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Common Core
posted in Off Topic
61
#61
-3 Frags +
Turin-Mike-TurinRofl you messed up the first one, it's the whole has one more.
You realize subtraction is the negation of addition right? So instead of your 5+1 = 6, the problem has 6 (whole) - 5 (known) = 1.

What kind of question is that? The whole still has one more than the known, not less.

The direction says to solve for the unknown part. If the whole is 6 and you know you have 5, 6 -5 = 1, 1 being the unknown part.

[quote=Turin][quote=-Mike-][quote=Turin]Rofl you messed up the first one, it's the whole has one [i]more[/i].[/quote]

You realize subtraction is the negation of addition right? So instead of your 5+1 = 6, the problem has 6 (whole) - 5 (known) = 1.[/quote]

What kind of question is that? The whole still has one more than the known, not less.[/quote]
The direction says to solve for the unknown part. If the whole is 6 and you know you have 5, 6 -5 = 1, 1 being the unknown part.
62
#62
0 Frags +

Why am I being taught subtraction? I wasn't talking about the math problem, I was joking about a typo.

Why am I being taught subtraction? I wasn't talking about the math problem, I was joking about a typo.
63
#63
1 Frags +

I don't know much about Common Core because Minnesota is one of the few (if not only) states not doing it. But it seems like you guys are taking poorly written questions and judging them based on that only. I'm sure the class had been learning specific strategies for addition/subtraction/fraction. Math education is less about rute memorization and regurgitation now and more about understanding, so the National Council of Teaching Mathematics (NCTM) is coming up with new ways to teach the understanding to young kids.

I'm sure I explained this poorly, but like I said I don't teach Common Core.

I don't know much about Common Core because Minnesota is one of the few (if not only) states not doing it. But it seems like you guys are taking poorly written questions and judging them based on that only. I'm sure the class had been learning specific strategies for addition/subtraction/fraction. Math education is less about rute memorization and regurgitation now and more about understanding, so the National Council of Teaching Mathematics (NCTM) is coming up with new ways to teach the understanding to young kids.

I'm sure I explained this poorly, but like I said I don't teach Common Core.
64
#64
4 Frags +

what's the answer tf.tv??

http://i.imgur.com/GgtcDVo.jpg

what's the answer tf.tv??

[img]http://i.imgur.com/GgtcDVo.jpg[/img]
65
#65
8 Frags +

poorly written questions can have more than one correct answer

poorly written questions can have more than one correct answer
66
#66
6 Frags +

Why would the old way be one unless you fucked up your order of operations

1) Parenthesis (2*2)
2) Multiple and Divide from left to right 20/5*4=16

I'm fucking old and we weren't taught that you did multiplication before division. They are the same tier.

Why would the old way be one unless you fucked up your order of operations

1) Parenthesis (2*2)
2) Multiple and Divide from left to right 20/5*4=16

I'm fucking old and we weren't taught that you did multiplication before division. They are the same tier.
67
#67
2 Frags +
NewbieMcNewbfaceWhy would the old way be one unless you fucked up your order of operations

1) Parenthesis (2*2)
2) Multiple and Divide from left to right 20/5*4=16

I'm fucking old and we weren't taught that you did multiplication before division. They are the same tier.

Well this is an example of a poorly written question, It isn't obvious if (2*2) is in the denominator or not.

[quote=NewbieMcNewbface]Why would the old way be one unless you fucked up your order of operations

1) Parenthesis (2*2)
2) Multiple and Divide from left to right 20/5*4=16

I'm fucking old and we weren't taught that you did multiplication before division. They are the same tier.[/quote]
Well this is an example of a poorly written question, It isn't obvious if (2*2) is in the denominator or not.
68
#68
newbie.tf
0 Frags +

Honestly order between division and multiplication shouldn't be an issue unless the expression is written really poorly. I don't remember ever being taught which was first or to go left to right or anything.

Honestly order between division and multiplication shouldn't be an issue unless the expression is written really poorly. I don't remember ever being taught which was first or to go left to right or anything.
69
#69
1 Frags +
KevinIsPwnHonestly order between division and multiplication shouldn't be an issue unless the expression is written really poorly. I don't remember ever being taught which was first or to go left to right or anything.

The division symbol is the devil. Write errything as fractions and there's nothing confusing about it.

[quote=KevinIsPwn]Honestly order between division and multiplication shouldn't be an issue unless the expression is written really poorly. I don't remember ever being taught which was first or to go left to right or anything.[/quote]

The division symbol is the devil. Write errything as fractions and there's nothing confusing about it.
70
#70
-1 Frags +

Sorry, I assumed the writer used / instead of ÷ because they didn't know how to insert the symbol.

I'm used to seeing fractions with a horizontal line, fraction bar, or vinculum. Sure, I write fractions like this ¾" when I'm taking measurements at work but I cannot recall seeing them written like that in textbooks.

From a section covering order of operations in an old math book:

Simplify the expressions:

(a) 25-12÷3*4

(b)
32+8÷2
2*3^2

Sorry, I assumed the writer used / instead of ÷ because they didn't know how to insert the symbol.

I'm used to seeing fractions with a horizontal line, fraction bar, or vinculum. Sure, I write fractions like this ¾" when I'm taking measurements at work but I cannot recall seeing them written like that in textbooks.

From a section covering order of operations in an old math book:

Simplify the expressions:

(a) 25-12÷3*4

(b)
[u]32+8÷2[/u]
2*3^2
71
#71
-8 Frags +

you guys are trying really hard to solve first grade math problems

you guys are trying really hard to solve first grade math problems
72
#72
-4 Frags +

a 24
b 2

as someone in hs that has common core, common core is literally the stupidest thing. if anything school is more about preparing you about tests. 90% of things taught in class is to help for the common core in the test. also most of the common core things are useless outside of tests

a 24
b 2

as someone in hs that has common core, common core is literally the stupidest thing. if anything school is more about preparing you about tests. 90% of things taught in class is to help for the common core in the test. also most of the common core things are useless outside of tests
73
#73
0 Frags +
NewbieMcNewbfaceSimplify the expressions:

(a) 25-12÷3*4

(b)
32+8÷2
2*3^2

a) 9
b) 2

dont turn this into facebook please i hate these posts

[quote=NewbieMcNewbface]
Simplify the expressions:

(a) 25-12÷3*4

(b)
[u]32+8÷2[/u]
2*3^2[/quote]
a) 9
b) 2

dont turn this into facebook please i hate these posts
74
#74
-4 Frags +
Rockkkkkkkhttp://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c136/Iblissstyx/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_751308141429248_zpsfhtctdlc.jpeg

The teacher is saying 8+5+??= 10

the question is worded in that way, quite literally.
I'm really not sure what the difficulty is. If you explain it to a kid that way, they'll understand what the question is asking.

[quote=Rockkkkkkk][img]http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c136/Iblissstyx/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_751308141429248_zpsfhtctdlc.jpeg[/img][/quote]
The teacher is saying 8+5+??= 10

the question is worded in that way, quite literally.
I'm really not sure what the difficulty is. If you explain it to a kid that way, they'll understand what the question is asking.
75
#75
2 Frags +

Biggest problem I see is that it alienates basically every parent from helping their children with math since they also have to learn the new method of math. The questions seem to be literally made for only elementary school kids to understand because they probably don't understand English as well. I mean I guess you don't have to worry about parents teaching their children wrong as much, but it's really too bad you can't teach them multiple ways to do the problem and let them self optimize.

Biggest problem I see is that it alienates basically every parent from helping their children with math since they also have to learn the new method of math. The questions seem to be literally made for only elementary school kids to understand because they probably don't understand English as well. I mean I guess you don't have to worry about parents teaching their children wrong as much, but it's really too bad you can't teach them multiple ways to do the problem and let them self optimize.
76
#76
4 Frags +
brownymasterBiggest problem I see is that it alienates basically every parent from helping their children with math since they also have to learn the new method of math. The questions seem to be literally made for only elementary school kids to understand because they probably don't understand English as well. I mean I guess you don't have to worry about parents teaching their children wrong as much, but it's really too bad you can't teach them multiple ways to do the problem and let them self optimize.

This is really the issue and part of the reason why this new curriculum has seen such bad backlash. This method is very different from what just about every parent has ever seen for basic mathematics. That doesn't change how poorly written and vague a lot of the these questions are, but a lot of the bad publicity comes from the confusion that parents of children are having and not necessarily kids themselves.

[quote=brownymaster]Biggest problem I see is that it alienates basically every parent from helping their children with math since they also have to learn the new method of math. The questions seem to be literally made for only elementary school kids to understand because they probably don't understand English as well. I mean I guess you don't have to worry about parents teaching their children wrong as much, but it's really too bad you can't teach them multiple ways to do the problem and let them self optimize.[/quote]

This is really the issue and part of the reason why this new curriculum has seen such bad backlash. This method is very different from what just about every parent has ever seen for basic mathematics. That doesn't change how poorly written and vague a lot of the these questions are, but a lot of the bad publicity comes from the confusion that parents of children are having and not necessarily kids themselves.
77
#77
0 Frags +
LinkNewbieMcNewbfaceSimplify the expressions:

(a) 25-12÷3*4

(b)
32+8÷2
2*3^2
a) 9
b) 2

dont turn this into facebook please i hate these posts

Sorry, that wasn't my intent. I didn't want people to actually try and solve them. Just wanted to demonstrate how math problems were written in my day. We had story problems beginning in first or second grade (don't remember which) so those common core application problems don't look too foreign. My point was math problems were not written like the one on that overhead.

[quote=Link][quote=NewbieMcNewbface]
Simplify the expressions:

(a) 25-12÷3*4

(b)
[u]32+8÷2[/u]
2*3^2[/quote]
a) 9
b) 2

dont turn this into facebook please i hate these posts[/quote]
Sorry, that wasn't my intent. I didn't want people to actually try and solve them. Just wanted to demonstrate how math problems were written in my day. We had story problems beginning in first or second grade (don't remember which) so those common core application problems don't look too foreign. My point was math problems were not written like the one on that overhead.
78
#78
5 Frags +

http://puu.sh/f2ugd.jpg

Thank God I don't have to go through this horseshit.

[img]http://puu.sh/f2ugd.jpg[/img]

Thank God I don't have to go through this horseshit.
79
#79
0 Frags +

Yeah to be honest the other stuff makes some sense, but that is completely nonsense. It's bullshit numerology.

Yeah to be honest the other stuff makes some sense, but that is completely nonsense. It's bullshit numerology.
80
#80
1 Frags +

When I first saw the Common Core way to subtract and add and whatnot, I actually really liked it. It was very more, uh, how would I put it. It felt more like what I identify as Mathematics.

This stuff here just kinda helps me think more like that it's preparing students more for the analytic and problem solving portion of Mathematics rather than the calculation aspect. Which I think is good. I think brute force calculation is kind of good to have? But I always thought there was too much. Especially for the fact that I have a phone next to me that beats me in being able to solve differential equations by far.

This is the start to analysis. Throwing more word problems and things like what were in that test at people means they'll have to understand how to analyze a problem or they'll fall behind. Which yeah, kinda sucks for some people. Pretty much everyone in my high school math classes didn't know how to do this, and maybe a fourth of the people in my honors sequences+series calculus classes in college didn't really know how to do it. Pretty much anyone I help out with Mathematics at a lower college level (Basically linear algebra and below) have those issues with analysis and problem solving (Which is probably the reason I'm helping them in the first place).

The society that exists nowadays just needs the analytic portion of this stuff more than it needs the raw computing, so I personally like the direction this is taking. It's more important to kinda get a feel for understanding why you are doing these steps and getting some sort of underlying feel to the process nowadays than it is to be able to crank out the process over and over when you can easily just be outclassed by a computer in basically any form of computational math out there.

I haven't looked more into it, I could imagine that it would be a total pain as a parent. I've heard literally all of my old teachers complain about it, but I haven't actually talked to any of my old math teachers now that I think about it. I'm not sure if it would be a pain as a current-generation teacher, maybe one that has been teaching for a while.

When I first saw the Common Core way to subtract and add and whatnot, I actually really liked it. It was very more, uh, how would I put it. It felt more like what I identify as Mathematics.

This stuff here just kinda helps me think more like that it's preparing students more for the analytic and problem solving portion of Mathematics rather than the calculation aspect. Which I think is good. I think brute force calculation is kind of good to have? But I always thought there was too much. Especially for the fact that I have a phone next to me that beats me in being able to solve differential equations by far.

This is the start to analysis. Throwing more word problems and things like what were in that test at people means they'll have to understand how to analyze a problem or they'll fall behind. Which yeah, kinda sucks for some people. Pretty much everyone in my high school math classes didn't know how to do this, and maybe a fourth of the people in my honors sequences+series calculus classes in college didn't really know how to do it. Pretty much anyone I help out with Mathematics at a lower college level (Basically linear algebra and below) have those issues with analysis and problem solving (Which is probably the reason I'm helping them in the first place).

The society that exists nowadays just needs the analytic portion of this stuff more than it needs the raw computing, so I personally like the direction this is taking. It's more important to kinda get a feel for understanding why you are doing these steps and getting some sort of underlying feel to the process nowadays than it is to be able to crank out the process over and over when you can easily just be outclassed by a computer in basically any form of computational math out there.

I haven't looked more into it, I could imagine that it would be a total pain as a parent. I've heard literally all of my old teachers complain about it, but I haven't actually talked to any of my old math teachers now that I think about it. I'm not sure if it would be a pain as a current-generation teacher, maybe one that has been teaching for a while.
81
#81
0 Frags +

I deal with deciphering engineers that have english as a second or third language all the time, and I can't get over how poorly laid out question #1 was.

Is it really that hard to word it as : "find the difference between the number of coins and the number 6".....(which is bizarrely on a cup for no reason). The whole "part I know" and missing part is just...odd. TIL that coins are a missing part of a cup and it takes 6 coins to make a cup.

I deal with deciphering engineers that have english as a second or third language all the time, and I can't get over how poorly laid out question #1 was.

Is it really that hard to word it as : "find the difference between the number of coins and the number 6".....(which is bizarrely on a cup for no reason). The whole "part I know" and missing part is just...odd. TIL that coins are a missing part of a cup and it takes 6 coins to make a cup.
82
#82
1 Frags +
Niko_Jimshttp://puu.sh/f2ugd.jpg

Thank God I don't have to go through this horseshit.

why are we complaining about this? As these students move on in life they'll stumble upon new ways to think of this stuff by themselves. The concept is strange, but theyre teaching kids how to think with base 10 (as normal) and subtract/add ones to a single 10 value, and continuing on from there until you arrive at the end where no ones need to be mentally organized. It's a solid method imo, call me retarded but this is actually how I started to get better at math myself when I began doing that. Maybe they're onto something actually; I can see them trying to fight the google-first-think-later routine so many of us spoiled tech kids got when it arrived in schools.

Basically the way I think Common Core is built is by taking all the bad habits of today's teenage generation and making the cirriculum be more specific in the nascent school years so our kids don't become tech vegetables.

typos

[quote=Niko_Jims][img]http://puu.sh/f2ugd.jpg[/img]

Thank God I don't have to go through this horseshit.[/quote]

why are we complaining about this? As these students move on in life they'll stumble upon new ways to think of this stuff by themselves. The concept is strange, but theyre teaching kids how to think with base 10 (as normal) and subtract/add ones to a single 10 value, and continuing on from there until you arrive at the end where no ones need to be mentally organized. It's a solid method imo, call me retarded but this is actually how I started to get better at math myself when I began doing that. Maybe they're onto something actually; I can see them trying to fight the google-first-think-later routine so many of us spoiled tech kids got when it arrived in schools.

Basically the way I think Common Core is built is by taking all the bad habits of today's teenage generation and making the cirriculum be more specific in the nascent school years so our kids don't become tech vegetables.

typos
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