DrHappinessGood job comparing people giving critique to mental illness, really makes you seem like the reasonable one here.
TynnyriI really hope the community doesn't only agree/disagree based on my playtime or my address, that's just sign of mild alexithymia
If people disagreed based on playtime, that is a sign of mild alexithymia.
I really hoped people didn't disagree based on playtime
I really hoped people didn't have mild alexithymia.
Alexithymia is a disability to form opinions. This is what you first described; Claiming most opinions here were formed on my playtime or steam reviews.
DrHappinessEven your definition of overcentralization makes little sense ... 'Centre', [of] it would merely shift
DrHappinessYour analogy didn't go over peoples heads, it made no sense.
These quotes show failures to grasp basic language and previous definitions.
You seem to lack the reading skills or/and the ability to do deductive reasoning. I don't know which it is or if it's both. Always possible you were just tired or have a reading disability, or just a bad day. Nonetheless, I hope we can discuss this when you get better.
[quote=DrHappiness]
Good job comparing people giving critique to mental illness, really makes you seem like the reasonable one here.
[/quote]
[quote=Tynnyri]I really hope the community doesn't only agree/disagree based on my playtime or my address, that's just sign of mild alexithymia [/quote]
If people disagreed based on playtime, that is a sign of mild alexithymia.
I really hoped people didn't disagree based on playtime
I really hoped people didn't have mild alexithymia.
Alexithymia is a disability to form opinions. This is what you first described; Claiming most opinions here were formed on my playtime or steam reviews.
[quote=DrHappiness]
Even your definition of overcentralization makes little sense ... 'Centre', [of] it would merely shift
[/quote]
[quote=DrHappiness]Your analogy didn't go over peoples heads, it made no sense.[/quote]
These quotes show failures to grasp basic language and previous definitions.
You seem to lack the reading skills or/and the ability to do deductive reasoning. I don't know which it is or if it's both. Always possible you were just tired or have a reading disability, or just a bad day. Nonetheless, I hope we can discuss this when you get better.
springrollsIs it because of solidified social norms or a sense of entitlement or elitism; or might it be perhaps that balancing competitive TF2 is far more complicated than simply unbanning the Scorch Shot or only running Class Limit 1.
TF2 is difficult to balance because either:
1. We are all entitled or elitist pricks.
2. TF2 balance is complicated.
I chose 2:
tacocatTynnyriIt's hard to keep seriously competitive for the reasons I outlined before. As you said, 17 years of a competitive scene - and where is it now?
I mean you are coming in here shitting on a format that you clearly have never tried or played in a serious setting, people wont treat you seriously, especially when you are blaming the format for the scene being small which is genuinely the worst take you can have.
Seems like you had some dissatisfaction with my choice. I don't think you guys are entitled. But you can always disagree, that's fine with me.
Maybe you quoted the wrong part? Your reply really comes off as you insulting everyone present.
[quote=springrolls]Is it because of solidified social norms or a sense of entitlement or elitism; or might it be perhaps that balancing competitive TF2 is far more complicated than simply unbanning the Scorch Shot or only running Class Limit 1. [/quote]
TF2 is difficult to balance because either:
1. We are all entitled or elitist pricks.
2. TF2 balance is complicated.
I chose 2:
[quote=tacocat][quote=Tynnyri]It's hard to keep seriously competitive for the reasons I outlined before. As you said, 17 years of a competitive scene - and where is it now?[/quote]
I mean you are coming in here shitting on a format that you clearly have never tried or played in a serious setting, people wont treat you seriously, especially when you are blaming the format for the scene being small which is genuinely the worst take you can have.[/quote]
Seems like you had some dissatisfaction with my choice. I don't think you guys are entitled. But you can always disagree, that's fine with me.
Maybe you quoted the wrong part? Your reply really comes off as you insulting everyone present.
CollaideGuys, I don't get why chess grandmasters don't just play the bongcloud every game. I think it's great fun and it offers unique strategies, and also they're too stuck in their simple-minded "chess theory". I beat everyone I play in elo 400 with the bongcloud!
you jest but amount of bongclouds by top chessmasters has slowly increased over time. funniest shit I've seen
[quote=Collaide]Guys, I don't get why chess grandmasters don't just play the bongcloud every game. I think it's great fun and it offers unique strategies, and also they're too stuck in their simple-minded "chess theory". I beat everyone I play in elo 400 with the bongcloud![/quote]
you jest but amount of bongclouds by top chessmasters has slowly increased over time. funniest shit I've seen
Incredible Things Are Happening At Team Fortress Dot Television...
Incredible Things Are Happening At Team Fortress Dot Television...
TynnyriThese quotes show failures to grasp basic language and previous definitions.
You seem to lack the reading skills or/and the ability to do deductive reasoning. I don't know which it is or if it's both. Always possible you were just tired or have a reading disability, or just a bad day. Nonetheless, I hope we can discuss this when you get better.
This is so funny when you consider DrHappiness literally did a PhD
[quote=Tynnyri]
These quotes show failures to grasp basic language and previous definitions.
You seem to lack the reading skills or/and the ability to do deductive reasoning. I don't know which it is or if it's both. Always possible you were just tired or have a reading disability, or just a bad day. Nonetheless, I hope we can discuss this when you get better.[/quote]
This is so funny when you consider DrHappiness literally did a PhD
SurnyThis is so funny when you consider DrHappiness literally did a PhD
Then it's most likely just a bad day. We all have those.
[quote=Surny]This is so funny when you consider DrHappiness literally did a PhD[/quote]
Then it's most likely just a bad day. We all have those.
I'd suggest you do literally anything else with your time but it sounds like you don't enjoy anything very much.
I'd suggest you do literally anything else with your time but it sounds like you don't enjoy anything very much.
YrrI'd suggest you do literally anything else with your time but it sounds like you don't enjoy anything very much.
I like a lot of things, you wouldn't know about any of that by creeping around my profile. That's why normally people have a conversation instead.
It's ironic to criticize my personality when you're doing this type of behavior. Take your own advice, creep.
PS: This is a fairly noncontroversial 6v6 discussion thread. Take a walk and really think about how creepy you are for randomly going into someone's profile with express goal of finding dirt on them.
[quote=Yrr]I'd suggest you do literally anything else with your time but it sounds like you don't enjoy anything very much.[/quote]
I like a lot of things, you wouldn't know about any of that by creeping around my profile. That's why normally people have a [b]conversation[/b] instead.
It's ironic to criticize my personality when you're doing this type of behavior. Take your own advice, creep.
[i]PS: This is a fairly noncontroversial 6v6 discussion thread. Take a walk and really think about how creepy you are for randomly going into someone's profile with express goal of finding dirt on them.[/i]
this is the best thread in a while
this is the best thread in a while
Bro why are u so obsessed with calling everyone a creep lmao
Bro why are u so obsessed with calling everyone a creep lmao
Tynnyri
I like a lot of things, you wouldn't know about any of that by creeping around my profile. That's why normally people have a conversation instead.
It's ironic to criticize my personality when you're doing this type of behavior. Take your own advice, creep.
PS: This is a fairly noncontroversial 6v6 discussion thread. Take a walk and really think about how creepy you are for randomly going into someone's profile with express goal of finding dirt on them.
I'll be honest mate you've got a bit of an unhealthy obsession with accusing people of being creeps despite your reasonably anonymous internet footprint compared to whatever you do away from the screen.
If you've ever worked for a corporate, likely you'd be familiar with linkedin - it's pretty common for getting a background or introduction on people you've never met before but might have an interest in interacting with.
Same with recruitment both external and internal - Any profile linked to your internet footprint might be looked at by those interested in employing you to build up a bit of your overall profile and whether you'll fit in, both qualification and personality wise. Does it not make sense if you're stirring the pot with controversial views people might have an interest in your experiences and qualifications to make those judgements?
It's the reality of the connected world we live in that you're putting a lot of data out there about yourself, and linking it in very simple ways. Not creepy in any way tbh, just regulate what you want to and do not want to share on whatever platform and leave it at that.
[quote=Tynnyri]
I like a lot of things, you wouldn't know about any of that by creeping around my profile. That's why normally people have a [b]conversation[/b] instead.
It's ironic to criticize my personality when you're doing this type of behavior. Take your own advice, creep.
[i]PS: This is a fairly noncontroversial 6v6 discussion thread. Take a walk and really think about how creepy you are for randomly going into someone's profile with express goal of finding dirt on them.[/i][/quote]
I'll be honest mate you've got a bit of an unhealthy obsession with accusing people of being creeps despite your reasonably anonymous internet footprint compared to whatever you do away from the screen.
If you've ever worked for a corporate, likely you'd be familiar with linkedin - it's pretty common for getting a background or introduction on people you've never met before but might have an interest in interacting with.
Same with recruitment both external and internal - Any profile linked to your internet footprint might be looked at by those interested in employing you to build up a bit of your overall profile and whether you'll fit in, both qualification and personality wise. Does it not make sense if you're stirring the pot with controversial views people might have an interest in your experiences and qualifications to make those judgements?
It's the reality of the connected world we live in that you're putting a lot of data out there about yourself, and linking it in very simple ways. Not creepy in any way tbh, just regulate what you want to and do not want to share on whatever platform and leave it at that.
Faust_3It's the reality of the connected world we live in that you're putting a lot of data out there about yourself, and linking it in very simple ways. Not creepy in any way tbh, just regulate what you want to and do not want to share on whatever platform and leave it at that.
Wait, do you do this to everyone you talk to? Do you follow people home to know their address? After all, it is technically public information; They shouldn't have let you follow them.
Faust_3Does it not make sense if you're stirring the pot with controversial views people might have an interest in your experiences and qualifications to make those judgements?
No. I didn't use my qualifications to make a point. Nobody asked or dared you to act this way. You and the others chose to act this way. First step for getting help is accepting that there is a problem. Being called creepy for this should be a wake-up call.
Faust_3might be looked at by those interested in employing you to build up a bit of your overall profile.
No, that's not normal. Please find help. This is textbook obsessive behavior. A healthy mind doesn't think like this. Please find help. This is not a personal attack, I am not mad at you; seriously, find help now.
[quote=Faust_3]It's the reality of the connected world we live in that you're putting a lot of data out there about yourself, and linking it in very simple ways. Not creepy in any way tbh, just regulate what you want to and do not want to share on whatever platform and leave it at that.[/quote]
Wait, do you do this to everyone you talk to? Do you follow people home to know their address? After all, it is technically public information; They shouldn't have let you follow them.
[quote=Faust_3]Does it not make sense if you're stirring the pot with controversial views people might have an interest in your experiences and qualifications to make those judgements?[/quote]
No. I didn't use my qualifications to make a point. Nobody asked or dared you to act this way. You and the others chose to act this way. First step for getting help is accepting that there is a problem. Being called creepy for this should be a wake-up call.
[quote=Faust_3]might be looked at by those interested in employing you to build up a bit of your overall profile.[/quote]
No, that's not normal. Please find help. This is textbook obsessive behavior. A healthy mind doesn't think like this. Please find help. [b]This is not a personal attack, I am not mad at you; seriously, find help now.[/b]
Tynnyri
No, that's not normal. Please find help. This is textbook obsessive behavior. A healthy mind doesn't think like this. Please find help. This is not a personal attack, I am not mad at you; seriously, find help now.
Sorry I think my point flew a bit over your head here, never did I state I've even looked at your tftv profile, you just made some wildly flawed assumptions.
I'm explaining the reality of a connected world, and how if you interact with employment in the real world, there's likely a lot of available data on you as well.
Considering you're trying to take the high road and declare as fact over anybody heres mental state or wellbeing pretty much indicates you have no self awareness over anything you've said. I was literally just educating you on the reality of how engrained personal data is in the framework of modern society, and you should take steps to minimise your exposure if you aren't comefortable with that, but evidently that's not a point you're willing to concede. Hope you live a fulfilling and contented life
[quote=Tynnyri]
No, that's not normal. Please find help. This is textbook obsessive behavior. A healthy mind doesn't think like this. Please find help. [b]This is not a personal attack, I am not mad at you; seriously, find help now.[/b][/quote]
Sorry I think my point flew a bit over your head here, never did I state I've even looked at your tftv profile, you just made some wildly flawed assumptions.
I'm explaining the reality of a connected world, and how if you interact with employment in the real world, there's likely a lot of available data on you as well.
Considering you're trying to take the high road and declare as fact over anybody heres mental state or wellbeing pretty much indicates you have no self awareness over anything you've said. I was literally just educating you on the reality of how engrained personal data is in the framework of modern society, and you should take steps to minimise your exposure if you aren't comefortable with that, but evidently that's not a point you're willing to concede. Hope you live a fulfilling and contented life
"despite your reasonably anonymous internet footprint" and "never did I state I've even looked at your profile"
Anyway, at least obsess over TF2 6v6 class limits instead. Only if we had a thread for that...
"despite your reasonably anonymous internet footprint" and "never did I state I've even looked at your profile"
Anyway, at least obsess over TF2 6v6 class limits instead. Only if we had a thread for that...
hey this thread got a bit derailed...
instead of typing more paragraphs speculating balancing, why don't you just spend 30 minutes or an hour and set up a pug/scrim/pugscrim with your desired ruleset changes
play the game; it's the best way to analyze fun/skill/stalemateyness. post the log/vod/player feedback
if you're unwilling to play it, then there's no point in your argument. Until then, I think that any further discussion is silly
hey this thread got a bit derailed...
instead of typing more paragraphs speculating balancing, why don't you just spend 30 minutes or an hour and set up a pug/scrim/pugscrim with your desired ruleset changes
play the game; it's the best way to analyze fun/skill/stalemateyness. post the log/vod/player feedback
if you're unwilling to play it, then there's no point in your argument. Until then, I think that any further discussion is silly
You're continuing to act like 6v6 class limits have not been bought up 50 million times before.
Everytime someone in this thread, who has significantly more experience in the game refutes your arguments, you call them a creep??
Like genuinely what else are you trying to accomplish by continuing to post in this thread?
You're continuing to act like 6v6 class limits have not been bought up 50 million times before.
Everytime someone in this thread, who has significantly more experience in the game refutes your arguments, you call them a creep??
Like genuinely what else are you trying to accomplish by continuing to post in this thread?
flyingbuddy Everytime someone in this thread, who has significantly more experience in the game refutes your arguments, you call them a creep??
I didn't do that. I had pretty good discussions with some people earlier.
Just check the post history, this community has pretty weird behavior. Checked some other posts too, this seems to be normal for you guys.
[quote=flyingbuddy] Everytime someone in this thread, who has significantly more experience in the game refutes your arguments, you call them a creep??[/quote]
I didn't do that. I had pretty good discussions with some people earlier.
Just check the post history, this community has pretty weird behavior. Checked some other posts too, this seems to be normal for you guys.
Buddy, you're starting to creep me out with your obsessive posting. This is a small community where everyone knows each other, why should we welcome you with open arms? Your constant pestering and jostling of my neighbours is really starting to creep me out, so cut it out? Go for a nice bike ride or something bro please.
Buddy, you're starting to creep me out with your obsessive posting. This is a small community where everyone knows each other, why should we welcome you with open arms? Your constant pestering and jostling of my neighbours is really starting to creep me out, so cut it out? Go for a nice bike ride or something bro please.
I'm honestly kneeling at the absolutely masterful display of trolling, nothing has made him drop the act.
Basing your entire online existence around being a contrarian and obsessively posting in a thread all day long to armchair diagnose people with mental illnesses really is an interesting idea.
I'm honestly kneeling at the absolutely masterful display of trolling, nothing has made him drop the act.
Basing your entire online existence around being a contrarian and obsessively posting in a thread all day long to armchair diagnose people with mental illnesses really is an interesting idea.
SurnyI'm honestly kneeling at the absolutely masterful display of trolling, nothing has made him drop the act.
Basing your entire online existence around being a contrarian and obsessively posting in a thread all day long to armchair diagnose people with mental illnesses really is an interesting idea.
MakBuddy, you're starting to creep me out with your obsessive posting. This is a small community where everyone knows each other, why should we welcome you with open arms? Your constant pestering and jostling of my neighbours is really starting to creep me out, so cut it out? Go for a nice bike ride or something bro please.
https://imgur.com/a/zgtKoVA
Here, tell me what you think of this simple guide.
[quote=Surny]I'm honestly kneeling at the absolutely masterful display of trolling, nothing has made him drop the act.
Basing your entire online existence around being a contrarian and obsessively posting in a thread all day long to armchair diagnose people with mental illnesses really is an interesting idea.[/quote]
[quote=Mak]Buddy, you're starting to creep me out with your obsessive posting. This is a small community where everyone knows each other, why should we welcome you with open arms? Your constant pestering and jostling of my neighbours is really starting to creep me out, so cut it out? Go for a nice bike ride or something bro please.[/quote]
https://imgur.com/a/zgtKoVA
Here, tell me what you think of this simple guide.
can this thread be locked lmao
can this thread be locked lmao
yeah thats probably for the best
yeah thats probably for the best
TynnyriThese quotes show failures to grasp basic language
"If people disagreed based on playtime, that is a sign of mild alexithymia." No comma should be used connecting a subordinate clause to a main one if the subordinate clause follows the main.
"I really hoped people didn't disagree based on playtime" Hope in simple past tense requires "would" as an auxiliary verb.
"I really hoped people didn't have mild alexithymia." Same as above.
"This is what you first described; Claiming ..." Incorrect use of semi-colon, a colon is used to introduce a quotation.
"These quotes show failures" Failure is generally an uncountable noun, except with specific conditions not met here.
"You seem to lack the reading skills or/and" The grammatical conjunction is "and/or".
"Always possible you were just tired or have a reading disability" A listing comma should be used instead of "or".
[quote=Tynnyri]
These quotes show failures to grasp basic language [/quote]
[b]"If people disagreed based on playtime, that is a sign of mild alexithymia."[/b] No comma should be used connecting a subordinate clause to a main one if the subordinate clause follows the main.
[b]"I really hoped people didn't disagree based on playtime"[/b] Hope in simple past tense requires "would" as an auxiliary verb.
[b]"I really hoped people didn't have mild alexithymia."[/b] Same as above.
[b]"This is what you first described; Claiming ..."[/b] Incorrect use of semi-colon, a colon is used to introduce a quotation.
[b]"These quotes show failures"[/b] Failure is generally an uncountable noun, except with specific conditions not met here.
[b]"You seem to lack the reading skills or/and"[/b] The grammatical conjunction is "and/or".
[b]"Always possible you were just tired or have a reading disability"[/b] A listing comma should be used instead of "or".
dempsey"Always possible you were just tired or have a reading disability" A listing comma should be used instead of "or".
I was talking about syllogisms and definitions (without the two its hard to have a discussion on any topic), not about grammar at all (which rarely affects discussions that much) but thanks anyway for your input.
[quote=dempsey]
[b]"Always possible you were just tired or have a reading disability"[/b] A listing comma should be used instead of "or".[/quote]
I was talking about syllogisms and definitions (without the two its hard to have a discussion on any topic), not about grammar at all (which rarely affects discussions that much) but thanks anyway for your input.
Tynnyri Why class limits are important:
Triathlons are made of 3 sports everyone competes in: Swimming, biking and running. A competitor has to be a good in all 3 to get first place. If a Olympic-level runner saw that sport, they would vote to ban swimming. They can vote to do that of course: Make swimming shorter, make it count for less. That would give competitive advantage to the Olympic runners, and they would enjoy that a lot.
Good runners would naturally want to win by removing the other 2, and running is more popular than swimming, so they could easily vote swimming away from triathlons. But triathlon without the 3 sports is no longer a triathlon
What I am trying to say, is that 6v6's current rules, through votes of the majority, haven't been constructed with TF2 in mind, they have been created with Scout and Soldier in mind. And being good at anything else is - despite being core part of TF2 - not fun for the people who are exceptionally good Scouts and Soldiers. And while I understand the sentiment that fun comes first, that goes both ways: Why would non-Scout players and non-Soldier players find it fun to play a format that focuses so much on those classes?
I understand completely, learning new skills and adapting to a changing landscape might not always be fun. But that is the heart of competition, and that's where fun should be derived in a competitive setting. Any "fun" that is derived from no need to learn, adapt or improve isn't competitive.
6v6 is not a natural competitive development
My harping on Scout and Soldier might seem arbitrary and unfair. That is fine. Let's discuss objectively the consequences the class limit rules and how they affect game.
In Highlander, every class has restriction of 1. With 9 players, this forces 1 of each class. However, highlander never seems to devolve into a stalemate where neither team is attacking or defending. The "flow" of a match is pretty similar to a casual match in this regard; Both teams slowly poke at each other, then explosive high-value picks (Heavy, Demo, Medic) ensue, the winning team pushes the advantage and the teamfight is quickly over. (Of course it is more nuanced than this)
However, the consensus in 6v6 seems to be that allowing heavies or pyros to even be viable (which is the sole reason given for Fists of Steel, Detonator, and Scorch Shot bans), will eventually lead to a slow, boring meta.
But that makes no sense. Highlander seems fine with these weapons. Sniper can easily kill Heavies, and Pyros lose against all hitscan weapons. So why can't a team break through a stalemate by switching classes to, for example, Sniper? (who counters both Pyro and Heavy) Most issues with stalemates seem to be caused by 5CP's brittle balance, but if that was the sole reason, people would've banned 5CP. So these balance issues seem to go deeper, affecting even KOTH and stopwatch.
And then it hit me. The class limits in 6v6 are weirdly specific. There can be 2 Scouts, but not 2 Medics.
Think of it this way: Would it be healthy for the game if we could stack Medics? Of course not, more players would be forced into over-centralized, Medic-focused meta. Everyone should agree that stacking a class creates issues, mainly of over-centralization.
And over-centralization eats away at the competitiveness of needing to adapt and learn. A player can't take the risk of running specialist class that has narrow use cases, because at any moment, 5 out of the 6 of the enemy team's players are probably playing as wide use case, generalist classes. And those enemies can't risk to swap to specialists either for the same reason. This type of circular logic is what creates overcentralization.
It doesn't matter if a player would find it fun to play other classes, or if they would be better with other classes. The meta is so overcentralized that nobody can pick specialists. (except rarely in lasts of 5CP)
Class limit of 1
If players were FORCED to pick specialists via a class limit of 1, this problem should be solved. I am not saying it will be more fun for the Scout players, but it would bring more competitiveness to the game. The ruling doesn't need to arbitrarily pick between Medic and Scout overcentralization, all classes can be affected equally. And if this change leads to another static meta, we can proudly say that the meta was natural.
You are incorrect.
[quote=Tynnyri][h] Why class limits are important: [/h]
Triathlons are made of 3 sports everyone competes in: Swimming, biking and running. A competitor has to be a good in all 3 to get first place. If a Olympic-level runner saw that sport, they would vote to ban swimming. They can vote to do that of course: Make swimming shorter, make it count for less. That would give competitive advantage to the Olympic runners, and they would enjoy that a lot.
Good runners would naturally want to win by removing the other 2, and running is more popular than swimming, so they could easily vote swimming away from triathlons. But triathlon without the 3 sports is no longer a triathlon
What I am trying to say, is that 6v6's current rules, through votes of the majority, haven't been constructed with TF2 in mind, they have been created with Scout and Soldier in mind. And being good at anything else is - despite being core part of TF2 - not fun for the people who are exceptionally good Scouts and Soldiers. And while I understand the sentiment that fun comes first, that goes both ways: Why would non-Scout players and non-Soldier players find it fun to play a format that focuses so much on those classes?
I understand completely, learning new skills and adapting to a changing landscape might not always be fun. But that is the heart of competition, and that's where fun should be derived in a competitive setting. Any "fun" that is derived from no need to learn, adapt or improve isn't competitive.
[h] 6v6 is not a natural competitive development [/h]
My harping on Scout and Soldier might seem arbitrary and unfair. That is fine. Let's discuss objectively the consequences the class limit rules and how they affect game.
In Highlander, every class has restriction of 1. With 9 players, this forces 1 of each class. However, highlander never seems to devolve into a stalemate where neither team is attacking or defending. The "flow" of a match is pretty similar to a casual match in this regard; Both teams slowly poke at each other, then explosive high-value picks (Heavy, Demo, Medic) ensue, the winning team pushes the advantage and the teamfight is quickly over. (Of course it is more nuanced than this)
However, the consensus in 6v6 seems to be that allowing heavies or pyros to even be viable (which is the sole reason given for Fists of Steel, Detonator, and Scorch Shot bans), will eventually lead to a slow, boring meta.
But that makes no sense. Highlander seems fine with these weapons. Sniper can easily kill Heavies, and Pyros lose against all hitscan weapons. So why can't a team break through a stalemate by switching classes to, for example, Sniper? (who counters both Pyro and Heavy) Most issues with stalemates seem to be caused by 5CP's brittle balance, but if that was the sole reason, people would've banned 5CP. So these balance issues seem to go deeper, affecting even KOTH and stopwatch.
And then it hit me. The class limits in 6v6 are weirdly specific. There can be 2 Scouts, but not 2 Medics.
Think of it this way: Would it be healthy for the game if we could stack Medics? Of course not, more players would be forced into over-centralized, Medic-focused meta. Everyone should agree that stacking a class creates issues, mainly of over-centralization.
And over-centralization eats away at the competitiveness of needing to adapt and learn. A player can't take the risk of running specialist class that has narrow use cases, because at any moment, 5 out of the 6 of the enemy team's players are probably playing as wide use case, generalist classes. And those enemies can't risk to swap to specialists either for the same reason. This type of circular logic is what creates overcentralization.
It doesn't matter if a player would find it fun to play other classes, or if they would be better with other classes. The meta is so overcentralized that nobody can pick specialists. (except rarely in lasts of 5CP)
[h] Class limit of 1 [/h]
If players were FORCED to pick specialists via a class limit of 1, this problem should be solved. I am not saying it will be more fun for the Scout players, but it would bring more competitiveness to the game. The ruling doesn't need to arbitrarily pick between Medic and Scout overcentralization, all classes can be affected equally. And if this change leads to another static meta, we can proudly say that the meta was natural.[/quote]
You are incorrect.
bloodmachineYou are incorrect.
want to discuss it?
[quote=bloodmachine]
You are incorrect.[/quote]
want to discuss it?
TynnyribloodmachineYou are incorrect.
want to discuss it?
Yes
[quote=Tynnyri][quote=bloodmachine]
You are incorrect.[/quote]
want to discuss it?[/quote]
Yes
Here's the thing my guy, competitive TF2 did not manifest with whitelists and class limits already in place, hell the tools to do so were not even available yet at the start.
The game was played as it was, and it was only in response to how it played, and how that made people feel to play that restrictions were introduced.
These restrictions have been constantly tested and considered for 17 years for all the reasons you've listed and far more.
The result has (almost) always been that the restrictions are the ones that make enough people happy enough to run a competitive league. Hell, sometimes the results are surprising, and the restrictions are changed to reflect the changing opinions of the people who want to play the game.
tl;dr They Tried That Already, Many Times, And You Are Welcome To Try It Again
As for your reaction to people looking at your profile, when you connect your Public steam account to the account you are making sweeping statements about the community and the balance of the game they play, people are going to view your Public Presence for Context on why you would make such claims. You are inviting engagement and this is how people interact with your arguments with an understanding of why you made them.
Here's the thing my guy, competitive TF2 did not manifest with whitelists and class limits already in place, hell the tools to do so were not even available yet at the start.
The game was played as it was, and it was only in response to [i]how[/i] it played, and [i]how[/i] that made people feel to play that restrictions were introduced.
These restrictions have been constantly tested and considered for 17 years for all the reasons you've listed and far more.
The result has (almost) always been that the restrictions are the ones that make enough people happy enough to run a competitive league. Hell, sometimes the results are surprising, and the restrictions are changed to reflect the changing opinions of the people who want to play the game.
tl;dr They Tried That Already, Many Times, And You Are Welcome To Try It Again
As for your reaction to people looking at your profile, when you connect your Public steam account to the account you are making sweeping statements about the community and the balance of the game they play, people are going to view your Public Presence for Context on why you would make such claims. You are inviting engagement and this is how people interact with your arguments with an understanding of why you made them.
[img]https://i.imgur.com/NvCcTgu.png[/img]