Forza Italia!

Perm's unusually extended rumspringa is finally over

In the UK the business news goes like this: industrial output in decline, service sector performing well. The service sector is dominated by the financial sector, the whole economy leans on it and the EU is a massive part of that. The FTSE 100 is plastered with international companies because capital they put into Britain can flow freely around the EU.

The free market consists of free movement of goods, capital, services and labour. If we don't get free movement of capital and services our economy is going to burn, all the other established trading blocs have their own financial centers who aren't going to welcome London. Everybody knows that the UK economy needs this, so they will make us pay through the nose.

Financial institutions are already announcing plans to move jobs in the thousands and they haven't even been seriously courted by Paris and Frankfurt yet. I can't imagine any future where we don't give everything to maintain access to the free market and the EU does not negotiate on the individual parts - you have one you have them all. Draw your own conclusions, we've gained nothing.

The notional "democracy and control" we've gained we already had. We just peacefully voted to leave the EU. No EU tanks are turning up at Dover to stop us. We were always in a democracy and we always had control and were one vote away from exercising it. They never have an answer to that either.

Are you seriously saying you think politicians in the UK don't go on to extremely cushy jobs after being in office? Acoba is a revolving door, lobbying rules are basically non-existent, we have just abolished regulations that make it easier for Parliament to become even more corrupt. Removing another possibility that allows politicians to be career politicians makes them more likely to have their eye on feathering their nest at the exit door. They are going to be more corrupt, as hard as that might be to believe.

The level of ignorance of the average UK voter has been covered previously in some depth. They didn't know, just face it. They probably thought Syrians were going to move into their Nan's spare bedroom.

Yeah look at all that misery they're causing, and questionable attitudes like anti-fascism on display. Who knows what they would have done if they'd won? They might even have hugged a Polish person.

You think there are 6 million eastern europeans in the UK?

To make sure that the latest heroic exploits of democracy's protectors get the publicity they deserve. Rule Britannia.

There's a difference between my implication and your inference, you're the one jumping to what you think is an obvious conclusion.

This is the UK, everybody is liberal - the Tories are liberal, it's the name of a dead center political party. Why are you commenting on a political environment you know nothing about? You don't even know the lingo.

Racist graffiti, hate mail and numerous reports of racist incidents all over the country telling people to get out because "We won".

Democracy's protectors.

Leave voters should be proud, these are your people.

e: one of democracy's protectors enjoys his new clean society

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClzR3azWYAASWOy.jpg

There's a fantasy scenario where the Tories call a general election before starting the process because of infighting and an effective labour leader emerges on a platform of calling a second referendum. Won't happen, the Tories will never call another one, although it would amuse me to see Cameron try in order to fuck people that have stabbed him in the back one last time.

The problem with that analysis is that it's in direct contradiction of the nature of the products that were at fault. Packaging toxic debts in a way to make them acceptably risk free is the very antithesis of the idea that you'll have overall grown your economies even if the bubble bursts, which would be an incredible risk. They were rated AAA, that's equivalent to gold, it's the same as money. Greek debt was rated AAA. There was no enjoying the party until the bubble burst, all these international bodies and firms are complicit in that. Of course you say don't invest if they're not rated AAA, that's what the ratings are for. It's just a total failure of the bodies who were charged with rating risk. The nobel prize winners watched the funds that pioneered their techniques go bust. I don't really want to argue about it but these weren't ordinary investment decisions, they were either a criminal con (which is why a load of US bankers landed in jail) or total incompetence.

These specifics don't run through the vast majority of voter's minds of course - I know I am weird for knowing about them - but the background noise and the fact that the average lower income voter has seen their living standards continue to decline make it easy to dismiss their advice now. "Everybody knows" that they're just self serving arseholes.

To put the anti-intellectualism in context, Johnson and Gove both have a background in journalism or effectively propaganda. They've gone into politics and are exceptionally cynical propagandists, and that's just an example of it. There wasn't a single voice they wouldn't smear in the most idiotic terms - Obama was against Britain because one of his ancestors is Kenyan and there's imperial history there. Gove is the mouthpiece of Lord Rothermere who hates Cameron. Their motives are mostly about Tory infighting and they're fucking the country while they're doing it.

For him personally losing was the suicide part.

The theory is that just by turning up and talking about it he's invoking the relevant article. I'm not sure that's the case or that other EU ministers will interpret it that way, and at this stage every opinion is dripping with undeclared interests. Not the opinion of an idiot though, a Prof in international relations or similar at Oxford.

There was the knowledge that debt was propping up the economy (a lot in mortgages) because that was the design, the supposed repackaging of toxic debt into safe bundles, junk bonds on steroids. A tiny handful of doomsayers spoke out but they carried no authority, while the architects of the financial "innovations" were given nobel prizes. Nobody big like the IMF, the EU, any central banks, credit ratings agencies, etc moved until it was too late. Those are the institutions predicting doom now and their failure makes it too easy to discredit them.

Credit ratings agencies that passed Greece as AAA safe 10 years ago are downgrading the UK. It doesn't have the impact it once had, even if this time they're right. That's why we have a zombie economy now, nobody has any other ideas other than to extend debt again, but there is no way to do it safely.

e: I've just been reminded of one of Michael Gove's lines during the campaign: “People in this country have had enough of experts.”. Says it all really.

Not without repercussions, it would be political suicide - they would destroy their popular vote at the next election and breathe new life into their rivals on the right who have now been completely neutralised. Also some legal opinion is that the next time Cameron meets his EU counterparts that would trigger exit negotiations regardless of intent.