because the act of exposing cheating in itself requires far too much subjective evidence to not at least push for it to only be in the areas that matter. if it was as simple as choosing any source of play you want, then it'd be easy to pick something that sounds "fishy" enough through thousands of hours of someone's playtime on, and considering some of the false positives I've seen in comp TF2, enough people would bite for it to slander, no matter how ridiculous the evidence may be

Wish I could live in the US, then I could cheat in tf2 and play competetively.

I am convinced, clearly the only viable solution is to give Hassassin a 1-day ban on esea so that he can't play his first playoff match. I'm not sure which team they are playing in said match but I heard that their opponents were really sexy.

Even when evidence is not subjective only, people still get a free pass. Even when people themselves admit to cheating in pubs it is given a free pass.

I am not here to fight the mindset, I just can't personally understand it.

but i havent seen any evidence of hassassin cheating at all

Do you fail to see the SMAC ban that says "aimbot"?

I'm not even talking about cheating in matches, but how could someone possibly deny that he has ever cheated?

your two pieces of hard evidence have been

1) being an idiot and using cheats on pubs (of which case, I know of a few other ppl who should be crucified)

2) using a tf2 texture pack that a good number of ppl have been using

if you assume either of these to somehow be grounds for a ban to ESEA, when ESEA makes it pretty clear that they only really care about what happens within their client, you're being ridiculous

How do you know that it's the texture pack? It looks slightly different to me. I know for a fact that the same effect can be reached with tools such as nvidia inspector. But you are still missing the point.

My evidence is in the ban and the screenshot with the red model. This shows a repeated history of cheating, and he clearly cannot be trusted.

Why am I having to repeat myself?

So is cheating alright now? If VAC actually worked, then we wouldn't even be having this conversation right now. I guess I'll just go cheat on ctf_turbine and then come into competitive and not suspect anybody to be suspicious.

its pretty fucking dumb of him to cheat in a pub if he actually did, but i doubt anyone actually cares because there's 0 evidence of him ever cheating in anything that actually matters

regardless, ESEA's and UGC's policy has always just been that if they don't cheat in a match, it doesn't matter, so this thread doesnt really do anything

idk why you keep addressing this point when like five people answered it already

you confuse "cheating in comp and cheating in a shitty pub are two different things" as a single meaningless binary option, rather than just an example of "this is abhorrent, this is just shit and was given the proper response by the servers involved"

any public allegation like this should be treated as innocent until proven guilty, and the evidence is heavily on you. you haven't shown any of this to have happened in a UGC or ESEA match, and those are the places that actually give you any grounds to justify this, whereas ppl far more trustworthy than you have seen him play live without any suspicion

I'm still not sure why you're so convinced that a well known player (online and at lan) is cheating based off of those troll-level screenshots. Stop while you're behind.

i think a lot of people would have taken this much more seriously if you didnt post those screenshots

like seriously what were you thinking

What if they're hacking in Plants vs Zombies? Would we need to ban them from TF2?

Context 100% matters. There's a reason why nobody cares that much. We're not here to police for other people. I've hacked in plenty of non-pvp games, yet I really doubt people would give me shit for it or care. If I hacked in a TF2 non-vac server I think people still wouldn't give a shit. If I hack in a VAC pub people would probably think I'm an asshole, but it ultimately doesn't affect them and if I got banned from the server it wouldn't matter anyway. Hacking in a comp match, then people should blow their shit because it's the TF2 comp community and we don't want cheaters in the comp setting. Everything outside the comp scene really shouldn't matter unless it's hilarious or matters a lot.

I don't see what the big deal about that is. I may have been wrong about the textures, I just know that they do not allow that in csgo and I was wrong to assume the same for tf2. The third one has a highly suspicious red model though, I see no other way to get that other than a cheat. The SMAC ban speaks for itself.

I tried to present all the evidence I could find.

At the very least, he should be placed on a watch list and kept under a careful eye.

I don't think people are doubting his alt hacked. People really just don't think he's hacking in matches or on his main account so there's nothing they can/should really do about it. SMAC ban registry can protect servers against him, but other than that nothing much will happen unless he starts hacking in matches or gets ESEA cheat banned (quite the rarity).

aight youre on my watchlist habib

u better watch the fuck out

That's exactly the point I was wanting to get across, whether I showed it well or not.

People were making it seem as if they did not think he hacked at all, which is not true. I'm just throwing this out there in case some more solid evidence comes up, there will be less of a doubt because he has clearly done it before.

My original intent was to collect further information until everybody started critisizing me. I should not have let it get to me.

Fair enough. Back in the old days, if we found someone cheating in any context they were banned from our leagues. There were no exceptions and people did not risk cheating because of it. I understand that ESEA and UGC do not enforce such things which probably means my way of thinking is old and out dated.

The saddest thing in this entire thread is the fact that we are two of the only people who get this reference

http://i.imgur.com/hXM3LB7.png?1

This, still, in no way says anything. It'd be more believable if the screen shot provided a player on the opposing team with the same texture layout. Personally, I don't know why his 3D player model looks like it does, but if it's supposed to be indicative of texture cheats, then it'd make more sense to provide a screenshot with members of the opposing team looking the same, which it doesn't. So your only defenses are a regularly used texture pack and an odd choice of coloring for a HUDs 3D model. Did you think this through?

The fucking excuse game has gone downhill, Remember how people used to defend themselves, Vhalin just had a little esp for PvZ, utaokuscot wanted wallhacks to cast better, Moose pleaded incompetence, Insom just cheated in csgo MM against other cheaters, pharaoh sold his LEM? smurf for 100 dollars and got his main acct vac because he used family sharing, So many more.

I will never understand the fucking "its just a pub XD" white knights. Its like people want to defend there own right to go cheat in pubs, Honestly fuck off you spastics.

I giggled myself too man, I thought everyone would forget by now rofl.

But overall, the start of this thread was horrible, all you did was bring up information from 3 screenshots that are old, and a skial thread is that is old. No demos, logs, or etc. of Hassassin cheating. I've been friends with the guy for a long time and he's always been one to try and improve his game, and always brings up the "It doesn't matter how many hours you have in the game, it's how you spend them" quote. When he MGEs he tries, when he DMs he tries, and when he plays matches he tries. If he ever did hack in pubs then that's just pubs and is irrelevant to competitive TF2 matches that matter to us. It's like using gameshark on the gameboy, many of us have done it before but it's a minor thing.

Agreed dude XDDD just a pub heh

clearly, we should all live in moral extremes of either wholly innocent or spawn of satan with no context beyond that like you instead

Nice, glad more people starting to see my point of view

idk why you consider this brand of flamebaiting to be very useful for any real discussion

Not trying to argue anything, but this is a complicated issue that I haven't made up my mind about.

It seems inconsistent with the VAC ban policy UGC and ETF2L have to let proven pub cheating go unpunished. It's easy to forgive someone for hacking in a pub months ago, and certainly it doesn't make them ineligible to compete. I just don't think it's fair if someone gets off completely free with admitted cheating. Simply put, cheating in a multiplayer environment is wrong and should be punished in some way.

UGC's rule:

ETF2L has a similar but harsher rule

Any proven cheater should be treated as if they're the not-so-proud owner of a VAC ban, otherwise we're saying "go ahead as long as your cheat is undetected". And we all know how common undetected TF2 cheats are. The purpose of the rules is to show that the competitive community of UGC and ETF2L does not tolerate people who cheat in TF2, period. I think it's important for all organizations to be willing to put their foot down against cheaters, since Valve has not been effective at this. UGC is trying to do its part to keep TF2 clean, not just the league itself.

These rules have been in place during the alleged offense, and Hassassin appears to be in violation of the intent of these rules, even without an actual VAC ban. At the same time, there seems to be plenty of reason to believe his competitive career is squeaky clean. Not sure what the appropriate action here is, but doing nothing doesn't sit right with me. Input is appreciated.

i cheat in fallout 4 o.O am i getting banned