I mean, I feel like this is probably a pretty weird thing to question, but during matches my dpm is usually from 225 to 275, and I feel like that is a little bit low for a roamer, although I am usually not dying too much and I tend to get plenty of frags. I feel like this might reflect my play style some. I usually just hold the flank during holds and I don't really go for picks unless we are at a disadvantage or unless I see a clear opportunity. I was wondering if I should play more aggressively and try to initiate more fights for my team,and bomb in for picks more often, or if my current strategy about holding flanks and then flanking the uber to clean up frags is a valid one. What sort of situations might there be when each one should be used?
Thank you in advance, I would just like to get an essential part of my game solidified before I become too comfortable with a potentially bad play style.
I mean, I feel like this is probably a pretty weird thing to question, but during matches my dpm is usually from 225 to 275, and I feel like that is a little bit low for a roamer, although I am usually not dying too much and I tend to get plenty of frags. I feel like this might reflect my play style some. I usually just hold the flank during holds and I don't really go for picks unless we are at a disadvantage or unless I see a clear opportunity. I was wondering if I should play more aggressively and try to initiate more fights for my team,and bomb in for picks more often, or if my current strategy about holding flanks and then flanking the uber to clean up frags is a valid one. What sort of situations might there be when each one should be used?
Thank you in advance, I would just like to get an essential part of my game solidified before I become too comfortable with a potentially bad play style.
if you're still carving out your play style as a roamer you shouldn't be worrying too much about DPM at the moment. those numbers are fair if you started to dip below 200 then your dm might be suffering a bit but things like this are best discussed with your team as well because it will help you work out the kinks of what you should or shouldn't be doing in holds and in transition
if you're still carving out your play style as a roamer you shouldn't be worrying too much about DPM at the moment. those numbers are fair if you started to dip below 200 then your dm might be suffering a bit but things like this are best discussed with your team as well because it will help you work out the kinks of what you should or shouldn't be doing in holds and in transition
you're basically just listing the two styles of roamer, you play the more passive role. nothing wrong with it as long as it works with your teams play style. dont worry about dpm, a LOT of damage is farmed by pockets/demos during stalemates. 200+ and you're fine.
you're basically just listing the two styles of roamer, you play the more passive role. nothing wrong with it as long as it works with your teams play style. dont worry about dpm, a LOT of damage is farmed by pockets/demos during stalemates. 200+ and you're fine.
That damage isn't low. lol
That damage isn't low. lol
generalized dpm numbers are dumb because it depends on the map, match length, playstyle and other shit
if you're going to compare damage numbers you have to do it with respect to your team mates and the people you're playing against. if you're consistently bottom damaging that's an issue, but with 225-275 i doubt that's the case. if the other roamer is doing more damage than you, just analyze what he was doing compared to what you were doing and if the damage was useful or not.
generalized dpm numbers are dumb because it depends on the map, match length, playstyle and other shit
if you're going to compare damage numbers you have to do it with respect to your team mates and the people you're playing against. if you're consistently bottom damaging that's an issue, but with 225-275 i doubt that's the case. if the other roamer is doing more damage than you, just analyze what he was doing compared to what you were doing and if the damage was useful or not.
225-275 is actually really nice as a roamer. But yeah, talk to your team and figure out what you can do best to serve your teams. Some teams need roamers that don't make plays and just act as huge blocks on the flank and insurances in prolonged battles. Other teams need roamers that don't realize they're not playing rj_rocketeer until halftime kicks in. One thing i can suggest tho, is that you should review demos of any roamer you feel like has a pretty set style, and try to incorporate their tools and tricks into your arsenal. The more things you can do, the more ways you can switch up your style midgame to catch people off guard. Or you can be like me and spy 24/7 to backcap.
225-275 is actually really nice as a roamer. But yeah, talk to your team and figure out what you can do best to serve your teams. Some teams need roamers that don't make plays and just act as huge blocks on the flank and insurances in prolonged battles. Other teams need roamers that don't realize they're not playing rj_rocketeer until halftime kicks in. One thing i can suggest tho, is that you should review demos of any roamer you feel like has a pretty set style, and try to incorporate their tools and tricks into your arsenal. The more things you can do, the more ways you can switch up your style midgame to catch people off guard. Or you can be like me and spy 24/7 to backcap.
the numbers dont matter if you win
the numbers dont matter if you win
225-275 is obviously not bad, but it isn't bad either if you average subpar 200 as a part time off classer on roamer
225-275 is obviously not bad, but it isn't bad either if you average subpar 200 as a part time off classer on roamer
dpm isn't important. your goal is to be as useful as possible.
dpm isn't important. your goal is to be as useful as possible.
That's a really nice DPM for a roamer.
That's a really nice DPM for a roamer.
Do play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?
Do play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?
Definitely map/role dependant.
Definitely map/role dependant.
termoDo play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?
Is there a best way to play in every situation?
[quote=termo]Do play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?[/quote]
Is there a best way to play in every situation?
viledpm isn't important. your goal is to be as useful as possible.
This is really all you have to worry about on roamer. If you guys are losing and you feel you aren't trying anything to prevent that, then change your game up and try harder.
[quote=vile]dpm isn't important. your goal is to be as useful as possible.[/quote]
This is really all you have to worry about on roamer. If you guys are losing and you feel you aren't trying anything to prevent that, then change your game up and try harder.
termoDo play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?
is anyone the best in every situation?
[quote=termo]Do play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?[/quote]
is anyone the best in every situation?
U can basically never play perfect obviously, but if u break it down between best and optimal, its the same thing really
U can basically never play perfect obviously, but if u break it down between best and optimal, its the same thing really
Because best would assume u have all the information required, but in tf2 that is rarely the case. In chess eg i would say you could make the best decision because all the information is available to you ie. you can see it on the board
Because best would assume u have all the information required, but in tf2 that is rarely the case. In chess eg i would say you could make the best decision because all the information is available to you ie. you can see it on the board
termoDo play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?
termoU can basically never play perfect obviously
that's how.
[quote=termo]Do play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?[/quote]
[quote=termo]U can basically never play perfect obviously[/quote]
that's how.
That doesnt mean anything to me u will have to give an example lol
That doesnt mean anything to me u will have to give an example lol
people have different strengths and weaknesses. because of this, people play differently.
people have different strengths and weaknesses. because of this, people play differently.
termoBecause best would assume u have all the information required, but in tf2 that is rarely the case. In chess eg i would say you could make the best decision because all the information is available to you ie. you can see it on the board
Although there is a finite amount of possible moves and sequences in chess and you even have all the information available to you, the computational complexity of figuring out the objectively best move (or the one that forces a checkmate) is so high that not even the best computers we have at the moment come even fractionally close to being able to compute that move. Even just finding a set of optimal moves is extremely difficult.
So in tf2 where you have a near infinite (for any practical purpose) amount of moves and sequences possible and incomplete information available the chances of one being able to figure out the objective best move by any computational device that will ever exist in the universe seems quite slim.
[quote=termo]Because best would assume u have all the information required, but in tf2 that is rarely the case. In chess eg i would say you could make the best decision because all the information is available to you ie. you can see it on the board[/quote]
Although there is a finite amount of possible moves and sequences in chess and you even have all the information available to you, the computational complexity of figuring out the objectively best move (or the one that forces a checkmate) is so high that not even the best computers we have at the moment come even fractionally close to being able to compute that move. Even just finding a set of optimal moves is extremely difficult.
So in tf2 where you have a near infinite (for any practical purpose) amount of moves and sequences possible and incomplete information available the chances of one being able to figure out the objective best move by any computational device that will ever exist in the universe seems quite slim.
Imo there will always be an optimal decision based on the information u have available to you
Imo there will always be an optimal decision based on the information u have available to you
termoImo there will always be an optimal decision based on the information u have available to you
so can you explain the relationship between your statement and the idea of playstyles?
[quote=termo]Imo there will always be an optimal decision based on the information u have available to you[/quote]
so can you explain the relationship between your statement and the idea of playstyles?
for me playstyles is just like a generalization of how a certain player/team plays
it doesnt really get into the nitty gritty of whats actually happening in the game and the specific decisions being made
james (yuki) said to me that he sometimes likes to try and push aggressively with disad or even, he says he likes to do it because of his confidence and because that is his style, to be aggressive..
to me thats like trying to justify a bad/not optimal decision
pushing aggressively with disad/even is just a decision! whether its right or wrong or w/e doesnt matter, hence my argument that there are no styles, only optimal/non optimal decisions
thats my view on it maybe its something controversial - i just cant quantify a 'playstyle'
for me playstyles is just like a generalization of how a certain player/team plays
it doesnt really get into the nitty gritty of whats actually happening in the game and the specific decisions being made
james (yuki) said to me that he sometimes likes to try and push aggressively with disad or even, he says he likes to do it because of his confidence and because that is his style, to be aggressive..
to me thats like trying to justify a bad/not optimal decision
pushing aggressively with disad/even is just a decision! whether its right or wrong or w/e doesnt matter, hence my argument that there are no styles, only optimal/non optimal decisions
thats my view on it maybe its something controversial - i just cant quantify a 'playstyle'
as long as we're on the topic of dpm, what should a pocket normally do in a relatively close game?
as long as we're on the topic of dpm, what should a pocket normally do in a relatively close game?
Depends on amount of heals + damage taken and speed of game, how aggressive you are on mids etc. Id say close to 300 is about par
Depends on amount of heals + damage taken and speed of game, how aggressive you are on mids etc. Id say close to 300 is about par
The thing is 'playstyles' are just a convenient generalisation we use to classify people by the type of decisions they normally make. That notwithstanding, I do think your state of mind does have merit, Termo, because you should always be trying to make the best decisions.
The thing is 'playstyles' are just a convenient generalisation we use to classify people by the type of decisions they normally make. That notwithstanding, I do think your state of mind does have merit, Termo, because you should always be trying to make the best decisions.
termoDo play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?
ur blowing my mind
[quote=termo]Do play styles even exist? How can they, if there is a best way to play in every situation?[/quote]
ur blowing my mind
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