hooli84% of egyptians believe that death is the appropriate punishment for leaving islam
http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Report-FINAL-December-2-2010.pdf
When asked about the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion, at least
three-quarters of Muslims in Jordan (86%), Egypt (84%) and Pakistan (76%) say they
would favor making it the law; in Nigeria, 51% of Muslims favor and 46% oppose it.
In contrast, Muslims in Lebanon, Turkey and Indonesia largely reject the notion that
harsh punishments should be the law in their countries. About three-quarters of Turkish
and Lebanese Muslims oppose the stoning of people who commit adultery (77% and
76%, respectively), as does a narrower majority (55%) of Muslims in Indonesia.
why did you ignore the several countries which heavily rejected it shown from the exact same paragraph?
[quote=hooli]84% of egyptians believe that death is the appropriate punishment for leaving islam
http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Report-FINAL-December-2-2010.pdf[/quote]
[quote]When asked about the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion, at least
three-quarters of Muslims in Jordan (86%), Egypt (84%) and Pakistan (76%) say they
would favor making it the law; in Nigeria, 51% of Muslims favor and 46% oppose it.
[b]In contrast, Muslims in Lebanon, Turkey and Indonesia largely reject the notion that
harsh punishments should be the law in their countries. About three-quarters of Turkish
and Lebanese Muslims oppose the stoning of people who commit adultery (77% and
76%, respectively), as does a narrower majority (55%) of Muslims in Indonesia.[/b] [/quote]
why did you ignore the several countries which heavily rejected it shown from the exact same paragraph?
I could probably create the exact same conclusion on christian morals in the US, should I focus solely on a heavy right-wing state, but that wouldn't be very indicative of american society as a whole, would it
I could probably create the exact same conclusion on christian morals in the US, should I focus solely on a heavy right-wing state, but that wouldn't be very indicative of american society as a whole, would it
French airforce is conducting right now a massive bombing of Raqqa, ISIS stronghold in Syria.
http://www.lefigaro.fr/actualite-france/2015/11/15/01016-20151115LIVWWW00003-en-direct-attentats-de-paris-daech.php#214408
cool loud fuckin vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujbK1pduYAU
france, yes
BonafideSheepy is the opposite of a tough guy, more like fluffy ball full of strong opinions
I don't think I really have strong opinions lol. My only opinion here is that I dislike Islam as a religion and what it stands for and I know that a lot of other people feel this way as well. Apparently nowadays disliking a religion is "racist" as people here have let me know. Which is actually kinda funny cause i'm not even hating a race, Islam is not a race its not like I hate the people who follow it, I just don't like the religion itself but people here are so stupid they interpret that as racist because the SJWs on tumblr have told them to.
[quote=Bonafide]Sheepy is the opposite of a tough guy, more like fluffy ball full of strong opinions[/quote]
I don't think I really have strong opinions lol. My only opinion here is that I dislike Islam as a religion and what it stands for and I know that a lot of other people feel this way as well. Apparently nowadays disliking a religion is "racist" as people here have let me know. Which is actually kinda funny cause i'm not even hating a race, Islam is not a race its not like I hate the people who follow it, I just don't like the religion itself but people here are so stupid they interpret that as racist because the SJWs on tumblr have told them to.
SheepylolBonafideSheepy is the opposite of a tough guy, more like fluffy ball full of strong opinions
I don't think I really have strong opinions lol. My only opinion here is that I dislike Islam as a religion and what it stands for and I know that a lot of other people feel this way as well. Apparently nowadays disliking a religion is "racist" as people here have let me know. Which is actually kinda funny cause i'm not even hating a race, Islam is not a race its not like I hate the people who follow it, I just don't like the religion itself but people here are so stupid they interpret that as racist because the SJWs on tumblr have told them to.
alright then, let's shoot. from only a few pages back:
SheepylolSpaceCadet has a point. Everytime something like this happens it makes me more and more weary when I see a muslim. You can never know who the extremists are. The more this happens the more people are gonna be scared when they see a muslim walking down the street. Also I feel now like we should really tighten up on who we let into our countries, maybe start doing background checks and interviews more ect. The truth is a lot of people from these countries aren't as civilized as we are and this is why we are seeing so many people from these countries raping our children, in the UK at least. People need to understand that the lifestyle in some of these middle eastern places are a lot different from what its like over here.
how do you think you can interpret a "muslim", solely on looks, without them potentially being of another religion entirely
[quote=Sheepylol][quote=Bonafide]Sheepy is the opposite of a tough guy, more like fluffy ball full of strong opinions[/quote]
I don't think I really have strong opinions lol. My only opinion here is that I dislike Islam as a religion and what it stands for and I know that a lot of other people feel this way as well. Apparently nowadays disliking a religion is "racist" as people here have let me know. Which is actually kinda funny cause i'm not even hating a race, Islam is not a race its not like I hate the people who follow it, I just don't like the religion itself but people here are so stupid they interpret that as racist because the SJWs on tumblr have told them to.[/quote]
alright then, let's shoot. from only a few pages back:
[quote=Sheepylol]SpaceCadet has a point. Everytime something like this happens it makes me more and more weary when I see a muslim. You can never know who the extremists are. The more this happens the more people are gonna be scared when they see a muslim walking down the street. Also I feel now like we should really tighten up on who we let into our countries, maybe start doing background checks and interviews more ect. The truth is a lot of people from these countries aren't as civilized as we are and this is why we are seeing so many people from these countries raping our children, in the UK at least. People need to understand that the lifestyle in some of these middle eastern places are a lot different from what its like over here.[/quote]
how do you think you can interpret a "muslim", solely on looks, without them potentially being of another religion entirely
Sheepylol2112The Bible is actually way more violent and spiteful than the Qur'an
Please don't say things like this I actually find it offensive. Out of all the stupid posts in this thread this is the only one that has made me mad. Sure the bible has violence but it is nothing like the quran at all. Really this has to be one of the most ignorant statements I have seen on here. Before you reply could you please go out and read both the quran and the bible (which is something you obviously haven't done) and then think about what you said.
Also peaceful religion am i right guys? xD http://i.imgur.com/uP80YOm.jpg
every single religion pre 1500 has some sort of violence in it. Not sure just the qur'an
[quote=Sheepylol][quote=2112]The Bible is actually way more violent and spiteful than the Qur'an[/quote]
Please don't say things like this I actually find it offensive. Out of all the stupid posts in this thread this is the only one that has made me mad. Sure the bible has violence but it is nothing like the quran at all. Really this has to be one of the most ignorant statements I have seen on here. Before you reply could you please go out and read both the quran and the bible (which is something you obviously haven't done) and then think about what you said.
Also peaceful religion am i right guys? xD http://i.imgur.com/uP80YOm.jpg[/quote]
every single religion pre 1500 has some sort of violence in it. Not sure just the qur'an
trashhooli84% of egyptians believe that death is the appropriate punishment for leaving islam
http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Report-FINAL-December-2-2010.pdf
When asked about the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion, at least
three-quarters of Muslims in Jordan (86%), Egypt (84%) and Pakistan (76%) say they
would favor making it the law; in Nigeria, 51% of Muslims favor and 46% oppose it.
In contrast, Muslims in Lebanon, Turkey and Indonesia largely reject the notion that
harsh punishments should be the law in their countries. About three-quarters of Turkish
and Lebanese Muslims oppose the stoning of people who commit adultery (77% and
76%, respectively), as does a narrower majority (55%) of Muslims in Indonesia.
why did you ignore the several countries which heavily rejected it shown from the exact same paragraph?
Its funny how differently that could be written.
A full 25% of Turkish Muslims think that, if anyone cheats on their spouse, they should be put to death. This isnt "25% of Turkish Muslims support the death penalty for murder". We are talking about a crime that... isn't a crime. At all.
Avast59% of Americans think torture is justified.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/new-poll-finds-majority-of-americans-believe-torture-justified-after-911-attacks/2014/12/16/f6ee1208-847c-11e4-9534-f79a23c40e6c_story.html
Of course, this is also interesting. Until you realize it isn't at all. In surveys, everything is literally about the question and how you ask it. Simply changing the wording on the question could yield exactly opposite results. Think about how you would respond to the question that was asked in that survey:
"All in all, Do you think the CIA's treatment of suspected terrorists was justified or unjustified."
Torture was not mentioned in the question. If you want to know if American's think torture is justified, you have to ask a different question. It took me a REALLY long time to come up with something that might be able to get that answer, and I think I have it: "Do you think torture is justified?". This pseudojournalistic media shitshow fuckery completely washes away all meaning of anything they try and talk about.
Philosophically, there are situations in which torturing a human being can be justified. Have all of our tortures been that way? No. Is that a problem? Yes. Does that even put us on the same plane of existence as firmly believing that apostasy, (consensual) sodomy, or adultery (all non-crimes) should be punishable by death? I surely fucking think not.
[quote=trash][quote=hooli]84% of egyptians believe that death is the appropriate punishment for leaving islam
http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Report-FINAL-December-2-2010.pdf[/quote]
[quote]When asked about the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion, at least
three-quarters of Muslims in Jordan (86%), Egypt (84%) and Pakistan (76%) say they
would favor making it the law; in Nigeria, 51% of Muslims favor and 46% oppose it.
[b]In contrast, Muslims in Lebanon, Turkey and Indonesia largely reject the notion that
harsh punishments should be the law in their countries. About three-quarters of Turkish
and Lebanese Muslims oppose the stoning of people who commit adultery (77% and
76%, respectively), as does a narrower majority (55%) of Muslims in Indonesia.[/b] [/quote]
why did you ignore the several countries which heavily rejected it shown from the exact same paragraph?[/quote]
Its funny how differently that could be written.
A full 25% of Turkish Muslims think that, if anyone cheats on their spouse, they should be put to death. This isnt "25% of Turkish Muslims support the death penalty for murder". We are talking about a crime that... isn't a crime. At all.
[quote=Avast]59% of Americans think torture is justified.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/new-poll-finds-majority-of-americans-believe-torture-justified-after-911-attacks/2014/12/16/f6ee1208-847c-11e4-9534-f79a23c40e6c_story.html[/quote]
Of course, this is also interesting. Until you realize it isn't at all. In surveys, everything is literally about the question and how you ask it. Simply changing the wording on the question could yield exactly opposite results. Think about how you would respond to the question that was asked in that survey:
"All in all, Do you think the CIA's treatment of suspected terrorists was justified or unjustified."
Torture was not mentioned in the question. If you want to know if American's think torture is justified, you have to ask a different question. It took me a REALLY long time to come up with something that might be able to get that answer, and I think I have it: "Do you think torture is justified?". This pseudojournalistic media shitshow fuckery completely washes away all meaning of anything they try and talk about.
Philosophically, there are situations in which torturing a human being can be justified. Have all of our tortures been that way? No. Is that a problem? Yes. Does that even put us on the same plane of existence as firmly believing that apostasy, (consensual) sodomy, or adultery (all non-crimes) should be punishable by death? I surely fucking think not.
trash
how do you think you can interpret a "muslim", solely on looks, without them potentially being of another religion entirely
A lot of muslims wear clothing that people identify as muslim, for example those stupid looking man dresses with head dresses ect. Of course not all muslims wear these, so you can't always know who is a muslim and who isn't. The fact I was bringing up is that because of these recent events carried out by muslims, many people start to feel uncomfortable when they see someone in "muslim" clothing or if they hear that someone is a muslim. This has nothing to do with racism as it is normal for people to associate fear and discomfort with something that has caused so much terror (in this case ISIS and muslim extremists).
A good example of this is how many women will feel intimidated or downright terrified of men if they were severely abused (sexually or physically) by men when they were children. If this is the case then you can't call out these women as being "sexist" because they have learned to associate men with pain and fear.
[quote=trash]
how do you think you can interpret a "muslim", solely on looks, without them potentially being of another religion entirely[/quote]
A lot of muslims wear clothing that people identify as muslim, for example those stupid looking man dresses with head dresses ect. Of course not all muslims wear these, so you can't always know who is a muslim and who isn't. The fact I was bringing up is that because of these recent events carried out by muslims, many people start to feel uncomfortable when they see someone in "muslim" clothing or if they hear that someone is a muslim. This has nothing to do with racism as it is normal for people to associate fear and discomfort with something that has caused so much terror (in this case ISIS and muslim extremists).
A good example of this is how many women will feel intimidated or downright terrified of men if they were severely abused (sexually or physically) by men when they were children. If this is the case then you can't call out these women as being "sexist" because they have learned to associate men with pain and fear.
Sheepyloltrash
how do you think you can interpret a "muslim", solely on looks, without them potentially being of another religion entirely
A lot of muslims wear clothing that people identify as muslim, for example those stupid looking man dresses with head dresses ect. Of course not all muslims wear these, so you can't always know who is a muslim and who isn't. The fact I was bringing up is that because of these recent events carried out by muslims, many people start to feel uncomfortable when they see someone in "muslim" clothing or if they hear that someone is a muslim. This has nothing to do with racism as it is normal for people to associate fear and discomfort with something that has caused so much terror (in this case ISIS and muslim extremists).
A good example of this is how many women will feel intimidated or downright terrified of men if they were severely abused (sexually or physically) by men when they were children. If this is the case then you can't call out these women as being "sexist" because they have learned to associate men with pain and fear.
Since when is hating someone for their cultural background any better than hating someone for their race?
[quote=Sheepylol][quote=trash]
how do you think you can interpret a "muslim", solely on looks, without them potentially being of another religion entirely[/quote]
A lot of muslims wear clothing that people identify as muslim, for example those stupid looking man dresses with head dresses ect. Of course not all muslims wear these, so you can't always know who is a muslim and who isn't. The fact I was bringing up is that because of these recent events carried out by muslims, many people start to feel uncomfortable when they see someone in "muslim" clothing or if they hear that someone is a muslim. This has nothing to do with racism as it is normal for people to associate fear and discomfort with something that has caused so much terror (in this case ISIS and muslim extremists).
A good example of this is how many women will feel intimidated or downright terrified of men if they were severely abused (sexually or physically) by men when they were children. If this is the case then you can't call out these women as being "sexist" because they have learned to associate men with pain and fear.[/quote]
Since when is hating someone for their cultural background any better than hating someone for their race?
YouSince when is hating someone for their culture any better than hating someone for their race?
SheepylolI don't hate people who follow it just because they follow it but I do hate the religion itself and I have my reasons for this.
[quote=You]
Since when is hating someone for their culture any better than hating someone for their race?[/quote]
[quote=Sheepylol]I don't hate people who follow it just because they follow it but I do hate the religion itself and I have my reasons for this.[/quote]
one day y'all are gonna learn to not reply to sheepylol's posts
one day y'all are gonna learn to not reply to sheepylol's posts
I was also not going to weigh in on this thread, but as someone who was born and raised in the Middle East, I think some perspective would be useful. Thankfully I don't have to type out a wall of text thanks to Hatim's post explaining the out of context verses that most islamophobic websites like to reference as a direct indication that all Muslims are at all times plotting to murder every non-muslim.
Anyway, starting from first grade, what we were taught in Islamic studies, which is one of the required subjects to pass every grade, was that Islam is a religion of peace, but only good Muslims go to heaven, and pretty much everyone else is going to hell (the latter is something I don't believe in since it's not explicitly said in the Quran). This really does not mean teachers encourage their students to hate other religions. Granted some people do grow up hating these other religions and sects of Islam (due to having an extremist teacher or religious leader, a different background, or simply wanting to hate, much like there are racist people pretty much all around the world), but out of these people a small minority decides to leave their education (if any), families, and lives to follow some assholes in a different continent just to kill the 'infidels'.
There are 1.5 billion Muslims, and unfortunately, a big chunk of them are from impoverished, war-torn countries, and/or extremist countries (specifically Saudi Arabia). Consequently, Islam currently has the highest rate of terrorism out of all religions. However, saying the religion of Islam promotes violence is factually wrong, it's the people teaching the religion who are implicitly or explicitly promoting hatred and violence.
I do want to apologize for my awful writing, hopefully you can understand what I'm trying to say.
I was also not going to weigh in on this thread, but as someone who was born and raised in the Middle East, I think some perspective would be useful. Thankfully I don't have to type out a wall of text thanks to Hatim's post explaining the out of context verses that most islamophobic websites like to reference as a direct indication that all Muslims are at all times plotting to murder every non-muslim.
Anyway, starting from first grade, what we were taught in Islamic studies, which is one of the required subjects to pass every grade, was that Islam is a religion of peace, but only good Muslims go to heaven, and pretty much everyone else is going to hell (the latter is something I don't believe in since it's not explicitly said in the Quran). This really does not mean teachers encourage their students to hate other religions. Granted some people do grow up hating these other religions and sects of Islam (due to having an extremist teacher or religious leader, a different background, or simply wanting to hate, much like there are racist people pretty much all around the world), but out of these people a small minority decides to leave their education (if any), families, and lives to follow some assholes in a different continent just to kill the 'infidels'.
There are 1.5 billion Muslims, and unfortunately, a big chunk of them are from impoverished, war-torn countries, and/or extremist countries (specifically Saudi Arabia). Consequently, Islam currently has the highest rate of terrorism out of all religions. However, saying the religion of Islam promotes violence is factually wrong, it's the people teaching the religion who are implicitly or explicitly promoting hatred and violence.
I do want to apologize for my awful writing, hopefully you can understand what I'm trying to say.
BisquitikpureIsis claims they are muslims but don't follow the teachings of Islam at all. Its sad that the actions of a few makes the world judge the rest of the billion+ population of muslims who just want to pray 5 times a day and give to charity. The religion itself isn't violent but if you're a violent person your islam is going to be violent. The same goes for any other religion. Religion just becomes the scapegoat for the actions of these psychopaths.
"Whoever kills an innocent person is as though he has killed all mankind. And whoever saves a life, it is as though he had saved all mankind.” (Qur’an, 5:32)
One could reply to you with 1000 passages quoted from the same book telling the exact opposite just to show the brutality and the dishonesty of this religion.
hit me with it
[quote=Bisquit][quote=ikpure]Isis claims they are muslims but don't follow the teachings of Islam at all. Its sad that the actions of a few makes the world judge the rest of the billion+ population of muslims who just want to pray 5 times a day and give to charity. The religion itself isn't violent but if you're a violent person your islam is going to be violent. The same goes for any other religion. Religion just becomes the scapegoat for the actions of these psychopaths.
"Whoever kills an innocent person is as though he has killed all mankind. And whoever saves a life, it is as though he had saved all mankind.” (Qur’an, 5:32)[/quote]
One could reply to you with 1000 passages quoted from the same book telling the exact opposite just to show the brutality and the dishonesty of this religion.[/quote]
hit me with it
ikpureBisquitikpureIsis claims they are muslims but don't follow the teachings of Islam at all. Its sad that the actions of a few makes the world judge the rest of the billion+ population of muslims who just want to pray 5 times a day and give to charity. The religion itself isn't violent but if you're a violent person your islam is going to be violent. The same goes for any other religion. Religion just becomes the scapegoat for the actions of these psychopaths.
"Whoever kills an innocent person is as though he has killed all mankind. And whoever saves a life, it is as though he had saved all mankind.” (Qur’an, 5:32)
One could reply to you with 1000 passages quoted from the same book telling the exact opposite just to show the brutality and the dishonesty of this religion.
hit me with it
^^
[quote=ikpure][quote=Bisquit][quote=ikpure]Isis claims they are muslims but don't follow the teachings of Islam at all. Its sad that the actions of a few makes the world judge the rest of the billion+ population of muslims who just want to pray 5 times a day and give to charity. The religion itself isn't violent but if you're a violent person your islam is going to be violent. The same goes for any other religion. Religion just becomes the scapegoat for the actions of these psychopaths.
"Whoever kills an innocent person is as though he has killed all mankind. And whoever saves a life, it is as though he had saved all mankind.” (Qur’an, 5:32)[/quote]
One could reply to you with 1000 passages quoted from the same book telling the exact opposite just to show the brutality and the dishonesty of this religion.[/quote]
hit me with it[/quote]
^^
Political Correctness is slowly killing our society and it looks like the Migrants and ISIS group are seeing it as a huge weakness/exploit.
When will everyone realise we've become consumed with making everyone happy and have forgotten to look after our own well being...
Political Correctness is slowly killing our society and it looks like the Migrants and ISIS group are seeing it as a huge weakness/exploit.
When will everyone realise we've become consumed with making everyone happy and have forgotten to look after our own well being...
hooli84% of egyptians believe that death is the appropriate punishment for leaving islam
http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Report-FINAL-December-2-2010.pdf
That is a problem in Egypt. I could list 10 other muslim countries that forbid this. Its a country issue not a religion issue. Many moral teachings of Islam are great. There are some questionable ones that cannot be applied today due to paradigm shifts in society's views. Some countries who haven't developed and modernized as quickly still abide by that while others don't agree with this and forbid it.
[quote=hooli]84% of egyptians believe that death is the appropriate punishment for leaving islam
http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Report-FINAL-December-2-2010.pdf[/quote]
That is a problem in Egypt. I could list 10 other muslim countries that forbid this. Its a country issue not a religion issue. Many moral teachings of Islam are great. There are some questionable ones that cannot be applied today due to paradigm shifts in society's views. Some countries who haven't developed and modernized as quickly still abide by that while others don't agree with this and forbid it.
political discussion on the internet. everybody is making big statements, bringing up biased sources to support their claims and nobody will change their mind. nobody actually knows a lot about the topic(if they did they wouldn't be posting here).
political discussion on the internet. everybody is making big statements, bringing up biased sources to support their claims and nobody will change their mind. nobody actually knows a lot about the topic(if they did they wouldn't be posting here).
Avast59% of Americans think torture is justified.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/new-poll-finds-majority-of-americans-believe-torture-justified-after-911-attacks/2014/12/16/f6ee1208-847c-11e4-9534-f79a23c40e6c_story.html
Lets flip the tables here, what would our reaction be if that article was about Palestinians feeling that torture is justified after their homes were destroyed, their families kidnapped, locked up, tortured and killed.
[quote=Avast]59% of Americans think torture is justified.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/new-poll-finds-majority-of-americans-believe-torture-justified-after-911-attacks/2014/12/16/f6ee1208-847c-11e4-9534-f79a23c40e6c_story.html[/quote]
Lets flip the tables here, what would our reaction be if that article was about Palestinians feeling that torture is justified after their homes were destroyed, their families kidnapped, locked up, tortured and killed.
ikpureThat is a problem in Egypt. I could list 10 other muslim countries that forbid this. Its a country issue not a religion issue. Many moral teachings of Islam are great. There are some questionable ones that cannot be applied today due to paradigm shifts in society's views. Some countries who haven't developed and modernized as quickly still abide by that while others don't agree with this and forbid it.
See post 421, Egypt is not an isolated incident.
[quote=ikpure]That is a problem in Egypt. I could list 10 other muslim countries that forbid this. Its a country issue not a religion issue. Many moral teachings of Islam are great. There are some questionable ones that cannot be applied today due to paradigm shifts in society's views. Some countries who haven't developed and modernized as quickly still abide by that while others don't agree with this and forbid it.[/quote]
See post 421, Egypt is not an isolated incident.
Sheepylol
A lot of muslims wear clothing that people identify as muslim, for example those stupid looking man dresses with head dresses ect. Of course not all muslims wear these, so you can't always know who is a muslim and who isn't. The fact I was bringing up is that because of these recent events carried out by muslims, many people start to feel uncomfortable when they see someone in "muslim" clothing or if they hear that someone is a muslim. This has nothing to do with racism as it is normal for people to associate fear and discomfort with something that has caused so much terror (in this case ISIS and muslim extremists).
That is a great example of Islamophobia.
[quote=Sheepylol]
A lot of muslims wear clothing that people identify as muslim, for example those stupid looking man dresses with head dresses ect. Of course not all muslims wear these, so you can't always know who is a muslim and who isn't. The fact I was bringing up is that because of these recent events carried out by muslims, many people start to feel uncomfortable when they see someone in "muslim" clothing or if they hear that someone is a muslim. This has nothing to do with racism as it is normal for people to associate fear and discomfort with something that has caused so much terror (in this case ISIS and muslim extremists). [/quote]
That is a great example of Islamophobia.
ulmyxxpolitical discussion on the internet. everybody is making big statements, bringing up biased sources to support their claims and nobody will change their mind. nobody actually knows a lot about the topic(if they did they wouldn't be posting here).
And then there's the guy who think's he's too good/righteous/moral/humble to comment. Discussion among the people is the single most important way to change minds, free thoughts, and propagate tolerance and democracy. Willingness to engage in at least some level of discourse is sign of a healthy mind that thinks about the issues of the world, at least on some level.
What is the alternative? Never talk about these things? Talk about these things with our own self-selected insular family/friends group that is far more likely to be homogeneous than the small group of people we have here?
Jesus fuck what a conceited comment. Of course none of us are experts. I am not a philosopher of religion, Sheepy is not the world's foremost expert on Islamophobia, and none of our resident Muslims are Doctors of religious philosophy or world leading Muslim scholarship. And that's just fine. You come to a forum, you get forum-goer level talks about issues. This public level democracy/open forum discussion on current events is completely fucking revolutionary. No longer do we get heavily filtered (yes, even in America) cherry picked information about world events and ideas. Our new internet lets us do a lot of things, but I would argue that in terms of a free and democratic society, the ability to do what we are doing RIGHT IN THIS THREAD is by far the most important.
23 years ago, when I was born, I was destined to live in a world where I might never get to know a Muslim, and probably never read a word of the Quran. I was destined to live in a world where I would be lucky to know 2-3 other gay teens. We now live in a world where a super conservative religious Muslim young adult from Syria can connect with the transsexual long haired liberal antitheist child of American hippies who expatriated to Canada 'cause Bush. This has propelled us into a new enlightenment, a global enlightening of morals and compassion for those who are different. Exposure to these new and different people makes us more compassionate and accepting people.
[quote=ulmyxx]political discussion on the internet. everybody is making big statements, bringing up biased sources to support their claims and nobody will change their mind. nobody actually knows a lot about the topic(if they did they wouldn't be posting here).[/quote]
And then there's the guy who think's he's too good/righteous/moral/humble to comment. Discussion among the people is the single most important way to change minds, free thoughts, and propagate tolerance and democracy. Willingness to engage in at least some level of discourse is sign of a healthy mind that thinks about the issues of the world, at least on some level.
What is the alternative? Never talk about these things? Talk about these things with our own self-selected insular family/friends group that is far more likely to be homogeneous than the small group of people we have here?
Jesus fuck what a conceited comment. Of course none of us are experts. I am not a philosopher of religion, Sheepy is not the world's foremost expert on Islamophobia, and none of our resident Muslims are Doctors of religious philosophy or world leading Muslim scholarship. And that's just fine. You come to a forum, you get forum-goer level talks about issues. This public level democracy/open forum discussion on current events is completely fucking revolutionary. No longer do we get heavily filtered (yes, even in America) cherry picked information about world events and ideas. Our new internet lets us do a lot of things, but I would argue that in terms of a free and democratic society, the ability to do what we are doing RIGHT IN THIS THREAD is by far the most important.
23 years ago, when I was born, I was destined to live in a world where I might never get to know a Muslim, and probably never read a word of the Quran. I was destined to live in a world where I would be lucky to know 2-3 other gay teens. We now live in a world where a super conservative religious Muslim young adult from Syria can connect with the transsexual long haired liberal antitheist child of American hippies who expatriated to Canada 'cause Bush. This has propelled us into a new enlightenment, a global enlightening of morals and compassion for those who are different. Exposure to these new and different people makes us more compassionate and accepting people.
hooliikpureThat is a problem in Egypt. I could list 10 other muslim countries that forbid this. Its a country issue not a religion issue. Many moral teachings of Islam are great. There are some questionable ones that cannot be applied today due to paradigm shifts in society's views. Some countries who haven't developed and modernized as quickly still abide by that while others don't agree with this and forbid it.
See post 421, Egypt is not an isolated incident.
If you've got the time
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzusSqcotDw&t=1m20s
[quote=hooli][quote=ikpure]That is a problem in Egypt. I could list 10 other muslim countries that forbid this. Its a country issue not a religion issue. Many moral teachings of Islam are great. There are some questionable ones that cannot be applied today due to paradigm shifts in society's views. Some countries who haven't developed and modernized as quickly still abide by that while others don't agree with this and forbid it.[/quote]
See post 421, Egypt is not an isolated incident.[/quote]
If you've got the time
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzusSqcotDw&t=1m20s
Just a warning, I am about to go through and address all of the racism and idiocy since I last posted, it will probably lead to several very long posts or lots and lots of shorter ones
Just a warning, I am about to go through and address all of the racism and idiocy since I last posted, it will probably lead to several very long posts or lots and lots of shorter ones
I haven't been following this thread, so I apologize if this has been posted, but here is a video of a panic during a flower-laying ceremony in Paris: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbmmeW35sIY&feature=youtu.be
Apparently some jackass set off firecrackers which rightfully frightened everybody else.
I haven't been following this thread, so I apologize if this has been posted, but here is a video of a panic during a flower-laying ceremony in Paris: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbmmeW35sIY&feature=youtu.be
Apparently some jackass set off firecrackers which rightfully frightened everybody else.
thanks for the warning mustard
thanks for the warning mustard
A lot of you guys are showing your true colors, yikes. I'm sure that the Quran doesn't say kill for the hell of it knowing that none of you guys have read it for yourselves and just cherry picking verses. The media has done an exceptional job of pretty much nailing people of the Islamic race as a whole. No it's not just extremists of Islam but a certain sect of the Sunnis.
Just please stop bashing the religion in this thread if you're viewing it from an outsiders perspective!
A lot of you guys are showing your true colors, yikes. I'm sure that the Quran doesn't say kill for the hell of it knowing that none of you guys have read it for yourselves and just cherry picking verses. The media has done an exceptional job of pretty much nailing people of the Islamic race as a whole. No it's not just extremists of Islam but a certain sect of the Sunnis.
Just please stop bashing the religion in this thread if you're viewing it from an outsiders perspective!
aim-people of the Islamic race
:|
[quote=aim-]people of the Islamic race[/quote]
:|
SheepylolmustardoverlordSheepylolThe truth is a lot of people from these countries aren't as civilized as we are and this is why we are seeing so many people from these countries raping our children, in the UK at least. People need to understand that the lifestyle in some of these middle eastern places are a lot different from what its like over here.
What the fuck are you talking about you racist freak
Thanks for the great insight you bring up. I'm really happy that we can have mature conversations where we can share our opinions like adults. I think you bring up a very valid point mustard and I respect your opinion. However I must go back to one of my previous posts on this - Muslims were getting away with raping children in the UK because the police were scared of being called racist by closed-minded ignorant man-children like you who decide to argue based on emotion instead of listening to the facts.
My point is that what you're saying is preposterous and racist and makes no sense whatsoever.
1) Your entire example is an anecdotal one that has nothing to do with terrorism or anything else we're discussing.
2) The reason the article uses "racism" as a term and not "Islamophobia" is because a big sticking point there was the men being South Asian, and there is a lot of racism against people from Pakistan, India, and Bangladesh (not all three of which are Muslim countries) in the UK. Does that mean fear of racism should trump action in stopping child molesters? Obviously not. It just means none of this is even remotely connected to the conversation we're having.
3) EVEN IF these Muslim men were particularly religious (which I saw no evidence that they were), and EVEN IF their sexual abuse was occurring in a religious context- have you heard of something called the Catholic Church? Last time I checked, when you say "religious figures accused of child molestation", most people don't immediately think "Muslim". However, people don't seem to blame the religion itself in the case of the Church, merely the individuals within it. That's the point- you're trying to connect dots that aren't there to justify your IRRATIONAL feelings about Muslims.
SheepylolAlso the FACT is that some middle eastern muslim countries aren't as civilized as western non-muslim countries.
I'm sure it's already clear to everyone who has read this thread that you don't really care about whether something you refer to as "fact" is factual or not, but this statement is also completely bogus. If you were being intellectually honest and using the definition of "civilized" that anthropologists actually use, ie an advanced society with complex divisions of labor, then it is true that the United States and the UK are more "civilized" than many Middle Eastern countries. Nazi Germany was too, by the way. If you are trying to use an unscientific definition of "civilized", based on cultural norms and values, you have to reckon with the many many innocent people that our countries have killed for political purposes. Either way, it's far from a fact and you are dumb.
[quote=Sheepylol][quote=mustardoverlord]
[quote=Sheepylol]The truth is a lot of people from these countries aren't as civilized as we are and this is why we are seeing so many people from these countries raping our children, in the UK at least. People need to understand that the lifestyle in some of these middle eastern places are a lot different from what its like over here.[/quote]
What the fuck are you talking about you racist freak[/quote]
Thanks for the great insight you bring up. I'm really happy that we can have mature conversations where we can share our opinions like adults. I think you bring up a very valid point mustard and I respect your opinion. However I must go back to one of my previous posts on this - Muslims were getting away with raping children in the UK because the police were scared of being called racist by closed-minded ignorant man-children like you who decide to argue based on emotion instead of listening to the facts.
[/quote]
My point is that what you're saying is preposterous and racist and makes no sense whatsoever.
1) Your entire example is an anecdotal one that has nothing to do with terrorism or anything else we're discussing.
2) The reason the article uses "racism" as a term and not "Islamophobia" is because a big sticking point there was the men being South Asian, and there is a lot of racism against people from Pakistan, India, and Bangladesh (not all three of which are Muslim countries) in the UK. Does that mean fear of racism should trump action in stopping child molesters? Obviously not. It just means none of this is even remotely connected to the conversation we're having.
3) EVEN IF these Muslim men were particularly religious (which I saw no evidence that they were), and EVEN IF their sexual abuse was occurring in a religious context- have you heard of something called the Catholic Church? Last time I checked, when you say "religious figures accused of child molestation", most people don't immediately think "Muslim". However, people don't seem to blame the religion itself in the case of the Church, merely the individuals within it. That's the point- you're trying to connect dots that aren't there to justify your IRRATIONAL feelings about Muslims.
[quote=Sheepylol]
Also the FACT is that some middle eastern muslim countries aren't as civilized as western non-muslim countries.[/quote]
I'm sure it's already clear to everyone who has read this thread that you don't really care about whether something you refer to as "fact" is factual or not, but this statement is also completely bogus. If you were being intellectually honest and using the definition of "civilized" that anthropologists actually use, ie an advanced society with complex divisions of labor, then it is true that the United States and the UK are more "civilized" than many Middle Eastern countries. Nazi Germany was too, by the way. If you are trying to use an unscientific definition of "civilized", based on cultural norms and values, you have to reckon with the many many innocent people that our countries have killed for political purposes. Either way, it's far from a fact and you are dumb.