calm down. it's probably just hats

as much as i love the idea of matchmaking with both or either of the comp formats, i'm not exactly excited to play against the Pomson/short circuit in any of them. valve has more to do than just making a lobby system if they expect it to be fun.

Like listen don't get me wrong, I think a focus on Spy vs. Engi is shit too, but this is the game we play. There are 9 classes. Think of this from Valve's perspective. They can't just forget about classes.. they're part of the game. We already previously had a War update for Soldier vs. Demo, two competitive classes. Unfortunately, we have to accept that as a competitive sixes community, we are not Valve's main audience or concern.

No one said it would be focused around HL. Highlander seems like the best idea for competitive since it uses all classes and almost no weapon bans which is highly similar to a pub which valves wants, that's why some people think it will be HL that will be added. But most people suggest it will be Arena respawn, since there are no class limit and no weapon ban.

I'd be pissed if after 17 seasons of ESEA alone, 3 community funded international LANs, and 7 years of 6's Valve picks a brand new game mode for their lobbies because "it's new and different." No disrespect to Arena Respawn, it looks fun, but picking an untested format over something the community has created and maintained for years would be a pretty shitty move.

please optimize the ga-haha

couldn't say it with a straight face.

if its arena respawn this game is actually dead.

unnecessary damage control

have you ever met an engi/spy main?

99% of engie mains are aware their class is shit and play it out of self-hatred and because they know they're not good enough to find a team as scout

99% of spy mains think their class is the best ever and spend their time compiling pub frag movies and coming up with new names for trickstabs

don't worry about it

the best players have the red ubered spy avatar

real talk

If Overwatch takes off (not saying it will), then Valve may have to bring out some sort of matchmaking with smaller teams just to keep the game going.

People aren't just gonna stop playing this game because another one that comes out that looks similar to TF2 "takes off"

even if competitive matchmaking does come to tf2, im 99% sure 6v6 wont be recognized or supported for at least another year after the system makes its first debut, considers ourselves lucky if its HL.

Id put my money on some new format that valve sees fit for comp tf2 revolving around item bans, for all we know it could be competitive pubs 12v12 lol

We won't, but casual players might. Especially if Overwatch happens to be F2P. The competitive community cannot support the game on its own in its current state.

Traders might somehow keep this game going even when player numbers are decreasing, though.

HL is at least already built into the game. We don't play it with mp_highlander enabled (class switching and such), but the command is there.

Valve could launch HL MM first and refine the system until just before Overwatch's release, and then they release 6v6 MM. I don't have much hope for them supporting us after this long, though I highly doubt they would even attempt 12v12 matchmaking. If Valve has any intention of promoting TF2 as a competitive game, the player count needs to be 10 or 12 ideally. HL might be able to work with effort, but 12v12... I don't see a way of making that competitive. MM for that would be the exact same as pubs.

lol like valve actually cares about 6s

This update will remove Spy and Engie so we can play sixes with matchmaking :)

EDIT: Joking it'll be AR

do you always quote things without reading them

also you're all pretty misguided if you think valve doesn't care about 6s.

Pretty sure you're all quoting some conversation that was never recorded or documented and paraphrased by Sal.

The TF2 team isn't retarded. Sure they might have changed the focus of the game from a shooter to an f2p shooter with hats but they know the more items they add the more money theyll make.

Dota is competitive, it has a mm system, every game you go in on the same footing as everyone else, same with csgo. I refuse to believe they'd make an open whitelist tf2 matchmaking with any sort of legitimacy.

I hope they don't prove me wrong, but questioning valve's intelligence or support for the game is not the way to go. The tf2 team has always listened when competitive players make suggestions, they supported TF2Lobby and even offered FLOOR_MASTER a job at valve after he coded it up.

Valve has never "let us down" when it really comes down it. They've had their fluke patches but I just hope at the end of the day we can look back and be like wow, they saved tf2.

It's not that they don't care, they just fuck us over because literally everything but 6s has higher priority to them. When they make updates, NONE of the content is competitive related, and they don't seem to test anything related to comp. For example, the BASE jumper would crash random players something like 5-10 times in a match, but since it only happened in tournament mode, valve somehow missed it and didn't get around to fixing it for a few days.

If this was crashing pub servers it never would've been released like that.

You cant blame them for caring for their game more than they care for what people made of their game, obviously they are not gonna playtest every item around competitive because TF2 was made to be a fun game at first.

I don't mind being lower on the priority list, but they simply don't test comp at all. Not even about balance, I mean that the new weapon literally didn't work in tournament mode, and they didn't notice this.

There's a difference between being second class and not being a concern of theirs. To their credit, they will fix reported bugs if they can.

you say they fix reported bugs
you know that invisible players bug
like, where the enemy people you are supposed to shoot don't actually appear on your screen
the models just aren't there
yeah i still get that

here we go with the invisible players complaint again. this has either become some type of meme or some people honestly believe they haven't acknowledged it.

clearly they haven't solved that one yet

To be honest you shouldn't expect either of those weapons to affect highlander that much, if at all. I personally consider the Pomson terrible and not worth using: if you're running level 3 sentries you'll want the rescue ranger, and if you're on offence with minis literally any of the shotguns is more useful. I won't trade half of my DPS for a gimmicky uber removal device. The short circuit... yeah, it could see some uses, but only with minis. I don't really see the point in running level 3 without a wrangler.

I understand why the weapons are banned but if they are allowed in 9v9 matchmaking I doubt they'll make a big difference to the game. Besides I don't think matchmaking is something to be taken very seriously... you have ETF2L and UGC for that. Honestly when/if MM comes out I'll grind it for long enough to achieve a high rank (assuming there are ranks) as my favourite class and leave it at that.

If you somehow think that the short circuit with lvl 3 sentry would not utterly break the game and make the engineer a god tier class you need a brain scan.

I think there are tons of times when a pomson does as much as a shotgun.
1. Long range spam, you're hitting for mid 20s instead of like 6s or 9s. And you've got 10% uber advantage on every medic hit.
2. Fighting scouts or spies close range is easier, because the projectile will hit for full damage (like 60s) with a large hitbox rather than pellet spread making it hard to do full damage against a slender target.
3. Any time you fight a spy, he can't dead ring, and he probably won't succeed in cloaking away. And the dead ringer is so obnoxiously effective when they only play the flank to avoid the pyro and refuse to ever die.

Since the engineer is a support class that plays with a sentry at his side at all times, a little loss in close combat 1v1 capability is not significant, because he's got his flank with him on 5cp or the combo with him on payload. I'd consider it an upgrade in low level competitive, but in high level comp lots of good engineers would still get more done with the shotgun.

you're kind of a dick

Hey you guys remember when they unnerfed demo because we complained
Yeah valve pays attention

That was more because it made pubs unplayable due to heavies and wrangled level 3s.