pl4sticwhy does every thread have to be a comparison between who the top player is cant they both just be good
it's the highlander mentality, there can only be one..
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Starkie - The Rise To Sublimity
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TF2 General Discussion
[quote=pl4stic]why does every thread have to be a comparison between who the top player is cant they both just be good[/quote]
it's the highlander mentality, there can only be one..
it's the highlander mentality, there can only be one..
OsirisHalf my memory of watching Starkie consists of amazing TF2, the other half is this gem. The only time I laughed harder watching TF2 is when Skeej shouted KANKERZOOI.
I stay on point, people won't let me forget about it. I step off point, people won't let me forget about it.
Life comes at you fast, huh.
[quote=Osiris]Half my memory of watching Starkie consists of amazing TF2, the other half is [url=https://youtu.be/1eDaBwmQQOI?t=1251]this gem[/url]. The only time I laughed harder watching TF2 is when Skeej shouted KANKERZOOI.[/quote]
I stay on point, people won't let me forget about it. I step off point, people won't let me forget about it.
Life comes at you fast, huh.
I stay on point, people won't let me forget about it. I step off point, people won't let me forget about it.
Life comes at you fast, huh.
VulcanJw321123100% more maturity.u do realize a lot of people hate starkie for the same reason people hate b4nny?
to be fair i've never seen starkie act like this before, though maybe its because its mainly behind the scenes
sorry if i am wrong about the things i said
[quote=Vulcan][quote=Jw321123]100% more maturity. [/quote]
u do realize a lot of people hate starkie for the same reason people hate b4nny?[/quote]
[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X_r6etzhcQ]to be fair i've never seen starkie act like this before, though maybe its because its mainly behind the scenes[/url]
sorry if i am wrong about the things i said
u do realize a lot of people hate starkie for the same reason people hate b4nny?[/quote]
[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X_r6etzhcQ]to be fair i've never seen starkie act like this before, though maybe its because its mainly behind the scenes[/url]
sorry if i am wrong about the things i said
s1keInteresting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.
[quote=s1ke]
Interesting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).[/quote]
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.
Interesting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).[/quote]
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.
Gazs1keInteresting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.
lmao are you joking?
[quote=Gaz][quote=s1ke]
Interesting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).[/quote]
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.[/quote]
lmao are you joking?
Interesting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).[/quote]
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.[/quote]
lmao are you joking?
Gazs1keInteresting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.
i love it when open players try to analyze invite plays
[quote=Gaz][quote=s1ke]
Interesting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).[/quote]
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.[/quote]
i love it when open players try to analyze invite plays
Interesting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).[/quote]
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.[/quote]
i love it when open players try to analyze invite plays
Tbf, the scout spamming, attacking and even chip shotting from the front is going to get more damage than the scout sneaking behind and waiting for a big pick, no?
Tbf, the scout spamming, attacking and even chip shotting from the front is going to get more damage than the scout sneaking behind and waiting for a big pick, no?
Jw321123VulcanJw321123100% more maturity.u do realize a lot of people hate starkie for the same reason people hate b4nny?
to be fair i've never seen starkie act like this before, though maybe its because its mainly behind the scenes
sorry if i am wrong about the things i said
if its not quite obvious b4nny is really fucking pounded in that clip, he doesnt act like this all the time lmao
[quote=Jw321123][quote=Vulcan][quote=Jw321123]100% more maturity. [/quote]
u do realize a lot of people hate starkie for the same reason people hate b4nny?[/quote]
[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X_r6etzhcQ]to be fair i've never seen starkie act like this before, though maybe its because its mainly behind the scenes[/url]
sorry if i am wrong about the things i said[/quote]
if its not quite obvious b4nny is really fucking pounded in that clip, he doesnt act like this all the time lmao
u do realize a lot of people hate starkie for the same reason people hate b4nny?[/quote]
[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X_r6etzhcQ]to be fair i've never seen starkie act like this before, though maybe its because its mainly behind the scenes[/url]
sorry if i am wrong about the things i said[/quote]
if its not quite obvious b4nny is really fucking pounded in that clip, he doesnt act like this all the time lmao
Vulcani love it when open players try to analyze invite plays
Sure showed me by presenting some hefty arguments
[quote=Vulcan]
i love it when open players try to analyze invite plays[/quote]
Sure showed me by presenting some hefty arguments
i love it when open players try to analyze invite plays[/quote]
Sure showed me by presenting some hefty arguments
Gazs1keInteresting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.
to say banny isn't in the discussion for best player is really something only someone who puts "i got 3rd in open" on their profile could come up with
[quote=Gaz][quote=s1ke]
Interesting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).[/quote]
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.[/quote]
to say banny isn't in the discussion for best player is really something only someone who puts "i got 3rd in open" on their profile could come up with
Interesting argument to make especially since b4nny didn't take more heals than paddie once during the rewind grand finals and outdamaged every scout every time. All respect to starkie and to him as a player, but please face reality (europeans).[/quote]
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.[/quote]
to say banny isn't in the discussion for best player is really something only someone who puts "i got 3rd in open" on their profile could come up with
GazBecause damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.
lol
you dont have to like the guy but hes still the best player in the world
[quote=Gaz]
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.[/quote]
lol
you dont have to like the guy but hes still the best player in the world
Because damage output on scout matters when all it tells you is that you did a terrible job at cleaning up (aka your primary task) or in b4nnys case that you take away the opportunity to deal damage from your combo by taking heals miles above the average amount for a pocket scout + insisting on taking every uber. I know b4nny pushed this belief, but frags are more important than damage and frankly, starkie outperformed him by miles in that regard and the general impact on the game with 1/4 of his heals. B4nny wasn't an important player outside of his calling the last two LANs so please lets not include him in these kind of discussions. The players who were far better than him don't deserve this.[/quote]
lol
you dont have to like the guy but hes still the best player in the world
please dont derail this nice thread anymore
best of luck in all your future furry endeavors tonythetiger
please dont derail this nice thread anymore
best of luck in all your future furry endeavors tonythetiger
best of luck in all your future furry endeavors tonythetiger
hope you still come to LAN to chill and watch vidja games
hope you still come to LAN to chill and watch vidja games
cirloNice article, loved it!
Just one oversight: ze knutsson rollerbladers arrived 2nd (both in S19 and S20)
They played with zappis in s19 instead of Stark
[quote=cirlo]Nice article, loved it!
Just one oversight: ze knutsson rollerbladers arrived 2nd (both in S19 and S20)[/quote]
They played with zappis in s19 instead of Stark
Just one oversight: ze knutsson rollerbladers arrived 2nd (both in S19 and S20)[/quote]
They played with zappis in s19 instead of Stark
holy fuck. Both b4nny and starkie are amazing players. just stop
holy fuck. Both b4nny and starkie are amazing players. just stop
dashnerNever forget his greatest contribution to the scene
I thought this was his greatest contribution.
Upon second reading, he said he wouldn't quit if this happened. We were lied too.
[quote=dashner][url=http://www.teamfortress.tv/post/704536/esa-rewind-lan-day-2]Never forget his greatest contribution to the scene[/url][/quote]
[url=http://www.teamfortress.tv/post/679115/crowns-are-going-to-fold-lt]I thought this was his greatest contribution.[/url]
Upon second reading, he said he wouldn't quit if this happened. We were lied too.
[url=http://www.teamfortress.tv/post/679115/crowns-are-going-to-fold-lt]I thought this was his greatest contribution.[/url]
Upon second reading, he said he wouldn't quit if this happened. We were lied too.
s1keStarkie's a marvelous scout that makes unbelievable offclassing plays consistently but how can you declare starkie is superior to b4nny and every scout in the world when Grant Vincent himself out damages starkie and pretty much every other scout in the game nowadays in every map of the rewind and essentially every tournament ever by typically plausible margins? Downfrag me all you want but it's true.
Damage is a routinely overrated statistic, it's not particularly important. 7 play a very methodical style and as a result tend to have low DPM, and if we know anything about Stark it's that he hates players piling up useless damage including himself.
If you watch Marxist's 9 precepts of scout video (made easily available at training.tf :D) he explains some of the very basic differences in scout style, and you need to remember that b4nny generally plays the mama bear scout role which tends to rack up far better stats because it is a relatively low risk role, receives lots of healing and often is able to attack players that aren't attacking him back because they're trying to kill the medic or demo. It makes sense to be near his combo of course because b4nny calls for his team. He plays it at a very high level and doesn't stick to such a simple formula, but it's a general guide.
Stark plays a higher risk role in probably the most risky and isolated way possible. He plays in a desert of heals even for a flank scout and doesn't hog packs either, takes up atypical positions threatening backcaps, high value picks or disruption to respawners and disrupts the whole standard flow of the game if given the chance. He is frequently in positions where he is being hunted by multiple enemy players with no prospect of support, although he usually does try to make these moves in the wider context of the whole team. This is not bad play, it's the requirements of the role at a high level. That his stats are as good as they are is a matter of making fine judgements about where and when to take these big risks. It would be easy to get the balance wrong and simply feed the opposing team, but Stark has finely tuned gamesense in these matters and good enough DM to make most players pay a high price.
Trying to compare the two statistically is truly apples and oranges, and I have written hundreds of thousands of words on comparing players statistically. They are very different players playing very different roles.
[quote=s1ke]Starkie's a marvelous scout that makes unbelievable offclassing plays consistently but how can you declare starkie is superior to b4nny and every scout in the world when Grant Vincent himself out damages starkie and pretty much every other scout in the game nowadays in every map of the rewind and essentially every tournament ever by typically plausible margins? Downfrag me all you want but it's true.[/quote]
Damage is a routinely overrated statistic, it's not particularly important. 7 play a very methodical style and as a result tend to have low DPM, and if we know anything about Stark it's that he hates players piling up useless damage including himself.
If you watch [url=http://training.tf/#/watch/2]Marxist's 9 precepts of scout video[/url] (made easily available at training.tf :D) he explains some of the very basic differences in scout style, and you need to remember that b4nny generally plays the mama bear scout role which tends to rack up far better stats because it is a relatively low risk role, receives lots of healing and often is able to attack players that aren't attacking him back because they're trying to kill the medic or demo. It makes sense to be near his combo of course because b4nny calls for his team. He plays it at a very high level and doesn't stick to such a simple formula, but it's a general guide.
Stark plays a higher risk role in probably the most risky and isolated way possible. He plays in a desert of heals even for a flank scout and doesn't hog packs either, takes up atypical positions threatening backcaps, high value picks or disruption to respawners and disrupts the whole standard flow of the game if given the chance. He is frequently in positions where he is being hunted by multiple enemy players with no prospect of support, although he usually does try to make these moves in the wider context of the whole team. This is not bad play, it's the requirements of the role at a high level. That his stats are as good as they are is a matter of making fine judgements about where and when to take these big risks. It would be easy to get the balance wrong and simply feed the opposing team, but Stark has finely tuned gamesense in these matters and good enough DM to make most players pay a high price.
Trying to compare the two statistically is truly apples and oranges, and I have written hundreds of thousands of words on comparing players statistically. They are very different players playing very different roles.
Damage is a routinely overrated statistic, it's not particularly important. 7 play a very methodical style and as a result tend to have low DPM, and if we know anything about Stark it's that he hates players piling up useless damage including himself.
If you watch [url=http://training.tf/#/watch/2]Marxist's 9 precepts of scout video[/url] (made easily available at training.tf :D) he explains some of the very basic differences in scout style, and you need to remember that b4nny generally plays the mama bear scout role which tends to rack up far better stats because it is a relatively low risk role, receives lots of healing and often is able to attack players that aren't attacking him back because they're trying to kill the medic or demo. It makes sense to be near his combo of course because b4nny calls for his team. He plays it at a very high level and doesn't stick to such a simple formula, but it's a general guide.
Stark plays a higher risk role in probably the most risky and isolated way possible. He plays in a desert of heals even for a flank scout and doesn't hog packs either, takes up atypical positions threatening backcaps, high value picks or disruption to respawners and disrupts the whole standard flow of the game if given the chance. He is frequently in positions where he is being hunted by multiple enemy players with no prospect of support, although he usually does try to make these moves in the wider context of the whole team. This is not bad play, it's the requirements of the role at a high level. That his stats are as good as they are is a matter of making fine judgements about where and when to take these big risks. It would be easy to get the balance wrong and simply feed the opposing team, but Stark has finely tuned gamesense in these matters and good enough DM to make most players pay a high price.
Trying to compare the two statistically is truly apples and oranges, and I have written hundreds of thousands of words on comparing players statistically. They are very different players playing very different roles.
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