https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bwz9dNJzmukQQXBVOFN6cmI1SkE/view?usp=sharing
cp_logjam (5CP)
posted in
Map Discussion
http://i.imgur.com/bJ6xNfL.png
Regarding this- why does it need to be reworked? Everyone said it was impossible to push in via the old shutter door anymore and everyone griped that the shutter sucked. I need to fix the way it is just a touch more for some sightline stuff, but that's not a huge deal.
I take it that the two images have the column in the back in different spots- not sure how that happened but that's also an easy fix. It's hard to get things exactly right when modifying as opposed to creating new. I'm not going to copy over and retexture the entire last for just a small portion. Change noted anyways.
I'll look into the UFO.
Blue stripe on red 2nd has been omitted for the real b20. It's been hiding in there for a hell of a long time too. Apologies for missing it.
"Logjam needs a new mid" Explain please. What's wrong with this mid? I can't do anything if you just say "make a new one." If that's all you're going to say, why did you bother taking screenshots at all other than to just be an ass?
Cave is moving. Here's a dev pic I posted on etf2l:
http://i.imgur.com/WzAbwcW.jpg
That's heavy heavy heavy WIP. The entrance is probably going to go to the left a bit more and the route needs to be altered for less sight line crap.
[img]http://i.imgur.com/bJ6xNfL.png[/img]
Regarding this- why does it need to be reworked? Everyone said it was impossible to push in via the old shutter door anymore and everyone griped that the shutter sucked. I need to fix the way it is just a touch more for some sightline stuff, but that's not a huge deal.
I take it that the two images have the column in the back in different spots- not sure how that happened but that's also an easy fix. It's hard to get things exactly right when modifying as opposed to creating new. I'm not going to copy over and retexture the entire last for just a small portion. Change noted anyways.
I'll look into the UFO.
Blue stripe on red 2nd has been omitted for the real b20. It's been hiding in there for a hell of a long time too. Apologies for missing it.
[b]"Logjam needs a new mid"[/b] Explain please. What's wrong with this mid? I can't do anything if you just say "make a new one." If that's all you're going to say, why did you bother taking screenshots at all other than to just be an ass?
Cave is moving. Here's a dev pic I posted on etf2l: [img]http://i.imgur.com/WzAbwcW.jpg[/img]
That's heavy heavy heavy WIP. The entrance is probably going to go to the left a bit more and the route needs to be altered for less sight line crap.
Regarding this- why does it need to be reworked? Everyone said it was impossible to push in via the old shutter door anymore and everyone griped that the shutter sucked. I need to fix the way it is just a touch more for some sightline stuff, but that's not a huge deal.
I take it that the two images have the column in the back in different spots- not sure how that happened but that's also an easy fix. It's hard to get things exactly right when modifying as opposed to creating new. I'm not going to copy over and retexture the entire last for just a small portion. Change noted anyways.
I'll look into the UFO.
Blue stripe on red 2nd has been omitted for the real b20. It's been hiding in there for a hell of a long time too. Apologies for missing it.
[b]"Logjam needs a new mid"[/b] Explain please. What's wrong with this mid? I can't do anything if you just say "make a new one." If that's all you're going to say, why did you bother taking screenshots at all other than to just be an ass?
Cave is moving. Here's a dev pic I posted on etf2l: [img]http://i.imgur.com/WzAbwcW.jpg[/img]
That's heavy heavy heavy WIP. The entrance is probably going to go to the left a bit more and the route needs to be altered for less sight line crap.
There might be a way that I can include something similar. I will definitely miss it. I once watched someone get a market garden kill on a med using that damn thing, it was great.
There might be a way that I can include something similar. I will definitely miss it. I once watched someone get a market garden kill on a med using that damn thing, it was great.
http://i.imgur.com/q2yCzlK.jpg
?
P.S. Maybe that gullywash-ish choke isn't that great idea...
[img]http://i.imgur.com/q2yCzlK.jpg[/img]
?
P.S. Maybe that gullywash-ish choke isn't that great idea...
?
P.S. Maybe that gullywash-ish choke isn't that great idea...
Cave doesn't need to be changed, there's nothing wrong with it, I like how it plays out as it gives a very good alternative to pushing mid and 2nd.
So far on middle this is the best change atm, however, again it's going to be mega difficult to push with all these stupid sniper sight lines, not only that but as I mentioned in my stream defenders can gain way to much intel and spam time on the enemy before they can even start to get close.
I'll say this for like the 89th time, you are changing way to much just because a few people whine about how difficult x is in the map, people that are complaining that shutter on last is hard to push? The same thing partially applies to gullywash shutter and badlands last.
Main thing is this map is being changed so much that there isn't time for metas to really settle on the smaller sections of the map.
To me the only thing that needed fixing was middle, some sightlines and a few tweaks at last, but you seem to change loads of stuff just to please everyone.
Cave doesn't need to be changed, there's nothing wrong with it, I like how it plays out as it gives a very good alternative to pushing mid and 2nd.
So far on middle this is the best change atm, however, again it's going to be mega difficult to push with all these stupid sniper sight lines, not only that but as I mentioned in my stream defenders can gain way to much intel and spam time on the enemy before they can even start to get close.
I'll say this for like the 89th time, you are changing way to much just because a few people whine about how difficult x is in the map, people that are complaining that shutter on last is hard to push? The same thing partially applies to gullywash shutter and badlands last.
Main thing is this map is being changed so much that there isn't time for metas to really settle on the smaller sections of the map.
To me the only thing that needed fixing was middle, some sightlines and a few tweaks at last, but you seem to change loads of stuff just to please everyone.
So far on middle this is the best change atm, however, again it's going to be mega difficult to push with all these stupid sniper sight lines, not only that but as I mentioned in my stream defenders can gain way to much intel and spam time on the enemy before they can even start to get close.
I'll say this for like the 89th time, you are changing way to much just because a few people whine about how difficult x is in the map, people that are complaining that shutter on last is hard to push? The same thing partially applies to gullywash shutter and badlands last.
Main thing is this map is being changed so much that there isn't time for metas to really settle on the smaller sections of the map.
To me the only thing that needed fixing was middle, some sightlines and a few tweaks at last, but you seem to change loads of stuff just to please everyone.
Maybe I'm being too much of a perfectionist. It's hard to find a balance IMO, when people are saying it's a shit map and they want it gone. When I hear things like that, I ask well what's wrong? When I get a shit ton of people saying that something is wrong, maybe that's something that needs tweaking.
I disagree with you on cave. It was very long and not very fun to flank fight in. The snipers... I've been fighting them constantly on this damn map, I'll win someday. Maybe.
As far as gaining intel and spamming- that's just sightline corrections and cover. I'll see what I can try and do when I'm finished with all these projects for school in a few days.
Also I think Cirlo's drawing of mid is interesting. I do actually recall doodling a very similar bridge with the houses on them in one of my notebooks. Although I'm not sure about a super sharp choke a la gullywash for the main choke. Considering the work I'm doing to logroom it would mess up the fastest rollouts and while that's not the biggest deal people really seem to get irked when you mess with jumps.
Maybe I'm being too much of a perfectionist. It's hard to find a balance IMO, when people are saying it's a shit map and they want it gone. When I hear things like that, I ask well what's wrong? When I get a shit ton of people saying that something is wrong, maybe that's something that needs tweaking.
I disagree with you on cave. It was very long and not very fun to flank fight in. The snipers... I've been fighting them constantly on this damn map, I'll win someday. Maybe.
As far as gaining intel and spamming- that's just sightline corrections and cover. I'll see what I can try and do when I'm finished with all these projects for school in a few days.
Also I think Cirlo's drawing of mid is interesting. I do actually recall doodling a very similar bridge with the houses on them in one of my notebooks. Although I'm not sure about a super sharp choke a la gullywash for the main choke. Considering the work I'm doing to logroom it would mess up the fastest rollouts and while that's not the biggest deal people really seem to get irked when you mess with jumps.
I disagree with you on cave. It was very long and not very fun to flank fight in. The snipers... I've been fighting them constantly on this damn map, I'll win someday. Maybe.
As far as gaining intel and spamming- that's just sightline corrections and cover. I'll see what I can try and do when I'm finished with all these projects for school in a few days.
Also I think Cirlo's drawing of mid is interesting. I do actually recall doodling a very similar bridge with the houses on them in one of my notebooks. Although I'm not sure about a super sharp choke a la gullywash for the main choke. Considering the work I'm doing to logroom it would mess up the fastest rollouts and while that's not the biggest deal people really seem to get irked when you mess with jumps.
If you take in consideration to make a mid similar to the draft I draw, maybe make the the whole area a little bit wider
If you take in consideration to make a mid similar to the draft I draw, maybe make the the whole area a little bit wider
The new forward spawn is pretty terrible. Just take this as an example; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buuhFjN1ts8
The new forward spawn is pretty terrible. Just take this as an example; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buuhFjN1ts8
Strangely, I enjoy the map. Especially as scout. Admittedly, the spire is weird,but I like it
Strangely, I enjoy the map. Especially as scout. Admittedly, the spire is weird,but I like it
So I guess I need to make it a full size door at the very least, and perhaps move it again? Got it.
So I guess I need to make it a full size door at the very least, and perhaps move it again? Got it.
Which mid do you prefer? The one in b19, or the one from b20pre2? Either way I'm likely going to have to tweak either one to make it work a bit better. I'm just curious as to how the new one works after people have tried it a bit.
http://strawpoll.me/4273376
Which mid do you prefer? The one in b19, or the one from b20pre2? Either way I'm likely going to have to tweak either one to make it work a bit better. I'm just curious as to how the new one works after people have tried it a bit.
Which mid do you prefer? The one in b19, or the one from b20pre2? Either way I'm likely going to have to tweak either one to make it work a bit better. I'm just curious as to how the new one works after people have tried it a bit.
neither. Honestly I liked the old mid more (the one played in s19?) without the planks and rocks leading up to the point, those seemed really out of place.
neither. Honestly I liked the old mid more (the one played in s19?) without the planks and rocks leading up to the point, those seemed really out of place.
cp_logjam_b20pre3
Last pre beta 20 version. It's got a decent amount of graphical issues and a couple other bugs. If anyone finds anything that's not clipped properly let me know.
Screens to come later.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/euqw7obm9x29baz/cp_logjam_b20pre3.bsp?dl=0
Pre2-> pre3
Major Changes:
blockbulleted and re-styled the stairs on 2nd
blockbulleted holes in the bridge on 2nd so you can't kill people hilariously with stickies
Added an addition to logroom's upper exit on mid
Added another wall in logroom
Moved where cave came out on 2nd
Made the cover at last larger and added some more too
Minor Changes:
raised some slanted roofs on mid and clipped so jumping is easier
modified the position of the rocks right by point
fixed a blue stripe on red's second
modified the clipping on the slant roof at mid so you can't stand on the very edge of it
fixed a displacement gap by the right side fence at 2nd
cp_logjam_b20pre3
Last pre beta 20 version. It's got a decent amount of graphical issues and a couple other bugs. If anyone finds anything that's not clipped properly let me know.
Screens to come later.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/euqw7obm9x29baz/cp_logjam_b20pre3.bsp?dl=0
Pre2-> pre3
Major Changes:
blockbulleted and re-styled the stairs on 2nd
blockbulleted holes in the bridge on 2nd so you can't kill people hilariously with stickies
[b]Added an addition to logroom's upper exit on mid
Added another wall in logroom
Moved where cave came out on 2nd[/b]
Made the cover at last larger and added some more too
Minor Changes:
raised some slanted roofs on mid and clipped so jumping is easier
modified the position of the rocks right by point
fixed a blue stripe on red's second
modified the clipping on the slant roof at mid so you can't stand on the very edge of it
fixed a displacement gap by the right side fence at 2nd
Last pre beta 20 version. It's got a decent amount of graphical issues and a couple other bugs. If anyone finds anything that's not clipped properly let me know.
Screens to come later.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/euqw7obm9x29baz/cp_logjam_b20pre3.bsp?dl=0
Pre2-> pre3
Major Changes:
blockbulleted and re-styled the stairs on 2nd
blockbulleted holes in the bridge on 2nd so you can't kill people hilariously with stickies
[b]Added an addition to logroom's upper exit on mid
Added another wall in logroom
Moved where cave came out on 2nd[/b]
Made the cover at last larger and added some more too
Minor Changes:
raised some slanted roofs on mid and clipped so jumping is easier
modified the position of the rocks right by point
fixed a blue stripe on red's second
modified the clipping on the slant roof at mid so you can't stand on the very edge of it
fixed a displacement gap by the right side fence at 2nd
Idk about other people but I always felt the main reason the map stalemated between 2nd and last was because pushing out of lobby if you're holding last is very hard when you can hold on the spire with height adv.
Compare to other maps with spires on 2nd: Badlands the spire is small and hard to get on so your whole team can't hold there. In process you can push behind through lobby to pc or from rollout, and you have flanks at lower lobby and shutter. On this map, you're forced to push with significant height disadv and a wall blocking your spam (also theirs but they can sit ontop of it) through main, through the flank which also has height disadv and is easy to spam or through the house area which doesn't have height disadv, but you have to walk a long distance in an area you can easily get spammed. House push is probs the best route but it's pretty easy to lock down, you can't get spam on the point going through it and its pretty easy to get fucked by a trap making pushing out slower if you want to clear.
Idk if this is just me, but it seems like its a problem when I play, although I might just be doing entirely the wrong thing.
Also, the moving of cave might force teams to hold a little further back but I doubt it.
Idk about other people but I always felt the main reason the map stalemated between 2nd and last was because pushing out of lobby if you're holding last is very hard when you can hold on the spire with height adv.
Compare to other maps with spires on 2nd: Badlands the spire is small and hard to get on so your whole team can't hold there. In process you can push behind through lobby to pc or from rollout, and you have flanks at lower lobby and shutter. On this map, you're forced to push with significant height disadv and a wall blocking your spam (also theirs but they can sit ontop of it) through main, through the flank which also has height disadv and is easy to spam or through the house area which doesn't have height disadv, but you have to walk a long distance in an area you can easily get spammed. House push is probs the best route but it's pretty easy to lock down, you can't get spam on the point going through it and its pretty easy to get fucked by a trap making pushing out slower if you want to clear.
Idk if this is just me, but it seems like its a problem when I play, although I might just be doing entirely the wrong thing.
Also, the moving of cave might force teams to hold a little further back but I doubt it.
Compare to other maps with spires on 2nd: Badlands the spire is small and hard to get on so your whole team can't hold there. In process you can push behind through lobby to pc or from rollout, and you have flanks at lower lobby and shutter. On this map, you're forced to push with significant height disadv and a wall blocking your spam (also theirs but they can sit ontop of it) through main, through the flank which also has height disadv and is easy to spam or through the house area which doesn't have height disadv, but you have to walk a long distance in an area you can easily get spammed. House push is probs the best route but it's pretty easy to lock down, you can't get spam on the point going through it and its pretty easy to get fucked by a trap making pushing out slower if you want to clear.
Idk if this is just me, but it seems like its a problem when I play, although I might just be doing entirely the wrong thing.
Also, the moving of cave might force teams to hold a little further back but I doubt it.
As far as lobby-2nd, I have heard a few people say that before, and I've been thinking about ways to change it. I'm not entirely sure how to do it. I might wind up raising the entire last point (last, lobby, etc) up by like, 128-256 units and having all of the entrances come out with height with respect to the ground, and then house would be roughly the height of spire. That's just a fuck ton of work and I'm not sure if it's worth it or not at this moment.
As far as lobby-2nd, I have heard a few people say that before, and I've been thinking about ways to change it. I'm not entirely sure how to do it. I might wind up raising the entire last point (last, lobby, etc) up by like, 128-256 units and having all of the entrances come out with height with respect to the ground, and then house would be roughly the height of spire. That's just a fuck ton of work and I'm not sure if it's worth it or not at this moment.
So Wareya jokingly jabbed at me, "How's the tenth different mid for logjam going?" So I went on a nostalgia trip...
Here's the full convo...http://pastebin.com/imTmiff2
And a tl;dr:
Logjam had 9 different mids in alpha. 3 of them were introduced under the name cp_uintah, and 1 of them was introduced under the name cp_stagg.
Logjam had 10 different mids in beta. (sonuvabitch his joke was right.)
Some highlights:
-b2 had the "Viaduct Mid"
-b6 had the bigass rock arch over the point... sometimes I wonder if I sniff glue then map
-b8 modified the ramps a bunch, and was the beginning of WARHURYEAH telling me mid sucks balls:
"Mid is really in dire need of something changing, it's so open and wide that all you get is 30 seconds of people just eyeing each other, there are very few ways for a roamer to jump without being clearly seen. Most other maps have blind spots/cover to jump from behind, creating a good amount of space for the team as they can jump in without being immediately called. This mid offers none of that." -WAR
"Make a new mid or it's going to be difficult for people to play it this season. If you don't it might lose a lot of popularity and may not be considered in future seasons. The ETF2L map pool is pretty shitty and unstable."
-WAR
Talk about forshadowing... #riplogjam
-b10 introduced THE BRIDGE MID, aka OBSCURE MID... I'd never seen obscure until I recently looked it up. Can't say that it looks like my mid too much, but I can see where people are coming from.
-b11 introduces the side corridors on mid where cave comes out...
-I laugh my ass off at my optimism: "Detailing progress so far, b12 (maybe RC1?!?!?!?) should be out by January.
-b18 introduces the humped bridge and the ramps up the rocks that got played in ETF2L S20.
-b20pre1 introduces the rock bridge mid, RIP houses
-b20pre3 introduces a better exit from logroom, and modifies the bridge pretty decently
So, that's 10 mids during beta. 5 of which came out after WAR told me mid was a pile of balls.
Logjam's first beta mid was the same as the last alpha mid- so the total number of mids is one less than the sum of alpha and beta mids.
18 different mids. That's just mid. Last has stayed pretty much the same through the whole thing. 2nd had about a billion different alpha versions, and the transitions have always been an issue.
So... next time you say "I'm interested in making a TF2 map for competitive" I'm going to recommend drinking heavily instead. Hah. It's been a fun ride having this map in ETF2L. By no means am I going to stop working on the map, but I'm pretty sure it's getting replaced in ETF2L.
What's my honest opinion on that? Well, I'd say that they're taking it out and I'm going to lose testing and it's going to be hard to get good feedback. That being said, that's none of their fault. Who wants to play on a shitty map that's constantly changing? Probably not many. I think Logjam got hyped a bit too hard and I got too excited when the chance of getting it in season happened originally, and it got thrown into rotation very prematurely. Which is certainly largely my fault for even letting it happen. I did make a shit ton of progress on the map between when the Logjam Cup was held and now. Hopefully the map will be good someday. Thanks for letting me run it for two glorious (lol) seasons, ETF2L.
So Wareya jokingly jabbed at me, "How's the tenth different mid for logjam going?" So I went on a nostalgia trip...
Here's the full convo...http://pastebin.com/imTmiff2
And a tl;dr:
Logjam had 9 different mids in alpha. 3 of them were introduced under the name cp_uintah, and 1 of them was introduced under the name cp_stagg.
Logjam had 10 different mids in beta. (sonuvabitch his joke was right.)
Some highlights:
-b2 had the "Viaduct Mid"
-b6 had the bigass rock arch over the point... sometimes I wonder if I sniff glue then map
-b8 modified the ramps a bunch, and was the beginning of WARHURYEAH telling me mid sucks balls:
[i]"Mid is really in dire need of something changing, it's so open and wide that all you get is 30 seconds of people just eyeing each other, there are very few ways for a roamer to jump without being clearly seen. Most other maps have blind spots/cover to jump from behind, creating a good amount of space for the team as they can jump in without being immediately called. This mid offers none of that."[/i] -WAR
[i]"Make a new mid or it's going to be difficult for people to play it this season. If you don't it might lose a lot of popularity and may not be considered in future seasons. The ETF2L map pool is pretty shitty and unstable."
[/i] -WAR
Talk about forshadowing... #riplogjam
-b10 introduced THE BRIDGE MID, aka OBSCURE MID... I'd never seen obscure until I recently looked it up. Can't say that it looks like my mid too much, but I can see where people are coming from.
-b11 introduces the side corridors on mid where cave comes out...
-I laugh my ass off at my optimism: "Detailing progress so far, b12 (maybe RC1?!?!?!?) should be out by January.
-b18 introduces the humped bridge and the ramps up the rocks that got played in ETF2L S20.
-b20pre1 introduces the rock bridge mid, RIP houses
-b20pre3 introduces a better exit from logroom, and modifies the bridge pretty decently
So, that's 10 mids during beta. 5 of which came out after WAR told me mid was a pile of balls.
Logjam's first beta mid was the same as the last alpha mid- so the total number of mids is one less than the sum of alpha and beta mids.
18 different mids. That's just mid. Last has stayed pretty much the same through the whole thing. 2nd had about a billion different alpha versions, and the transitions have always been an issue.
So... next time you say "I'm interested in making a TF2 map for competitive" I'm going to recommend drinking heavily instead. Hah. It's been a fun ride having this map in ETF2L. By no means am I going to stop working on the map, but I'm pretty sure it's getting replaced in ETF2L.
What's my honest opinion on that? Well, I'd say that they're taking it out and I'm going to lose testing and it's going to be hard to get good feedback. That being said, that's none of their fault. Who wants to play on a shitty map that's constantly changing? Probably not many. I think Logjam got hyped a bit too hard and I got too excited when the chance of getting it in season happened originally, and it got thrown into rotation very prematurely. Which is certainly largely my fault for even letting it happen. I did make a shit ton of progress on the map between when the Logjam Cup was held and now. Hopefully the map will be good someday. Thanks for letting me run it for two glorious (lol) seasons, ETF2L.
Here's the full convo...http://pastebin.com/imTmiff2
And a tl;dr:
Logjam had 9 different mids in alpha. 3 of them were introduced under the name cp_uintah, and 1 of them was introduced under the name cp_stagg.
Logjam had 10 different mids in beta. (sonuvabitch his joke was right.)
Some highlights:
-b2 had the "Viaduct Mid"
-b6 had the bigass rock arch over the point... sometimes I wonder if I sniff glue then map
-b8 modified the ramps a bunch, and was the beginning of WARHURYEAH telling me mid sucks balls:
[i]"Mid is really in dire need of something changing, it's so open and wide that all you get is 30 seconds of people just eyeing each other, there are very few ways for a roamer to jump without being clearly seen. Most other maps have blind spots/cover to jump from behind, creating a good amount of space for the team as they can jump in without being immediately called. This mid offers none of that."[/i] -WAR
[i]"Make a new mid or it's going to be difficult for people to play it this season. If you don't it might lose a lot of popularity and may not be considered in future seasons. The ETF2L map pool is pretty shitty and unstable."
[/i] -WAR
Talk about forshadowing... #riplogjam
-b10 introduced THE BRIDGE MID, aka OBSCURE MID... I'd never seen obscure until I recently looked it up. Can't say that it looks like my mid too much, but I can see where people are coming from.
-b11 introduces the side corridors on mid where cave comes out...
-I laugh my ass off at my optimism: "Detailing progress so far, b12 (maybe RC1?!?!?!?) should be out by January.
-b18 introduces the humped bridge and the ramps up the rocks that got played in ETF2L S20.
-b20pre1 introduces the rock bridge mid, RIP houses
-b20pre3 introduces a better exit from logroom, and modifies the bridge pretty decently
So, that's 10 mids during beta. 5 of which came out after WAR told me mid was a pile of balls.
Logjam's first beta mid was the same as the last alpha mid- so the total number of mids is one less than the sum of alpha and beta mids.
18 different mids. That's just mid. Last has stayed pretty much the same through the whole thing. 2nd had about a billion different alpha versions, and the transitions have always been an issue.
So... next time you say "I'm interested in making a TF2 map for competitive" I'm going to recommend drinking heavily instead. Hah. It's been a fun ride having this map in ETF2L. By no means am I going to stop working on the map, but I'm pretty sure it's getting replaced in ETF2L.
What's my honest opinion on that? Well, I'd say that they're taking it out and I'm going to lose testing and it's going to be hard to get good feedback. That being said, that's none of their fault. Who wants to play on a shitty map that's constantly changing? Probably not many. I think Logjam got hyped a bit too hard and I got too excited when the chance of getting it in season happened originally, and it got thrown into rotation very prematurely. Which is certainly largely my fault for even letting it happen. I did make a shit ton of progress on the map between when the Logjam Cup was held and now. Hopefully the map will be good someday. Thanks for letting me run it for two glorious (lol) seasons, ETF2L.
It's not your fault really, I still don't understand why ETF2L include maps that aren't complete/RC, if you add a map that's in beta to a map pool PLOT TWIST IT MIGHT NOT BE RECEIVED WELL.
Not only that but the massive hype the EU double mix circlejerk gave it was also really bad for the map, especially as everyone was thinking it was amazing when again, people in double mixes won't always try and there's no consequence for losing, you won't find out how shitty pushing or holding various sections of the maps are because nobody is trying to win that bad.
It's probably best to just ask tf2pickup.net to add a newer version in rotation and still talk to the double mix guys to get some more feedback, just take it with a pinch of salt when someone says x is good but y is fucking terrible..
logjam not being in the map pool is probably the best thing that could have happened to the map as now you won't be rushing to "fix" shit to make it play better for the new season.
It's not your fault really, I still don't understand why ETF2L include maps that aren't complete/RC, if you add a map that's in beta to a map pool PLOT TWIST IT MIGHT NOT BE RECEIVED WELL.
Not only that but the massive hype the EU double mix circlejerk gave it was also really bad for the map, especially as everyone was thinking it was amazing when again, people in double mixes won't always try and there's no consequence for losing, you won't find out how shitty pushing or holding various sections of the maps are because nobody is trying to win that bad.
It's probably best to just ask tf2pickup.net to add a newer version in rotation and still talk to the double mix guys to get some more feedback, just take it with a pinch of salt when someone says x is good but y is fucking terrible..
logjam not being in the map pool is probably the best thing that could have happened to the map as now you won't be rushing to "fix" shit to make it play better for the new season.
Not only that but the massive hype the EU double mix circlejerk gave it was also really bad for the map, especially as everyone was thinking it was amazing when again, people in double mixes won't always try and there's no consequence for losing, you won't find out how shitty pushing or holding various sections of the maps are because nobody is trying to win that bad.
It's probably best to just ask tf2pickup.net to add a newer version in rotation and still talk to the double mix guys to get some more feedback, just take it with a pinch of salt when someone says x is good but y is fucking terrible..
logjam not being in the map pool is probably the best thing that could have happened to the map as now you won't be rushing to "fix" shit to make it play better for the new season.
HyceAs far as lobby-2nd, I have heard a few people say that before, and I've been thinking about ways to change it. I'm not entirely sure how to do it. I might wind up raising the entire last point (last, lobby, etc) up by like, 128-256 units and having all of the entrances come out with height with respect to the ground, and then house would be roughly the height of spire. That's just a fuck ton of work and I'm not sure if it's worth it or not at this moment.
I think actually changing a bit of the architecture of second itself might help better address this rather than changing the height of last. Look at the location of spire on second and the routes that you have to take up onto, moving this stuff around you can probably force the team on 2nd to hold a bit further back when they're being pushed from lobby. The ideal is to force at least some of them to have to hold behind spire, e.g. on badlands where many teams hold on pride rock/launchpad. Currently its not only the height adv but that you're able to hold so close. Doing stuff like widening the lower flank between 2nd and last to make it more viable as a push route might help a lot too.
I think the map actually has a cool amount of potential but the two things I always had issue with was that losing mid made it incredibly hard pushing last to 2nd or 2nd to mid. Without the houses on mid, you've solved a large part of the issue with the latter, I think you can solve the former too.
[quote=Hyce]As far as lobby-2nd, I have heard a few people say that before, and I've been thinking about ways to change it. I'm not entirely sure how to do it. I might wind up raising the entire last point (last, lobby, etc) up by like, 128-256 units and having all of the entrances come out with height with respect to the ground, and then house would be roughly the height of spire. That's just a fuck ton of work and I'm not sure if it's worth it or not at this moment.[/quote]
I think actually changing a bit of the architecture of second itself might help better address this rather than changing the height of last. Look at the location of spire on second and the routes that you have to take up onto, moving this stuff around you can probably force the team on 2nd to hold a bit further back when they're being pushed from lobby. The ideal is to force at least some of them to have to hold behind spire, e.g. on badlands where many teams hold on pride rock/launchpad. Currently its not only the height adv but that you're able to hold so close. Doing stuff like widening the lower flank between 2nd and last to make it more viable as a push route might help a lot too.
I think the map actually has a cool amount of potential but the two things I always had issue with was that losing mid made it incredibly hard pushing last to 2nd or 2nd to mid. Without the houses on mid, you've solved a large part of the issue with the latter, I think you can solve the former too.
I think actually changing a bit of the architecture of second itself might help better address this rather than changing the height of last. Look at the location of spire on second and the routes that you have to take up onto, moving this stuff around you can probably force the team on 2nd to hold a bit further back when they're being pushed from lobby. The ideal is to force at least some of them to have to hold behind spire, e.g. on badlands where many teams hold on pride rock/launchpad. Currently its not only the height adv but that you're able to hold so close. Doing stuff like widening the lower flank between 2nd and last to make it more viable as a push route might help a lot too.
I think the map actually has a cool amount of potential but the two things I always had issue with was that losing mid made it incredibly hard pushing last to 2nd or 2nd to mid. Without the houses on mid, you've solved a large part of the issue with the latter, I think you can solve the former too.
cp_logjam_b20
Pre3-> b20
Increased cap time of last point (hammer value was 1.3, now it's 2.5)
Fixed a plank pile floating at 2nd
Fixed mesh not rendering in logroom
Fixed a few displacement errors in cave
Added the upper ground back in choke
Moved the big HP on mid back towards choke
Moved the big ammo on mid to be by the rock by choke
Added a small ammo on either side of the point
Download: https://www.dropbox.com/s/nklfx94pjxizmyb/cp_logjam_b20.bsp?dl=0
Screens:
http://i.imgur.com/7EpxPjG.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/adwAp7v.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/x52jlr7.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/rYhp2yo.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/xbB0nOv.jpg
cp_logjam_b20
Pre3-> b20
Increased cap time of last point (hammer value was 1.3, now it's 2.5)
Fixed a plank pile floating at 2nd
Fixed mesh not rendering in logroom
Fixed a few displacement errors in cave
Added the upper ground back in choke
Moved the big HP on mid back towards choke
Moved the big ammo on mid to be by the rock by choke
Added a small ammo on either side of the point
Download: [url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/nklfx94pjxizmyb/cp_logjam_b20.bsp?dl=0]https://www.dropbox.com/s/nklfx94pjxizmyb/cp_logjam_b20.bsp?dl=0[/url]
Screens:
[img]http://i.imgur.com/7EpxPjG.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/adwAp7v.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/x52jlr7.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/rYhp2yo.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/xbB0nOv.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/WwUMRp0.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/n8Xco0s.jpg[/img]
Pre3-> b20
Increased cap time of last point (hammer value was 1.3, now it's 2.5)
Fixed a plank pile floating at 2nd
Fixed mesh not rendering in logroom
Fixed a few displacement errors in cave
Added the upper ground back in choke
Moved the big HP on mid back towards choke
Moved the big ammo on mid to be by the rock by choke
Added a small ammo on either side of the point
Download: [url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/nklfx94pjxizmyb/cp_logjam_b20.bsp?dl=0]https://www.dropbox.com/s/nklfx94pjxizmyb/cp_logjam_b20.bsp?dl=0[/url]
Screens:
[img]http://i.imgur.com/7EpxPjG.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/adwAp7v.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/x52jlr7.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/rYhp2yo.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/xbB0nOv.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/WwUMRp0.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/n8Xco0s.jpg[/img]
HyceSo... next time you say "I'm interested in making a TF2 map for competitive" I'm going to recommend drinking heavily instead. Hah.
I chose to do both!
[quote=Hyce]
So... next time you say "I'm interested in making a TF2 map for competitive" I'm going to recommend drinking heavily instead. Hah.[/quote]
I chose to do both!
So... next time you say "I'm interested in making a TF2 map for competitive" I'm going to recommend drinking heavily instead. Hah.[/quote]
I chose to do both!
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=454812035&searchtext=logjam
Logjam is now on the steam workshop! An end to awful naming conventions and suffixes and feedback all over everywhere! Thanks Valve!
Also- anyone who's tried B20, I'd love to hear what you think.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=454812035&searchtext=logjam
Logjam is now on the steam workshop! An end to awful naming conventions and suffixes and feedback all over everywhere! Thanks Valve!
Also- anyone who's tried B20, I'd love to hear what you think.
Logjam is now on the steam workshop! An end to awful naming conventions and suffixes and feedback all over everywhere! Thanks Valve!
Also- anyone who's tried B20, I'd love to hear what you think.
everything on this map is a tiny doorway, it makes it really tough to get into an area without taking massive amounts of damage.
everything on this map is a tiny doorway, it makes it really tough to get into an area without taking massive amounts of damage.
I'm not dead! I swear!
Anyhoo. Working towards RC1 at the moment. None of this is finalized but here's what I've been working on. I hope to have RC1 finished by August at the latest.
http://i.imgur.com/1YbIzuY.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/YBlFmR5.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/hLKQbpR.jpg
I'm not dead! I swear!
Anyhoo. Working towards RC1 at the moment. None of this is finalized but here's what I've been working on. I hope to have RC1 finished by August at the latest.
[img]http://i.imgur.com/1YbIzuY.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/YBlFmR5.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/hLKQbpR.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/40L5tj9.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/NiYedxU.jpg[/img]
Anyhoo. Working towards RC1 at the moment. None of this is finalized but here's what I've been working on. I hope to have RC1 finished by August at the latest.
[img]http://i.imgur.com/1YbIzuY.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/YBlFmR5.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/hLKQbpR.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/40L5tj9.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/NiYedxU.jpg[/img]
More RC1 teasers... Logjam in ESEA S20?!?!?!
http://i.imgur.com/FcGuxNd.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/2FzNAna.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/a9A2Q9M.jpg
More RC1 teasers... Logjam in ESEA S20?!?!?!
[img]http://i.imgur.com/FcGuxNd.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/2FzNAna.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/a9A2Q9M.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/91FJSRX.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/8joYFLS.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/FcGuxNd.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/2FzNAna.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/a9A2Q9M.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/91FJSRX.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/8joYFLS.jpg[/img]
CP_LOGJAM_RC1
DOWNLOAD: https://www.dropbox.com/s/peumff7z3mqqcsq/cp_logjam_rc1.bsp?dl=0
SCREENS: http://imgur.com/a/bKKiP
Gameplay changelog:
Metric fuckton of clipping
Modified the forward spawn at 2nd point to have a larger door that opens sideways
Added a raised walkway around spire at 2nd to block choke -> saw sightline as well as allow players to still utilize the space
Detailed a lot of stuff
Probably more things I forgot
Special thanks to Phi, Wareya, Benroads, and Bereth for detail/clipping/gameplay feedback.
Here's a few screens for those of you that don't want to peek into the imgur link:
http://i.imgur.com/dbdDIxz.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/uM29Pw6.jpg
[B]CP_LOGJAM_RC1[/B]
DOWNLOAD: https://www.dropbox.com/s/peumff7z3mqqcsq/cp_logjam_rc1.bsp?dl=0
SCREENS: http://imgur.com/a/bKKiP
Gameplay changelog:
Metric fuckton of clipping
Modified the forward spawn at 2nd point to have a larger door that opens sideways
Added a raised walkway around spire at 2nd to block choke -> saw sightline as well as allow players to still utilize the space
Detailed a lot of stuff
Probably more things I forgot
Special thanks to Phi, Wareya, Benroads, and Bereth for detail/clipping/gameplay feedback.
Here's a few screens for those of you that don't want to peek into the imgur link:
[img]http://i.imgur.com/dbdDIxz.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/uM29Pw6.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/l1jRgeA.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/E237vQB.jpg[/img]
DOWNLOAD: https://www.dropbox.com/s/peumff7z3mqqcsq/cp_logjam_rc1.bsp?dl=0
SCREENS: http://imgur.com/a/bKKiP
Gameplay changelog:
Metric fuckton of clipping
Modified the forward spawn at 2nd point to have a larger door that opens sideways
Added a raised walkway around spire at 2nd to block choke -> saw sightline as well as allow players to still utilize the space
Detailed a lot of stuff
Probably more things I forgot
Special thanks to Phi, Wareya, Benroads, and Bereth for detail/clipping/gameplay feedback.
Here's a few screens for those of you that don't want to peek into the imgur link:
[img]http://i.imgur.com/dbdDIxz.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/uM29Pw6.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/l1jRgeA.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/E237vQB.jpg[/img]
i put this map on my server and every time i try to join it it crashes my game on sending client info
everyone else can join but me, is anyone else getting somethin like this?
i put this map on my server and every time i try to join it it crashes my game on sending client info
everyone else can join but me, is anyone else getting somethin like this?
everyone else can join but me, is anyone else getting somethin like this?
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