So essentially, how is the future of competitive TF2 affected by the recent recall of net neutrality laws?
My main concern is actually being able to play TF2 online at all.
For me personally, I have had a long struggle with TF2 and my ISP since I started playing this game. I live in the middle of Silicon Valley (literally a few miles from the main headquarters of Apple, Google, Ebay, Netflix, Facebook, Yahoo, Amazon, Twitter, etc.) yet I have always had inconsistent slow as shit download speeds (1mbps and slower on occasion), despite paying increasingly higher and higher prices every year. Even after moving my computer downstairs and using a wired connection, I would still get 300+ ping spikes in the middle of matches and scrims which actually led to my departure from many teams over the years. I have called my ISP (Comcast) countless times and had them replace their wires going into my house, upgraded my internet plan/router, and tons of other weird things they had me try. Yet this isn't some unusual incident. Many of my close friends in real life have had similar issues in this area with AT&T as well as other smaller ISP's. And now it looks like playing games online will not be given priority on our networks, unless we pay even more than we are already paying.
This is just going to increase the prerequisites for playing this game on a competitive level even more than it already has been raised, making TF2 less accessible for new players than it already is. We all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra. Are we going to be forced to do team registration through instagram to avoid extra charges? Or are we just going to cut our losses and let the community shrink even more than it already has? What can be done now, and what will we have to do in the future to ensure our game's survival? (If I somehow missed something that makes net neutrality irrelevant to TF2, I would really love to know, otherwise, what do you lads think? What can we do?)
Decent main resource hub: https://www.savetheinternet.com/resources
Public knowledge link: https://www.publicknowledge.org/issues/net-neutrality
Pai's video mocking us: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFhT6H6pRWg
Website telling you how to shitpost and spam congress: https://www.battleforthenet.com/
(I will edit this post and add more relevant resources as they get linked in the thread)
So essentially, how is the future of competitive TF2 affected by the recent recall of net neutrality laws?
My main concern is actually being able to play TF2 online at all.
For me personally, I have had a long struggle with TF2 and my ISP since I started playing this game. I live in the middle of Silicon Valley (literally a few miles from the main headquarters of Apple, Google, Ebay, Netflix, Facebook, Yahoo, Amazon, Twitter, etc.) yet I have always had inconsistent slow as shit download speeds (1mbps and slower on occasion), despite paying increasingly higher and higher prices every year. Even after moving my computer downstairs and using a wired connection, I would still get 300+ ping spikes in the middle of matches and scrims which actually led to my departure from many teams over the years. I have called my ISP (Comcast) countless times and had them replace their wires going into my house, upgraded my internet plan/router, and tons of other weird things they had me try. Yet this isn't some unusual incident. Many of my close friends in real life have had similar issues in this area with AT&T as well as other smaller ISP's. And now it looks like playing games online will not be given priority on our networks, unless we pay even more than we are already paying.
This is just going to increase the prerequisites for playing this game on a competitive level even more than it already has been raised, making TF2 less accessible for new players than it already is. We all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra. Are we going to be forced to do team registration through instagram to avoid extra charges? Or are we just going to cut our losses and let the community shrink even more than it already has? What can be done now, and what will we have to do in the future to ensure our game's survival? (If I somehow missed something that makes net neutrality irrelevant to TF2, I would really love to know, otherwise, what do you lads think? What can we do?)
Decent main resource hub: https://www.savetheinternet.com/resources
Public knowledge link: https://www.publicknowledge.org/issues/net-neutrality
Pai's video mocking us: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFhT6H6pRWg
Website telling you how to shitpost and spam congress: https://www.battleforthenet.com/
(I will edit this post and add more relevant resources as they get linked in the thread)
a potential upside i missed, is that we might see more LANs out of necessity
a potential upside i missed, is that we might see more LANs out of necessity
im fairly sure the bill to repeal net neutrality hasn't actually passed through congress or the house, correct?
im fairly sure the bill to repeal net neutrality hasn't actually passed through congress or the house, correct?
Blitheim fairly sure the bill to repeal net neutrality hasn't actually passed through congress or the house, correct?
Net neutrality was repealed on December 14th. I believe there is a vote to 'undo the repeal' or something? Although I heard it was not looking good, so I would still plan for the worst.
[quote=Blithe]im fairly sure the bill to repeal net neutrality hasn't actually passed through congress or the house, correct?[/quote]
Net neutrality was repealed on December 14th. I believe there is a vote to 'undo the repeal' or something? Although I heard it was not looking good, so I would still plan for the worst.
[img]https://puu.sh/g3i6b/81c2eb7635.jpg[/img]
I had Comcast when I lived in San Jose and never had a problem with it. In the 5 years I lived there, I think my internet went out maybe 3 times.
I had Comcast when I lived in San Jose and never had a problem with it. In the 5 years I lived there, I think my internet went out maybe 3 times.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLixBupkgzw
yeah it might kill the game
ah who am i kidding its dead anyways
yeah it might kill the game
ah who am i kidding its dead anyways
Blitheim fairly sure the bill to repeal net neutrality hasn't actually passed through congress or the house, correct?
It didn't have to pass through the house or senate since its not a bill. It's bullshit that non-elected officials have this kind of power.
[quote=Blithe]im fairly sure the bill to repeal net neutrality hasn't actually passed through congress or the house, correct?[/quote]
It didn't have to pass through the house or senate since its not a bill. It's bullshit that non-elected officials have this kind of power.
TholeWe all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra. Are we going to be forced to do team registration through instagram to avoid extra charges?
uhh you do realize that the immense public backlash would prevent this happening for quite some time. this shits not gonna happen overnight lmao
isnt this a bit of an over reaction
[quote=Thole]We all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra. Are we going to be forced to do team registration through instagram to avoid extra charges?[/quote]
uhh you do realize that the immense public backlash would prevent this happening for quite some time. this shits not gonna happen overnight lmao
isnt this a bit of an over reaction
Kinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes
Kinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes
SentinelKinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes
the ISP's in my area fought the city to keep google from putting up fiber optic on their power lines. i am getting ULTRA CUCKED by these shitheads
[quote=Sentinel]Kinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes[/quote]
the ISP's in my area fought the city to keep google from putting up fiber optic on their power lines. i am getting ULTRA CUCKED by these shitheads
SentinelKinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes
Not all American internet is bad, but the vast majority is. I feel bad for the rest of you.
http://beta.speedtest.net/result/6903828669.png
[quote=Sentinel]Kinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes[/quote]
Not all American internet is bad, but the vast majority is. I feel bad for the rest of you.
[img]http://beta.speedtest.net/result/6903828669.png[/img]
_brianSentinelKinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes
Not all American internet is bad, but the vast majority is. I feel bad for the rest of you.
http://beta.speedtest.net/result/6903828669.png
how much do you pay for that?
[quote=_brian][quote=Sentinel]Kinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes[/quote]
Not all American internet is bad, but the vast majority is. I feel bad for the rest of you.
[img]http://beta.speedtest.net/result/6903828669.png[/img][/quote]
how much do you pay for that?
Xorickhow much do you pay for that?
Google Fiber internet is $70/month.
[quote=Xorick]how much do you pay for that?[/quote]
Google Fiber internet is $70/month.
mastercomsXorickhow much do you pay for that?
Google Fiber internet is $70/month.
are you serious? i pay $100+ for mine and i only get ~250 down and 11 up. fuck comcast
[quote=mastercoms][quote=Xorick]how much do you pay for that?[/quote]
Google Fiber internet is $70/month.[/quote]
are you serious? i pay $100+ for mine and i only get ~250 down and 11 up. fuck comcast
Xorickwords
Yeah $70 per month. I moved to this apartment over others specifically for Google Fiber.
[quote=Xorick]words[/quote]
Yeah $70 per month. I moved to this apartment over others specifically for Google Fiber.
I pay 40$ (I got them to come down 10$ recently) for 2.7 mbs down and 0.7 mbs up. It's the realest shit.
I pay 40$ (I got them to come down 10$ recently) for 2.7 mbs down and 0.7 mbs up. It's the realest shit.
i can pay for any internet that i want but im still gonna have 80 ping
i can pay for any internet that i want but im still gonna have 80 ping
If speeds are throttled for e.g. mumble traffic, steam etc, one thing that TF2 does have going for it is that it's running on the same engine and ports as CS, which is highly popular, so it's reasonable to assume that if shit does get split up there will likely be a gaming package that will prioritize that kind of traffic (specifically thinking routing to ESEA/faceit will be ok, 3rd party servers might be fucked tho). Mumble might have some issues because it's open source and uses 3rd party servers, but something like discord will probably be fine so people might have to switch to that.
It still fucking sucks for everyone because I guarantee you'll have to pay an extra premium to get this.
If speeds are throttled for e.g. mumble traffic, steam etc, one thing that TF2 does have going for it is that it's running on the same engine and ports as CS, which is highly popular, so it's reasonable to assume that if shit does get split up there will likely be a gaming package that will prioritize that kind of traffic (specifically thinking routing to ESEA/faceit will be ok, 3rd party servers might be fucked tho). Mumble might have some issues because it's open source and uses 3rd party servers, but something like discord will probably be fine so people might have to switch to that.
It still fucking sucks for everyone because I guarantee you'll have to pay an extra premium to get this.
Xorickfuck comcast
https://i.imgur.com/QcLWJNy.jpg
i think i pay for the bottom speed, but i only get it from 3AM to 6AM.
[quote=Xorick]fuck comcast[/quote]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/QcLWJNy.jpg[/img]
i think i pay for the bottom speed, but i only get it from 3AM to 6AM.
boy if you think this is gunna change tf2 at all youre overreacting ye its shit but not the end of the internet
boy if you think this is gunna change tf2 at all youre overreacting ye its shit but not the end of the internet
SentinelKinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes
And I pay for 20 eur a month for 1 Mbps download in a third world country
[quote=Sentinel]Kinda off topic but I'm always surprised how garbage NA internet is
I mean, I live in a crappy borderline thirdie country and I've got stable 50 Mbps upload/download fiberoptic for 15 eur a month. It never goes down and I never get spikes[/quote]
And I pay for 20 eur a month for 1 Mbps download in a third world country
TholeWe all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra
Was this really a thing in the US until net neutrality was introduced in 2015?
[quote=Thole]We all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra[/quote]
Was this really a thing in the US until net neutrality was introduced in 2015?
scrabTholeWe all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra
Was this really a thing in the US until net neutrality was introduced in 2015?
No, because there were still legal processes about wether or not it is justified (correct me if I'm wrong).
If you want to see an example of this look at portugal: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNGlrABUIAAr9RO.jpg
[quote=scrab][quote=Thole]We all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra[/quote]
Was this really a thing in the US until net neutrality was introduced in 2015?[/quote]
No, because there were still legal processes about wether or not it is justified (correct me if I'm wrong).
If you want to see an example of this look at portugal: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNGlrABUIAAr9RO.jpg
scrabTholeWe all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra
Was this really a thing in the US until net neutrality was introduced in 2015?
No.
Basically some things weren't quite clear, some were legal, some were not and the FCC tried its best to enforce the rules it set. So most ISPs weren't really willing to try and find out. E.g. Comcast tried to block torrents completely or at least throttle them to death and it was decided that that is in fact illegal. No fine because it wasn't clear, but they weren't allowed to block/throttle based on protocol anymore.
In 2015 ISPs were reclassified as "common carriers", since then basically the same rules apply to internet access as for telephones. Obviously blocking/throttling is definitely illegal now.
Now that is reversed and with the current commissioners 3-2 in favour of fucking everyone in the ass and letting everyone do whatever the fuck they want since no rules will be enforced it's pretty clear what will happen.
I mean the official line is "ISPs should instead voluntarily commit to the principles of net neutrality and violations of them should be enforced by the Federal Trade Commission instead of the FCC as unfair or deceptive business practices."
So it wouldn't be like before 2015. It would be like before 2015 except all the rules will be removed and those that aren't won't be enforced.
But with ISPs already removing the standard "we're commited to net neutrality" blabla from their websites you can guess that's not going to happen.
[quote=scrab][quote=Thole]We all know that the majority of people are going to switch to a social media + netflix and steam/xbox internet package in the next year or so, so outside resources like Mumble, Teamfortress.tv, and UGC/ESEA/ETF2L are going to cost extra[/quote]
Was this really a thing in the US until net neutrality was introduced in 2015?[/quote]
No.
Basically some things weren't quite clear, some were legal, some were not and the FCC tried its best to enforce the rules it set. So most ISPs weren't really willing to try and find out. E.g. Comcast tried to block torrents completely or at least throttle them to death and it was decided that that is in fact illegal. No fine because it wasn't clear, but they weren't allowed to block/throttle based on protocol anymore.
In 2015 ISPs were reclassified as "common carriers", since then basically the same rules apply to internet access as for telephones. Obviously blocking/throttling is definitely illegal now.
Now that is reversed and with the current commissioners 3-2 in favour of fucking everyone in the ass and letting everyone do whatever the fuck they want since no rules will be enforced it's pretty clear what will happen.
I mean the official line is "ISPs should instead voluntarily commit to the principles of net neutrality and violations of them should be enforced by the Federal Trade Commission instead of the FCC as unfair or deceptive business practices."
So it wouldn't be like before 2015. It would be like before 2015 except all the rules will be removed and those that aren't won't be enforced.
But with ISPs already removing the standard "we're commited to net neutrality" blabla from their websites you can guess that's not going to happen.
IIRC the US Congress has a 60-day period from Dec. 14th (the date it was issued) to challenge the FCC's ruling. Beyond that, we have no say.
IIRC the US Congress has a 60-day period from Dec. 14th (the date it was issued) to challenge the FCC's ruling. Beyond that, we have no say.
scrabWas this really a thing in the US until net neutrality was introduced in 2015?
nope. but a lot of ISPs just realized they can jew everyone like this, and they have now announced plans to implement service bundles with extra charges for things outside of those bundles.
[quote=scrab]Was this really a thing in the US until net neutrality was introduced in 2015?[/quote]
nope. but a lot of ISPs just realized they can jew everyone like this, and they have now announced plans to implement service bundles with extra charges for things outside of those bundles.
dont believe everything you read on reddit
dont believe everything you read on reddit
lootdont believe everything you read on reddit
i get all my news from reddit snapchat and buzzfeed
[quote=loot]dont believe everything you read on reddit[/quote]
i get all my news from reddit snapchat and buzzfeed