likely true with some special exceptions

i thunk it means what division you play in

youre saying that RainofLight could 1v1 shrugger any day? rofl

the top of IM and the bottom of invite are interchangeable, just like they are every season. There are IM teams that can play close with low/mid invite teams.

In the same way, the dividing line is blurry between open and IM. The difference is that the teams at the top of open can not just hang in low IM, but in some cases would be capable of making real IM playoff runs. In the past there have been teams in open capable of winning games in invite even.

These things have been true for as long as I can remember. There have always been players in open and IM who are objectively better than some of their Invite counterparts, but because tf2 is not a game you can make a living on, there's little incentive not to play with your friends.

Yes he could.
But he would get raped every day.

when you apply the 80/20 rule to tf2; the top 20% of a division beats 80% of the division above it

80% of invite is 7 teams so thats 2 playoff teams idk about that

Don't you mean the top 20% of a league beats the bottom 20% of the league above it? That's how I always understood that rule at least

I mean the basic difference is the speed of the game - invite teams just move/execute far faster or at least more efficiently than their counterparts. You can find open players who may be more technically skilled in certain aspects than their invite counter-parts but they simply don't play the game as competently or as consistently in general. The other issue is experience - it's a lot easier to present an open team with something they don't know how to get around than it is to present some never before seen thing to an invite team - generally.

Maybe if you're looking at IM when the division was way stronger coordination was the biggest difference but as of now the difference in DM between top IM and even low/mid invite is pretty massive.

step it UP

I don't think you can isolate one specific difference. On average the average player will be a little better at everything. It doesn't make sense that the progression of DM suddenly stops at IM.

tf2 is a team game so the best player on a good IM team might be better than the worst player on an invite team, but we would have no way to really show it unless they were in the same div

plus different individuals have different experience levels, especially if they play different classes (tons of invite scouts have enough experience to get theirs, but not enough to main call or whatever)

can't always oversimplify things

you got it all wrooong, it's all about who's dick your sucking and how good you suck it

got any pointers?

Make sure you lick the tip, and if they ask for butt play you always say "yes sir" that's how you play with grant the man look at muma!

definitely not. there is always the standout player that can compete in with higher invite players but even the difference in DM between top invite and low invite can be big. it is pretty easy to tell that it isn't just experience causing you to roll teams, it is natural when playing lower level players to take more 1v1's and push flank and get solo kills.

I notice that a lot of times what separates an IM team from an invite team is simply just having more solo players that play for stats, dont comm, and/or dont listen to comms. There are a lot of those players out there unfortunately.

basically, given f is a function that represents dm potential, f : (IM) -> (Invite) isn't injective or surjective even when |IM| <= |Invite|

same dude same

iamverysmart

the divisions get a little stagnant though when the top open team is 6 ex inviters, the top IM team is 6 ex inviters, and the top invite team is 6 current inviters

how do u expect to get better when shitties play against other shitties

I think a perfect example of this (at least in terms of solo play) was the old goldfish vs. Slamberg battles in IM. Both of them used to just try to do all the work, they'd always be the one making plays, or in behind distracting.. and honestly, it worked a lot in IM (and was awesome to watch). But moving to Invite, you find that teams learn, adapt and adjust so quickly, that you can't get away with just big dicking every life - you'll just end up salty with like 60 deaths. It's been cool to see them, as well as some other players, grow and evolve from a solo/hero type player, to more of a team player after making Invite.

in that case, why are there divisions? just put all the teams into 1 division

top of IM has only 2 ex inviters! Yeet

actually not really nvm

i'm sure that i balance out at least 2 seasons of invite exp

Okay what even is this fucking mess.

This sounds like you want a function that maps players to some real number - or maybe some tuple of reals. Or maybe you want pairs of players mapped to some indicator of who would win. This bad definition is irrelevant anyway, since then you say

Okay so now you've defined your domain and codomain (after trying to define the map on individual elements - lolwtf) but we could charitably say that you're considering the restriction of the function to these new sets. But IM and Invite are sets of players (or maybe they're skill ranges... WHO KNOWS, still doesn't work anyway).
So the map is from players to players? Okay, perhaps it maps a player to the player in the codomain with the closest skill? WHO KNOWS. Let's move on.

So I guess IM and Invite are sets of players (or at least there exist bijections to the relevant sets of players)! If |IM| < |Invite| the map isn't surjective anyway (and if |IM| = |Invite| then not injective is the same as not surjective).
What about not being surjective for |IM| > |Invite|? Well then there exists a player in invite that is not mapped to by our mystery function f. Woohoo, this tells us a lot.
Also the map not being injective doesn't really tell us anything about the relative skill levels - every player in IM could be exactly as skilled as the top player in invite, or there could be a pair of players that have the same skill as any particular invite player then all the others have different skills. Not that I've worked out what f is even supposed to do yet.

But wait! Maybe I've interpreted you wrong! Maybe you're saying that for all functions that represent DM potential, your conclusion holds!
Great, except I don't know what it means for a function to represent DM potential, and the conclusions still miss the point of the thread.

Moral of the story: don't try to use maths to sound smart, and if you do get it right.

really you just typed 400 words in response to a dolphin rider post so it looks like he wins again