im all for that, but not with 4 pipes, and not with 500 self damage on those W happy scouts

whoever said above, we should not try to revert changes because we're unable to adapt and evolve. at least until its used for a long while

Performancewise this update was amazing. I was getting frame drops every time I got near to a medic healing gun while healing. Now I'm getting a constant 150 fps in a higher resolution and on directx 9 (used to play on dx8)

In regards, to demoman, I feel this was Valve trying to make a change back to what they intended demoman to be. His stickies were a tool of territorial denial, not necessarily constant damage output. Take a listen to the developer commentary.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-rXp1cFYq_Y#t=273

If we're talking about reverting classes back to their original purpose, they should put pyro, engy, and spy back as well.

Yes. A million times yes. I would wholeheartedly love to see that.

slightly increasing the clip size for pills or reload speed for sticks would be nice

I think that this update ruin just a bit this game, well nothing to say about the new weapons but really the new taunts are horrible :c and the changes on the old weapons like axtinguisher and stickybombs, pff could avoid doing so.

Hold me :(

there's still 400 damage loaded into a single clip of left click right click stickies. ~800 total damage between pipes and stickies in a single clip IF you dont splash anything and insta det every sticky. not to mention sticky traps and the fact that direct pipes have no damage falloff. i'm pretty sure the demo mains out there will somehow find a way to adjust.

sorry, but comparing headshotting a moving class to lobbing stickies into a general area of players and right clicking is kind of moronic.

if you've been playing demo for 7 years and can't figure out how to play around a damage nerf you should probably call it quits.

dunno why people are losing their shit over this, it's not like they gave demo a 2 clip sticky or some shit...he still plays exactly the same, except with lowered damage so you can, ya know, push forward even though the other teams demo is alive.

real talk though its insane to me that people are so against nerfing a weapon that requires such little precision. you can miss high, low, left, or right but if you det at the right distance you still do good damage. and if its just a botched sticky fuck it just leave it there and maybe someone runs over it later, which is now rewarded with damage ramp up :) that's fucking nuts.

try looking at the situation without bias before you go and post shit fella.

100 damage directs x4
90 damage meatshots x6

= 940 damage in a soldier's everything

if you are burning while in air with the parachute, you wont fall till the flames are gone, youll keep flying

i think people should try demo out in a 6v6 setting before they post their opinions

Ubering demos to push is a lot less effective now. Honestly defending is buffed considering stickying your way forward is nerfed and heavies already rev'd do the same damage. Only mini sentries got their damage/acc nerfed too so sentries are going to stay as painful. This probably affects euros more than us though.

So you want the defence class to have higher damage output with spam as opposed the the offense?

Soldier can't do dick for midrange damage
shotgun is much harder to get >50 with than the other guns
ur dum

Fuck it, I'm going to hit some mean pipes.

Those definitions mean nothing anymore you know. His comparison was still awful though.

dunno why you had to quote a huge wall of text to post that but ok.

cool, the pocket has more damage loaded than the demo. he also has to be in very close range to do that damage, and in most situations while in that close of range will never get off those 10 total shots before dying (excluding getting ubered obvi).

Tried it with regular stickies and it was pretty bad. It got to a point where calling sticky damage was pointless because everything was around 30 damage (including a whole lot of 19s). Having to sticky a scout three, four, or even five times is a death sentence as a demo so I just threw out the sticky launcher completely. For offense, and even self defense, stickies are pretty bad. Another issue that comes from the low damage is the fact that stickies don't toss people around as much making hitscan more accurate when fighting demos.

On the flip side, pipes only somehow achieved normal demo DPM so that was a pleasant surprise.

edit:

To be fair, pipes hit past a certain range really boil down to bad dodging/unaware players. This basically means that unless they are ground detting, you need to be pretty close to do good damage. Not getting off shots at this point becomes even more of a problem for demos as stickies now do more damage to the user than anyone else (before the 2 seconds) and the fact that pipes wreck the user if they get hugged. Point being, on top of the damage the enemy players do to you, you are also doing just as much to yourself making you die incredibly fast in some cases. Pipes are also far less forgiving than rockets and stickies which put many players in a pretty deep hole.

After pugging tonight I have 0 fear of demos and will happily rush into them at every opportunity. Also if they try to get you off a point with stickies you'll take barely any damage.

Good times for scouts I guess.

What's funny/sad is we still can't go 2 demo limit because stickying paths isn't nerfed. It'd be nice if they'd at least make it reasonable to allow 2 demos instead of leaving demo like this.

Valve should make a separate game to TF2, where they can test all these crazy ideas and get feedback from them to see if to works.

It could be called TF2 beta...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ihNQ1DlHA8

=/

I have no idea how it is for sixes, but lets just say in pubs I'll be running the shields exclusively on the demo now.

Nobody cares about hats but, tip of the hats hat is in the game.

From what I remember no one played it.

I just tried this in game, it's been fixed I think.

No, no, no, you got it all wrong! TF2 is for beta testing half-assed projects before they put them fully in Dota 2.

testing out demo damage.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDPnQYHBKOk

You can still kill medics with krtiz, but you gotta be hella accurate now, otherwise he'll run away with ~30 health remaining and shit on you with his uber afterwards.

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