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kittyndollarlayerwere u in a bathroomkittyndollarlayer have u ever met a trans person irl ever before ever
Yes, in Asia I've had them try to hit on me and my straight friends before. Not a good experience. :(
With the transexual individual I was not at a bathroom, just at a hotel and at a 7-11. See above regarding my other experiences with opposite genders in the bathroom, I didn't want to double post so I added it.
kittyndollarlayer have u ever met a trans person irl ever before ever
Yes, in Asia I've had them try to hit on me and my straight friends before. Not a good experience. :(
ReeroI mean while it is very unlikely that a person will claim to be trans and use that to be a pervert, I can still also understand why it would make women uncomfortable in the showers and bathrooms.
I can also see a pervert using being trans to try to get out of trouble with the law when he may actually not be trans...
I personally can care less but I see both sides of the argument as reasonable.
Yea along the same lines as that, in Asia it was quite common for cleaning ladies to enter a bathroom with no notice while a man is there peeing or whatever. They would start moping the bathroom and sometimes even come quite close to you, to the point where you might feel like they are checking you out. This happened to me multiple times. After that happened the first time, if a women would enter, I'd usually zip up and go into a bathroom stall. Very annoying and an uncomfortable experience.
kittyn1. no
2. no
3. not at a higher rate than cis people
Well I'm encouraged that you seem to have some idea of what is acceptable and not acceptable in a restroom. And I agree with you regarding 1&2.
I believe however if transgender people are allowed to use either bathroom they need to have their rights clearly defined so they do not overstep whats allowed, and so they do not inconvenience or cause mental trauma to others.
But I still have another issue, and that is one that I brought up previously and that is: can a "legitimate" transgender individual that bears does no resemblance to the women they identify as enter a women's bathroom on a school or public property?
kittynuh no? cause he is a straight man that has his dong out are you fucking simple
and if theyre a transwoman then it completely depends on the people in the shower with them
Please actually read!
dollarlayerboth in the case of him identifying as a transgender women, and as a straight man
By both cases I mean 2 scenarios.
1) Is it ok for a biological but legitimately transgendered man that identifies as a women to shower with his junk hanging out inside a women's locker room?
2) Is it ok if a man that is not transgendered to shower in a women's locker room with his junk hanging out.
kittynregardless i dont think that would ever happen ever except in dollarlayer land where going to the bathroom means youre a rapist
"There are also nearly 700,000 transgender individuals in the US." Oh so not even 1 out of 700,000 people are ever going to do that?
kittynlol its already pretty simple if youre not a fucking retard its not like crossdressing is a free ticket to legal sexual assault town population whoever is in this bathroom im going into
It's simple is it, then please provide a clear and concise answer regarding if it is acceptable for a man to shower in a women's locker room with his junk hanging out (both in the case of him identifying as a transgender women, and as a straight man).
saturn_dollarlayerif you think perverts and rapists are going to just not enter bathrooms no matter what transgender laws exist you're seriously kidding yourself & if you seriously cared about victims of sexual assault you wouldn't be bring them up as a rhetorical gotcha against a group that's more statistically likely to be raped in the first place. do you think bathrooms forcing trans people into the bathroom that corresponds with their sex assigned to them at birth wouldn't be difficult to enforce, either?Max_Do you even read the articles you post
Literally the first paragraph
“This didn’t seem like a transgender issue to staff — someone who was ‘identifying’ as a woman,” Seattle Parks and Recreation Communications Manager David Takami told me via email. “We have guidelines that allow transgender individuals to use restrooms and locker rooms consistent with their gender identity.”
At around 5:30 p.m. on Feb. 8, an adult went into the locker room to change. Takami says that at “no time did he verbally ‘identify’ as female,” nor did he request to be treated as transgender."
I'm not sure if you read my previous post. Here is a quote from it:
dollarlayerBut if they are actually trans or not, that is quite irrelevant. There are so many rules and regulations you'd have to implement by allowing either sex to enter either bathroom.
Basically what I'm saying is by changing laws or allowing "legitimate" transgender individuals to enter either bathroom of their choice you open up a can of worms to those that may not even remotely be transgender and might be completely straight pervert individuals.
it's kind of telling that you choose to ignore actual statistics in favor of cherry picked stories, none of which were committed by a trans person in the first place and rely on completely hypothetical situations as the basis for your arguments. do you think an entire group of people should be punished on the off chance that someone might do a bad thing when they go to pee? do you not see how stupid that is?
That follows the same liberal logic as the gun free zone signs, that criminals respect the law. That is not at all my point, that its possible to stop sexual assault or rape.
My point is there needs to be a clear definition of what is considered acceptable so those breaking the law can be prosecuted by the definition of the law. When transgender people are put into the equation defining what is lawful and unlawful can be quite difficult.
LsRainbowsdollarlayerkittynname a single time any of those things have actually happened
Here you go here is, an example of 1) http://mynorthwest.com/188993/man-caught-undressing-in-front-of-girls-at-green-lake-locker-room/
You think thats bad, look at this!
http://www.mizozo.com/world/12/2010/03/anne-marie-o-loughlin-female-rapist-found-guilty-o....html
Clearly we can't allow women in to women's bathroom either, to prevent this sort of thing from happening!
Rape is rape, doesn't matter who does it. There are same sex creeps, opposite sex creeps, transgender creeps etc. I don't think anyone is arguing that same sex individuals are incapable of sexually abusing or raping another individual.
A man showering in a women's bathroom with his junk hanging out is a totally separate issue. Are you saying you are cool with that, and that the majority of women would find it acceptable and be like oh no big deal that guy over there with a raging erection, yea I'm fine I'll just continue dressing here in the corner as he looks over at me.
radeondollarlayerI could really just keep thinking of scenario after scenario where transgender people could cause quite a disruption in rest rooms and locker rooms.http://www.vox.com/cards/transgender-myths-fiction-facts/transgender-bathroom-bills
This page in itself does a pretty good job debunking your theory.
I don't need any debunking when I have already provided two sources in just a couple of minutes, which show the issues with these transgender laws regarding bathroom sharing.
Max_Do you even read the articles you post
Literally the first paragraph
“This didn’t seem like a transgender issue to staff — someone who was ‘identifying’ as a woman,” Seattle Parks and Recreation Communications Manager David Takami told me via email. “We have guidelines that allow transgender individuals to use restrooms and locker rooms consistent with their gender identity.”
At around 5:30 p.m. on Feb. 8, an adult went into the locker room to change. Takami says that at “no time did he verbally ‘identify’ as female,” nor did he request to be treated as transgender."
I'm not sure if you read my previous post. Here is a quote from it:
dollarlayerBut if they are actually trans or not, that is quite irrelevant. There are so many rules and regulations you'd have to implement by allowing either sex to enter either bathroom.
Basically what I'm saying is by changing laws or allowing "legitimate" transgender individuals to enter either bathroom of their choice you open up a can of worms to those that may not even remotely be transgender and might be completely straight pervert individuals.
Although a "transgender" person might not be at directly fault, the laws in some states which allow either sex to enter either bathroom are problematic and difficult or impossible to enforce.
kittynname a single time any of those things have actually happened
Here you go here is, an example of 1) http://mynorthwest.com/188993/man-caught-undressing-in-front-of-girls-at-green-lake-locker-room/
And another: http://dailycaller.com/2016/02/17/man-strips-in-womens-restroom-says-new-transgender-rules-make-it-totally-legal/
harvestdollarlayerhe doesn't identify as one it's clear throughout the entire article, people like this just make trans people look bad that doesn't mean trans people should be punished as a whole because of some terrible people. the facts are this: actual trans people have 0 cases of sexual assault against cis in public bathrooms. ur post is literally cis guy vs cis women i don't understand. plus, if you really believe that is a problem, what about all the trans people being sexually assaulted on a daily basis by cis people because they're forced to be in a bathroom that doesn't fit their gender identity?fatswimdudei think the problem there is that the person was videotaping in a restroom, not anything to do with gender identity
He was dressed as women, how do you know that he doesn't identify as one?
This is one of the very problems im trying to point out is even if he is a straight man and was just in it for the recordings, allowing the opposite sex into a rest room just opens up a door of possibilities for crimes. There are some pretty small cameras now days if he wasn't an idiot he could have totally gotten away with it.
who cares that 1 of every 2 transgender individuals experience being sexually assaulted in their life. 1 2 3
basically my point is either way you go, that kind of shit is going to happen. but if you let trans people go into the bathroom they identify as it will happen less often if you're including everyone (aka yes trans people aswell)
like as you say, we have it now: Disgusting VILE "trans" women will go into women's bathrooms and sexually assault women, so the solution would be to not allow that right?
but if that were not allowed, trans women will just be fucking sexually assaulted in men's bathrooms, far more often than cis people getting sexually assaulted by trans people.
imagine https://s.yimg.com/ny/api/res/1.2/bEIMe1aV4OwRNjDJ67Allw--/YXBwaWQ9aGlnaGxhbmRlcjtzbT0xO3c9NDI3O2g9NjQwO2lsPXBsYW5l/http://40.media.tumblr.com/1f492d69ef84964c14bf9936f27dd472/tumblr_inline_nxzbzgepUN1t1n6uk_540.jpg her in a men's bathroom because by your standards your method would prevent sexual assault, so she wouldn't be sexually assaulted in a men's bathroom? (she's trans if you can't tell)
tl;dr explain your solution because it seems like what you want to do will just cause more sexual assault ironically, but instead to trans people
You are genuinely judging how the person feels from a several paragraph NBC article? The individual could be gender fluid, you never know. But if they are actually trans or not, that is quite irrelevant. There are so many rules and regulations you'd have to implement by allowing either sex to enter either bathroom.
1) Can an individual that completely appears to be a man (clothes, facial hair and general demeanor depict them as a man) enter a women's bathroom? Why or why not?
2) If not, what level of qualifications do they need. Do they need a doctor or psychologist to issue a statement validating that they are a "legitimate" transgender? Or do they need to dress like an average women?
3) What is stopping a straight pervert man or teen from wearing a wig and entering a women's bathroom to take a look at women using the bathroom or showering. If they are accused of being a perv, how to prosecute them and differentiate them from a "legitimate" transgender?
4) At say a university women locker room, a biological man that identifies as a women enters the locker room to shower. Women that are also showering and using the facility see his male body parts, are they to accept this as normal? I have a feeling that security or the police would be called. How do you handle this kind of situation? Are the transgender allowed to shower and enter a women's bathroom as long as they hide their opposite sex body parts?
I could really just keep thinking of scenario after scenario where transgender people could cause quite a disruption in rest rooms and locker rooms.
fatswimdudei think the problem there is that the person was videotaping in a restroom, not anything to do with gender identity
He was dressed as women, how do you know that he doesn't identify as one?
This is one of the very problems im trying to point out is even if he is a straight man and was just in it for the recordings, allowing the opposite sex into a rest room just opens up a door of possibilities for crimes. There are some pretty small cameras now days if he wasn't an idiot he could have totally gotten away with it.
saturn_OH BOY I THOUGHT I WAS GONNA NOT POST IN THIS THREAD ANYMORE, BUT,hooli I mean its not like a 52 year old man identifying as a 6 year old girl, in girls bathroom at an elementary school could be considered a problem by the kids or parents.... (/sarcasm).
LOL. Fake hooli quotes. :P
saturn_do you want to know how many proven assaults there are from trans people to others in bathrooms? it's a big fat whopping zero. inversely, trans people are more likely to be the ones assaulted in bathrooms, not the other way around.
It literally happened 2 weeks ago in California. A transgendered (biological man) was video taping women in the bathroom. http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Secret-Recording-Store-Mall-Antelope-Valley-Palmdale-Restroom-207541101.html
eee"they don't need any psychological treatment"
man you literally have no idea how most people want to handle trans people
Care to enlighten me with what you mean by that?
I'm aware that there are some "extremists" that wouldn't mind just shooting them. I'm not one of those people, I think they need to be loved and cared for just like any human deserves. But I think they need psychological treatment and guidance and just need good friends and family to support them, in the same way someone needs support if they are going through depression.
You guys are like hawks -4 frags in 120 seconds, I'm impressed! :D