PC Build Thread

#2071

turgaid

0 Frags – +

can't understand first question, if u mean if i'm sure leds are on gpu and not on the mobo---> yes i'm sure
yes
yes ( i did not made stupid mistakes like wrong channel on the monitor or unplugged something)
No; how can I upgrade the bios without having signal on my screen? Nothing shows up in my monitor so i can't see bios or upgrade it.

#2072

Setsul

2 Frags – +

#2071
Thanks to the Kaby Lake Pentiums having HT enabled you're looking at a reasonable build.
It makes the i3s look a bit ridiculous though. I mean before you had the i3s with higher clockrates, AVX2, ECC, HT, all in all maybe 50% better peformance on average, sometimes more, sometimes less. Now all you get is AVX2 and higher clockrates. 10, maybe 15% more performance at a 100% higher price. Yeah no.
Well either way, 60€ for 3.5 GHz Dual Core with Hyperthreading is pretty reasonable compared to the 150€ Intel wanted two years ago.

http://geizhals.de/intel-pentium-g4560-bx80677g4560-a1558362.html?hloc=at&hloc=de
http://geizhals.de/asrock-b250m-pro4-90-mxb3c0-a0uayz-a1544872.html?hloc=at&hloc=de
http://geizhals.de/?cat=ramddr3&xf=256_2x%7E5828_DDR4%7E5831_DIMM
Just get RAM from whichever shop you're getting the rest from.
http://geizhals.de/gigabyte-radeon-rx-460-windforce-oc-2g-gv-rx460wf2oc-2gd-a1490241.html?hloc=at&hloc=de
http://geizhals.de/corsair-cx-series-modular-cx450m-450w-atx-2-4-cp-9020101-eu-cp-9020101-uk-a1404819.html?hloc=at&hloc=de
http://geizhals.de/cooler-master-n200-nse-200-kkn1-a919524.html
I was too lazy to look for a cheaper case because it already works out to ~400€ and I'm not going to argue about asthetics.
You should look for at least 2 fans, dust filters, some cable management space, front panel USB 3.0 and <50€, other than that I wouldn't really care.

#2072
I meant did you plug the monitor into the GPU or mobo?

Well worst case get mobo that doesn't need a BIOS update.
http://www.taocomputer.eu/shop2007/scheda.asp?id=36838

#2071
Thanks to the Kaby Lake Pentiums having HT enabled you're looking at a reasonable build.
It makes the i3s look a bit ridiculous though. I mean before you had the i3s with higher clockrates, AVX2, ECC, HT, all in all maybe 50% better peformance on average, sometimes more, sometimes less. Now all you get is AVX2 and higher clockrates. 10, maybe 15% more performance at a 100% higher price. Yeah no.
Well either way, 60€ for 3.5 GHz Dual Core with Hyperthreading is pretty reasonable compared to the 150€ Intel wanted two years ago.

http://geizhals.de/intel-pentium-g4560-bx80677g4560-a1558362.html?hloc=at&hloc=de
http://geizhals.de/asrock-b250m-pro4-90-mxb3c0-a0uayz-a1544872.html?hloc=at&hloc=de
http://geizhals.de/?cat=ramddr3&xf=256_2x%7E5828_DDR4%7E5831_DIMM
Just get RAM from whichever shop you're getting the rest from.
http://geizhals.de/gigabyte-radeon-rx-460-windforce-oc-2g-gv-rx460wf2oc-2gd-a1490241.html?hloc=at&hloc=de
http://geizhals.de/corsair-cx-series-modular-cx450m-450w-atx-2-4-cp-9020101-eu-cp-9020101-uk-a1404819.html?hloc=at&hloc=de
http://geizhals.de/cooler-master-n200-nse-200-kkn1-a919524.html
I was too lazy to look for a cheaper case because it already works out to ~400€ and I'm not going to argue about asthetics.
You should look for at least 2 fans, dust filters, some cable management space, front panel USB 3.0 and <50€, other than that I wouldn't really care.

#2072
I meant did you plug the monitor into the GPU or mobo?

Well worst case get mobo that doesn't need a BIOS update.
http://www.taocomputer.eu/shop2007/scheda.asp?id=36838

#2073

turgaid

0 Frags – +

the monitor is plugged to gpu
i had an idea: my friend has a i5-6500 I can try to run with that and if the pc still dont work the mobo has something broken and i can send it back to seller?

#2074

Setsul

2 Frags – +

#2074
That would be ideal.
If it works, update the BIOS just in case, you can do that from the BIOS/UEFI itself, no need for windows, and then try with the 7700 again.

#2075

Fire

0 Frags – +

x

#2076

QuantumBlink

0 Frags – +

http://pcpartpicker.com/b/Pqq48d

#2077

Shounic

0 Frags – +

edit: nvm i made a mistake :D

#2078

turgaid

0 Frags – +

hi all
can this mobo: MB Intel 1151 ASRock B150M Pro4S supports this rams: corsair vengeange ddr4 16x2gb 2400hz although they are not in the list of compatible rams in the asrock site ???? (this mobo should support only 2133hz rams )

thanks for ur answers

hi all
can this mobo: MB Intel 1151 ASRock B150M Pro4S supports this rams: corsair vengeange ddr4 16x2gb 2400hz although they are not in the list of compatible rams in the asrock site ???? (this mobo should support only 2133hz rams )

thanks for ur answers

#2079

Setsul

0 Frags – +

#2079
I think you mean 2x16GB 2400MHz.
Yes, worst case it'll just run at 2133MHz.

So did you try it with the i5-6500?

#2079
I think you mean 2x16GB 2400MHz.
Yes, worst case it'll just run at 2133MHz.

So did you try it with the i5-6500?

#2080

turgaid

0 Frags – +

didn't manage to find the i5-6500(or any other) so i brought the pc to a local shop...

#2081

toads_tf

0 Frags – +

what would I need to play tf2 and other fairly recent games at a constant nice, smooth frame rate with a gtx 970?

i'm thinking about getting an i7-6700k for my birthday, would i need to go higher or lower?

what would I need to play tf2 and other fairly recent games at a constant nice, smooth frame rate with a gtx 970?

i'm thinking about getting an i7-6700k for my birthday, would i need to go higher or lower?

#2082

Fire

0 Frags – +

x

#2083

Setsul

2 Frags – +

#2082
Overclocking yes/no?
Streaming yes/no?

It's table time!

______________Streaming | No Streaming
Overclocking___ i7-7700K _| i3-7350K or i5-7600K*
No Overclocking i7-7700 __ | i3-7100/7300/7320 or i5-7400/7500/7600*

*depending on budget.

#2082
Overclocking yes/no?
Streaming yes/no?

It's table time!

______________Streaming | No Streaming
Overclocking___ i7-7700K _| i3-7350K or i5-7600K*
No Overclocking i7-7700 __ | i3-7100/7300/7320 or i5-7400/7500/7600*

*depending on budget.

#2084

toads_tf

0 Frags – +

Here's the build I was thinking of doing, I would rather it not be too much more expensive than this so I can afford peripherals, but since I'm likely going to build this a month or two down the road I may be able to pull together a little bit more cash.

___________________________
CPU: i7-7700k (present from very generous parents i reckon i'll chip in here though ;)
GPU: GTX 970 (100.00 used from a friend)
Mobo: MSI H110M Gaming LGA 1151 Micro-ATX Motherboard (69.99 here)
RAM: PNY Anarchy 16GB Kit (2x8GB) DDR4 2133MHz (82.99 here)
PSU: EVGA 600 B1 100-B1-0600-KR 80+ BRONZE 600W (49.99 here)
Chassis: Rosewill CHALLENGER - Black Gaming ATX Mid Tower Computer Case (49.99 here)
Storage: SEAGATE CONSTELLATION ST32000644NS 2TB 7200RPM SATA-II (58.00 here)
Cooler: CORSAIR Hydro Series H50 120mm Quiet Edition (59.99 here)
___________________________________

Since this is the first time I've built a computer and i'm fairly clueless about all this, I was wondering if there were any problems, things I should do differently, unnecessary purchases, or places I could cut back on expenses based off of this here.

Thanks in advance :)

Here's the build I was thinking of doing, I would rather it not be too much more expensive than this so I can afford peripherals, but since I'm likely going to build this a month or two down the road I may be able to pull together a little bit more cash.

___________________________
CPU: i7-7700k (present from very generous parents i reckon i'll chip in here though ;)
GPU: GTX 970 (100.00 used from a friend)
Mobo: MSI H110M Gaming LGA 1151 Micro-ATX Motherboard (69.99 [url=https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=1292434&gclid=Cj0KEQiAwrbEBRDqxqzMsrTGmogBEiQAeSE6ZeLPvLPra0YO-0oW57FQ46W1dholq_J2lpOXAoEDipUaAp-38P8HAQ&Q=&ap=y&c3api=1876%2C52934714882%2C&is=REG&A=details]here[/url])
RAM: PNY Anarchy 16GB Kit (2x8GB) DDR4 2133MHz (82.99 [url=http://www.staples.com/PNY-Anarchy-16GB-Kit-2x8GB-DDR4-2133MHz-PC4-17000-CL15-Desktop-Memory/product_2114105?cid=PS:GooglePLAs:2114105&ci_src=17588969&ci_sku=2114105&KPID=2114105&cvosrc=PLA.google-SALES.Computer%20Accessories%20%26%20Peripherals&cvo_crid=39506881662&cvo_campaign=71700000015257010&gclid=CjwKEAiAn7HEBRDHwNqitoWqsQcSJAADWmI2ZJ8QxpBMeBzlwpdMHXoV0pp2yz04oXQCMBbDj8vEQRoCOiTw_wcB]here[/url])
PSU: EVGA 600 B1 100-B1-0600-KR 80+ BRONZE 600W (49.99 [url=https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16817438014]here[/url])
Chassis: Rosewill CHALLENGER - Black Gaming ATX Mid Tower Computer Case (49.99 [url=https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811147153]here[/url])
Storage: SEAGATE CONSTELLATION ST32000644NS 2TB 7200RPM SATA-II (58.00 [url=https://www.serversupply.com/products/part_search/pid_lookup.asp?pid=198664&gclid=CjwKEAiAn7HEBRDHwNqitoWqsQcSJAADWmI2sct94qRJfJTCRfcRltRwiiXl-V8o4hqVl9ryXIvryhoCYH3w_wcB]here[/url])
Cooler: CORSAIR Hydro Series H50 120mm Quiet Edition (59.99 [url=https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181010&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC-_-pla-_-Liquid+%2F+Water+Cooling-_-N82E16835181010&gclid=Cj0KEQiAwrbEBRDqxqzMsrTGmogBEiQAeSE6ZeVWgqblI0PTmhJ2081fuW1pj3YsfgxdQRpKZl9hXjUaAuCR8P8HAQ&gclsrc=aw.ds]here[/url])
___________________________________

Since this is the first time I've built a computer and i'm fairly clueless about all this, I was wondering if there were any problems, things I should do differently, unnecessary purchases, or places I could cut back on expenses based off of this here.

Thanks in advance :)

#2085

Setsul

0 Frags – +

Budget?
Are you going to overclock?
What are you going to use it for?

#2086

toads_tf

0 Frags – +

I'll be using it for video games, video editing, 3D animation/modeling, possibly stream(?) and a bunch of other stuff that probably won't be too dependent on very high specs. I'd like to be able to overclock, though if I can get along fine without it I'd be happy to run less of a risk of frying my computer.

In terms of budget, I'd say the non-CPU/GPU parts could go up to about 400-450 dollars, as I'm set on getting the 970 for a very low 100 dollars and the CPU could be essentially anywhere lower than the price of the i7-7700k.

I'll be using it for video games, video editing, 3D animation/modeling, possibly stream(?) and a bunch of other stuff that probably won't be too dependent on very high specs. I'd like to be able to overclock, though if I can get along fine without it I'd be happy to run less of a risk of frying my computer.

In terms of budget, I'd say the non-CPU/GPU parts could go up to about 400-450 dollars, as I'm set on getting the 970 for a very low 100 dollars and the CPU could be essentially anywhere lower than the price of the i7-7700k.

#2087

Setsul

0 Frags – +

In that case an i7 does make sense, but you'll have to decice whether or not you want to overclock.

When do you want to build it? Depending on that Zen may or may not be an option.

In that case an i7 does make sense, but you'll have to decice whether or not you want to overclock.

When do you want to build it? Depending on that Zen may or may not be an option.

#2088

toads_tf

0 Frags – +

I guess I'd like to overclock the processor, as long as the cooling required for that doesn't add too much to the total price, and I'm thinking of building it sometime in March (maybe a little earlier/later?), as my friend is going to sell me the 970 after he buys a 1080ti when they come out.

i can always build it earlier minus the GPU

I guess I'd like to overclock the processor, as long as the cooling required for that doesn't add [i]too much[/i] to the total price, and I'm thinking of building it sometime in March (maybe a little earlier/later?), as my friend is going to sell me the 970 after he buys a 1080ti when they come out.

i can always build it earlier minus the GPU

#2089

Setsul

0 Frags – +

You also need a mobo that allows overclocking. Cooling + CPU/mobo price difference works out to around 150$, assuming you'd get an i7-7700 if you're not overclocking. ~20% performance difference once overclocked. i7-7700K overclocking vs not overclocking would be a difference of ~100$ in price and 10-15% in performance.

By March Zen might be an option. We'll see in late February.

I don't see the 1080 Ti being released in March. Maybe April or May, but as long as there is no danger of Vega being released nVidia would rather ride out the 1200$ price tag on the Titan X as long as possible.

You also need a mobo that allows overclocking. Cooling + CPU/mobo price difference works out to around 150$, assuming you'd get an i7-7700 if you're not overclocking. ~20% performance difference once overclocked. i7-7700K overclocking vs not overclocking would be a difference of ~100$ in price and 10-15% in performance.

By March Zen might be an option. We'll see in late February.

I don't see the 1080 Ti being released in March. Maybe April or May, but as long as there is no danger of Vega being released nVidia would rather ride out the 1200$ price tag on the Titan X as long as possible.

#2090

toads_tf

0 Frags – +

Based off what you've said, I'm probably going to go without the overclocking and go for a i7-7700. Not to worried about the prices on the processor.

If that's the case with the 1080ti, I'll probably build it a little bit sooner and most likely spend more money on the GPU to get a proper one from a store/online instead of buying my friend's. Because of that, I'll also probably spend a little less money on the other parts. There's a gtx 970 at the local Fry's for 200 dollars, if you have a more cost-effective suggestion I'd like to hear it, I honestly don't know the first thing about this stuff.

So, excluding the CPU, my budget's around 500-600 dollars for the rest of the parts. Looking for a decent sized HDD, 16 gigs of ram, and a GPU that can pull its weight on a lot of fairly recent games. But other than I'm interested in having a little money left over for a nice monitor a bit further down the road, so as long as they work I'm okay with going a tad on the cheaper side.

Based off what you've said, I'm probably going to go without the overclocking and go for a i7-7700. Not to worried about the prices on the processor.

If that's the case with the 1080ti, I'll probably build it a little bit sooner and most likely spend more money on the GPU to get a proper one from a store/online instead of buying my friend's. Because of that, I'll also probably spend a little less money on the other parts. There's a gtx 970 at the local Fry's for 200 dollars, if you have a more cost-effective suggestion I'd like to hear it, I honestly don't know the first thing about this stuff.

So, excluding the CPU, my budget's around 500-600 dollars for the rest of the parts. Looking for a decent sized HDD, 16 gigs of ram, and a GPU that can pull its weight on a lot of fairly recent games. But other than I'm interested in having a little money left over for a nice monitor a bit further down the road, so as long as they work I'm okay with going a tad on the cheaper side.

#2091

Setsul

0 Frags – +

An RX 480 or GTX 1060 would probably be better.
I'd wait at least until February to see how Zen turns out.

#2092

Admirable

2 Frags – +

I'm ready to nut. My old PC is dying. Gonna gut it, keeping only the 250GB Samsung 840 PRO and the GTX 960 (which I might upgrade in a month or two to something stupid like a GTX1080)

Here are the parts I picked out, gonna pull the trigger in the next 24 hours as my old PC keeps intermittently locking and has had a good run at 6 years.

http://i.imgur.com/Y5L2BLT.png

RAM kits is 3466MHz CL16-18-18-36 (CMK16GX4M4B3466C16R), 16GB (4x4GB) Corsair Vengeance DDR4LPX Red

Related thread on Twitter featuring the legendary barcaphilip https://twitter.com/AdmirablePlayer/status/827653964749533185

Would intend to overclock the 7700K because I'm a macho man.

Your thoughts please :>

I'm ready to nut. My old PC is dying. Gonna gut it, keeping only the 250GB Samsung 840 PRO and the GTX 960 (which I might upgrade in a month or two to something stupid like a GTX1080)

Here are the parts I picked out, gonna pull the trigger in the next 24 hours as my old PC keeps intermittently locking and has had a good run at 6 years.

[img]http://i.imgur.com/Y5L2BLT.png[/img]

RAM kits is 3466MHz CL16-18-18-36 (CMK16GX4M4B3466C16R), 16GB (4x4GB) Corsair Vengeance DDR4LPX Red

Related thread on Twitter featuring the legendary barcaphilip https://twitter.com/AdmirablePlayer/status/827653964749533185

Would intend to overclock the 7700K because I'm a macho man.

Your thoughts please :>

#2093

Setsul

2 Frags – +

LOL at Hovering Umlaut, that's not how any of this works. Go with 2x8GB.
3466MHz is also a bit overkill, but if it's not much more expensive why not.

H100i v2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31g0YE61PLQ

http://www.teamfortress.tv/12714/pc-build-thread/?page=19#557

Zen is a thing and it's a thing probably coming at GDC this year (27.02. - 03.03.) so don't say I didn't warn you.

LOL at Hovering Umlaut, that's not how any of this works. Go with 2x8GB.
3466MHz is also a bit overkill, but if it's not much more expensive why not.

H100i v2
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31g0YE61PLQ[/youtube]
http://www.teamfortress.tv/12714/pc-build-thread/?page=19#557

Zen is a thing and it's a thing probably coming at GDC this year (27.02. - 03.03.) so don't say I didn't warn you.

#2094

Admirable

0 Frags – +

Thanks, based Setsul!

Is the NH-D15 still the best option for cooling?

What would the benefit of waiting for Zen be? More bang for my buck?

Thanks, based Setsul!

Is the NH-D15 still the best option for cooling?

What would the benefit of waiting for Zen be? More bang for my buck?

#2095

toads_tf

0 Frags – +

quick question

what are the prices for the motherboards with the new zen am4 socket going to be like when zen does come out? I may get an AMD cpu because of zen but if the prices will be too much on the mobo side of things i may not

quick question

what are the prices for the motherboards with the new zen am4 socket going to be like when zen does come out? I may get an AMD cpu because of zen but if the prices will be too much on the mobo side of things i may not

#2096

Setsul

0 Frags – +

#2095
Well best option implies you'll actually need it.
However where the NH-D15 shines and really wipes the floor with aios is >150W, better >200W. Even overclocked an i7-7700K won't draw that much.

http://www.coolingtechnique.com/img/rece/dissipatori/noctua/nh-d15/nh-d15-stock.png

Yes, Zen would most likely be more band for buck, especially if the 6 cores are reasonably priced. Would be great for streaming and I'm assuming that's why you went with the i7 instead of the i5.

#2096
Depends on what you want exactly. I don't expect it to be more expensive but overclocking mobos are going to be similarly priced to Z270 mobos.

#2095
Well best option implies you'll actually need it.
However where the NH-D15 shines and really wipes the floor with aios is >150W, better >200W. Even overclocked an i7-7700K won't draw that much.
[img]http://www.coolingtechnique.com/img/rece/dissipatori/noctua/nh-d15/nh-d15-stock.png[/img]

So even a cheaper cooler would be more than enough.
Could you tell me which shop you're using? The list of candidates is a bit long otherwise.
Single tower coolers will be a bit quieter, dual towers will be a bit cooler especially at higher wattages (although as I've said you won't really get into that territory).
http://skinflint.co.uk/cryorig-h5-universal-cr-5ha-a1147852.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/be-quiet-dark-rock-advanced-c1-bk014-a598939.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/enermax-ets-t50-axe-ets-t50a-bvt-a1491128.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/be-quiet-dark-rock-3-bk018-a1054331.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/cryorig-h5-ultimate-cr-h5b-a1353135.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/raijintek-tisis-0r100001-a1066542.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/noctua-nh-u14s-a929404.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/phanteks-ph-tc12dx-white-ph-tc12dx-a885279.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/noctua-nh-d14-a478667.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/phanteks-ph-tc14pe-bk-black-a757982.html?hloc=uk
http://skinflint.co.uk/be-quiet-dark-rock-pro-3-bk019-a1054341.html?hloc=uk

Yes, Zen would most likely be more band for buck, especially if the 6 cores are reasonably priced. Would be great for streaming and I'm assuming that's why you went with the i7 instead of the i5.

#2096
Depends on what you want exactly. I don't expect it to be more expensive but overclocking mobos are going to be similarly priced to Z270 mobos.

#2097

Admirable

0 Frags – +

Thanks for the advice. Here's what I bought in the end:

£94.76 - BeQuiet 600 W Straight 10 Modular Power Supply Unit
£51.08 - Be Quiet! Dark Rock Advanced CPU Cooler - BK014
£112.99 - ASUS PRIME Z270-P Intel Kaby Lake ATX Motherboard
£109.99 - Corsair Vengeance LPX red DIMM kit 16GB
£366.00 - Intel Core i7 7700K 4.2GHz Kaby Lake Processor - Unlocked

Total: £734.82

I could have saved £50 with an i7-6700K and £45 on a cheaper PSU, but sometimes I just like to ball out.

Bought the PSU on Amazon and everything else from Aria-PC.

I was very close to just buying the PSU and waiting to see what happens with Zen, but questionable decision making has characterised my life and I don't intended to stop now. Thanks again :D

Thanks for the advice. Here's what I bought in the end:

£94.76 - BeQuiet 600 W Straight 10 Modular Power Supply Unit
£51.08 - Be Quiet! Dark Rock Advanced CPU Cooler - BK014
£112.99 - ASUS PRIME Z270-P Intel Kaby Lake ATX Motherboard
£109.99 - Corsair Vengeance LPX red DIMM kit 16GB
£366.00 - Intel Core i7 7700K 4.2GHz Kaby Lake Processor - Unlocked

Total: £734.82

I could have saved £50 with an i7-6700K and £45 on a cheaper PSU, but sometimes I just like to ball out.

Bought the PSU on Amazon and everything else from Aria-PC.

I was very close to just buying the PSU and waiting to see what happens with Zen, but questionable decision making has characterised my life and I don't intended to stop now. Thanks again :D

#2098

krub4s

0 Frags – +

just another quick question, will an i7 6800k benefit over an i7 7700k in a single pc stream setup? what else does it benefit over? I can afford both types of builds so price doesn't matter to me.

i also plan on streaming h1z1 and csgo if that matters

just another quick question, will an i7 6800k benefit over an i7 7700k in a single pc stream setup? what else does it benefit over? I can afford both types of builds so price doesn't matter to me.

i also plan on streaming h1z1 and csgo if that matters

#2099

Setsul

2 Frags – +

#2098
Come on, why did you change the PSU? 650W was overkill but at least the G2 is a very good PSU. You just bought a 50£ PSU for 100£. PSUs are always overpriced on Amazon.
It's Amazon so you should still be able to return it and get a 550 or 650W G2 instead. Yes, 550W would be plenty.

#2099
Yes, a bit.
Anything that uses more than 8 threads.
You will probably regret buying one right before the Zen release though.
Don't forget the added mobo cost.

#2098
Come on, why did you change the PSU? 650W was overkill but at least the G2 is a very good PSU. You just bought a 50£ PSU for 100£. PSUs are always overpriced on Amazon.
It's Amazon so you should still be able to return it and get a 550 or 650W G2 instead. Yes, 550W would be plenty.

#2099
Yes, a bit.
Anything that uses more than 8 threads.
You will probably regret buying one right before the Zen release though.
Don't forget the added mobo cost.

#2100

Admirable

2 Frags – +

Sorry sir :D