Stop being cancer to new players people

#31

coyo_geezer

14 Frags – +

The only time i've seen people be remotely toxic towards newer players is when they're incredibly toxic themselves.

#32

Stylax

6 Frags – +

Ive seen it quite a lot on face it. Often unprovoked

I guess in theory it should be eradicated at all levels. A top level player can still be undeservedly toxic to a mid level medic just because they're not as good. But some people are just pricks so ah well

Ive seen it quite a lot on face it. Often unprovoked

I guess in theory it should be eradicated at all levels. A top level player can still be undeservedly toxic to a mid level medic just because they're not as good. But some people are just pricks so ah well

#33

Sentinel

2 Frags – +

AdebisiOn a side note, as a fresh meat player it sucks when better opposition in scrims goof around and play off classes to mid.

I know it can be fun but it really doesn't help the new players youre up against and they ll learn nothing from it. I guess you have no obligation to newer players but it's nice to be helpful right ? And in the long term new player improvement helps keep comp tf2 alive.

Add other fresh meat leaders and scrim their teams instead of scrimming vs mixes that just want to mess around

AdebisiIve seen it quite a lot on face it. Often unprovoked

I guess in theory it should be eradicated at all levels. A top level player can still be undeservedly toxic to a mid level medic just because they're not as good. But some people are just pricks so ah well

Just accept it as a part of the game experience. Everyone gets shittalked from time to time, dont take their words seriously, it's just a game. Just tell them that you're new and they should stop being toxic

[quote=Adebisi]On a side note, as a fresh meat player it sucks when better opposition in scrims goof around and play off classes to mid.

I know it can be fun but it really doesn't help the new players youre up against and they ll learn nothing from it. I guess you have no obligation to newer players but it's nice to be helpful right ? And in the long term new player improvement helps keep comp tf2 alive.[/quote]

Add other fresh meat leaders and scrim their teams instead of scrimming vs mixes that just want to mess around

[quote=Adebisi]Ive seen it quite a lot on face it. Often unprovoked

I guess in theory it should be eradicated at all levels. A top level player can still be undeservedly toxic to a mid level medic just because they're not as good. But some people are just pricks so ah well[/quote]

Just accept it as a part of the game experience. Everyone gets shittalked from time to time, dont take their words seriously, it's just a game. Just tell them that you're new and they should stop being toxic

#34

Stylax

0 Frags – +

SentinelAdebisiOn a side note, as a fresh meat player it sucks when better opposition in scrims goof around and play off classes to mid.

I know it can be fun but it really doesn't help the new players youre up against and they ll learn nothing from it. I guess you have no obligation to newer players but it's nice to be helpful right ? And in the long term new player improvement helps keep comp tf2 alive.
Add other fresh meat leaders and scrim their teams instead of scrimming vs mixes that just want to mess around

Yeah ideally but not always possible.

We played open teams that did it. Its not that cunty or anything but it's just not really productive for anyone if we re having the mentality of helping new players.

I will also say that a lot of players were incredibly kind and helpful with the fresh meat cup, including the poster of this thread. So its not all doom and gloom

[quote=Sentinel][quote=Adebisi]On a side note, as a fresh meat player it sucks when better opposition in scrims goof around and play off classes to mid.

I know it can be fun but it really doesn't help the new players youre up against and they ll learn nothing from it. I guess you have no obligation to newer players but it's nice to be helpful right ? And in the long term new player improvement helps keep comp tf2 alive.[/quote]

Add other fresh meat leaders and scrim their teams instead of scrimming vs mixes that just want to mess around[/quote]
Yeah ideally but not always possible.

We played open teams that did it. Its not that cunty or anything but it's just not really productive for anyone if we re having the mentality of helping new players.

I will also say that a lot of players were incredibly kind and helpful with the fresh meat cup, including the poster of this thread. So its not all doom and gloom

#35

Sentinel

3 Frags – +

Adebisiif we re having the mentality of helping new players

People don't play tf2 to be helpful to new players. They play tf2 so they can have fun themselves. Most players are helpful to one degree or another but no one goes into the game thinking "You know what I wanna do today? Help new players"

[quote=Adebisi]if we re having the mentality of helping new players[/quote]

People don't play tf2 to be helpful to new players. They play tf2 so they can have fun themselves. Most players are helpful to one degree or another but no one goes into the game thinking "You know what I wanna do today? Help new players"

#36

Stepanex

4 Frags – +

hoolifuck youwrechedddddhttp://puu.sh/vMgVG/52bb5fa0f4.png

you aren't removing shit

well, fuck me then

barefoot_banditwho are you, you randomly join my pug mumble looking for 7v7 hl mixes, I told you these were na 6s pugs, then you made some weird jokes, that I couldn't understand, idk you seem like a troll so banned you. this is my interaction with this kid

Sorry, heh, I tried to be funny but am not. Just to let you know, I would not fuck with the ongoing game and as far as I remember I never fucked with someone's game. (if someone remembers that I did, call me out on it so I will remember and feel bad for my behavior).

MenachemBesides, honestly, I can't help but wonder if the toxicity in pugs isn't a good thing;

It might be little good because people playing this game will learn how to act when someone is being an ass to them. Also, it adds the stress into the game so you should be slowly getting better working in a stressful situation.

Anyway, to be honest I found the forums here getting more and more welcoming. Thanks for all the positivity here.

Show Content

this thread was supposed to be removed by now :(

[quote=hooli]fuck you[/quote]

[quote=wrecheddddd]http://puu.sh/vMgVG/52bb5fa0f4.png

you aren't removing shit[/quote]

well, fuck me then

[quote=barefoot_bandit]who are you, you randomly join my pug mumble looking for 7v7 hl mixes, I told you these were na 6s pugs, then you made some weird jokes, that I couldn't understand, idk you seem like a troll so banned you. this is my interaction with this kid[/quote]

Sorry, heh, I tried to be funny but am not. Just to let you know, I would not fuck with the ongoing game and as far as I remember I never fucked with someone's game. (if someone remembers that I did, call me out on it so I will remember and feel bad for my behavior).

[quote=Menachem]Besides, honestly, I can't help but wonder if the toxicity in pugs isn't a good thing;[/quote]
It might be little good because people playing this game will learn how to act when someone is being an ass to them. Also, it adds the stress into the game so you should be slowly getting better working in a stressful situation.

Anyway, to be honest I found the forums here getting more and more welcoming. Thanks for all the positivity here.

[spoiler] this thread was supposed to be removed by now :( [/spoiler]

#37

All_Over_RS

1 Frags – +

Geel9I've found that people who spam binds after they kill someone are usually doing it because they think it's impressive that they killed them.

That is, they found it noteworthy that they were able to kill whoever they're harassing. They're intimidated. They're small people.

no i spam binds cus it makes ppl angry

[quote=Geel9]I've found that people who spam binds after they kill someone are usually doing it because they think it's impressive that they killed them.

That is, they found it noteworthy that they were able to kill whoever they're harassing. They're intimidated. They're small people.[/quote]

no i spam binds cus it makes ppl angry

#38

Stylax

5 Frags – +

SentinelAdebisiif we re having the mentality of helping new players
People don't play tf2 to be helpful to new players. They play tf2 so they can have fun themselves. Most players are helpful to one degree or another but no one goes into the game thinking "You know what I wanna do today? Help new players"

People can have multiple focuses at one time . You can have fun AND help new players .

Seen that time and time again during the fresh meat cup

[quote=Sentinel][quote=Adebisi]if we re having the mentality of helping new players[/quote]

People don't play tf2 to be helpful to new players. They play tf2 so they can have fun themselves. Most players are helpful to one degree or another but no one goes into the game thinking "You know what I wanna do today? Help new players"[/quote]

People can have multiple focuses at one time . You can have fun AND help new players .

Seen that time and time again during the fresh meat cup

#39

roach

0 Frags – +

shit talk is part of the game

#40

shoras

14 Frags – +

New plan: let's shit talk those, who are better than us.

#41

Drummer

18 Frags – +

shorasNew plan: let's shit talk those, who are better than us.

Is it really new if Thalash does it?

[quote=shoras]New plan: let's shit talk those, who are better than us.[/quote]

Is it really new if Thalash does it?

#42

bearodactyl

3 Frags – +

shorasNew plan: let's shit talk everyone (including ourselves)

ftfy

[quote=shoras]New plan: let's shit talk everyone (including ourselves)[/quote]
ftfy

#43

aim-

14 Frags – +

no ones actively trying to be mean to anyone

youre new we get it, but if we literally have to tell you something a thousand fucking times and you dont do it or

if something goes wrong the first time and youre met with that same scenario the second time and dont learn from it after we tell you what you should do and how you should be doing it

this is usually what gets you put on a stake and gets you stigma'd in pugs

no ones actively trying to be mean to anyone

youre new we get it, but if we literally have to tell you something a thousand fucking times and you dont do it or

if something goes wrong the first time and youre met with that same scenario the second time and dont learn from it after we tell you what you should do and how you should be doing it

this is usually what gets you put on a stake and gets you stigma'd in pugs

#44

fuego

3 Frags – +

Dont be so goddamn frail and learn from your mistakes

#45

Phantom

3 Frags – +

if you basically don't do something like this https://youtu.be/HshsGGvcTQg?t=5m45s
most people will be nice

#46

SpaceCadet

7 Frags – +

-Phantom-if you basically don't do something like this https://youtu.be/HshsGGvcTQg?t=5m45s
most people will be nice

aim clip at 5:08 of that video makes me laugh so hard, fucking great

percy fucking destroyed at 5:04, no reaction on face cam at all. rofl

any sandblast clip is ruined by the fucking keyboard clicking sound that never ends, hard to watch stream

[quote=-Phantom-]if you basically don't do something like this https://youtu.be/HshsGGvcTQg?t=5m45s
most people will be nice[/quote]

aim clip at 5:08 of that video makes me laugh so hard, fucking great

percy fucking destroyed at 5:04, no reaction on face cam at all. rofl

any sandblast clip is ruined by the fucking keyboard clicking sound that never ends, hard to watch stream

#47

Highclass

-5 Frags – +

I opened this thread expecting there to be nothing of value in here. I was not disappointed.

#48

syph

-1 Frags – +

Toxicity might be shit to deal with sometimes but it makes games more competitive imo

#49

beachruin

8 Frags – +

So this is going to be an incredibly long and incoherent nerd essay I am so sorry.

There was a point in time where I was observing a lot of parts about the TF2 community. And just like the TF2 Facepunch Emporium years ago, I didn't want to even look at the TFTV forums because I thought this community's attitude towards anybody but themselves was incredibly fucking toxic and elitist.

Show Content

If you search back far enough into my history, you can see the parts where I was raised on Highlander and UGC values, when I would try to preach to an also equally as catered-to TF2 crowd about "play fair, play nice" values in order to try and recruit new players into competitive. I thought a majority of people here were volatile. I thought TFTV was a perfect example of self-fulfilling prophecy where idiots complained about why they weren't getting any love and attention from Valve and then they notice people shitting on their casual playerbase. I thought Invite players trying to preach to "get over it" were full of themselves and were too far up top to realize what they were saying was incredibly damaging to the newer audience.

I remember teaching to new people, other than my low-level game knowledge, that you should avoid TFTV or 6v6 elitists who told you that you were unable to play whatever you wanted because fuck it, play what you want. That if there was shittalk on your team or something that was making you uncomfortable with a teammate, you needed to talk about it and if they didn't comply to what you said, you needed to cut them to teach them it wasn't acceptable in your team. Or if you thought it was unchangeable, you needed to leave because if Valve never noticed competitive TF2 because of toxicity, that was entirely their fault, not Valve's. I thought a handful of 6v6 people were ungrateful, obnoxious, and sometimes insensitive, before I wondered if it was overly sensitive because of their inferiority complex at how much they never got attention. And in my mind I thought "ha, and they wonder why" and laughed at their hubris.

Then after volunteering for TFTV and being sponsored to LANs I learned about esports - and I gave up.

Anybody who has played with me recently knows my flaws and can tell you my flaws. Anybody who played with me back in the day also knows my flaws. They also probably know my fear. I didn't have thick enough skin, I've been too afraid to play again, even lobbies and pugs that don't matter. I hated being screamed at by PUG-star pockets if I took the beam off them for one second. I hated people in lobbies being aidslords who asked me how long I idled on a server for my Medigun points. Out of all my drops, my bad movement, my inability to learn from my mistakes, the worst thing I did in regards to playing the game was that I gave up.

In my head, I just didn't want to justify that behaviour or enable it to continue happening. In my hands, I didn't want to justify putting in time and effort to a grind where I had to go through that again. In my soul, I knew as a player I had lost long-term. There are people who got over it, ignored it, even indulged in it, and then put in the grind for days upon days and made their way to the top. Ondkaja told me that if you tilt, you deserve to lose, and you will be stronger if you can come out of it. Nursey taught me that you can literally go through hell on Earth, and still get to the top if you really wanted to get there. I didn't strive for stronger or the top, I didn't even strive for better. I tilted, I wasn't as committed as I thought. I gave up. As much as I want to go back and prove people wrong, or stick with "I love this game mode and I want to play again", it's not for me.

I get self-conscious now when people are surprised when I said I've played, or if they notice me in a pickup or lobby if I decide to surface to practice again. Fuck posting this alone is like I'm so afraid I'm just going to be judged for this negatively. As much as I enjoy playing the game mode that taught me competitive and made me want to stay involved even if I couldn't play it - I'm not cut out for it. I didn't grow a thick skin, but I didn't grow as a player either. But I know better people than me who have seen more in this community and have told people here to fuck off for less.

But where do we draw the line when it's all built on volunteers?

I've watched volunteers go through questioning the "teach if you can't play" attitude, and questions their self-worth by asking "if I'm not good at the game, does that mean I deserve to contribute to the competitive TF2 scene". Writers, casters, video editors, artists, who have played and might still play. Maybe they aren't cut out for it as much as their other calling. I see players who have also contributed stop or not focus as much on volunteering in order to focus on getting to the top - Stark and AMS, who did things like frag videos, casting, mapping, are people I can think of who dedicated a lot to their game.

But I used to get anonymous messages telling me I was doing more harm than good for competitive TF2 in my early days of trying to market it to the newbies and casuals, and I needed to stop. Volunteers have left or have refused to keep helping competitive TF2 growth because some of the top players' attitudes or egos are no longer justifiable to support the effort it takes to constantly keep trying to keep everything together. The few committed sponsors we left have made it clear they are dissatisfied with bad sportsmanship. And yet we're still here supporting a game where a consistent second place top 6v6 team is infamous for a shit-binding, shit-talking player who loves putting people on tilt. That's probably a constant x10 in other top scenes, though.

After checking out CS:GO and Overwatch's communities and what it's like up there and down in the vast wider range of it all, having to deal with more casual-sided people who argued they hate blanket nerfs and buffs that their game's competitive community forces upon the players and how esports is ruining how games are being balanced or build, or how vapid and toxic other games' communities are or how some extremists of video games push "you need to play video games for FUN, not sport" - I wonder about toxicity's grey side a lot more. Wonder what falls under "it's for the sport, don't kill the sport" versus "it's just abusive language, deal with it".

In the end, I contribute what I can because I love this game, I love the scene, I love the effort put in, and I love a good handful of you guys. But I wonder if I also do it because I feel like this is the only way people will accept me in this scene, because it's all I'm good at compared to playing it. I still wonder if I gave up too easily, but I guess I decided competitive wasn't for me - just as others far better or worse than me have decided it's not for them.

Whether we're not cut out and being too sensitive, or we're completely justified in not playing (for others, supporting) the game, is up to anybody else.

So this is going to be an incredibly long and incoherent nerd essay I am so sorry.

There was a point in time where I was observing a lot of parts about the TF2 community. And just like the TF2 Facepunch Emporium years ago, I didn't want to even look at the TFTV forums because I thought this community's attitude towards anybody but themselves was [i]incredibly[/i] fucking toxic and elitist.

[spoiler]If you search back [url=http://uberchain.tumblr.com/post/105464649104/]far enough into my history[/url], you can see the parts where I was raised on Highlander and UGC values, when I would try to preach to an also equally as catered-to TF2 crowd about "play fair, play nice" values in order to try and recruit new players into competitive. I thought a majority of people here were volatile. I thought TFTV was a perfect example of self-fulfilling prophecy where idiots complained about why they weren't getting any love and attention from Valve and then they notice people shitting on their casual playerbase. I thought Invite players trying to preach to "get over it" were full of themselves and were too far up top to realize what they were saying was incredibly damaging to the newer audience.

I remember teaching to new people, other than my low-level game knowledge, that you should avoid TFTV or 6v6 elitists who told you that you were unable to play whatever you wanted because fuck it, play what you want. That if there was shittalk on your team or something that was making you uncomfortable with a teammate, you needed to talk about it and if they didn't comply to what you said, you needed to cut them to teach them it wasn't acceptable in your team. Or if you thought it was unchangeable, you needed to leave because if Valve never noticed competitive TF2 because of toxicity, that was entirely their fault, not Valve's. I thought a handful of 6v6 people were ungrateful, obnoxious, and sometimes insensitive, before I wondered if it was overly sensitive because of their inferiority complex at how much they never got attention. And in my mind I thought "ha, and they wonder why" and laughed at their hubris.

Then after volunteering for TFTV and being sponsored to LANs I learned about esports - and [b]I gave up. [/b]

Anybody who has played with me recently knows my flaws and can tell you my flaws. Anybody who played with me back in the day also knows my flaws. They also probably know my fear. I didn't have thick enough skin, I've been too afraid to play again, even lobbies and pugs that don't matter. I hated being screamed at by PUG-star pockets if I took the beam off them for one second. I hated people in lobbies being aidslords who asked me how long I idled on a server for my Medigun points. Out of all my drops, my bad movement, my inability to learn from my mistakes, the worst thing I did in regards to playing the game was that [b]I gave up. [/b]

In my head, I just didn't want to justify that behaviour or enable it to continue happening. In my hands, I didn't want to justify putting in time and effort to a grind where I had to go through that again. In my soul, I knew as a player I had lost long-term. There are people who got over it, ignored it, even indulged in it, and then put in the grind for days upon days and made their way to the top. Ondkaja told me that if you tilt, you deserve to lose, and you will be stronger if you can come out of it. Nursey taught me that you can literally go through hell on Earth, and still get to the top if you really wanted to get there. I didn't strive for stronger or the top, I didn't even strive for better. I tilted, I wasn't as committed as I thought. I gave up. As much as I want to go back and prove people wrong, or stick with "I love this game mode and I want to play again", it's not for me.

I get self-conscious now when people are surprised when I said I've played, or if they notice me in a pickup or lobby if I decide to surface to practice again. Fuck posting this alone is like [i]I'm so afraid[/i] I'm just going to be judged for this negatively. As much as I enjoy playing the game mode that taught me competitive and made me want to stay involved even if I couldn't play it - I'm not cut out for it. [b]I didn't grow a thick skin, but I didn't grow as a player either. [/b]But I know better people than me who have seen more in this community and have told people here to fuck off for less.

But where do we draw the line when it's all built on volunteers?

I've watched volunteers go through questioning the "teach if you can't play" attitude, and questions their self-worth by asking "if I'm not good at the game, does that mean I deserve to contribute to the competitive TF2 scene". Writers, casters, video editors, artists, who have played and might still play. Maybe they aren't cut out for it as much as their other calling. I see players who have also contributed stop or not focus as much on volunteering in order to focus on getting to the top - Stark and AMS, who did things like frag videos, casting, mapping, are people I can think of who dedicated a lot to their game.

But I used to get anonymous messages telling me I was doing more harm than good for competitive TF2 in my early days of trying to market it to the newbies and casuals, and I needed to stop. Volunteers have left or have refused to keep helping competitive TF2 growth because some of the top players' attitudes or egos are no longer justifiable to support the effort it takes to constantly keep trying to keep everything together. The few committed sponsors we left have made it clear they are dissatisfied with bad sportsmanship. And yet we're still here supporting a game where a consistent second place top 6v6 team is infamous for a shit-binding, shit-talking player who loves putting people on tilt. That's probably a constant x10 in other top scenes, though.

After checking out CS:GO and Overwatch's communities and what it's like up there and down in the vast wider range of it all, having to deal with more casual-sided people who argued they hate blanket nerfs and buffs that their game's competitive community forces upon the players and how esports is ruining how games are being balanced or build, or how vapid and toxic other games' communities are or how some extremists of video games push "you need to play video games for FUN, not sport" - I wonder about toxicity's grey side a lot more. Wonder what falls under "it's for the sport, don't kill the sport" versus "it's just abusive language, deal with it". [/spoiler]

In the end, I contribute what I can because I love this game, I love the scene, I love the effort put in, and I love a good handful of you guys. But I wonder if I also do it because I feel like this is the only way people will accept me in this scene, because it's all I'm good at compared to playing it. I still wonder if I gave up too easily, but I guess I decided competitive wasn't for me - just as others far better or worse than me have decided it's not for them.

Whether we're not cut out and being too sensitive, or we're completely justified in not playing (for others, [i]supporting[/i]) the game, is up to anybody else.

#50

sandblast

2 Frags – +

SpaceCadet-Phantom-if you basically don't do something like this https://youtu.be/HshsGGvcTQg?t=5m45s
most people will be nice
aim clip at 5:08 of that video makes me laugh so hard, fucking great

percy fucking destroyed at 5:04, no reaction on face cam at all. rofl

any sandblast clip is ruined by the fucking keyboard clicking sound that never ends, hard to watch stream

i got a new kb so the clickyness is gone i made a big mistake buying it to begin with

[quote=SpaceCadet][quote=-Phantom-]if you basically don't do something like this https://youtu.be/HshsGGvcTQg?t=5m45s
most people will be nice[/quote]

aim clip at 5:08 of that video makes me laugh so hard, fucking great

percy fucking destroyed at 5:04, no reaction on face cam at all. rofl

any sandblast clip is ruined by the fucking keyboard clicking sound that never ends, hard to watch stream[/quote]
i got a new kb so the clickyness is gone i made a big mistake buying it to begin with

#51

hayes

4 Frags – +

I've haven't been playing pugs for very long or interacted with too many teams, but every team I've talked to has been over the top nice to me. Playing mix champ gave me a decent understanding of the game, where I've only met one toxic person over the course of ~60 pugs. I only have around 50 pug champ games, but most people are nice and just want to play. I've seen very new players tell the team to help them out multiple times, and every single time the team gives him/her pointers on what to do. The only toxic people I see are incredibly toxic towards everyone else, but they aren't very many.

I know I'm not the newest player ever, but new players should just ask for advice, play mix champ, and practice DM and jumping before playing seriously. People understandably get frusturated; I know I've had super shit games where people express that, but it's completely understandable and acceptable. Anyone whp is super toxic, just mute them and report them if you want to.

I've haven't been playing pugs for very long or interacted with too many teams, but every team I've talked to has been over the top nice to me. Playing mix champ gave me a decent understanding of the game, where I've only met one toxic person over the course of ~60 pugs. I only have around 50 pug champ games, but most people are nice and just want to play. I've seen very new players tell the team to help them out multiple times, and every single time the team gives him/her pointers on what to do. The only toxic people I see are incredibly toxic towards everyone else, but they aren't very many.

I know I'm not the newest player ever, but new players should just ask for advice, play mix champ, and practice DM and jumping before playing seriously. People understandably get frusturated; I know I've had super shit games where people express that, but it's completely understandable and acceptable. Anyone whp is super toxic, just mute them and report them if you want to.

#52

SpaceCadet

12 Frags – +

The only "toxic" thing that really annoys me happens pretty regularly on streams from the top players.

I'm not one to rip on the guy but b4nny is easily the worst offender and the best example. Lots of times the dude will die and he will say "what is he doing?" or "why is he even there?" or another phrase to try and indicate that he would not have died if the other player was just doing what he expected him to do.

I mean, you fucking died, its ok. One way or another you were either unlucky, fucked up, or were outplayed in that instance. It is a terribly toxic mindset to have, especially for the best players who should be above such things.

What annoys me the most is that I have begun to do this from time to time in scrims. I get fucking owned by someone and want to blame the other player because of their positioning or style of play. That is fucking idiotic and I hate myself after I say it every single time. I don't know how I got infected but I am confident it was from watching these streams.

The only "toxic" thing that really annoys me happens pretty regularly on streams from the top players.

I'm not one to rip on the guy but b4nny is easily the worst offender and the best example. Lots of times the dude will die and he will say "what is he doing?" or "why is he even there?" or another phrase to try and indicate that he would not have died if the other player was just doing what he expected him to do.

I mean, you fucking died, its ok. One way or another you were either unlucky, fucked up, or were outplayed in that instance. It is a terribly toxic mindset to have, especially for the best players who should be above such things.

What annoys me the most is that I have begun to do this from time to time in scrims. I get fucking owned by someone and want to blame the other player because of their positioning or style of play. That is fucking idiotic and I hate myself after I say it every single time. I don't know how I got infected but I am confident it was from watching these streams.

#53

Corrie

1 Frags – +

SpaceCadetThe only "toxic" thing that really annoys me happens pretty regularly on streams from the top players.

I'm not one to rip on the guy but b4nny is easily the worst offender and the best example. Lots of times the dude will die and he will say "what is he doing?" or "why is he even there?" or another phrase to try and indicate that he would not have died if the other player was just doing what he expected him to do.

I mean, you fucking died, its ok. One way or another you were either unlucky, fucked up, or were outplayed in that instance. It is a terribly toxic mindset to have, especially for the best players who should be above such things.

What annoys me the most is that I have begun to do this from time to time in scrims. I get fucking owned by someone and want to blame the other player because of their positioning or style of play. That is fucking idiotic and I hate myself after I say it every single time. I don't know how I got infected but I am confident it was from watching these streams.

I dont think that its toxicity if they just say it to themself. Its just the initial release of stress, really. If you look at all streamers they will do this to varying degrees.

[quote=SpaceCadet]The only "toxic" thing that really annoys me happens pretty regularly on streams from the top players.

I'm not one to rip on the guy but b4nny is easily the worst offender and the best example. Lots of times the dude will die and he will say "what is he doing?" or "why is he even there?" or another phrase to try and indicate that he would not have died if the other player was just doing what he expected him to do.

I mean, you fucking died, its ok. One way or another you were either unlucky, fucked up, or were outplayed in that instance. It is a terribly toxic mindset to have, especially for the best players who should be above such things.

What annoys me the most is that I have begun to do this from time to time in scrims. I get fucking owned by someone and want to blame the other player because of their positioning or style of play. That is fucking idiotic and I hate myself after I say it every single time. I don't know how I got infected but I am confident it was from watching these streams.[/quote]
I dont think that its toxicity if they just say it to themself. Its just the initial release of stress, really. If you look at all streamers they will do this to varying degrees.

#54

aim-

5 Frags – +

again i dont think anyone knows what toxic means

literally slemnish and arekk have spun this meme into a mainstream thing from s21

toxic is literally being being passive aggressive and just a bad personality to play with on a team

audibly sighing and having bitch tendencies such as avoiding saying whats on your mind and hindering your team from getting better are signs of being a toxic player to certain degrees

not responding when spoken to is also a big contender

again i dont think anyone knows what toxic means

literally slemnish and arekk have spun this meme into a mainstream thing from s21

toxic is literally being being passive aggressive and just a bad personality to play with on a team

audibly sighing and having bitch tendencies such as avoiding saying whats on your mind and hindering your team from getting better are signs of being a toxic player to certain degrees

not responding when spoken to is also a big contender

#55

SpaceCadet

1 Frags – +

CorrieSpaceCadetThe only "toxic" thing that really annoys me happens pretty regularly on streams from the top players.

I'm not one to rip on the guy but b4nny is easily the worst offender and the best example. Lots of times the dude will die and he will say "what is he doing?" or "why is he even there?" or another phrase to try and indicate that he would not have died if the other player was just doing what he expected him to do.

I mean, you fucking died, its ok. One way or another you were either unlucky, fucked up, or were outplayed in that instance. It is a terribly toxic mindset to have, especially for the best players who should be above such things.

What annoys me the most is that I have begun to do this from time to time in scrims. I get fucking owned by someone and want to blame the other player because of their positioning or style of play. That is fucking idiotic and I hate myself after I say it every single time. I don't know how I got infected but I am confident it was from watching these streams.I dont think that its toxicity if they just say it to themself. Its just the initial release of stress, really. If you look at all streamers they will do this to varying degrees.

In front of 300+ viewers isn't exactly to themselves but I guess it depends on the way you look at it.
Your view point is valid, so I suppose its different for each person on what they view as toxic

[quote=Corrie][quote=SpaceCadet]The only "toxic" thing that really annoys me happens pretty regularly on streams from the top players.

I'm not one to rip on the guy but b4nny is easily the worst offender and the best example. Lots of times the dude will die and he will say "what is he doing?" or "why is he even there?" or another phrase to try and indicate that he would not have died if the other player was just doing what he expected him to do.

I mean, you fucking died, its ok. One way or another you were either unlucky, fucked up, or were outplayed in that instance. It is a terribly toxic mindset to have, especially for the best players who should be above such things.

What annoys me the most is that I have begun to do this from time to time in scrims. I get fucking owned by someone and want to blame the other player because of their positioning or style of play. That is fucking idiotic and I hate myself after I say it every single time. I don't know how I got infected but I am confident it was from watching these streams.[/quote]
I dont think that its toxicity if they just say it to themself. Its just the initial release of stress, really. If you look at all streamers they will do this to varying degrees.[/quote]

In front of 300+ viewers isn't exactly to themselves but I guess it depends on the way you look at it.
Your view point is valid, so I suppose its different for each person on what they view as toxic

#56

DarkNecrid

2 Frags – +

#49 I feel ya, I was sort of similar really. Back in the day when dinosaurs roamed the earth and b4nny didn't exist yet as a competitive player I was a pubber who played Arena (2k of my 8k hours are Arena lmao) and a bunch of competitive players came in one day and were just massive cunts to everyone and kept bragging about playing ESEA etc. I pretty much became one of those bots that said "tf2 wasnt intended to be competitive, etc etc".

Then I got accepted into the 2nd GameFAQ's 6v9 hosted by Cerious as the pubstar Spy. It was fun and I did try a bunch of TF2Lobbies because of it (although I almost quit because literally my 3rd lobby some of vhalins friends were on our team and swapped to his team and made it a 3v9...AND it was yukon so it was already miserable), but I wasn't totally convinced. (although reading gotfrag was fun as a lurker)

The game changer for me was that I was considered the best pubstar Spy out of all the 6v9s so I was asked to come back as the Allstar Pub Spy for an Allstar game, which was against Blaze, Yz50, Move, SolidSnake, Radio Raheem, and TLR.

While everyone on that team was cool, the game changer for me was Blaze. I wish I could get the archive of the GotFrag thread for that 6v9 but Blaze was the best. His personality and attitude towards me is basically the sole reason I even bothered really playing 6s and is the sole reason I played Highlander and have kept up with this scene since 2009 after getting over my comp hate spree from 2008.

I usually have somewhat thin skin myself, but the niceness Blaze displayed after that event was a glimmer of hope in what was to me (and tbh, still is) a sea of toxicity. It's all I needed to try because if I could find a team filled with people like that I could be content.

In the 8 years + some odd months I've been playing I only ever found those dream teams twice.

I mostly stayed for the people I do like, but my people have basically all quit at this point (the Runaway Five folks and what not).

If you're too thin skinned to play, I don't blame you at all, but I hope you're doing these things because you actually enjoy doing them and not because you want to contribute to the invisible "community" as the only thing you'll ever really get out of this is personal fulfillment and maybe the occasional feel good moment by people that will just go be dumb like 2 seconds later.

Things on this front won't get any better, I've experienced it personally get worse as the nice players I buddied up with quit the game - in part (often a significant part) due to the community's overall personality and attitude. The blatant hypocrisy of wanting the game to be big and then acting abhorrent within the community is also pretty annoying. People usually pull the "but people are awful in other (bigger) games too so its ok" card but its like, yeah, but those games competitive scenes aren't actually dying, need tons more players and sponsor support and don't mostly hinge on community support to survive. I mean, ESEA last season dropped to the same amount of teams it had back in Season 7 which was the season when it fully destroyed CEVO and became the main 6s site - so large that they finally introduced Intermediate for the first time. That was in August 23rd, 2010. TF2 can't really afford that level of behavior, it isn't fuck huge like those other games are. Those games being fuck huge is what allows that level of behavior to not impact them severely.

#49 I feel ya, I was sort of similar really. Back in the day when dinosaurs roamed the earth and b4nny didn't exist yet as a competitive player I was a pubber who played Arena (2k of my 8k hours are Arena lmao) and a bunch of competitive players came in one day and were just massive cunts to everyone and kept bragging about playing ESEA etc. I pretty much became one of those bots that said "tf2 wasnt intended to be competitive, etc etc".

Then I got accepted into the 2nd GameFAQ's 6v9 hosted by Cerious as the pubstar Spy. It was fun and I did try a bunch of TF2Lobbies because of it (although I almost quit because literally my 3rd lobby some of vhalins friends were on our team and swapped to his team and made it a 3v9...AND it was yukon so it was already miserable), but I wasn't totally convinced. (although reading gotfrag was fun as a lurker)

The game changer for me was that I was considered the best pubstar Spy out of all the 6v9s so I was asked to come back as the Allstar Pub Spy for an Allstar game, which was against Blaze, Yz50, Move, SolidSnake, Radio Raheem, and TLR.

While everyone on that team was cool, the game changer for me was Blaze. I wish I could get the archive of the GotFrag thread for that 6v9 but Blaze was the best. His personality and attitude towards me is basically the sole reason I even bothered really playing 6s and is the sole reason I played Highlander and have kept up with this scene since 2009 after getting over my comp hate spree from 2008.

I usually have somewhat thin skin myself, but the niceness Blaze displayed after that event was a glimmer of hope in what was to me (and tbh, still is) a sea of toxicity. It's all I needed to try because if I could find a team filled with people like that I could be content.

In the 8 years + some odd months I've been playing I only ever found those dream teams twice.

I mostly stayed for the people I do like, but my people have basically all quit at this point (the Runaway Five folks and what not).

If you're too thin skinned to play, I don't blame you at all, but I hope you're doing these things because you actually enjoy doing them and not because you want to contribute to the invisible "community" as the only thing you'll ever really get out of this is personal fulfillment and maybe the occasional feel good moment by people that will just go be dumb like 2 seconds later.

Things on this front won't get any better, I've experienced it personally get worse as the nice players I buddied up with quit the game - in part (often a significant part) due to the community's overall personality and attitude. The blatant hypocrisy of wanting the game to be big and then acting abhorrent within the community is also pretty annoying. People usually pull the "but people are awful in other (bigger) games too so its ok" card but its like, yeah, but those games competitive scenes aren't actually dying, need tons more players and sponsor support and don't mostly hinge on community support to survive. I mean, ESEA last season dropped to the same amount of teams it had back in Season 7 which was the season when it fully destroyed CEVO and became the main 6s site - so large that they finally introduced Intermediate for the first time. That was in August 23rd, 2010. TF2 can't really afford that level of behavior, it isn't fuck huge like those other games are. Those games being fuck huge is what allows that level of behavior to not impact them severely.

#57

Corrie

0 Frags – +

SpaceCadetCorrieSpaceCadetThe only "toxic" thing that really annoys me happens pretty regularly on streams from the top players.

I'm not one to rip on the guy but b4nny is easily the worst offender and the best example. Lots of times the dude will die and he will say "what is he doing?" or "why is he even there?" or another phrase to try and indicate that he would not have died if the other player was just doing what he expected him to do.

I mean, you fucking died, its ok. One way or another you were either unlucky, fucked up, or were outplayed in that instance. It is a terribly toxic mindset to have, especially for the best players who should be above such things.

What annoys me the most is that I have begun to do this from time to time in scrims. I get fucking owned by someone and want to blame the other player because of their positioning or style of play. That is fucking idiotic and I hate myself after I say it every single time. I don't know how I got infected but I am confident it was from watching these streams.I dont think that its toxicity if they just say it to themself. Its just the initial release of stress, really. If you look at all streamers they will do this to varying degrees.
In front of 300+ viewers isn't exactly to themselves but I guess it depends on the way you look at it.
Your view point is valid, so I suppose its different for each person on what they view as toxic

It seems to be a natural reaction. I know i cant help doing it sometimes They just happen to be streaming in front of people. For me personally, toxicity is when you go out of your way to make other people feel bad, often becuase yourself feel that way. Sometimes if i dislike the way someone is playing i'll get the urge to call them a cunt. Toxicity is if i actually called them a cunt

[quote=SpaceCadet][quote=Corrie][quote=SpaceCadet]The only "toxic" thing that really annoys me happens pretty regularly on streams from the top players.

I'm not one to rip on the guy but b4nny is easily the worst offender and the best example. Lots of times the dude will die and he will say "what is he doing?" or "why is he even there?" or another phrase to try and indicate that he would not have died if the other player was just doing what he expected him to do.

I mean, you fucking died, its ok. One way or another you were either unlucky, fucked up, or were outplayed in that instance. It is a terribly toxic mindset to have, especially for the best players who should be above such things.

What annoys me the most is that I have begun to do this from time to time in scrims. I get fucking owned by someone and want to blame the other player because of their positioning or style of play. That is fucking idiotic and I hate myself after I say it every single time. I don't know how I got infected but I am confident it was from watching these streams.[/quote]
I dont think that its toxicity if they just say it to themself. Its just the initial release of stress, really. If you look at all streamers they will do this to varying degrees.[/quote]

In front of 300+ viewers isn't exactly to themselves but I guess it depends on the way you look at it.
Your view point is valid, so I suppose its different for each person on what they view as toxic[/quote]
It seems to be a natural reaction. I know i cant help doing it sometimes They just happen to be streaming in front of people. For me personally, toxicity is when you go out of your way to make other people feel bad, often becuase yourself feel that way. Sometimes if i dislike the way someone is playing i'll get the urge to call them a cunt. Toxicity is if i actually called them a cunt

#58

dishsoap

-5 Frags – +

Am i toxic?

#59

All_Over_RS

6 Frags – +

dishsoapAm i toxic?

well i drank dish soap once and it hurt my stomach a lot so i would say yes

[quote=dishsoap]Am i toxic?[/quote]

well i drank dish soap once and it hurt my stomach a lot so i would say yes

#60

dishsoap

-7 Frags – +

All_Over_RSdishsoapAm i toxic?
well i drank dish soap once and it hurt my stomach a lot so i would say yes

Ok i might be toxic but you are straight DUMB

[quote=All_Over_RS][quote=dishsoap]Am i toxic?[/quote]

well i drank dish soap once and it hurt my stomach a lot so i would say yes[/quote]
Ok i might be toxic but you are straight DUMB