's bad, in fact a lot of other dm maps are worse than it

bring back arena_ravine 2013

the time is now, revive a classic dm map

turbine dm is great because you can cap the intel and get crits for your entire team for like ten seconds

if you're gonna get rid of something get rid of snakewater

My rockets always go straight through the stairs on turbine >_>

stairs are the true counter to soldier

If you're complaining about Turbine being a pain, just remember, try to control an area. DM is more than just pointing and clicking on people, if you can control an area, make good shots, and die less often than others. You're doing something right.

Also, if you ever touch CS, don't do DM mods if you dislike the idea of "Spawning and dieing." It's a pain, but you just have to be quick and ready to die. That system really helps because it puts you in a bad situation, instead of saying "Hey! Here's your spawn, go out and fight buddy!" It's like being thrown into a pool with no knowledge of swimming, but you get better if you try it.

Badlands mid train tracks.

I see more people defending turbine than people wanting me to take it off. do I leave it on? I'll also add metalworks if I find that tf.tv thread with the soap spawns

I tried bringing it back but I didn't have soap spawns for it.

if every map was as chaotic as turbine I probably wouldn't like it but it is nice to have at least 1 map like it.

But that's exactly what DM is. If you "control an area" like you described very often, then you won't be any good anywhere else on the map.

I don't really like turbine because imo scouts just take the crates and shoot you twice if you jump at them. or you're on the floor and get spammed instantly :C
it always feels as though if a scout gets on the crates (which aren't that high), you have to airshot him twice to kill him.. Which you rarely have time for, seeing as something will kill you from behind D:

Are you one of those soldiers that take a big sweeping airshot and jump straight at the scouts without airstrafing? Learn how to rocketjump better instead of complaining, it's not the mod's problem.

There's a large number of players who think they are playing DM to get better gamesense or something, and that just isn't the case at all. You play DM to get better at clicking on people, movement, and focusing correct targets. That is the extent to what DM is supposed to be used for, and if you are complaining about being killed instantly when you spawn, you're clearly playing the mod wrong. The fact that you spawn INSTANTLY should mean you don't care how or when you die.

I don't really know what you said but badlands has two crates that scouts can stand, granary has 4 giant crates, process-- oh wait every mid has some sort of height advantage

This isn't like some conglomerate bipolar community, people do not always have the same opinion. The people who never stop complaining will keep complaining, and the people who don't care will continue to not care.