i didnt grow up at all from playing this game, fuck
Lange's thoughts on the state of competitive TF2
posted in
TF2 General Discussion
I just miss the djc and cbear duo :(
we´re never replacing that
I just miss the djc and cbear duo :(
we´re never replacing that
we´re never replacing that
@clckwrk
Feel free to invite me to some invite pugs or whatever some time =)
Are you done as well? If so, man its sad seeing so much top talent leaving the scene. However, I know there are players out there who will get to that level and we will continue to have top level tf2 because we're still playing this damn game just because it's fun.
@tf2isdeadppl
"tf2center"By the time I write this, we have almost reached 55,000 players in our database. Although this is a big achievement, this will also pose some “challenges” for us
Thats a lot of people who all have the possibility to be the next amazing tf2 player/caster/streamer/plugin-dev.
@lange
Thanks for what you've done for tf2. You've made a huge impact in the community and it's sad to see the realization of your dream not come into reality. However, please know that so many look up to what you provided that making a video such as this may just very contribute to damaging the overall competitive tf2 scene. Your words were emotionally charged and we can tell you loved the game, however know that you are not the nail in the coffin of the death of tf2. There will be those who play until the last 12 players get in a server and hit f4 to ready up.
Now.. Can the community stop being so depressed about illusions of grandeur and just play some tf2?
[b]@clckwrk[/b]
[quote]Feel free to invite me to some invite pugs or whatever some time =)[/quote]
Are you done as well? If so, man its sad seeing so much top talent leaving the scene. However, I know there are players out there who will get to that level and we will continue to have top level tf2 because we're still playing this damn game just because it's fun.
[b]@tf2isdeadppl[/b]
[quote="tf2center"]By the time I write this, we have almost reached 55,000 players in our database. Although this is a big achievement, this will also pose some “challenges” for us[/quote]
Thats a lot of people who all have the possibility to be the next amazing tf2 player/caster/streamer/plugin-dev.
[b]@lange[/b]
Thanks for what you've done for tf2. You've made a huge impact in the community and it's sad to see the realization of your dream not come into reality. However, please know that so many look up to what you provided that making a video such as this may just very contribute to damaging the overall competitive tf2 scene. Your words were emotionally charged and we can tell you loved the game, however know that you are not the nail in the coffin of the death of tf2. There will be those who play until the last 12 players get in a server and hit f4 to ready up.
Now.. Can the community stop being so depressed about illusions of grandeur and just play some tf2?
[quote]Feel free to invite me to some invite pugs or whatever some time =)[/quote]
Are you done as well? If so, man its sad seeing so much top talent leaving the scene. However, I know there are players out there who will get to that level and we will continue to have top level tf2 because we're still playing this damn game just because it's fun.
[b]@tf2isdeadppl[/b]
[quote="tf2center"]By the time I write this, we have almost reached 55,000 players in our database. Although this is a big achievement, this will also pose some “challenges” for us[/quote]
Thats a lot of people who all have the possibility to be the next amazing tf2 player/caster/streamer/plugin-dev.
[b]@lange[/b]
Thanks for what you've done for tf2. You've made a huge impact in the community and it's sad to see the realization of your dream not come into reality. However, please know that so many look up to what you provided that making a video such as this may just very contribute to damaging the overall competitive tf2 scene. Your words were emotionally charged and we can tell you loved the game, however know that you are not the nail in the coffin of the death of tf2. There will be those who play until the last 12 players get in a server and hit f4 to ready up.
Now.. Can the community stop being so depressed about illusions of grandeur and just play some tf2?
vibhavpEven if we dont make it to the mega-grand stage of esports, the fact that, as Lange himself said in the GXL outro video:Lange we can unite over the fact that we love this game and the community so much that we're willing to spend our own resources *just to share it with people*, maybe that's enough.And as long as we continue to do it, competitive TF2 will go a loooong way. Im pretty sure 2015 will be a bigger blast, so if anyone thinks they're done with the game, you're going to miss something really good :D
The GXL outro video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3c2b6KRyHE, Lange's part starts at 5:18.
Threw this together when I saw the vid the first time, feel like it's pretty relevant now.
[quote=vibhavp]Even if we dont make it to the mega-grand stage of esports, the fact that, as Lange himself said in the GXL outro video: [quote=Lange] we can unite over the fact that we love this game and the community so much that we're willing to spend our own resources *just to share it with people*, maybe that's enough. [/quote]
And as long as we continue to do it, competitive TF2 will go a loooong way. Im pretty sure 2015 will be a bigger blast, so if anyone thinks they're done with the game, you're going to miss something really good :D
The GXL outro video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3c2b6KRyHE, Lange's part starts at 5:18.[/quote]
Threw this together when I saw the vid the first time, feel like it's pretty relevant now.
[img]http://i.imgur.com/5M1qS08.png[/img]
And as long as we continue to do it, competitive TF2 will go a loooong way. Im pretty sure 2015 will be a bigger blast, so if anyone thinks they're done with the game, you're going to miss something really good :D
The GXL outro video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3c2b6KRyHE, Lange's part starts at 5:18.[/quote]
Threw this together when I saw the vid the first time, feel like it's pretty relevant now.
[img]http://i.imgur.com/5M1qS08.png[/img]
if everyone took the time they spent debating whether or not the game was dying and actively used it to advertise or introduce new players to competitive tf2 the community would probably be competing with csgo for the 3rd largest modern esport.
and to elaborate on that, the games that are making it to this grand stage everybody likes to reference were all mods at one point. Dota was a custom map for a different game. Csgo started out just like our game as well. Those communities grew because of the hard work and dedication that people poured into the game the only difference is that the langes of dota or counter strike never gave up and look at what their games grew into.
if everyone took the time they spent debating whether or not the game was dying and actively used it to advertise or introduce new players to competitive tf2 the community would probably be competing with csgo for the 3rd largest modern esport.
and to elaborate on that, the games that are making it to this grand stage everybody likes to reference were all mods at one point. Dota was a custom map for a different game. Csgo started out just like our game as well. Those communities grew because of the hard work and dedication that people poured into the game the only difference is that the langes of dota or counter strike never gave up and look at what their games grew into.
and to elaborate on that, the games that are making it to this grand stage everybody likes to reference were all mods at one point. Dota was a custom map for a different game. Csgo started out just like our game as well. Those communities grew because of the hard work and dedication that people poured into the game the only difference is that the langes of dota or counter strike never gave up and look at what their games grew into.
WithADanceNumber@clckwrkFeel free to invite me to some invite pugs or whatever some time =)
Are you done as well? If so, man its sad seeing so much top talent leaving the scene. However, I know there are players out there who will get to that level and we will continue to have top level tf2 because we're still playing this damn game just because it's fun.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'm done. I mean, I've basically been done since before GXL. I barely ever play and really just barely carried out my scrimming responsibilities. The game doesn't do it for me much anymore and a lot of the reason is competition. It just feels like there's no incentive from most people to get better and reach the top. I think this has always been a small hiccup in the TF2 community, at least since several seasons ago. We ran into the same problem in the GXL thread, where on the second day of the event (the GXL tournament), some people were unhappy that top teams would be playing in it and would have preferred pugs to be made. That's because there are two contrasting ideas in this game. There are those who want to treat it like it's counter-strike (the way many top players would prefer) and those who treat it like it's high/drunk smash bros in your friends basement. At that same event, iBP won the CEVO event, and C9 won the GXL event. And I doubt there was much community pressure to get iBP and C9 and Denial or whoever else was there to not compete with their starting 6. It's just the way this game is.
Saltysally1if everyone took the time they spent debating whether or not the game was dying and actively used it to advertise or introduce new players to competitive tf2 the community would probably be competing with csgo for the 3rd largest modern esport.
also, no. First of all that's not our jobs to campaign competitive TF2. It's ridiculous. Secondly the 6s version of the game is very different from a pubbing perspective. I mean, maybe if we got the best marketers in the entire game to slave away at trying to sell this game, maybe it would grow a lot. But that's no one's responsibility and it's asking a lot. It certainly doesn't take 10 minutes to get people interested. And only 1 of those 3 would be sticking with it, anyway.
Also I'm gonna keep going on this rant because I think it's kind of insulting. You're almost implying there aren't people who have tried to introduce new people and advertise competitive TF2. All the work that's gone into streams, everything extv has done with competitive TF2, enigma creating this forum, the moderators and other web developers that maintain it. All of that is for this very reason, to not only create a hub for existing players, but to create a place for new players to go. This idea isn't a sandbox game where I can pull "3 people waiting to play comp game" out of my resources bag and spawn them. It takes time. It's also not a wikipedia advertisement about donating $3.
[quote=WithADanceNumber]@clckwrk
[quote]Feel free to invite me to some invite pugs or whatever some time =)[/quote]
Are you done as well? If so, man its sad seeing so much top talent leaving the scene. However, I know there are players out there who will get to that level and we will continue to have top level tf2 because we're still playing this damn game just because it's fun.
[/quote]
Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'm done. I mean, I've basically [i]been[/i] done since before GXL. I barely ever play and really just barely carried out my scrimming responsibilities. The game doesn't do it for me much anymore and a lot of the reason is competition. It just feels like there's no incentive from most people to get better and reach the top. I think this has always been a small hiccup in the TF2 community, at least since several seasons ago. We ran into the same problem in the GXL thread, where on the second day of the event (the GXL tournament), some people were unhappy that top teams would be playing in it and would have preferred pugs to be made. That's because there are two contrasting ideas in this game. There are those who want to treat it like it's counter-strike (the way many top players would prefer) and those who treat it like it's high/drunk smash bros in your friends basement. At that same event, iBP won the CEVO event, and C9 won the GXL event. And I doubt there was much community pressure to get iBP and C9 and Denial or whoever else was there to not compete with their starting 6. It's just the way this game is.
[quote=Saltysally1]if everyone took the time they spent debating whether or not the game was dying and actively used it to advertise or introduce new players to competitive tf2 the community would probably be competing with csgo for the 3rd largest modern esport.[/quote]
also, no. First of all that's not our jobs to campaign competitive TF2. It's ridiculous. Secondly the 6s version of the game is very different from a pubbing perspective. I mean, [i]maybe[/i] if we got the best marketers in the entire game to slave away at trying to sell this game, [i]maybe[/i] it would grow a lot. But that's no one's responsibility and it's asking a lot. It certainly doesn't take 10 minutes to get people interested. And only 1 of those 3 would be sticking with it, anyway.
Also I'm gonna keep going on this rant because I think it's kind of insulting. You're almost implying there aren't people who have tried to introduce new people and advertise competitive TF2. All the work that's gone into streams, everything extv has done with competitive TF2, enigma creating this forum, the moderators and other web developers that maintain it. All of that is for this very reason, to not only create a hub for existing players, but to create a place for new players to go. This idea isn't a sandbox game where I can pull "3 people waiting to play comp game" out of my resources bag and spawn them. It takes time. It's also not a wikipedia advertisement about donating $3.
[quote]Feel free to invite me to some invite pugs or whatever some time =)[/quote]
Are you done as well? If so, man its sad seeing so much top talent leaving the scene. However, I know there are players out there who will get to that level and we will continue to have top level tf2 because we're still playing this damn game just because it's fun.
[/quote]
Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'm done. I mean, I've basically [i]been[/i] done since before GXL. I barely ever play and really just barely carried out my scrimming responsibilities. The game doesn't do it for me much anymore and a lot of the reason is competition. It just feels like there's no incentive from most people to get better and reach the top. I think this has always been a small hiccup in the TF2 community, at least since several seasons ago. We ran into the same problem in the GXL thread, where on the second day of the event (the GXL tournament), some people were unhappy that top teams would be playing in it and would have preferred pugs to be made. That's because there are two contrasting ideas in this game. There are those who want to treat it like it's counter-strike (the way many top players would prefer) and those who treat it like it's high/drunk smash bros in your friends basement. At that same event, iBP won the CEVO event, and C9 won the GXL event. And I doubt there was much community pressure to get iBP and C9 and Denial or whoever else was there to not compete with their starting 6. It's just the way this game is.
[quote=Saltysally1]if everyone took the time they spent debating whether or not the game was dying and actively used it to advertise or introduce new players to competitive tf2 the community would probably be competing with csgo for the 3rd largest modern esport.[/quote]
also, no. First of all that's not our jobs to campaign competitive TF2. It's ridiculous. Secondly the 6s version of the game is very different from a pubbing perspective. I mean, [i]maybe[/i] if we got the best marketers in the entire game to slave away at trying to sell this game, [i]maybe[/i] it would grow a lot. But that's no one's responsibility and it's asking a lot. It certainly doesn't take 10 minutes to get people interested. And only 1 of those 3 would be sticking with it, anyway.
Also I'm gonna keep going on this rant because I think it's kind of insulting. You're almost implying there aren't people who have tried to introduce new people and advertise competitive TF2. All the work that's gone into streams, everything extv has done with competitive TF2, enigma creating this forum, the moderators and other web developers that maintain it. All of that is for this very reason, to not only create a hub for existing players, but to create a place for new players to go. This idea isn't a sandbox game where I can pull "3 people waiting to play comp game" out of my resources bag and spawn them. It takes time. It's also not a wikipedia advertisement about donating $3.
#159
honestly that thing with people not wanting to play invite teams @gxl was ridiculous. Why even play a game in a competitive format if you don't want to be the best. It makes no sense to me, however i'm really competitive and I don't see my self stopping till i've played at my very best. Once I get there , I don't know what my end game will be. Who knows maybe there will be nothing at the top level, it will be empty and there will be nothing more to learn. However for myself, and many others the journey to the top and to play as best as possible is what keeps us here.
Thanks for the inspiration. gg
#159
honestly that thing with people not wanting to play invite teams @gxl was ridiculous. Why even play a game in a competitive format if you don't want to be the best. It makes no sense to me, however i'm really competitive and I don't see my self stopping till i've played at my very best. Once I get there , I don't know what my end game will be. Who knows maybe there will be nothing at the top level, it will be empty and there will be nothing more to learn. However for myself, and many others the journey to the top and to play as best as possible is what keeps us here.
Thanks for the inspiration. gg
honestly that thing with people not wanting to play invite teams @gxl was ridiculous. Why even play a game in a competitive format if you don't want to be the best. It makes no sense to me, however i'm really competitive and I don't see my self stopping till i've played at my very best. Once I get there , I don't know what my end game will be. Who knows maybe there will be nothing at the top level, it will be empty and there will be nothing more to learn. However for myself, and many others the journey to the top and to play as best as possible is what keeps us here.
Thanks for the inspiration. gg
WithADanceNumber#159
honestly that thing with people not wanting to play invite teams @gxl was ridiculous. Why even play a game in a competitive format if you don't want to be the best. It makes no sense to me, however i'm really competitive and I don't see my self stopping till i've played at my very best. Once I get there , I don't know what my end game will be. Who knows maybe there will be nothing at the top level, it will be empty and there will be nothing more to learn. However for myself, and many others the journey to the top and to play as best as possible is what keeps us here.
Thanks for the inspiration. gg
Playing an invite team vs playing invite players are two different things. I can remain competitive against top players, but not against teams that have chemistry and co-ordination built over years of playing with each other compared to a team formed just that day.
[quote=WithADanceNumber]#159
honestly that thing with people not wanting to play invite teams @gxl was ridiculous. Why even play a game in a competitive format if you don't want to be the best. It makes no sense to me, however i'm really competitive and I don't see my self stopping till i've played at my very best. Once I get there , I don't know what my end game will be. Who knows maybe there will be nothing at the top level, it will be empty and there will be nothing more to learn. However for myself, and many others the journey to the top and to play as best as possible is what keeps us here.
Thanks for the inspiration. gg[/quote]
Playing an invite team vs playing invite players are two different things. I can remain competitive against top players, but not against teams that have chemistry and co-ordination built over years of playing with each other compared to a team formed just that day.
honestly that thing with people not wanting to play invite teams @gxl was ridiculous. Why even play a game in a competitive format if you don't want to be the best. It makes no sense to me, however i'm really competitive and I don't see my self stopping till i've played at my very best. Once I get there , I don't know what my end game will be. Who knows maybe there will be nothing at the top level, it will be empty and there will be nothing more to learn. However for myself, and many others the journey to the top and to play as best as possible is what keeps us here.
Thanks for the inspiration. gg[/quote]
Playing an invite team vs playing invite players are two different things. I can remain competitive against top players, but not against teams that have chemistry and co-ordination built over years of playing with each other compared to a team formed just that day.
WithADanceNumber#159
honestly that thing with people not wanting to play invite teams @gxl was ridiculous. Why even play a game in a competitive format if you don't want to be the best. It makes no sense to me, however i'm really competitive and I don't see my self stopping till i've played at my very best. Once I get there , I don't know what my end game will be. Who knows maybe there will be nothing at the top level, it will be empty and there will be nothing more to learn. However for myself, and many others the journey to the top and to play as best as possible is what keeps us here.
Thanks for the inspiration. gg
It's because the game is competitive but there's no monetary incentive to keep it afloat. So, like I said before, competitive TF2 is becoming more of just an idea, because it's not funded by anything big and thus doesn't have as much competition. Working your way up to that level without some sort of reason other than to be the best is hard for some people. Those players who wanted pug teams seriously just like the idea of competitive TF2. It's sort of like pubbing to them, just more organized and focused on the aspects they enjoy. But absolutely, your mindset is the one competitive tf2 needs and the journey all top players want to see other players taking. Thanks, I'm happy to have inspired anyone, and if you'd like you can add me and feel free to ask me questions
[quote=WithADanceNumber]#159
honestly that thing with people not wanting to play invite teams @gxl was ridiculous. Why even play a game in a competitive format if you don't want to be the best. It makes no sense to me, however i'm really competitive and I don't see my self stopping till i've played at my very best. Once I get there , I don't know what my end game will be. Who knows maybe there will be nothing at the top level, it will be empty and there will be nothing more to learn. However for myself, and many others the journey to the top and to play as best as possible is what keeps us here.
Thanks for the inspiration. gg[/quote]
It's because the game is competitive but there's no monetary incentive to keep it afloat. So, like I said before, competitive TF2 is becoming more of just an idea, because it's not funded by anything big and thus doesn't have as much competition. Working your way up to that level without some sort of reason other than to be the best is hard for some people. Those players who wanted pug teams seriously just like the idea of competitive TF2. It's sort of like pubbing to them, just more organized and focused on the aspects they enjoy. But absolutely, your mindset is the one competitive tf2 needs and the journey all top players want to see other players taking. Thanks, I'm happy to have inspired anyone, and if you'd like you can add me and feel free to ask me questions
honestly that thing with people not wanting to play invite teams @gxl was ridiculous. Why even play a game in a competitive format if you don't want to be the best. It makes no sense to me, however i'm really competitive and I don't see my self stopping till i've played at my very best. Once I get there , I don't know what my end game will be. Who knows maybe there will be nothing at the top level, it will be empty and there will be nothing more to learn. However for myself, and many others the journey to the top and to play as best as possible is what keeps us here.
Thanks for the inspiration. gg[/quote]
It's because the game is competitive but there's no monetary incentive to keep it afloat. So, like I said before, competitive TF2 is becoming more of just an idea, because it's not funded by anything big and thus doesn't have as much competition. Working your way up to that level without some sort of reason other than to be the best is hard for some people. Those players who wanted pug teams seriously just like the idea of competitive TF2. It's sort of like pubbing to them, just more organized and focused on the aspects they enjoy. But absolutely, your mindset is the one competitive tf2 needs and the journey all top players want to see other players taking. Thanks, I'm happy to have inspired anyone, and if you'd like you can add me and feel free to ask me questions
honestly the people complaining about playing against invite teams rather than invite pug teams would have gotten beaten by the pug teams too. at least this way you can say you were beat by one of the top teams not just some hodgepodge of really good players. iunno
i'm gonna miss everyone that's leaving, but i feel like it's not going to be as significant as a lot of people are saying it will be. just like when relic and co. left or when extv took that break. there will always be people to fill in the gaps over time. next season might be kinda shitty but whatever. let's just play some video games kids.
honestly the people complaining about playing against invite teams rather than invite pug teams would have gotten beaten by the pug teams too. at least this way you can say you were beat by one of the top teams not just some hodgepodge of really good players. iunno
i'm gonna miss everyone that's leaving, but i feel like it's not going to be as significant as a lot of people are saying it will be. just like when relic and co. left or when extv took that break. there will always be people to fill in the gaps over time. next season might be kinda shitty but whatever. let's just play some video games kids.
i'm gonna miss everyone that's leaving, but i feel like it's not going to be as significant as a lot of people are saying it will be. just like when relic and co. left or when extv took that break. there will always be people to fill in the gaps over time. next season might be kinda shitty but whatever. let's just play some video games kids.
i had fun playing against invite teams, and im glad i played them, but i think i remember something the fragile said in the original GXL post about LAN teams not being allowed to play with the same teams that they played with in the CEVO event. If that was never a rule, more of a suggestion, so be it. Just thought that was where a few of the complaints couldve come from.
i had fun playing against invite teams, and im glad i played them, but i think i remember something the fragile said in the original GXL post about LAN teams not being allowed to play with the same teams that they played with in the CEVO event. If that was never a rule, more of a suggestion, so be it. Just thought that was where a few of the complaints couldve come from.
I too had a good time playing against the top teams. The game we had against Mix^ was honestly over so fast I barely even had time to process what we were doing wrong, but against Street Hoops (and the other pug teams with invite players) it was actually a lot of fun to see exactly how we stood up against that top level talent.
I think people were just nervous. It was fun for everyone who was actually there.
I too had a good time playing against the top teams. The game we had against Mix^ was honestly over so fast I barely even had time to process what we were doing wrong, but against Street Hoops (and the other pug teams with invite players) it was actually a lot of fun to see exactly how we stood up against that top level talent.
I think people were just nervous. It was fun for everyone who was actually there.
I think people were just nervous. It was fun for everyone who was actually there.
clckwrk#162
It's because the game is competitive but there's no monetary incentive to keep it afloat. So, like I said before, competitive TF2 is becoming more of just an idea, because it's not funded by anything big and thus doesn't have as much competition. Working your way up to that level without some sort of reason other than to be the best is hard for some people. Those players who wanted pug teams seriously just like the idea of competitive TF2. It's sort of like pubbing to them, just more organized and focused on the aspects they enjoy. But absolutely, your mindset is the one competitive tf2 needs and the journey all top players want to see other players taking. Thanks, I'm happy to have inspired anyone, and if you'd like you can add me and feel free to ask me questions
I have to agree with this so so much. Teams like Street Hoops with incredibly talented players have worked so hard to make it into that top 4 Invite bubble in only a handful of seasons and that's why I admire them so much, but closing that huge gap to consistently contest for 1st place against teams with players that have the advantage of so many years of Invite experience takes a ludicrous amount of time that people can't commit.
There's not enough money involved to justify spending 30-40 hours a week playing catch-up to out-practice established teams. It's not that our scene has a lack of hardcore competitive players desiring to make the top - a lot of players with that drive rightfully question whether it's worth so much time and effort. It's just not.
This is why I'm actually happy to see veterans like yourself take their leave from the game, not out of dislike but out of respect for the next generation of top players. I hope you have a good one. Are we going to see the absolute pinnacle of 6v6 like Froyo during the i-Series? No, but that's not the point. I'm so glad there will spots open for up and coming players to step up to the top level with the strong likelihood of closer games and more competitive seasons ahead. I've always thought the scene needed more new blood instead of the constant praising of the old.
[quote=clckwrk]#162
It's because the game is competitive but there's no monetary incentive to keep it afloat. So, like I said before, competitive TF2 is becoming more of just an idea, because it's not funded by anything big and thus doesn't have as much competition. Working your way up to that level without some sort of reason other than to be the best is hard for some people. Those players who wanted pug teams seriously just like the idea of competitive TF2. It's sort of like pubbing to them, just more organized and focused on the aspects they enjoy. But absolutely, your mindset is the one competitive tf2 needs and the journey all top players want to see other players taking. Thanks, I'm happy to have inspired anyone, and if you'd like you can add me and feel free to ask me questions[/quote]
I have to agree with this so so much. Teams like Street Hoops with incredibly talented players have worked so hard to make it into that top 4 Invite bubble in only a handful of seasons and that's why I admire them so much, but closing that huge gap to consistently contest for 1st place against teams with players that have the advantage of so many years of Invite experience takes a ludicrous amount of time that people can't commit.
There's not enough money involved to justify spending 30-40 hours a week playing catch-up to out-practice established teams. It's not that our scene has a lack of hardcore competitive players desiring to make the top - a lot of players with that drive rightfully question whether it's worth so much time and effort. It's just not.
This is why I'm actually happy to see veterans like yourself take their leave from the game, not out of dislike but out of respect for the next generation of top players. I hope you have a good one. Are we going to see the absolute pinnacle of 6v6 like Froyo during the i-Series? No, but that's not the point. I'm so glad there will spots open for up and coming players to step up to the top level with the strong likelihood of closer games and more competitive seasons ahead. I've always thought the scene needed more new blood instead of the constant praising of the old.
It's because the game is competitive but there's no monetary incentive to keep it afloat. So, like I said before, competitive TF2 is becoming more of just an idea, because it's not funded by anything big and thus doesn't have as much competition. Working your way up to that level without some sort of reason other than to be the best is hard for some people. Those players who wanted pug teams seriously just like the idea of competitive TF2. It's sort of like pubbing to them, just more organized and focused on the aspects they enjoy. But absolutely, your mindset is the one competitive tf2 needs and the journey all top players want to see other players taking. Thanks, I'm happy to have inspired anyone, and if you'd like you can add me and feel free to ask me questions[/quote]
I have to agree with this so so much. Teams like Street Hoops with incredibly talented players have worked so hard to make it into that top 4 Invite bubble in only a handful of seasons and that's why I admire them so much, but closing that huge gap to consistently contest for 1st place against teams with players that have the advantage of so many years of Invite experience takes a ludicrous amount of time that people can't commit.
There's not enough money involved to justify spending 30-40 hours a week playing catch-up to out-practice established teams. It's not that our scene has a lack of hardcore competitive players desiring to make the top - a lot of players with that drive rightfully question whether it's worth so much time and effort. It's just not.
This is why I'm actually happy to see veterans like yourself take their leave from the game, not out of dislike but out of respect for the next generation of top players. I hope you have a good one. Are we going to see the absolute pinnacle of 6v6 like Froyo during the i-Series? No, but that's not the point. I'm so glad there will spots open for up and coming players to step up to the top level with the strong likelihood of closer games and more competitive seasons ahead. I've always thought the scene needed more new blood instead of the constant praising of the old.
Well guys it's been a lot of fun while we kept it going. After almost 5000 hours in the game I never even completed a season of open and likely never will. Regardless this has been and always will be my favorite game and community to be a part of. I'm sorry for all the things I've done to people but in the end I'm glad to have met every person I think I could have while it lasted. We had a lot of fun with the competitive for a long time. Hell this community managed to create and keep a very unsupported topic from the developers for a pretty long time. I'm glad and proud of everyone in this community for sticking with the game and putting forth the effort that all of you did. Glad to be a part of this game "dying" as it may be.
Well guys it's been a lot of fun while we kept it going. After almost 5000 hours in the game I never even completed a season of open and likely never will. Regardless this has been and always will be my favorite game and community to be a part of. I'm sorry for all the things I've done to people but in the end I'm glad to have met every person I think I could have while it lasted. We had a lot of fun with the competitive for a long time. Hell this community managed to create and keep a very unsupported topic from the developers for a pretty long time. I'm glad and proud of everyone in this community for sticking with the game and putting forth the effort that all of you did. Glad to be a part of this game "dying" as it may be.
-Mike- https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/List_of_Community_item_owners
I love how it lists me as being a founder/head admin of VTV. I was neither. :D
[quote=-Mike-] https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/List_of_Community_item_owners
[/quote]
I love how it lists me as being a founder/head admin of VTV. I was neither. :D
[/quote]
I love how it lists me as being a founder/head admin of VTV. I was neither. :D
i'm scared everyone will move to overwatch based on hype, thus killing tf2, and then realise it's actually worse than tf2
we'll see
The game's not dying until then, but it hurts to see people as inspirational as mixup and clockwork leave, who's the best scout in the game now? :(
i'm scared everyone will move to overwatch based on hype, thus killing tf2, and then realise it's actually worse than tf2
we'll see
The game's not dying until then, but it hurts to see people as inspirational as mixup and clockwork leave, who's the best scout in the game now? :(
we'll see
The game's not dying until then, but it hurts to see people as inspirational as mixup and clockwork leave, who's the best scout in the game now? :(
This post is going to reflect on earlier posts that discuss ESEA dropping TF2.
Even if ESEA did decide to drop TF2, it wouldn't be the end of the world. We played in other leagues before ESEA, so hopefully that would again be an option after ESEA. I mean, sure, nearly everyone jumped ship because ESEA was a lot better than TWL, Cevo and CAL. But ESEA hasn't been around forever, and I think we'd do just fine without it.
Don't get me wrong though. Despite the league's sketchy past, I don't want to see it go until either the players or the league feels it would be the best/the right decision. Whatever happen to the league in the future, we'll sure enough be fine as a competitive scene.
This post is going to reflect on earlier posts that discuss ESEA dropping TF2.
Even if ESEA did decide to drop TF2, it wouldn't be the end of the world. We played in other leagues before ESEA, so hopefully that would again be an option after ESEA. I mean, sure, nearly everyone jumped ship because ESEA was a lot better than TWL, Cevo and CAL. But ESEA hasn't been around forever, and I think we'd do just fine without it.
Don't get me wrong though. Despite the league's sketchy past, I don't want to see it go until either the players or the league feels it would be the best/the right decision. Whatever happen to the league in the future, we'll sure enough be fine as a competitive scene.
Even if ESEA did decide to drop TF2, it wouldn't be the end of the world. We played in other leagues before ESEA, so hopefully that would again be an option after ESEA. I mean, sure, nearly everyone jumped ship because ESEA was a lot better than TWL, Cevo and CAL. But ESEA hasn't been around forever, and I think we'd do just fine without it.
Don't get me wrong though. Despite the league's sketchy past, I don't want to see it go until either the players or the league feels it would be the best/the right decision. Whatever happen to the league in the future, we'll sure enough be fine as a competitive scene.
I woke up this morning, the morning after i saw the lange video, and thought to myself how lucky i am to of stumbled upon this game, how lucky i am to start playing compeditive! I love this game with all my heart! This ride is the best thing that has happened to me. The ride isn't over yet.
I woke up this morning, the morning after i saw the lange video, and thought to myself how lucky i am to of stumbled upon this game, how lucky i am to start playing compeditive! I love this game with all my heart! This ride is the best thing that has happened to me. The ride isn't over yet.
holy fucking shit we have like a million threads that talk about how the game is dead and no one gives a fuck about it, and funny how the same people who say that come back and still play it
tf2 is like a drug, you dont stop playing it
holy fucking shit we have like a million threads that talk about how the game is dead and no one gives a fuck about it, and funny how the same people who say that come back and still play it
tf2 is like a drug, you dont stop playing it
tf2 is like a drug, you dont stop playing it
Just to clarify, the letter hasn't failed... yet :D
We were in a short initial conversation with Valve which actually resulted in them asking us to send the letter we had drafted. We know they have received it and are just giving them time* to respond.
See you in Season 20!
*Valve Time
Just to clarify, the letter hasn't failed... yet :D
We were in a short initial conversation with Valve which actually resulted in them asking us to send the letter we had drafted. We know they have received it and are just giving them time* to respond.
See you in Season 20!
[i]*Valve Time[/i]
We were in a short initial conversation with Valve which actually resulted in them asking us to send the letter we had drafted. We know they have received it and are just giving them time* to respond.
See you in Season 20!
[i]*Valve Time[/i]
Also a lot of interesting points have been raise, though many not new.
The whole Valve letter, having read it, the impression I got was it was more of a charity appeal than something that will actually interest them. Without revealing the content of the letter, it's split into 3 parts about our achievements as a community, our challenges and how the authors of the letter want to go forward with Valve. If we were a Charitable organisation, telling them about our history in Africa digging wells, the challenges we face getting fresh water to starving children and how we can go forward with their support to build more wells, we would get more of a response because the ethics of supporting a charity would at least be good publicity. Supporting 0.5% of the TF2 total playerbase to play a video game they enjoy doesn't offer anything, not even good publicity.
The tone of it is all wrong, it's an offer to Valve to spend time on something that isn't profitable and against the direction they seem to be taking the game. They are a business, they are in it for profits, competitive TF2 in it's current format offers virtually nothing to them. Most of us know this, but I want to re-iterate the point again as I will explain further below.
They have thrown us a bone in the past with various smaller updates and support of in-game medals. Remembering for in-game medals, the first time this was used, we must remember it brought in 10,000+ new people to comp TF2 and formed a new competitive gamemode (well not new, rejuvenated an older format) all from a simple idea with one blog post from Valve to market it - that took virtually no effort for them and had a big impact on player numbers for us. The fact they have done this is MORE than we can realistically expect from them.
Robin Walker meeting with eXtine & Sal a couple years back opened some form of dialogue, gave honest opinions and feedback on what we have created as a competitive community. I have yet to see any major competitive league attempt to implement that. As somebody pointed out, what we have developed has been driven by years of influential people in this community pushing the game in a certain direction and Valve going in another direction. The flaws of competitive TF2 (in every format) have been raised a number of times and even Valve support would not fix them in order to make TF2 a comparable e-sport as in it's current format, as Gentlemen Jon has put it, "Nobody cares".
Good news is the future, like with everyone's life, is in our own hands. We can go a number of directions, we will continue to be driven by influential individuals who run our leagues, streams, LAN events, content, community hubs and of course our talented technical individuals who create amazing things. This has been said before in many different ways by many different people.
- As a community we might be driven to take the "FUCK Valve" approach and do it ourselves and make ourselves the best we can be.
- The more controversial view is, goodbye competitive TF2 as we know it. Change everything from the ground up, if it means kill current formats, so be it. This sort of major change is nearly impossible to be implemented without some official support form the developer.
If you want Valve, do it their way - All we are to them is a homeless person trying to survive asking for some spare change for 10th time. Only way we can reach them is if we can benefit them in some way, we don't.
To Lange personally - You are an inspiring individual and the effort you put into the community was beyond words to describe and we all greatly appreciate it. I wish you luck in whatever avenue you wish to pursue.
But the letter to valve, though heartwarming to me, was frankly not very good at achieving its desired aims, I find it unlikely to bring anything more than Valve throwing us another bone.
Also a lot of interesting points have been raise, though many not new.
The whole Valve letter, having read it, the impression I got was it was more of a charity appeal than something that will actually interest them. Without revealing the content of the letter, it's split into 3 parts about our achievements as a community, our challenges and how the authors of the letter want to go forward with Valve. If we were a Charitable organisation, telling them about our history in Africa digging wells, the challenges we face getting fresh water to starving children and how we can go forward with their support to build more wells, we would get more of a response because the ethics of supporting a charity would at least be good publicity. Supporting 0.5% of the TF2 total playerbase to play a video game they enjoy doesn't offer anything, not even good publicity.
The tone of it is all wrong, it's an offer to Valve to spend time on something that isn't profitable and against the direction they seem to be taking the game. They are a business, they are in it for profits, competitive TF2 in it's current format offers virtually nothing to them. Most of us know this, but I want to re-iterate the point again as I will explain further below.
They have thrown us a bone in the past with various smaller updates and support of in-game medals. Remembering for in-game medals, the first time this was used, we must remember it brought in 10,000+ new people to comp TF2 and formed a new competitive gamemode (well not new, rejuvenated an older format) all from a simple idea with one blog post from Valve to market it - that took virtually no effort for them and had a big impact on player numbers for us. The fact they have done this is MORE than we can realistically expect from them.
Robin Walker meeting with eXtine & Sal a couple years back opened some form of dialogue, gave honest opinions and feedback on what we have created as a competitive community. I have yet to see any major competitive league attempt to implement that. As somebody pointed out, what we have developed has been driven by years of influential people in this community pushing the game in a certain direction and Valve going in another direction. The flaws of competitive TF2 (in every format) have been raised a number of times and even Valve support would not fix them in order to make TF2 a comparable e-sport as in it's current format, as Gentlemen Jon has put it, "Nobody cares".
Good news is the future, like with everyone's life, is in our own hands. We can go a number of directions, we will continue to be driven by influential individuals who run our leagues, streams, LAN events, content, community hubs and of course our talented technical individuals who create amazing things. This has been said before in many different ways by many different people.
- As a community we might be driven to take the "FUCK Valve" approach and do it ourselves and make ourselves the best we can be.
- The more controversial view is, goodbye competitive TF2 as we know it. Change everything from the ground up, if it means kill current formats, so be it. This sort of major change is nearly impossible to be implemented without some official support form the developer.
If you want Valve, do it their way - All we are to them is a homeless person trying to survive asking for some spare change for 10th time. Only way we can reach them is if we can benefit them in some way, we don't.
To Lange personally - You are an inspiring individual and the effort you put into the community was beyond words to describe and we all greatly appreciate it. I wish you luck in whatever avenue you wish to pursue.
But the letter to valve, though heartwarming to me, was frankly not very good at achieving its desired aims, I find it unlikely to bring anything more than Valve throwing us another bone.
The whole Valve letter, having read it, the impression I got was it was more of a charity appeal than something that will actually interest them. Without revealing the content of the letter, it's split into 3 parts about our achievements as a community, our challenges and how the authors of the letter want to go forward with Valve. If we were a Charitable organisation, telling them about our history in Africa digging wells, the challenges we face getting fresh water to starving children and how we can go forward with their support to build more wells, we would get more of a response because the ethics of supporting a charity would at least be good publicity. Supporting 0.5% of the TF2 total playerbase to play a video game they enjoy doesn't offer anything, not even good publicity.
The tone of it is all wrong, it's an offer to Valve to spend time on something that isn't profitable and against the direction they seem to be taking the game. They are a business, they are in it for profits, competitive TF2 in it's current format offers virtually nothing to them. Most of us know this, but I want to re-iterate the point again as I will explain further below.
They have thrown us a bone in the past with various smaller updates and support of in-game medals. Remembering for in-game medals, the first time this was used, we must remember it brought in 10,000+ new people to comp TF2 and formed a new competitive gamemode (well not new, rejuvenated an older format) all from a simple idea with one blog post from Valve to market it - that took virtually no effort for them and had a big impact on player numbers for us. The fact they have done this is MORE than we can realistically expect from them.
Robin Walker meeting with eXtine & Sal a couple years back opened some form of dialogue, gave honest opinions and feedback on what we have created as a competitive community. I have yet to see any major competitive league attempt to implement that. As somebody pointed out, what we have developed has been driven by years of influential people in this community pushing the game in a certain direction and Valve going in another direction. The flaws of competitive TF2 (in every format) have been raised a number of times and even Valve support would not fix them in order to make TF2 a comparable e-sport as in it's current format, as Gentlemen Jon has put it, "Nobody cares".
Good news is the future, like with everyone's life, is in our own hands. We can go a number of directions, we will continue to be driven by influential individuals who run our leagues, streams, LAN events, content, community hubs and of course our talented technical individuals who create amazing things. This has been said before in many different ways by many different people.
- As a community we might be driven to take the "FUCK Valve" approach and do it ourselves and make ourselves the best we can be.
- The more controversial view is, goodbye competitive TF2 as we know it. Change everything from the ground up, if it means kill current formats, so be it. This sort of major change is nearly impossible to be implemented without some official support form the developer.
If you want Valve, do it their way - All we are to them is a homeless person trying to survive asking for some spare change for 10th time. Only way we can reach them is if we can benefit them in some way, we don't.
To Lange personally - You are an inspiring individual and the effort you put into the community was beyond words to describe and we all greatly appreciate it. I wish you luck in whatever avenue you wish to pursue.
But the letter to valve, though heartwarming to me, was frankly not very good at achieving its desired aims, I find it unlikely to bring anything more than Valve throwing us another bone.
I play dota casually because there is a competitive scene that takes it seriously. I actually bought an item, and the last two compendiums. Ive only purchased a couple mvm tickets from valve for TF2.
How many kids do you think bought the PA arcana, and also love spamming S A D B O Y S or some other shit in Arteezy's or EEsama's chat?
High level play can increase the value of a game, which means more dedicated players which means more money thrown away. There is a monetary incentive for valve to support competitive tf2.
But it starts with pub kids being interested in the game, which they arent. They want Highlander cause they can see every class. Why do you think Robin suggested HL instead of 6s?
Edit: Reading it again, i guess i was saying the same thing as hildreth lol
I play dota casually because there is a competitive scene that takes it seriously. I actually bought an item, and the last two compendiums. Ive only purchased a couple mvm tickets from valve for TF2.
How many kids do you think bought the PA arcana, and also love spamming S A D B O Y S or some other shit in Arteezy's or EEsama's chat?
High level play can increase the value of a game, which means more dedicated players which means more money thrown away. There is a monetary incentive for valve to support competitive tf2.
But it starts with pub kids being interested in the game, which they arent. They want Highlander cause they can see every class. Why do you think Robin suggested HL instead of 6s?
Edit: Reading it again, i guess i was saying the same thing as hildreth lol
How many kids do you think bought the PA arcana, and also love spamming S A D B O Y S or some other shit in Arteezy's or EEsama's chat?
High level play can increase the value of a game, which means more dedicated players which means more money thrown away. There is a monetary incentive for valve to support competitive tf2.
But it starts with pub kids being interested in the game, which they arent. They want Highlander cause they can see every class. Why do you think Robin suggested HL instead of 6s?
Edit: Reading it again, i guess i was saying the same thing as hildreth lol
Ferskintf2 is like a drug, you dont stop playing it
haha yeah, we're going to be playing for the rest of our lives, you can't quit TF2 it's impossible! haha
[quote=Ferskin]
tf2 is like a drug, you dont stop playing it[/quote]
haha yeah, we're going to be playing for the rest of our lives, you can't quit TF2 it's impossible! haha
tf2 is like a drug, you dont stop playing it[/quote]
haha yeah, we're going to be playing for the rest of our lives, you can't quit TF2 it's impossible! haha
Ferskintf2 is like a drug, you dont stop playing it
You lead in with a fucking simile and then just go into a statement of opinion. Can you check this fucking writing style?
Fucking amateurs.
[quote=Ferskin]
tf2 is like a drug, you dont stop playing it[/quote]
You lead in with a fucking simile and then just go into a statement of opinion. Can you check this fucking writing style?
Fucking amateurs.
tf2 is like a drug, you dont stop playing it[/quote]
You lead in with a fucking simile and then just go into a statement of opinion. Can you check this fucking writing style?
Fucking amateurs.
If ESEA does drop tf2 we always have MLG....r-right?
If ESEA does drop tf2 we always have MLG....r-right?
yeah it was fun playing against you at GXL clock. i'll never forget dat airshot
yeah it was fun playing against you at GXL clock. i'll never forget dat airshot
I feel TF2 is gonna end up like cs 1.6 and source. You're just gonna eventually have a fairly small community that just plays the game because they love to. There won't be any lans or big prizes, people will just play for fun.
I feel TF2 is gonna end up like cs 1.6 and source. You're just gonna eventually have a fairly small community that just plays the game because they love to. There won't be any lans or big prizes, people will just play for fun.
also, no. First of all that's not our jobs to campaign competitive TF2. It's ridiculous. Secondly the 6s version of the game is very different from a pubbing perspective. I mean, maybe if we got the best marketers in the entire game to slave away at trying to sell this game, maybe it would grow a lot. But that's no one's responsibility and it's asking a lot. It certainly doesn't take 10 minutes to get people interested. And only 1 of those 3 would be sticking with it, anyway.
I honestly hate communicating via text of any kind because tone is lost, I wasn't implying that that there was absolutely zero people trying to spread the word i was saying that if people like you who sit here and take time to read this utter bullshit and instead spent that time introducing friends we would see a lot more growth than we have. When tf2 celebrities join pubs hundreds of people add them, what if you linked them to this forum or that guide made by sigma instead of ignoring the request? Obviously it's ridicoulous to ask any 1 person to advertise but we have like idk just a ball park estimate of 300 people that regularly participate in streams or on this forum? what if they took 5 minutes a day and used it to advertise?
TL:DR mad props to people like lange who try, but what if everybody who watched that video took the 5 min it took them to read this thread went and wrote a post on reddit or something?
after watching that buick video it seems the community is still growing so this thread is literally a waste of fucking time. LMAO
[quote]also, no. First of all that's not our jobs to campaign competitive TF2. It's ridiculous. Secondly the 6s version of the game is very different from a pubbing perspective. I mean, [i]maybe[/i] if we got the best marketers in the entire game to slave away at trying to sell this game, [i]maybe[/i] it would grow a lot. But that's no one's responsibility and it's asking a lot. It certainly doesn't take 10 minutes to get people interested. And only 1 of those 3 would be sticking with it, anyway.[/quote]
I honestly hate communicating via text of any kind because tone is lost, I wasn't implying that that there was absolutely zero people trying to spread the word i was saying that if people like you who sit here and take time to read this utter bullshit and instead spent that time introducing friends we would see a lot more growth than we have. When tf2 celebrities join pubs hundreds of people add them, what if you linked them to this forum or that guide made by sigma instead of ignoring the request? Obviously it's ridicoulous to ask any 1 person to advertise but we have like idk just a ball park estimate of 300 people that regularly participate in streams or on this forum? what if they took 5 minutes a day and used it to advertise?
TL:DR mad props to people like lange who try, but what if everybody who watched that video took the 5 min it took them to read this thread went and wrote a post on reddit or something?
after watching that buick video it seems the community is still growing so this thread is literally a waste of fucking time. LMAO
I honestly hate communicating via text of any kind because tone is lost, I wasn't implying that that there was absolutely zero people trying to spread the word i was saying that if people like you who sit here and take time to read this utter bullshit and instead spent that time introducing friends we would see a lot more growth than we have. When tf2 celebrities join pubs hundreds of people add them, what if you linked them to this forum or that guide made by sigma instead of ignoring the request? Obviously it's ridicoulous to ask any 1 person to advertise but we have like idk just a ball park estimate of 300 people that regularly participate in streams or on this forum? what if they took 5 minutes a day and used it to advertise?
TL:DR mad props to people like lange who try, but what if everybody who watched that video took the 5 min it took them to read this thread went and wrote a post on reddit or something?
after watching that buick video it seems the community is still growing so this thread is literally a waste of fucking time. LMAO
Please
sign in through STEAM
to post a comment.