It's pretty obvious. For every spy that queues, there needs to be an engie, heavy, and medic before they can play, and that will obviously take forever for the spy. In addition, it would be hard enough to simply get 2 full teams, but balancing them with rating would add even more complexity.

He did state that matchmaking is no class limit with no class bans though, didn't say anything about it being changed ever
EDIT: sorry for not watching 1 hour and 40 mins of 4v4

except he did? he totally mentioned that the current phase of testing was for making sure the servers work and AFTER that they can focus on class limits (very possible) and weapon bans (not likely)

doesnt that happen already in the current lobbies ? whats so hard about it ? maybe instead of going into the queue blindly with no idea of what classes are missing for a match, valve just provides that info

It has been confirmed that Valve will move toward requiring DirectX 9 usage for competitive play, similar to their requirements for playing campaigns, in order to promote parity among players and focus on modernizing the game. Valve will also restrict certain settings for stability and standardization purposes.

Why is this being -fragged?

look at current csgo queue times. to queue for certain maps generally take 1-2 minutes, if you queue for a lot of maps at once it can take as little as 20 seconds. now lets pretend csgo had 1/5th of its current players, which would make it roughly the size of tf2¹. that changes queue time from 1-2 minutes to 5-10 minutes, or 1:40 if you queue for a lot of maps at once. now imagine instead of 5 players for team, you had 9. double queue times again. now imagine every person on each team has to queue for a specific role, rather than a general role. another significant increase in queue times

you get the idea that for tf2 hl matchmaking to be as balanced as it is in cs (which is just about balanced enough that there aren't a huge number of total stomps), you would be looking at 10-15 maybe even 20 minute queue times. this is only the major issue with highlander matchmaking as a concept, which doesnt even begin to breach the concept of leavers², and the difficulty in designing a rating system for every individual class which hooks up players of a similar skill level

generally, 6's is the much safer and easier to manage format for the time being, and i'm sure valve will be spending a longer period of time developing highlander to be sure that it is stable and usable if/when it first gets released

¹ and honestly, because tf2 is in general a game that attracts a more casual audience, assuming the same proportion of the tf2 community will play matchmaking as the csgo community is likely a mistake.

² bots are inherently more effective in cs, where permadeath ensures that a player can take control of a bot for a significant period of time if they die early, and when there are fewer crucial mechanical skills like rocket jumping, pyro combo-ing, hell even double jumping as scout is something that bots are currently unable to do.

Everyone want a good laugh?

Because this video is a joke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkAhstxjicA

ok i get that, but what if you could queue for a match without actually having to stare at the matchmaking scree?, you could basically do the queue in the background while playing whatever form of tf2, i get queue times are far from ideal but you still get a shit ton of games played at places like tf2 center, if the games happen there why wouldnt they happen on an ingame lobby system ? sure there would be dead times where you actually have a hard time finding players, but do you honestly think 6s its gonna atract casual pub players to comp ? i understand the majority of the ppl on this website only care about 6s and think highlander is shit, but as a new player with little clue of competitive tf2 you would have a much easier time on highlander than it would on 6s

regarding the bots, the bots are shit in cs go (fact), sure taking control of the bot makes it less painful but missing players will happen both in 6s and highlander and if youre missing a player in 6s youre basically fucked while in highlander its still playable depending on the class ofc

The bots are intentionally bad because otherwise teams would kick their worst player.

the bots aint bad, theyre pure shit :D

This is worth a watch for a guy who calls Grant "bunny" and it's not in an ironic way

yeah i'm aware of this, but the bots in cs are both A.) more useful on their own due to fewer specific mechanical skills and 100% hitscan weapons, and B.) more usable by players, because of the control a bot function. having a bot replace a disconnected player will just straight up be less effective for tf2 matchmaking than it is in cs, which means leavers are a more serious problem, which means valve will want to keep the number of players in a match to a minimum. this issue is actually amplified even more by highlander, because being able to change up your team composition on the fly will allow you to semi-negate the issues that having a bot presents, maybe by letting you play more defensive classes if you're already ahead. with highlander though, you just have to deal with having a useless player in one slot.

is there a joke here

i dont see it

"bunny"

i think not having highlander as an option from the start its a mistake, sure it would be harder to get games running and to create a balanced system but it would be a much smoother transition from casual players to some sort of competitive format,sure its cool to hate on highlander here but if i actually invite a friend that never played anything except pubs and i tell him its 6s pretty sure most of them are going to decline the invitation but if i explain to them its just 9v9 (a glorified pub) i might get some of them to actually try it ! having options never really hurt anyone

Matchmaking will probably be more like a pub with 6 players on each team, some classlimits (because 2 demo/2 heavy/2 medic is not a fun game for anyone). and everyone actually trying to win and not being completely awful at the game than it will be like 6s.

I doubt a majority of matchmaking games will have a team with 2 scouts 2 soldiers 1 demo 1 medic.

as you progress on rank you will start to get the more "standart" games, will be a shitfest at start but eventually the meta will keep up with the current team standarts

its incredibly hard from a matchmaking standpoint to get 18 similarly skilled players into a server, get those same players to decide on a different class, and get them to stay in the ranked game the whole time. tf2 at the moment doesn't have the playerbase for 9v9. (hell even popular games like Dota would struggle with this sort of thing in a theoretical scenario, there would be huge mmr differences and other issues)

why have highlander match making when that game mode almost exists in pubs already BOOM SHAKALAKA

There are multiple redditors who have unironically suggested a 12v12 matchmaking mode

6s meta will be developed by the pubbers themselves, if you played MvM when it first came out, nobody knew what classes to run, later after lots of people played it, people started suggesting a proper line-up for MvM and then it spread across whole Tf2 community and now we see 1 Scout, 1 Solly, 1 Demo, 1 Heavy, 1 Engie and 1 Medic in MvM, in standard ones at least, I know some MvM nerds like to challenge themselves by trying out different setups.

But MvM lineup is close to 6s lineup, I won’t be surprised if the same thing that happened to MvM will be applied to 6s, it will just take some time to see people say in chat/voicechat “We don’t need a Spy, we need 2 Scouts” or something similar. You just need to give this Matchmaking some time until people adopt 6s meta.

As for Highlander, it’s much more complicated, you have to make a system where people will pick their desired classes (like in Tf2Center) before they actually join MM servers or else you will see 5 people complaining that they didn’t get their precious Spy/Pyro spot and eventually ragequit. So first you have to make matchmaking system that works, and 6s is good for that because there are no class limits, so you don’t need that Tf2Center system where you pick your class before you play.

And lets be honest, highlander is like a pub, if you’re waiting for mostly Highlander matchmaking, then I would recommend you to play our already existing glorified pubs known as Tf2Center lobbies, or if you want, Valve pubs. :)

tl;dr Give it some time after mm is released, people will find out what classes best to run after few weeks/months, the same that happened when MvM came out, when people didn't know which classes best to run but then learned after some time. Yes they made a trailer which gave players a basic idea of the best lineup, hopefully they will make a similar trailer or a guide for matchmaking, to help out newbies.

Except for the part where offering both splits the already small community causing both modes to end up with shitty queue times.

the vnn video has like 400000 comments from buthurt pyro mains complaning that valve is ruining tf2 by only doing 6v6.

vnn is shit even by reddits standards. im pretty sure the guy who makes those videos is banned from r/tf2 and facepunch

Everyone gets banned on facepunch though.

i think you guys keep forgetting this thing was created to the overall standart tf2 player and not to the invite hardcore player that wants the global elite symbol next to his name ...
whats the point of creating this if youre already alienating players from the start ? what happens to the spy mains or heavys, pyros ? isnt the 6s meta splitting these dudes from the rest of the community ?
you guys keep mentioning skill balance like tf2 has an insane wide range of skills speccially on highlander ...

No idea what you mean, HL features all classes; tf2 has an insanely wide range of skills on all classes.

It's also borderline technically impossible to implement as explained multiple times, just deal with it.

hyypeeeee

its just a discussion of different opinions buddy, chill
and i didnt said the skill range of the classes wasnt big i said the skill range as an overall teams on highlander isnt that big

but that's not the point, the system will try to pair your pyro with a similarly skilled pyro, same for every other class. It's a matchmaking nightmare.