I don't think the average tftv forum goer should have much input in the future rules of 6v6

heavy boxing fight on mid

Perhaps so, but I see no harm in collecting the data. Who doesn't love data?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pj-qBUWOYfE

I dunno about other nerds, but I'd gladly play a best of three every match with each match potentially taking an hour.

My body is ready.

am i 15-18 or 18-21 i don't know help pls, i need to choose one

Having too many data areas and not enough participants will lead to some odd results.

Also, no mediguns allowed ever

Awesome I was going to do something like this, but I think you have it covered!

Thought about something while doing the poll:
Which map type do you prefer playing the most as a competitive player?
A)5cp (cp_badlands, cp_process)
B)Koth (koth_viaduct, koth_coalplant)
C)A/D (cp_gravelpit, cp_ediface)

Which map type do you like to spectate on the most?
A)5cp (cp_badlands, cp_process)
B)Koth (koth_viaduct, koth_coalplant)
C)A/D (cp_gravelpit, cp_ediface)

I don't know why, but I think that might add a few nice stats that can be helpful for your poll.

not gonna lie, i really do like the euro ruleset better. the only thing i don't like about it is that you dont switch teams and not all maps are perfectly symmetric.

But team switching is one of the main constraints of the NA ruleset really, at least for leagues with no self developed client, which is 99% of them.

Logs will get messed up, no automatic way of doing it because no official client and overall very confusing and scrappy.

The main map which relied on this was granary anyway and it was mostly fixed on that big update a couple months ago.

i know, i said i like the euro ruleset better

playing both sides is slightly more balanced though

Good job. Interested in the results.

Say what you want here:
Unlocks are part of the game, we need them!

About the ruleset, I strongly think the EU timelimit ruleset makes it much more exiting to watch and much easier to watch. The NA ruleset is much more complicated (especially for new players and viewers). Half-time is a map change, but I'm fine with having a short pause when the timer hits 15 minutes if that's what people want? Maybe we can ask Valve to implant some simple half-time system?
30 min is just also much easier to manage, since you know roughly it's going to take 20-30 minutes. With NA it can range from 10 minutes up to an hour, making it a disaster to manage for everyone. "I have only 35 minutes .. can I do a mix?" (and the LAN situations, casters ... even spectators)

Edit: Half-time system by Valve might not even be a bad idea. But how should this work? Timelimit 30 with halftimesystem 1 -> making the timelimit 15 and then switch sides -> ready up and do another 15 minutes (half the timelimit set or half points scored to win, automatically generated by this system)? Scoreboard still has the rounds scored from last half.

This poll does not allow for some options which I exclusively desire.

Just for the record na people don't mix/pug with esea rules, they play with timelimit 30 iirc.

The pug can be extending, depends on how fun it is. A pause for a half or switching sides is silly for pugs.

It is indeed. But is it not also silly to play a completely different ruleset in pugs / lobbies / mixes than you do in "normal" competitive games?

no? goal is to win the round regardless is it not?

Is switching sides sensible for league games?

yes because it makes the game as fair as possible because not all maps are perfectly symmetrical and maybe one color is easier to see or whatever the case may be.

in a pug no one cares about fairness/winning that much.

it also adds a small pause for bathroom or strat or whatever. (I think this is good)

its like saying pugs aren't played bo3 so we shouldn't play matches bo3. lol

Not saying that, it's just that the ruleset for pugs in NA seems to be completely different from league or scrim ruleset?
You could just add a half-time to the way pugs work instead of completely changing the timelimit, score system etc.. Or the other way around...

I was never really much of a fan of pledge, but he did a great job at that fully charged episode. He kept an open mind and the discussion going.

I find the "highlight" of the discussion to be the best option:
2 halves (benefit of half time)
20-25 minutes per half (time pressure, 1 hour is too long)
1 map per week for etfl2 and the aussie league (allows teams to scrim 1 map per week)
some middle ground between etf2l and esea unlocks (the quickfix situation was handled poorly)

If it were my dream situation:

We'd play 2 30 minute halves with best of threes being played consecutively (win limit 5, 3 for half). If you wanted to play like a wuss and spend 3+ hours of your life on Tf2, then, by all means, enjoy. Instead of 8 maps we'd have a pool of 6 with each team eliminating 3 (the team that doesn't get a second map pick would get to pick which map is played first, loser picks second, loser picks third).

Then if people could actually handle that, we'd just dispense with "seasons" as they exist now and go to bracket play - which would allow teams to die and reform constantly like they want to as your season could be over the first 1-3 weeks (if you get dumpstered in your first group). Seasons would also happen a lot more rapidly.

But that's just a dream :(

This actually sounds freakin amazing for someone like me who's always playing this game anyways, but I'm sure a lot of people can't dedicate that much time to matches in a single night (against evenly matched teams, you're looking at probably 90 minutes minimum, that's a long time to be focusing on playing tf2 at your best)

Also unless I'm misunderstanding, this makes the LAN situation difficult or impossible, yeah? Or are you proposing this system be set up for all divisions besides invite?

there's no option for winning at first to 5, only best of 5 and 5 rounds ahead

up front: i do not play competitive tf2 at all -- either 6s or Highlander. if i found tf2 when i was in college or grad school, things would be different but i just do not have the time now. i do make time to watch as much TF2 content as possible -- from Fully Charged to TFTV casts to TFTV EU games to random HL games that are casted either on TFTV or POV (such as xalox's casts in the HL Nations cup)

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i am not saying it should be a huge consideration (if you totally ignore players you lose your player base) but ignoring the viewers/casual in these kinds of discussions (rule/map sets) are one of the things that keep TF2 from growing

example: look, i understand many players do not like gravelpit...but if viewers love it and it is not difficult to cast -- can't that be considered? let's be honest, a casual viewer DOES NOT enjoy watching a match of cp_metalworks. they have not played it, they do not know the map and it not particularly enjoyable to watch.

am i saying that comp tf2 should stick to maps played in pubs? heck no! cp_process is a great example of a map that has been played in 6s that (thanks to becoming an official map) is now played in a ton of pubs and is not particularly difficult to understand.

i do think that the standardization of rulesets/mapsets would be beneficial for casual viewers (and would help bring more people into the game) -- but focusing only on the thoughts of only those currently in 6s when these kinds of discussions occur will do nothing to help the game grow.

If you're not playing you shouldn't have an opinion.

...and 6s players wonder why viewers and players are streaming to HL

You don't play the game, you don't have a functioning understanding of what makes the game work, why do you get to have an opinion? It's fun to watch isn't an argument for how to determine a rule-set. Golf sure would be a lot more fun if major tournaments were held on mini-golf courses, it's a test of skill, why don't we do that?

You can watch and play all the highlander you want, it's never going to even so much as have a lan event. Not to mention that probably the top 5 most viewed TF2 events are all involve 6s play.