mirelin for mechanics and flashiness
knoxxx for game sense and calling
Best med ever?
posted in
TF2 General Discussion
mirelin for mechanics and flashiness
knoxxx for game sense and calling
knoxxx for game sense and calling
Man the lack of F2 is really making me sad. Also for memes sake we cant forget glue.
Man the lack of F2 is really making me sad. Also for memes sake we cant forget glue.
SnackRaptor found every opportunity to take advantage of the ETF2L ruleset in s26 and did some things no other teams would even bother doing. His use of vaccinator at crucial times was as effective as it was annoying. Also his mechanics are second to none.
> His use of vaccinator at crucial times was as effective as it was annoying.
lol i guess grabas a fuckin god then hail that man for playing medic and spy the way he did
[quote=Snack]
Raptor found every opportunity to take advantage of the ETF2L ruleset in s26 and did some things no other teams would even bother doing. His use of vaccinator at crucial times was as effective as it was annoying. Also his mechanics are second to none.
[/quote]
> His use of vaccinator at crucial times was as effective as it was annoying.
lol i guess grabas a fuckin god then hail that man for playing medic and spy the way he did
Raptor found every opportunity to take advantage of the ETF2L ruleset in s26 and did some things no other teams would even bother doing. His use of vaccinator at crucial times was as effective as it was annoying. Also his mechanics are second to none.
[/quote]
> His use of vaccinator at crucial times was as effective as it was annoying.
lol i guess grabas a fuckin god then hail that man for playing medic and spy the way he did
lmao this thread. "shade for achievements, other medics for skill and positioning." i get the feeling if shade actually had less lan wins he might be considered a better medic by everyone.
raymon had to carry at i58, and he did. shade has never had to carry really, but he could.
lmao this thread. "shade for achievements, other medics for skill and positioning." i get the feeling if shade actually had less lan wins he might be considered a better medic by everyone.
raymon had to carry at i58, and he did. shade has never had to carry really, but he could.
raymon had to carry at i58, and he did. shade has never had to carry really, but he could.
I just want to point out somethings about shade that people seem to forget about, In terms of achievement everyone here agrees shade won the most, but everyone is saying like "well shade played on froyo, it was more of a team effect, etc etc."
IT'S THE SAME FOR EVERY MED THAT HAS WON, IT WAS A TEAM EFFORT.
Raymon didn't carry his team to win i58, crowns did better than all the teams that was all, kaptain and especially Starkie did really well at i58 along with raymon. Also you can argue that the competition was the lowest it ever was. Now i'm not saying that raymon can't be called the best med, but i just find it hard to compare him to shade when shade had many phenominal performances as well (ESEA LAN s18, i52 and i55, etc.) when the competition was arguably harder.
Mierlin did have good movement but didn't have enough achievement performance IMO to make him the best.
Knoxx I feel can really contend with shade because of i49 and was a great maincaller, but shade did better than knoxx achievement wise (and as his role imo) later on in i52 and i55. But again the i49 was a team effort as well.
I don't know about pyyyour but he did well but i felt he quit too soon to make him a for sure best med. he won i46 but again wasn't the carry of the team and competition was tough but fairly new i felt.
Now for shade, we know his achievements but no one is talking about his skills.
IMO he was the best at keeping himself alive. He knew when a situation went sour and that always helps your team from getting rolled.
Also he was the best at milking along with not dropping, only times i saw him drop was from a flank play and i never saw him pussy pop, dude had balls of steel.
Not only does shade has reached higher achievements, but he had certain skills that helped him surpass many great medics mechanically wise as well
I just want to point out somethings about shade that people seem to forget about, In terms of achievement everyone here agrees shade won the most, but everyone is saying like "well shade played on froyo, it was more of a team effect, etc etc."
IT'S THE SAME FOR EVERY MED THAT HAS WON, IT WAS A TEAM EFFORT.
Raymon didn't carry his team to win i58, crowns did better than all the teams that was all, kaptain and especially Starkie did really well at i58 along with raymon. Also you can argue that the competition was the lowest it ever was. Now i'm not saying that raymon can't be called the best med, but i just find it hard to compare him to shade when shade had many phenominal performances as well (ESEA LAN s18, i52 and i55, etc.) when the competition was arguably harder.
Mierlin did have good movement but didn't have enough achievement performance IMO to make him the best.
Knoxx I feel can really contend with shade because of i49 and was a great maincaller, but shade did better than knoxx achievement wise (and as his role imo) later on in i52 and i55. But again the i49 was a team effort as well.
I don't know about pyyyour but he did well but i felt he quit too soon to make him a for sure best med. he won i46 but again wasn't the carry of the team and competition was tough but fairly new i felt.
Now for shade, we know his achievements but no one is talking about his skills.
IMO he was the best at keeping himself alive. He knew when a situation went sour and that always helps your team from getting rolled.
Also he was the best at milking along with not dropping, only times i saw him drop was from a flank play and i never saw him pussy pop, dude had balls of steel.
Not only does shade has reached higher achievements, but he had certain skills that helped him surpass many great medics mechanically wise as well
IT'S THE SAME FOR EVERY MED THAT HAS WON, IT WAS A TEAM EFFORT.
Raymon didn't carry his team to win i58, crowns did better than all the teams that was all, kaptain and especially Starkie did really well at i58 along with raymon. Also you can argue that the competition was the lowest it ever was. Now i'm not saying that raymon can't be called the best med, but i just find it hard to compare him to shade when shade had many phenominal performances as well (ESEA LAN s18, i52 and i55, etc.) when the competition was arguably harder.
Mierlin did have good movement but didn't have enough achievement performance IMO to make him the best.
Knoxx I feel can really contend with shade because of i49 and was a great maincaller, but shade did better than knoxx achievement wise (and as his role imo) later on in i52 and i55. But again the i49 was a team effort as well.
I don't know about pyyyour but he did well but i felt he quit too soon to make him a for sure best med. he won i46 but again wasn't the carry of the team and competition was tough but fairly new i felt.
Now for shade, we know his achievements but no one is talking about his skills.
IMO he was the best at keeping himself alive. He knew when a situation went sour and that always helps your team from getting rolled.
Also he was the best at milking along with not dropping, only times i saw him drop was from a flank play and i never saw him pussy pop, dude had balls of steel.
Not only does shade has reached higher achievements, but he had certain skills that helped him surpass many great medics mechanically wise as well
KnOxXx didn't mentor me, I was just under his/numlocked's wing during my period in Epsilon. F2 was actually my mentor, so I'm sure that spins the wheel a bit for you boys.
KnOxXx didn't mentor me, I was just under his/numlocked's wing during my period in Epsilon. F2 was actually my mentor, so I'm sure that spins the wheel a bit for you boys.
glasslmao this thread. "shade for achievements, other medics for skill and positioning." i get the feeling if shade actually had less lan wins he might be considered a better medic by everyone.
raymon had to carry at i58, and he did. shade has never had to carry really, but he could.
But that's the whole debate, isn't it? What constitutes as a better medic: the achievements won alongside top teams or the ability to perform at an independent level regardless of what their team composition is?
If you're consistently playing for top teams and winning that must mean you're great and obviously a preferable choice over any other medics if said top team insists on continuing to use you.
If you're the kind of player that can singlehandedly change the tide of the game in situations when the rest of your team failed then surely you must also be great.
Which of these two is the greatest?
To put it in another perspective you can ask the question:
What defines the best medic? Someone who ensures their team's victory or someone who can pull their weight and change the outcome of the game? These are two different things. One's about filling your role, which is the whole "great medics don't get in stupid situations" argument. The other is about doing more than it is expected of you in the face of adversity, performing at a game-changing level.
For me it is the latter. I dislike hard metagames because it wrongfully conditions players to adapt to someone else's way of thinking. Metagames are imposed by true TF2 titans who understand the game at such a capacity that they are able to visualize how to consistently check-mate the opposition. It therefore takes an even larger titan to find ways to exploit the convention and break it.
Being very good at following a set of directives doesn't make you the best player, it only proves that you can listen. Being very good at finding ways of turning the tide around is what makes you the best player. These concepts aren't necessarily mutually exclusive, obviously, but one sets a higher expectation.
I pick Knoxxx.
[quote=glass]lmao this thread. "shade for achievements, other medics for skill and positioning." i get the feeling if shade actually had less lan wins he might be considered a better medic by everyone.
raymon had to carry at i58, and he did. shade has never had to carry really, but he could.[/quote]
But that's the whole debate, isn't it? What constitutes as a better medic: the achievements won alongside top teams or the ability to perform at an independent level regardless of what their team composition is?
If you're consistently playing for top teams and winning that must mean you're great and obviously a preferable choice over any other medics if said top team insists on continuing to use you.
If you're the kind of player that can singlehandedly change the tide of the game in situations when the rest of your team failed then surely you must also be great.
Which of these two is the greatest?
To put it in another perspective you can ask the question:
What defines the best medic? Someone who ensures their team's victory or someone who can pull their weight and change the outcome of the game? These are two different things. One's about filling your role, which is the whole "great medics don't get in stupid situations" argument. The other is about doing more than it is expected of you in the face of adversity, performing at a game-changing level.
For me it is the latter. I dislike hard metagames because it wrongfully conditions players to adapt to someone else's way of thinking. Metagames are imposed by true TF2 titans who understand the game at such a capacity that they are able to visualize how to consistently check-mate the opposition. It therefore takes an even larger titan to find ways to exploit the convention and break it.
Being very good at following a set of directives doesn't make you the best player, it only proves that you can listen. Being very good at finding ways of turning the tide around is what makes you the best player. These concepts aren't necessarily mutually exclusive, obviously, but one sets a higher expectation.
I pick Knoxxx.
raymon had to carry at i58, and he did. shade has never had to carry really, but he could.[/quote]
But that's the whole debate, isn't it? What constitutes as a better medic: the achievements won alongside top teams or the ability to perform at an independent level regardless of what their team composition is?
If you're consistently playing for top teams and winning that must mean you're great and obviously a preferable choice over any other medics if said top team insists on continuing to use you.
If you're the kind of player that can singlehandedly change the tide of the game in situations when the rest of your team failed then surely you must also be great.
Which of these two is the greatest?
To put it in another perspective you can ask the question:
What defines the best medic? Someone who ensures their team's victory or someone who can pull their weight and change the outcome of the game? These are two different things. One's about filling your role, which is the whole "great medics don't get in stupid situations" argument. The other is about doing more than it is expected of you in the face of adversity, performing at a game-changing level.
For me it is the latter. I dislike hard metagames because it wrongfully conditions players to adapt to someone else's way of thinking. Metagames are imposed by true TF2 titans who understand the game at such a capacity that they are able to visualize how to consistently check-mate the opposition. It therefore takes an even larger titan to find ways to exploit the convention and break it.
Being very good at following a set of directives doesn't make you the best player, it only proves that you can listen. Being very good at finding ways of turning the tide around is what makes you the best player. These concepts aren't necessarily mutually exclusive, obviously, but one sets a higher expectation.
I pick Knoxxx.
#67
Except medic is different. Being good at medic in particular is about not making any mistakes, whether or not you want to think people at the top have a "convoluted style of playing." Idk about older medics since I didn't pay much attention to competitive at the time, but shade definitely makes the least mistakes, despite having not the greatest movement or mechanics. Mechanics matter, and that's what helps you clutch rounds, but playing perfect tf2 is 10x more important on medic in the grand scheme of a whole series.
#67
Except medic is different. Being good at medic in particular is about not making any mistakes, whether or not you want to think people at the top have a "convoluted style of playing." Idk about older medics since I didn't pay much attention to competitive at the time, but shade definitely makes the least mistakes, despite having not the greatest movement or mechanics. Mechanics matter, and that's what helps you clutch rounds, but playing perfect tf2 is 10x more important on medic in the grand scheme of a whole series.
Except medic is different. Being good at medic in particular is about not making any mistakes, whether or not you want to think people at the top have a "convoluted style of playing." Idk about older medics since I didn't pay much attention to competitive at the time, but shade definitely makes the least mistakes, despite having not the greatest movement or mechanics. Mechanics matter, and that's what helps you clutch rounds, but playing perfect tf2 is 10x more important on medic in the grand scheme of a whole series.
harbleu definitely had the best shittalk game and was fun as hell to watch
harbleu definitely had the best shittalk game and was fun as hell to watch
At no point did I use the word convoluted or alluded to such a thing. Someone is eventually going to make a mistake and the best players are those who are able to perform beyond their box of "just don't make a mistake" in order to rectify the damage that had been done. These are what we call "plays" and there's a very definitive difference between having a couple of lucky moronic moments and from having the capacity to carry. Make no mistake, I'm not talking about who would look best in a "top 10 nutty arrows" video.
The best player in any class or role should first of all not be making mistakes and secondly be capable of delivering when it is called for. KnoxXx remains my pick due to his diligence in never giving up.
At no point did I use the word convoluted or alluded to such a thing. Someone is eventually going to make a mistake and the best players are those who are able to perform beyond their box of "just don't make a mistake" in order to rectify the damage that had been done. These are what we call "plays" and there's a very definitive difference between having a couple of lucky moronic moments and from having the capacity to carry. Make no mistake, I'm not talking about who would look best in a "top 10 nutty arrows" video.
The best player in any class or role should first of all not be making mistakes and secondly be capable of delivering when it is called for. KnoxXx remains my pick due to his diligence in never giving up.
The best player in any class or role should first of all not be making mistakes and secondly be capable of delivering when it is called for. KnoxXx remains my pick due to his diligence in never giving up.
shade doesnt just not make mistakes, he actively plays more intelligently
his positioning and timing is just straight up better than the other medics at his level
hitting 3 crossbows and a good surf to live with 3 hp is worse medic play than delaying for a second longer or kiting more effectively so the guy bombing you gets 0 damage
shade doesnt just not make mistakes, he actively plays more intelligently
his positioning and timing is just straight up better than the other medics at his level
hitting 3 crossbows and a good surf to live with 3 hp is worse medic play than delaying for a second longer or kiting more effectively so the guy bombing you gets 0 damage
his positioning and timing is just straight up better than the other medics at his level
hitting 3 crossbows and a good surf to live with 3 hp is worse medic play than delaying for a second longer or kiting more effectively so the guy bombing you gets 0 damage
shade - has had the best positioning of any NA med, drops gems of knowledge that have turned games around
kbk - woulda been in top 2 with shade if he had been on a good team, excellent calls and mechanics
harb - able to ignite the passion in his team and let them snowball over teams, but overly emotional and shut down sometimes
shade - has had the best positioning of any NA med, drops gems of knowledge that have turned games around
kbk - woulda been in top 2 with shade if he had been on a good team, excellent calls and mechanics
harb - able to ignite the passion in his team and let them snowball over teams, but overly emotional and shut down sometimes
kbk - woulda been in top 2 with shade if he had been on a good team, excellent calls and mechanics
harb - able to ignite the passion in his team and let them snowball over teams, but overly emotional and shut down sometimes
PYYYOUR. harbleu. shade.
To me, it's very hard to ignore what these guys provided to their teams. All were phenomenal minds of Medic, and all delivered incredible / clutch performances individually and with their respective teams. PYYYOUR brought so much knowledge to the game and many Medics from the olden days learned so much with him, myself included. harbleu was the game's #1 Medic to watch bar none: an exciting high-risk high-reward playstyle that captivated audiences. Never forget S15 LAN and i52. shade obviously is the most storied Medic now with all these LAN wins but I feel for that reason he's almost like underrated when everyone's focused on the team aspect of the game. He played his role by never dying and if that was all he provided it would suffice (obviously that's not all but hopefully my point is made).
Plenty of "younger" or other notable Medics throughout the years who have been really impressive. I particularly liked indust, Fragile, Nursey, and of course ¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º° KROSSBOW KID °º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸. Even mesr's Medic for that one season ages ago was great, too.
I don't know much about the EU Medics besides watching streams, but most of their names have already been said here.
PYYYOUR. harbleu. shade.
To me, it's very hard to ignore what these guys provided to their teams. All were phenomenal minds of Medic, and all delivered incredible / clutch performances individually and with their respective teams. PYYYOUR brought so much knowledge to the game and many Medics from the olden days learned so much with him, myself included. harbleu was the game's #1 Medic to watch bar none: an exciting high-risk high-reward playstyle that captivated audiences. Never forget S15 LAN and i52. shade obviously is the most storied Medic now with all these LAN wins but I feel for that reason he's almost like underrated when everyone's focused on the [i]team[/i] aspect of the game. He played his role by never dying and if that was all he provided it would suffice (obviously that's not all but hopefully my point is made).
Plenty of "younger" or other notable Medics throughout the years who have been really impressive. I particularly liked indust, Fragile, Nursey, and of course ¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º° KROSSBOW KID °º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸. Even mesr's Medic for that one season ages ago was great, too.
I don't know much about the EU Medics besides watching streams, but most of their names have already been said here.
To me, it's very hard to ignore what these guys provided to their teams. All were phenomenal minds of Medic, and all delivered incredible / clutch performances individually and with their respective teams. PYYYOUR brought so much knowledge to the game and many Medics from the olden days learned so much with him, myself included. harbleu was the game's #1 Medic to watch bar none: an exciting high-risk high-reward playstyle that captivated audiences. Never forget S15 LAN and i52. shade obviously is the most storied Medic now with all these LAN wins but I feel for that reason he's almost like underrated when everyone's focused on the [i]team[/i] aspect of the game. He played his role by never dying and if that was all he provided it would suffice (obviously that's not all but hopefully my point is made).
Plenty of "younger" or other notable Medics throughout the years who have been really impressive. I particularly liked indust, Fragile, Nursey, and of course ¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º° KROSSBOW KID °º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸. Even mesr's Medic for that one season ages ago was great, too.
I don't know much about the EU Medics besides watching streams, but most of their names have already been said here.
Raymon: "I might be dead. Holy shit i'm alive i'm the best team fortress playe-i'm dead."
Raymon: "I might be dead. Holy shit i'm alive i'm the best team fortress playe-i'm dead."
adam "reptile" dopko was undefeated in his career as medic with a lan win
adam "reptile" dopko was undefeated in his career as medic with a lan win
peltdelaying for a second longer or kiting more effectively so the guy bombing you gets 0 damage
this is exactly what it feels like to play against shade and it is f r u s t r a t i n g
[quote=pelt]delaying for a second longer or kiting more effectively so the guy bombing you gets 0 damage[/quote]
this is exactly what it feels like to play against shade and it is f r u s t r a t i n g
this is exactly what it feels like to play against shade and it is f r u s t r a t i n g
People seem to be mixing up best =/= greatest
Shade is undeniably the greatest medic ever, nobody else comes even remotely close
BUT, even with that shade is still probably the best med of all time. With every single answer here (save for one or two), shade is the only single person that was not only still relevant in that respective time period, but still in contention for being the best medic of that era. He's 100% of the time throughout his whole playing time been considered a top two medic in the world which is something which speaks to his consistency and longevity.
When you want to talk about "best meds" there are a probably close to a dozen answers, but pretty much all of them were only dominant for a year or two max. (my answer for "best" goes to cozen btw)
People seem to be mixing up best =/= greatest
Shade is undeniably the greatest medic ever, nobody else comes even remotely close
BUT, even with that shade is still probably the best med of all time. With every single answer here (save for one or two), shade is the only single person that was not only still relevant in that respective time period, but still in contention for being the [u]best[/u] medic of that era. He's 100% of the time throughout his whole playing time been considered a top two medic in the world which is something which speaks to his consistency and longevity.
When you want to talk about "best meds" there are a probably close to a dozen answers, but pretty much all of them were only dominant for a year or two max. (my answer for "best" goes to cozen btw)
Shade is undeniably the greatest medic ever, nobody else comes even remotely close
BUT, even with that shade is still probably the best med of all time. With every single answer here (save for one or two), shade is the only single person that was not only still relevant in that respective time period, but still in contention for being the [u]best[/u] medic of that era. He's 100% of the time throughout his whole playing time been considered a top two medic in the world which is something which speaks to his consistency and longevity.
When you want to talk about "best meds" there are a probably close to a dozen answers, but pretty much all of them were only dominant for a year or two max. (my answer for "best" goes to cozen btw)
VulcanRuwin
Idk why this is getting down fragged so much. Ruwin was a very very good medic and certainly better than a lot of the meds posted already
[quote=Vulcan]Ruwin[/quote]
Idk why this is getting down fragged so much. Ruwin was a very very good medic and certainly better than a lot of the meds posted already
Idk why this is getting down fragged so much. Ruwin was a very very good medic and certainly better than a lot of the meds posted already
#87 probably a bunch of people who are recent players and don't know that Ruwin used to play hella Medic back in the day?
anyways my vote is for shade, I don't remember exactly when but there was a really good decently close match on Granary (of all maps) where he had 0 deaths, it was actually amazing. best med at minimizing mistakes.
#87 probably a bunch of people who are recent players and don't know that Ruwin used to play hella Medic back in the day?
anyways my vote is for shade, I don't remember exactly when but there was a really good decently close match on Granary (of all maps) where he had 0 deaths, it was actually amazing. best med at minimizing mistakes.
anyways my vote is for shade, I don't remember exactly when but there was a really good decently close match on Granary (of all maps) where he had 0 deaths, it was actually amazing. best med at minimizing mistakes.
Ruwin was the best med in his time imo, and possibly the best all time, but it would be hard comparing him to some of the newer meds.
Platinum AMArbYou've been around a while, who do you think are the best players of all time for each class? (either the 4 major ones, or all 9)Platinum#38 not including myself, TLR on pocket, harbleu on roam, enigma on scout, b4nny on demo, ruwin on medic. I think the players that play the game now have such a deeper understanding that the players of old could definitely not compete.
Ruwin was the best med in his time imo, and possibly the best all time, but it would be hard comparing him to some of the newer meds.
[quote=Platinum AMA][quote=rb]You've been around a while, who do you think are the best players of all time for each class? (either the 4 major ones, or all 9)[/quote]
[quote=Platinum]#38 not including myself, TLR on pocket, harbleu on roam, enigma on scout, b4nny on demo, ruwin on medic. I think the players that play the game now have such a deeper understanding that the players of old could definitely not compete.[/quote][/quote]
[quote=Platinum AMA][quote=rb]You've been around a while, who do you think are the best players of all time for each class? (either the 4 major ones, or all 9)[/quote]
[quote=Platinum]#38 not including myself, TLR on pocket, harbleu on roam, enigma on scout, b4nny on demo, ruwin on medic. I think the players that play the game now have such a deeper understanding that the players of old could definitely not compete.[/quote][/quote]
Please
sign in through STEAM
to post a comment.