It's a really difficult situation tbh ;/
I hope that something good will happen regardless of what happens to tf2 center
How can we use tf2center when masternoob is such a dickhead though?

tl;dr version:
trying is first step to failing so why bother trying, just suck it up buttercups.

He isnt a dickhead to the average user. Ill say it again, ive used the site for a year and ive played 600 lobbies, ~400 of which have been hosted by me and ive never run into any issues with the staff.

he does have a point though, if we want the majority tf2center's playerbase to switch over to something new we have to convince them that doing so is worth it.

.

Not just that its worth it. They have to know it exists.

My friend got banned for not joining a lobby quickly enough and having audible issues with his connection in mumble.
And I got into a argument with him cause my steam name has the word penis in it which is too sexual for a website based around a R rated game.

The website has what, 20k registered users? Maybe more, i dont remember the exact number but its in the tens of thousands. Kkaltuu mentioned in his post that MN and Tereza has around a hundred bans each and the other admins had a few dozen. That means that they've banned 1% of the userbase. That leaves 99% that are satisfied with the service and havent had any run-ins with the staff.

I never claimed that there arent any isolated incidents of the staff being dicks. Every online community has those.

All im saying is, the majority is happy and will continue to use the site.

Its too bad that these exact points were already made in a post on the main thread

My bad. I only read 1.5 pages of it and went on to write this post.

8 page threads scare me.

The lurking rule is still in effect though meaning 90% of the website is just there and not super active, won't make lobbies, won't be on forums and won't have involvement. If the 10% of the people who play a shit ton, make lobbies and go on the forums leave the 90% who don't care about tf2center beyond the fact it has a lobby system would rather switch to a website where people actively make lobbies and shit.

A service, however well coded, can only function when it has a dedicated and passionate staff behind it. The current 'drama' might not impact you directly, but it certainly had an impact on the staff working at TF2C. And unless those incredibly talented and dedicated members are replaced with equally talented and dedicated members TF2C is going to start to decline.

I'm not saying that those people won't be replaced, it is very possible. But the truth is, people like you probably aren't going to be the ones who step up to fill the gaps. And the people who are likely to step up are the ones that are fairly invested in starting a new project because they do not like the direction that TF2C is currently heading.

You do realize that a service like TF2C is not self sustaining, it requires donations, it requires coders, it requires PR, and forum moderation, admins to handle abuse, harassment, rule breaking, hacking. Unless you know of a lot of other members of this player base that "does not give a shit" a lot of those services are going to be heavily understaffed.

If you only work with the dedicated 10% you still wont get a replacement for center. You'll most likely end up with something like tf2pickup except with a very low skill level

Eh, TF2center is probably going to die after match making is released from being both lead by imcompetency, less convenient and not be able to rank up.

A very good point and something i intended to cover in the main post but forgot, because i typed it out without bothering to re-read it.
But yes i do believe that after all this crap there will still be people that would step in to fill the gap in center. There are two sides to every story, and im sure that MN still has some friends that would help and support him. If not, he can always bribe people with donation perks and shiny names or w/e if they apply for mod. The quality of the service would decline, but its still too giant of a site to die out over this.

that is an incredibly wrong way to look at things. probably 80% of tftv hasnt been banned from tf2c for some shitty reason but 99% of them thinks theyre shitty admins.
Additionally, 1% of a relatively small community is huge. its not some dismissable stat.

i'm sorry i just play cause i have nothing else to do ;-;

Sentinel you must not of been around when tf2lobby went under. It was at least twice as big as centers ever been and it just seemed to disappear in less then a month. I don't even know why it failed, I don't remember any Lobby drama at that point but I could be mistaken. Either way my point is NOTHING IS TOO BIG TO FAIL ON THE INTERNET.

A few dozen people on the forums arent 99% of the tftv userbase. (or are they? i honestly dont know how large the community on this website is, im not trying to be sarcastic, i genuinely dont know). Anyway as i said, thinking the admins are shitheads =/= never using the site.

Its dismissable compared to the 99%. Percentages are percentages. And the tf2c community is far from small compared to other tf2 communities. It's in the tens of thousands.

TF2Center wasn't the first, it killed a giant when it was created, and a replacement could very easily kill it in exactly the same way.

As for the other point you made, maybe. I suspect it will decline considerably unless there is a change in direction. MN has done a lot to drive away the majority of strong candidates. And those players he has driven away are friends with most of the remaining candidates. We are a small community, and you said it yourself: the vast majority of us just don't give a shit.

The ones that do aren't terribly fond of the current direction that TF2C is headed. And if you don't care as long as you get to play lobbies why should you care if some of us make another place where you can find lobbies with the help of all those dedicated individuals who don't want to be a part of TF2C anymore...

Guys I think we should listen to this guy. How do we ignore someone who can, by himself, speak for the opinions of 99% of the Team Fortress 2 userbase? I mean maybe if it was just his opinion we could disregard it but come on we're disregarding the opinions of tens of thousands of people here!

Seriously though mate, sarcasm aside you've shot yourself in the foot here, as you make some good points (albeit nothing that's exactly new and groundbreaking in this whole discussion) but I don't see how you expect anyone to take them seriously when you've put them across in such a blatantly inflammatory manner and with so much flagrant overexaggeration (as we all know, 80% of all statistics are pulled out of somebody's ass).

Other than this won't particularly comment as anything I would want to say has been said already above and, even moreso, in the other thread.

You're completely right about this, and i never said anything that goes against it in my posts. If you guys manage to make a site with a decent userbase, of course ill use it. I have nothing that attaches me to tf2center. I just said that i sincerely doubt that you'll succeed in creating a site that will rival tf2center. Such a project would require blood and sweat from those involved in it, as well as finances. There is also the time frame. No one knows what MM will look like if it comes out and if its going to be a replacement for the web based lobby system, so i doubt the community would invest their time and money in a project that might become obsolete once MM comes out. I didnt want to bring up this point in this thread because it's being covered in the other thread about the replacement website.

But if you guys manage to create a site that can and will rival center, my hats go off to you. All of them. The dozens of hats in my backpack. My post was never intended to be a shot directed at the community here on tftv or any other community. I mentioned in my original post that the scene simply wouldnt exist if not for the dedication of certain community members. I just wanted to give you the POV of an average player.

I even tried sending this thread to a few people on my friends list, to see their opinions on it. Most of them, people that have used center for a pretty long time, didnt even know about the drama which just proves my original point - the 99% arent involved enough to know whats going on.

what the fuck? I have no idea who masternoob is but if he shot up a school i'd sure as fuck not touch his site.. and then you compare murdering children to some old guy banging hookers? What is going on in your head

have u ever even PLAYED CS?

like really idk why people just dont even bother to look at the shit that is similar to TF2 and instead just say dumb stuff

Eh i did ask people to excuse my lack of eloquence. Im not exactly versed in writing forum rants. All im saying is, i havent heard any mentions of the incidents outside of some etf2l and tftv posts. Center is still up, lobbies are still being played, the online user counter is still the same as it was a month ago.

1. OHMYGODITSCYZERSOMEONEWITHARECOGNIZABLETF2NAMENOTICEDMYPOST
2. I did say its an extremely dumbified example. My point was that the public wont stop using a service just because someone on the staff of that service slighted another person that the public hasnt even heard of.

IM NOT SAYING ITS THE RIGHT THING TO DO. IM JUST SAYING ITS WHATS GOING TO HAPPEN / IS HAPPENING.

You've said yourself that you are not involved in the community, so maybe you haven't been paying attention for the last decade. But as a community we have, time and again, done things that we should be too small to achieve.

Volunteers built MGE, Nodecg, created eXtv, tf.tv, UGC, ETF2L, TF2Lobbies AND TF2Center, countless pugging resources, Tip of the Hat, Flares that Care (and in the space of days dismantled Flares that Care and created TF2Can which was several magnitudes more successful than the original. We have created Sizzling Stats, Logs.tf countless server plugins. We have survived without developer support for nearly a decade, a feat few other games can even begin to claim.

We sent teams to an international LAN not once, or even twice, but 3 times. And one of those was almost entirely funded by a single member of this community (and was later paid back by the community through an outpouring of donations)

We have created production quality in our casts and coverage that rivals other, established, e-sports and done it with a handful of volunteers.

Maybe it would surprise you, but I don't think I'd be surprised by anything this community is able to accomplish through dedication, passion, and raw talent.

~With regards just 1 player who had no part in any of the above, but is still willing to dedicate time and energy to improving the services that the 99% use every day

i must say i agree with sentinel because new comprtitive players coming to tf2c to train and it wont stop until this game will die so no one really cares about the elite of tf2c and who is the admin you have to stop complain about everything
just play and ignore the other its only a video game

When i said i wasnt involved, i simply meant that i never bothered replying or giving my input on the matters at hand. But yes i do know of, and use all those services youve mentioned and i know about the people behind them, I was there for the whole FTC fiasco, i read the entire bloody 18 page thread.

All those services were created by people working together. The new rival site isnt that kind of project. It's a revenge project against an already well established community website that the average user has no interest in leaving. Thats why i think its going to fail, unless the people behind it invest massive amounts of effort.

There was no drama, it was because the site was intermittently crashing/going down for months at a time and the owners were nowhere to be found.