#3210
Overclocking yes/no?
When are you going to build it?

#3212
I'm guessing that's a no for overclocking?
Can you be a bit more specific with the "other shooters"? Getting 60 fps on low in CS:GO is quite different from getting 120 fps on high in Quake Champions even though neither is particularly intense graphically.

Didn't really plan/thought about overclocking so probably no
Mostly Kovaak, Quake Live, zombie mode on Black Ops 1/3.
I don't play triple A and generally run low graphic settings on every game I play.
Constantly running TF2 above 144 (and up) is a must though if I achieved that with my shitty old laptop I'm guessing it should be manageable nowadays.
I don't stream and don't plan to.

Ok, assuming you don't want to wait until summer for new CPUs there are a few options.

No overclocking would mean something like this with a CPU between an i3-8100 and an i7-8700, depending on how much you're willing to spend.
https://fr.pcpartpicker.com/list/6XmFV6
https://fr.pcpartpicker.com/list/ZBfFV6
Keep in mind that it's mostly about clockrate so the difference won't even be that much. Even the 8100 would be enough for your purposes.
At that point going with an AMD CPU with higher clockrate and faster RAM will probably work out to around the same or better performance at a lower price.

Now if you want faster RAM because it does help in TF2 you need a Z370/Z390 mobo and at that point adding a cheap cooler and switching to a 8350K would allow you to overclock. Or go all the way with a decent mobo and cooler and an i5-9600K. Way overkill but obviously significantly better and still doable with your budget. https://fr.pcpartpicker.com/list/fQ3mtg

So think about it, if you don't want to invest the time needed for overclocking a ~650€ build will do what you want it to do just fine. I mean if your old laptop was fast enough this is guaranteed to be more than fast enough.
Basically what I'm saying is it's not worth paying for the option of overclocking and a few percent more performance if you end up not doing it and would be content with less so I'm asking you if you'd also open to spending less than 900€ even though it means you're not getting the latest and greatest, the best upgrade possible within your budget. I mean you can buy a FreeSync monitor or whatever you want with the leftover money.

HDD can be added if you need more than 500GB, case depends on your preferences more than on anything else. I went with µATX because why not. No need for a bigger case.

I have about $800 to upgrade most of my computer. I'm saving ssds/hdd, case, cooler and gpu (1060 6gb).

I have no idea how to pick a mobo and I'm not sure if it makes sense to upgrade to an nvme m.2 ssd.

PCPartPicker part list: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/J2WrbX
Price breakdown by merchant: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/J2WrbX/by_merchant/

CPU: Intel - Core i7-8700K 3.7 GHz 6-Core Processor ($365.99 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: MSI - MAG Z390 TOMAHAWK ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($152.96 @ Amazon)
Memory: G.Skill - Trident Z 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-4000 Memory ($190.98 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - EVO Edition 620 W 80+ Bronze Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($41.98 @ Newegg)
Total: $751.91

What's the goal of the upgrade?

A good NVMe SSD that's actually fast will cost you so you'll have to give up other things (do you really need 4000 MHz RAM?) if you want to make it happen within that budget. If you're not doing anything with a shit ton of random reads/writes the difference between a good SATA SSD and a reasonably priced NVMe SSD isn't nearly as noticeable as the upgrade from an HDD to an SSD.

We'll deal with the mobo later. If you want to overclock you'll need a good cooler. If you don't then a lot of this build should be changed.

Most everything I'm replacing is 5+ years old and I'd like to get better fps in a lot of new games + improve speed generally. I don't really do anything crazy on my computer, the most intense things are gaming and occasionally streaming.

I really don't know what kind of ram makes sense.

I have an h100i cooler, and I think it's still really good and not in need of replacement. It just occurred to me that the block might not be the right size for the new cpu socket.

Then maybe an NVMe SSD could make sense. Current SSD?

Also what's your current CPU? Unless it's pretty bad I don't see how upgrading it would improve fps in new games.
Any examples of what games you'd be playing and how many fps on what settings you're getting and how many you want?

Intel socket size hasn't changed in the past 5 years so the cooler will still fit.

My current ssd is a Samsung 850 evo 500 gb.

Current cpu is 4670k. The most stressful game for my pc is apex and with everything low at 720p I get about 90 fps.

#3220
I believe the 4- k series is seriously under powered for most AAA games now a days.
I would advise an upgraded cpu + whatever, but correct me if I am wrong.

your ssd is good enough to do anything....

correct me if im wrong please

.

#3220
That's a decent SSD so NVMe would be an upgrade but not game changin like HDD->SSD.

Apex is a bit difficult to benchmark (much lower fps in MP than in the benchmark), but that still seems a bit low.
Are you sure that nothing is throttling?

Either way I don't think that the CPU is the problem here.
Probably the most comprehensive and realistic benchmark would be this:
https://www.computerbase.de/2019-04/apex-legends-leserbenchmarks/
These are max settings but you can see that it's pretty much sorted exclusively by GPU performance.
Most interesting results in your case:
GTX 1060 CD, R5 2600, W10
69,4
GTX 1060 FE, i9-9900K, W10
64,0

and

RX 580 CD, E3-1240v2, W10
80,5
RX 580 CD, R5 2600 OC, W10
79,0
RX 580 CD, i9-9900K, W10
76,5
RX 480 CD, R5 1600X, W10
76,0

In both cases the slowes CPU gets the highest fps because it's paired with the fastest GPU.
Aftermarket 1060 > Founder's Edition 1060.
580 only slightly faster than a 480 with the 9900K doing fuck all.
Different 580s with different clockrates getting different results and a 1240v2 (slower than the 4670K apart from Hyperthreading) easily beating a 9900K.

Apart from higher minimum fps more threads don't see to do that much either so I really don't think that's the problem.
https://www.dsogaming.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Apex-Legends-CPU.png
That's with a 4930K, faster than the 1240v2 but slower than the 4670K assuming you overclocked it even slightly, except for the core/thread count.
So with the exception of minimum fps the 4670K should not be slower than a 1240v2 (or 4930K with 4C/8T) enabled and those are GPU bound at max settings 1080p with a 1060/580 and should easily get over 100 fps on 720p.

EDIT:
After looking at some 720p/1080p and High/Low benchmarks scaling seems to be dogshit, going from 1080p High to 720p Low doesn't get you much more fps.
So the computerbase benchmark is fairly accurate and 60-65 fps on 1080p High translate to the 90-ish fps you're getting on 720p Low.

Conclusion: It's the GPU.

#3221
If the 4670K is seriously underpowered then what CPU isn't?

Not sure if there are SSDs that can't do something.

#3222
Well what's the build going to be used for and when are you going to buy the parts?
New CPUs this summer and all that.

So how should I upgrade?

I'm guessing your current mobo doesn't support M.2 SSDs and it wouldn't be that much of an upgrade anyway so just keep your current SSD.
EDIT: If you really want an upgrade though and got enough money left over (depends on the GPU) you can look for one of the cheaper PCIe SSDs.

Overclock if you haven't already. Overclock higher if you already have. :D

Buy a new GPU. Considering your budget you can get anything, it's just a matter of how many fps you think you'll need/want. E.g. if you want twice the fps or a bit more then get a 1080 Ti or 2080.

Hello my old pc has died after a solid 9 years so i need to invest in a new one, i know very little about computers so any help is appreciated!

I have a budget of 800€ (+100 if really needed), i also have monitors (1x 144hz + 1x 4k) and peripherals + a relatively new m.2 ssd with 128gb if that works. I only play tf2, quake3/quake live but i want to play Stellaris. I'm fine with not running the games on high settings too but i do want to be able to use dx9 comfortably in tf2.

I will also run linux on it. Thanks!!

You don't need an HDD either?
Linux should be compatible with more or less all desktop parts, so you don't need to worry about that.
Stellaris will run like dogshit in the endgame on any hardware so you don't need to worry about that either.

I'm guessing you'll want to build this asap?
Only one question left, overclocking yes/no?

I will probably want an hdd since the ssd is small. I have never overclocked a computer but if it isn't too hard and you recommend it; sure. I have also been looking at the Node 202 case and it looks pretty cool, do you have any thoughts on it? It is pretty small after all.

And yes i will buy and build it ASAP, thanks for your answer!

edit: Actually i realized that i have a msata ssd and not an m.2 ssd, does that matter for the build? i can buy a new ssd if it matters, i know very little about computer hardware.

Yeah. 1TB or more?
Probably wouldn't overclock if you're going for such a small form factor.
Keep in mind that at that size everything's a bit tight an the build process is a bit more difficult. I generally recommend µATX because full ATX is usually a waste of space, but mini-ITX is possible. Just be aware that this will massively limit your choice of mainboards and coolers and potentially limit your choice of GPUs. The mainboards will be more expensive and the coolers of that size will obviously be limited in what they can do so overclocking can be fairly limited up to almost impossible.
Maybe look up the sizes of small µATX cases that are still easy enough to build in (20-30L volume) and compare that with the 10-15L category of mini-ITX that you're looking at right now. You don't gain that much so unless space is really tight I wouldn't recommend it.

Technically yes, practically no. M.2 has basically replaced mSATA so you'll need an adapter but it shouldn't change the rest of the build. Which model is it anyway? Maybe if the budget allows for it you could get an upgrade anyway.

1 TB should be enough.
Nvm the smallest form factor if it limits the performance for my budget, what is a normal price for a computer chassi? Looking at the µATX size but the prize-range is anywhere between 50 € and 150 €.

The msata ssd is a Samsung 850 EVO with 250 gb actually so i'd prefer getting an adapter over buying a new ssd considering the size and cost.

Yes, those are normal prices. Depends on what you want/need.

Yes, makes more sense to keep it then.

Also shouldn't your budget be in Skr?

I'll make a partlist later today or tomorrow.

Well it should be in sek i suppose but since 10 sek ≈ 1 euro it's easy to convert and i figured it was easier for most people to get the hang of budget and prices in general if it's in euro.

Alright, thanks a lot for all the help.

For overclocking:
https://se.pcpartpicker.com/list/zdxRcY
Not overclocking:
https://se.pcpartpicker.com/list/3PKKw6

Note that these lists are garbage because pcp sucks so I'll redo them properly once you've decided on which path to take.
I mean look at the shipping and great variety of shops used.

It would be really easy to reduce the price by dropping down to a cheaper GPU because everything you want to play would run on a toaster. Similarly 16 GB is actually unnecessary.
The 2600X is basically pointless, it just fit within the budget. If you're trying to save money we can go way lower there.
Also the 8350K (last years model) is quite a bit cheaper but not that much slower if you overclock (and you really should since you'd be paying for it on both CPU, mobo and cooler).

I forgot to mention it but a 2 TB HDD costs <50% more than a 1 TB HDD so if you think you'll need it eventually it's better to get it now.

Basically two questions:
1. Do you want to max out CPU performance, because that's the only thing that'll do anything* or do you want 80-90% of the performance for half the price?
*And even then it's only TF2 and Stellaris, I'm pretty sure Quake 3 runs on actual toasters at this point.

2. Do you want to use up the budget for niceties like a better GPU that will come in handy in other games that actually use it or do you want to keep it as cheap as possible?

In that case an 8350K should be ok, i would go with overclocking if the difference is so small anyways. I'd rather save the money. 1 TB is good enough. I do want 16 GB ram though, since i've had too little amount for so long i'd rather splurge and get a good amount now.

1. I'd rather get 80-90 % of the performance for half the price.

2. Don't necessarily want to be as cheap as possible but the only other games i have in consideration is borderlands 3 but it doesn't run on linux. edit: maybe it runs via proton? not too sure about it though.

The 8350K isn't the half price option, even though it is cheaper.
I'd say we stick with the 570 because it's quite cheap for the performance and borderlands 3 at least won't be completely unplayable with it. Kind of hard to tell before release.

I haven't paid attention to shops so this could be optimized further but it should work out to around 8000 SEK. Cheaper cooler and RAM would bring it down further if needed.
The case is also up to you, there should be enough reasonable choices with the budget I allocated for it.

https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=4447770
https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=3545926
https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=4957065
https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=3723899

Pick whichever is cheaper once shipping is taken into account for all parts.
https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=3795740
https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=3313393

https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=4290357
https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=4342401
https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=3565494

EDIT: I didn't put it in the list but I'm pretty sure you can find an mSATA > SATA adapter on your own.

Thanks for the help with the computer i have ordered all the parts now. I decided to go with the 2600X after all and switched case but other than that i went with your recommendations, now i just need to wait. :-)

edit: bought 2600X since 8350K+cooler was the same price as it but 2600X is newer, don't know if i did the better choice but we'll see!

Ok sorry, I misread that. I wanted to get a partlist done asap so you could approve or disapprove and I could make the final corrections and you could build soon.
I went with the 8350K but you just misunderstood and really wanted the significantly cheaper option (you even wrote that).

Anyway I hope you changed the mobo as well.
I'm not sure about RAM compatibility, the 2600X (Zen in general) is a bit picky.

The 2600X isn't faster because it's newer, it just got more threads but is slower per thread. In GPU limited games it won't make a difference and in most CPU limited (including TF2) it will be slower than an overclocked 8350K unless you're streaming. It was in the initial list mostly to demonstrate what's the best you can get with the 8000/9000 budget.
The cheap option would've been a 2400G or even just 2200G and overclocking it with the stock cooler (the AMD stock coolers are good enough for that). That should be as fast as a similarly overclocked 2600X in most games and be vastly cheaper. If you ordered the 2600X from a different shop you can still easily changed that so I'd do it.
The 2400G will be closer to the 2600X should a game use more than 4 threads (not TF2), but other than that the 2200G should perform mostly the same.

Do you mind me asking which case you went with?

Hm ok well i decided to go with the 2600X because a friend has a similar version and recommended it.

I did not change mobo or ram I was not aware that it mattered when changing from 8350K honestly but nothing has been shipped so I can still change everything.

I also picked the more expensive version because I totally forgot that I worked in the beginning of last month and will actually get paid after all this week.

I went with fractal design define mini c for the case.

edit: guess I fucked up, after searching a bit it does seem like the mobo isn’t compatible with 2600X oops. Guess I gotta change my order, the ram seems to be alright with 2600X though.

Ok, so the fastest would be 9350KF if you want that. No other changes necessary.
Cheapest would be 2200G/2400G and mobo
https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=4891812
or slightly better
https://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=4891729
I'd go with the second one for the 2600X if you want to overclock it.

RAM is not about physically fitting in this case, but about actually running at the rated frequency without crashing.
I can look that up later for those two mobos.

I wouldn't get the 2600X just because someone bought something similar. I mean the 2200G/2400G are also similar.

In that case isn’t it just better to go with 8350k + cooler than 9350kf? The latter is as expensive without a cooler. Tbh I might just go with the 8350k + cooler and overclock it just like you originally said. Sorry for the annoyance lol.

edit: or stay on the 2600X and change mobo and maybe ram, damn I can’t decide. I guess 2600x would be more future proof though(?)

I am aware that it isn’t about physically fitting.

Thanks again for bearing with me and helping with the build.

The idea is 9350KF + cooler and then overclock it anyway. 4.6 GHz vs 4.0 stock so you should get a slightly higher overclock.

Future proof for what? TF2 is still not going to use 6 cores in 2020. Unless you'd be streaming/rendering it's really just the choice between cheaper and slower quadcore (2x00G) or more expensive but faster quadcore (8350K/9350KF).

The only other option would be to wait slightly longer for the 9300/9320 to become available and drop overclocking. B instead of Z mobo, no cooler because it's included and you can't overclock, cheaper RAM because Intel doesn't allow >2666 MHz on B mobos and you'd be looking at about the same price as a 2400G combo but with better performance.

Hello,

I'm thinking of converting my current PC to mini ITX with the ghost S1 mini.

My question is that I wanna continue using my i7 8700k with this mini itx rig. I would like to be able to overclock if possible. Is there a good low profile air cooler that would be able to overclock i7 8700k? doesnt have to be a massive overclock. Currently looking at Cryorig C7 and Noctua NH-L9i. I understand that it might not be possible and the suggestion below is better.
CPU Heatsink: Up to 66 mm

Alternatively get the large top hat for the case and get water cooling (I'd like to use aircooler more since my intention is to bring the machine to lans and I'm a bit frightened to move the pc around with a water cooler inside).
WATER COOLING: 240 mm AIO radiator thickness 31.5 mm, 2 x 25 mm high fans w. L TopHat

List of specs I will reuse
ASUS ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2070 8GB OC Gaming
Intel Core i7-8700K
Corsair Vengeance LPX Black 16GB (2x8GB) 3000MHz DDR4
SSD

What I need to get
PSU > Corsair SF600 (if 600w is enough)
Mini ITX mobo (ASUS ROG STRIX H370-I)
Cpu cooler ?
Case (Ghost S1 Mini)

If you have any suggestions for anything else that I've mentioned I'm open to it!
Thanks!