Is this the Proletariat vs. the Bourgeoisie? It seems like people think they're part of some big communist revolution for the working class tf2 player.

yes

kill the police

Alright, so much for my first Teamfortress.TV post, but here it is.

First of all, Killing's in class, so he couldn't answer any of these replies during the day, he had a midterm, but we spoke a few minutes ago.

I am Shooter, League Commissioner for ESEA League. Validation right here; https://play.esea.net/users/131406

As Killing said in previous replies on other threads, in other to have a season of the League, Invite/Main/Intermediate teams need to be paid before we close registration, and we need to have enough teams in the Open division. If the final decision is to NOT have a TF2 season (due to NOT enough teams) within ESEA, everyone who paid league fees will be refunded, once the decision has been taken (it can take a few days).

Shooter please save us

ESEA really want to continue to support the TF2 community, but to do that ESEA needs to have paid teams signed up to the League.

this thread is already 25 pages deep, i'm not sure if killing already addressed this but has the option of gutting main + im and having open + invite been discussed at all? what sort of options/flexibility do you have there

nvm defy

invite teams should pay up if they want the league to live

nah just give a refund for the difference in fees.

I think defy's point was that having only 2 prize pots would save money, which I didn't think of.

well ya, i thought that was obvious :P

We have different options in mind, but at the moment, 0 Main, 2 Intermediate, and 2 Open teams paid. That's 4 teams total ready on about ~55 teams combined. I don't think removing divisons would be very welcomed, but I can be wrong.

oh shit pipher is apparently typing his reply to my thread right now. i'm hyped, hopefully i look like an idiot and cevo turns out to be the shit since esea is looking like its fucked.

you need to be more vocal about what options you're considering/keeping us updated. telling people we will have an esea season no matter what would get a LOT of teams paid up. word on the street is that esea is dead so i dont think you're gonna see very many people paying up regardless of if that's true or not.

no offense to you directly, but you guys are shitting the bed and should probably stop doing that.

I stopped paying attention to this thread but someone else showed me this so here we go:

"Do you really think in just a few days you will be able to offer a league that's an equal to ESEA AS IT IS RIGHT NOW, or do you think that will take a good amount of time?"

• No one has ever advocated CEVO as an equal to ESEA in terms of current competition, establishment, legacy, or service. When I talk to everyone about CEVO, the main point I stress is that if we build a better foundation now, the league will only grow faster and develop even more. If you start strong, there's less to fix in the future and you can continue building up from there. I said this in another post, if you really want me to find, I will because I can.

"Obviously you guys joining forces with CEVO and making a big run for it publically when this has never happened before would split the community. So if this was your intention then I really hope you, Lange, and everyone else all of whom I respect really know what you're doing."

• AGAIN - I WANTED TO PLAY IN ESEA. My team was the first one to start paying in IM because that's how weird and on top of my shit I am. My new players joined roster the day they unlocked and I immediately paid for 3 people. I created a CEVO roster and described it "jk not actually doing this" (see previous pastebin that someone kept for some reason). The only reason I am volunteer staff for CEVO now is because I knew two weeks ago that ESEA was going to die. If you'll recall blink, who was the one who messaged you first about all this which turned into you starting this thread? Who messaged 50+ other leaders and players telling them of this possibility? And you know what I did from there? I added cevo captains. I talked to cevo captains. And that's how I knew that no, we wouldn't get enough teams in ESEA, so yes-- CEVO is probably our only chance to play competitive this season. So you can direct your "why'd you have to split the community" question somewhere else, because my only intent was to foster the growth and improvement of CEVO as much as possible only after I knew ESEA was going to die.

"ESEA has been around for 16 seasons they shouldn't have to campaign for newer players like you guys did."

• Establishment and seniority don't mean automatic domination of a consumer group. Just because esea's been around for a while doesn't mean it WILL BE around forever. When it comes down to it, a competitive league is providing a service. Teams/players consume that service. And as I and many others have said before-- after last season's horrible track record (delayed registration by a month, rosters took forever to unlock, client was broken week 1, people had to play over thanksgiving, etc etc etc LIST GOES ON FOREVER) on top of the continuing complaints of server lag, history of client problems + bitcoin rep, and clear lack of response to requests for things like soap dm, better stats, EVERYTHING. Yes. ESEA DOES have to campaign for new players. Because if there's an alternative out there like CEVO then they should be competing to keep their customers.

TL;DR ESEA killed itself. I'm only trying to make sure CEVO's the best it can be now so it'll flourish faster and get to a level that will hopefully be better than ESEA ever was.

Never going on forums again I can't believe this is 25 pages.

goddamnit edit:
"Do you really think if CEVO hadn't come about, that ESEA would be having these problems filling up their open division?"

• From PAGE FUCKING 4 LORD JESUS CHRIST:
  1) ESEA's higher divisions have never looked stronger than right now. Open is empty.
  2) CEVO's initially registered teams and a majority of the currently 91 rosters are new players.
  Of course not. If there were no competition, then ESEA would continue to have a monopoly.

ded

I think ESEA has said pretty much since the beginning that anyone who registered would be refunded if at the end not enough teams showed interests to play on ESEA.

Before announcing options, I think it would be worth it to keep the 4 divisions format, simply because it would be the best season so far (as I've heard...).

I dig that people would get refunded but my point is if people are a little tight on cash/worried about how long the delay will be on a refund why not guarantee the season if that's what it takes?

More people would be interested if you guys were more vocal man, look at how many cevo idiots post walls of text on here about random shit. like someone just posted this list of things "cevo did for us" and it was shit like "made cevo servers available for matches" and "made players pay $15 to pay and then made a prize pot with that money" like this is a big deal or some selfless act of cevo.

DO SOMETHING PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

The refund wouldn't be very long to process on our end (not sure about how Paypal does it, though).

I can't guarantee a season, but if enough teams sign up, ESEA will really look into it to have a season. Look at last season's number, and compare to this season... :S

Ok so ESEA has 2 different plans in mind. Please TELL US what those plans are. You should probably get some feedback from us first. This will of course require you to extend registration. There is no way we will get ~50 teams fully paid in the next few hours, especially if we have no idea what the "plans" are.

- extend registration
- tell us the options
- give us time to pay

EDIT: also, if this season is scrapped please don't drop TF2. If cevo falls through everyone will come back.

oh i'm sure we will be graced with your idiotic presence again, thanks for stopping by

alright so pipher replied http://cevo.com/forums/topic/6284/team-fortress-2/questions-for-cevo-regarding-tf2/

tl;dr version:
-they might have ddos protection on their servers, they might not

-no guarantee on getting a reschedule if ddos'ed, case by case basis (they like to think they're fair about it)

-they should be able to roughly triple the prize pool of this season so no increase in fees next season even with new divisions

-cevo-p "more than likely" to be in next season, another division (im/main/whatever they call it) as well if participation increases

-increased prize pots (no defined amount) and prestige to tempt teams to play in the highest possible divisions/not sandbag

-you can file a formal dispute if you think someone's cheating (tf2 staff--no clue who--reviews a demo or something?)

-supposedly paladin ring0/kernel cheat proof

i like that pipher replied, but there was a LOT of "more than likely" and "should be able to" and "hopefully" esque words. felt a lot like an esea post just worded less abrasively. idk, hopefully all his replies were the truth and cevo is the shit.

Extending registration is always an option for us, depending the numbers we have once we close it.
The prefered options is to have the 4 divisions (like I said earlier) Invite/Main/Intermediate/Open.

I'll run some numbers, and I'll post here the minimum. Would that help?

yes. minimum numbers would help, for both a 4 division season and a 2 division season. i know 4 division is the goal as it looks like shit if we have to drop to 2 but you guys fucked up big time and did next to nothing to remedy the situation. it's desperation time if you guys care at all about your tf2 division.

Would a 2 division season have a LAN?

Since it's likely that there will be fewer teams this season, are we going to see a reduction in the number of match servers? I believe it was increased last season, but it would only follow that a reduction in teams would cause a reduction in servers.

yes, definitely

shooter we'd really appreciate it if you interacted with us more often! thanks for hearing us out.

shooter please ignore mr_slin at all costs. he is nothing more than a troll in this community.

shooter if you ever wanted to know what marmadukeGRYLLS looks like IRL you can mouseover this spoiler below