Then it's on ascent for not pushing out and honestly they would be rewarded to do said push in a 5cp+3cp dom scenario. Ascent is holding last, 7 is holding 2nd 7 is accruing points at 3x speed for a domination victory. Ascent HAS to push out otherwise they will lose if they do nothing best case the win the fight and push back to mid and say they cap it now ascent is accruing domination points in a 2:1 ratio vs 7 (or possibly at base rate while 7 gains nothing for only controlling 1 dom point) worst case scenario for ascent pushing out of last is they wipe and lose the round they were going to lose anyway.

vs Current

Ascent is holding last. 7 is holding 2nd. Ascent has 0 reason to push out cause at the end of the timer nothing is lost for them unless they're down rounds already. Which the worst case scenario for not pushing is they get another chance at winning a mid fight... Sounds like a reward for sitting at your own last. (unless it's the end of the 2nd half)

a 5cp with 3cp dom that's set up as a team can only gain domination points by owning the mid point, you have to cap the point sequentially like current, controlling the enemy teams 2nd point triples domination point gain, capturing enemy teams last point will result in an automatic round Win. This would add a natural time limit to EACH round rather than having points constantly give a handful of minutes to a round timer that could be cut short by the map timer in a fashion not terrible dissimilar to koth (who's ever seen a 30+ minute match with only 1 round won on ANY koth map in 6s?) This system would also incentivize BOTH teams to constantly push either to not lose via domination or to end the round even faster and get on with the next round (with the downsides of not accruing domination points as fast or the enemy team accruing domination points at base speed).

Would it be awesome? Idk cause like I said I've never played it and I think the "theory" of it sounds quite entertaining BUT lets be real here it doesn't matter how good the game mode is if the map is complete shit. Badlands would be a terrible choice for this kind of game mode. Ideally for this kind of gamemode you would need to setup points as such

RedLast = somewhat easy Red hold <-> Red2nd = Bad Blue hold, Average Red hold <-> Middlepoint = somewhat bad to average hold <-> Blue2nd = Average Blue hold, Bad Red hold <-> BlueLast = somewhat easy Blue hold

I don't believe a current 5cp map is like this due to most 5cp maps from what I recall being absurdly hard to get in / out of last (relative from going to 2nd to mid or mid to 2nd).

in terms of spectating would you rather see a 1 - 0 5cp match that took 60minutes or a 5 - 2 5cp+3cp dom match that took 60?

Wouldn't instaspawn combined with x2 slower capping time make mid awfully long?

i rather just have more koth maps :(

Yeah I was thinking either one or the other. Instaspawn might be cool on a small map cause it would encourage constant aggression and clutch plays but on the flip side it might lead to 30 minute rounds that go back and forth forever. Probably wouldn't be a good comp format but fun for pugs maybe.

Instant respawn sucks when it comes to uber advantage. You could uber into a team, kill a scout and a medic, and end up with uber disad since they spawned and started building before your uber faded.

Mid fight simulator

Mfw the 6v6 meta is so cancer that the community tries to invent new map designs to make it bearable.

If your criticism is that defense and stalemating is too OP then you need to forgo gamemodes that enable defense and start promoting gamemodes that benefit aggression. These gamemodes already exist, they're called KOTH and Payload - the latter being a bit too slow paced to really function in a 6v6 context.

What both of these have in common is a time based pressure. That is, I claim, the pressure that is needed. After all, in 5CP games it is only when a team is losing and the clock is running out that we begin to see them go for more desperately aggressive plays.

It would be interesting to see a ETF2L season with two KOTH maps instead of one just to see what impact this would have on the meta.

u can already do 1 cp its called King Of The Hill

Sorry I didnt notice your reply.

I agree with you, your idea is good, but designing such a map would be a complete novelty and require someone very skilled to make such a map without being able to take easy inspiration on existing designs. My personal gripe with that is that, just like koth, it puts the pressure on the team that lost the midfight to make a move, but unlike koth, losing too many players gets punished harder (as you lose your 2nd/the round) whereas ideally, 5CP is about attackers being pressured to score a round.

So your relationship between points could be :
RedLast = bad Red hold(successful hold = big play) <-> Red2nd = Bad Blue hold, Average/easy Red hold <-> Middlepoint = bad hold <-> Blue2nd = Average/easy Blue hold, Bad Red hold <-> BlueLast = hard Blue hold

And then, a map maker must know how to create choke points that are hard to hold, without making the map backcap city, without making it sniper friendly, while still allowing for positional/corners play. That's hard.

In both cases, making good and new map designs is important, but it's equally hard to make your gamemode a reality as it is to make a differently shaped 5cp map, and perhaps even harder when you consider coding the domination rule thing. Therefore, one might as well focus efforts on trying new 5cp designs.

That's attack/defend which the OP states is not what this thread is about. they're talking 3cp like powerhouse. Symmetrical maps like the current 6s 5cp meta

A better way to get rid of stalemates would be to make the round timer after a point is capped much shorter and just give the team with more points the round win. This forces the defending team to have to push out of last otherwise they risk losing the round. The only issue I see with this approach is teams stalemating after they push up to second or last becoming a dominant strategy, but personally I think this opens up more interesting gameplay since the defending team now has to actively think about getting out of last as opposed to just waiting for the attacking team to retard push in.

Forcing teams to push out is something that isn't encouraged enough on 5cp, and threatening a round loss for turtling too long is a good thing imo.

you're giving the team that wins mid a free round for turtling second, it's very difficult to push into 2nd if the attacking team doesn't make mistakes

how is that better?

It's better because it's an actual resolution to the round. Teams can already do that after winning mid, but they don't get a round win for it. You need something to keep people from just stalemating forever, and just lowering the time limit doesn't give enough reward to feel good because then even though you won the midfight, nobody wins the round because neither team did anything after the one conclusive team fight. Plus I imagine most teams would take the risk and try to end the round immediately if some sort of advantageous position came up, as opposed to just trying to burn time. Plus I am of the opinion that the midfight should be the most important fight in the round, so to me making the midfight more important isn't that big of a drawback.