Hi im planning to buy a new computer. Budget is 900 CAD / 700 ish USD. I have peripherals and a monitor so I just need the tower and power supply and stuff. All i plan to do with it is play tf2, osu, and maybe overwatch if it runs good.

When? Can it wait until after the weekend?

I just want to get the the most powerful pc for the budget so i assumed that would be now during black friday and stuff but if things will be cheaper later then sure

Ideally i want it before esea season 27 starts though if possible

Also my goal is to get like 150+ frames constant so i can buy a 144 hz later, and my brother said this should be more than enough: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/guide/r2NnTW/entry-level-amd-gaming-build

Since we're talking about TF2 I'd recommend getting an i3-8100 instead and an SSD. If there's anything on sale it should be on Cyber Monday so I think it'll be better if I make a partlist on that day.

Not sure if I should be posting here since it isn't for gaming, but after spending the last year reading this thread I'd love your input, Setsul. This is my first time putting a build together from scratch.

I'm putting this together for my grandparents. They'll be using it for very basic old people tasks. 99% of what they need it for is office and Youtube. No games, no movie editing, just... basic. If possible, I'd also like it to remain snappy even after they inevitably install a few toolbars and junk; at least until I can come clear shit out for them. I put together a quick part list.

CPU: Intel - Pentium G4400 3.3GHz Dual-Core Processor ($47.99 @ SuperBiiz)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC - Alpine 11 GT Rev. 2 28.6 CFM CPU Cooler ($5.69 @ OutletPC)
Motherboard: Gigabyte - GA-H110M-A Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($29.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: G.Skill - Aegis 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR4-2133 Memory ($69.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Western Digital - Blue 250GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($69.99 @ Amazon)
Case: Corsair - 200R ATX Mid Tower Case ($39.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - 300W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply ($36.59 @ SuperBiiz)
Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit ($88.89 @ OutletPC)
Software: Microsoft - Office Home and Student 2016 Software ($94.99 @ Amazon)
Wireless Network Adapter: Gigabyte - GC-WB867D-I PCI-Express x1 802.11a/b/g/n/ac Wi-Fi Adapter ($34.99 @ Amazon)
Total: $519.10

Really, I'd just like to know if there's anywhere I'm underspending, or (more importantly :) ) if there's anywhere I'm actually spending too much.

As a side note, I do have some spare DDR3 RAM lying around, as well as some laptop-sized wifi cards. Would it be worth trying to put together a build with a different mobo in order to save on those parts? Will there be a difference in speed between DDR3 and DDR4 if the clock speeds are the same?

Another newbie question: I pulled the CD drive out of an old laptop, and I'm having trouble figuring out whether it'd be compatible with the case I chose. Any advice?

#2673
Didn't get any cheaper.
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel - Core i3-8100 3.6GHz Quad-Core Processor ($154.00 @ Vuugo)
Motherboard: ASRock - Z370M Pro4 Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($135.00 @ Vuugo)
Memory: Corsair - Vengeance LPX 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR4-3000 Memory ($108.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Storage: Samsung - 850 EVO-Series 250GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($109.99 @ Memory Express)
Storage: Seagate - BarraCuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($54.25 @ Vuugo)
Video Card: Gigabyte - GeForce GTX 1050 Ti 4GB Windforce OC Video Card ($199.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Case: Fractal Design - Focus G Mini (Black) MicroATX Mini Tower Case ($67.99 @ PC Canada)
Power Supply: Corsair - CXM (2015) 450W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($59.99 @ Memory Express)
Total: $890.20
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-27 14:13 EST-0500

#2677
If you're going for old parts to save money why not just get used parts?

I don't think you'll be able to find any DDR3 mobo new at this point.
Do you mean mini PCIe? A mini ITX mobo with a mini PCIe slot will be much more expensive.

You'd have to buy an adapter and that'll probably cost you the same as buying a normal sized CD/DVD drive.

I'm definitely not committed to using the old parts, I was just curious if it'd be worth trying to make them work. It seems like it won't be.

What about the part list I posted? If I were planning to go out and buy those right now, are there any changes you'd make first?

i dont wanna bump but: you're a god setsul, thank you!

I have a GTX 760 and an i7 4770k which runs tf2 fine but in other games the old gpu is a bit dumpy, can anyone give me recommendations for what's the best value/bang for your buck? I saw a few deals for 1060s but idk how good that is or if its worth spending nearly twice as much for a 1070 or whatever

#2679
Used parts are actually an option if you're going for as cheap as possible.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel - Celeron G3930 2.9GHz Dual-Core Processor ($35.59 @ OutletPC)
Motherboard: Gigabyte - GA-B250M-DS3H Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($39.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: Crucial - 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR4-2133 Memory ($84.89 @ OutletPC)
Storage: Crucial - BX300 120GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($49.99 @ Amazon)
Case: Zalman - ZM-T1 PLUS MicroATX Mini Tower Case ($28.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Power Supply: Corsair - CXM (2015) 450W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($19.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Lite-On - iHAS124-14 DVD/CD Writer ($10.99 @ Newegg Marketplace)
Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit ($88.89 @ OutletPC)
Software: Microsoft - Office Home and Student 2016 Software ($94.99 @ Amazon)
Total: $454.31
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-27 19:02 EST-0500

250GB SSD is obviously an option.
G4600 for slightly better performance and much better GPU is also an option
Wi-Fi depending on router your grandparents got. I've got some serious doubts about them a) having 802.11ac and b) actually needing it.

#2680
Bang for buck is very subjective. fps/$ isn't very useful because when we're not talking about competitive 40 fps are painful, 60 fps are fine and 80 fps are mostly wasted (need to cap at 60 because of screen tearing).
You need at least a rough idea of how much performance (at least 1 game + settings/resolution/fps you want) then you can rule out what would be too slow and what would be overkill.

Could I get a quick explanation for why you chose this cpu and motherboard? I showed the 2673 build to some steam friends who've built PCs and all of them said the choices for those two parts don't seem optimal or don't make sense. I doubt they know the game on a hardware level as well as you do though

2673 build as in the one you posted in #2675?

More cores don't really anything for TF2 beyond 3 (or 2+SMT) so if you were to compare the R3 1200 with a Pentium G4560/4600/4620 (all cheaper) the tradeoff would be:
+ more cores on the 1200, same number of threads (so basically no difference TF2)
-lower clockrate and IPC
-more expensive
So specifically for TF2 the 1200 gets you less performance at a higher price. Doesn't make much sense to pick it then, does it?
Mobo is just low end garbage.

-> i3-8100 because a while more cores do barely anything that + more cache still compensates for the clockrate when compared with the G4620 (3.7 vs 3.6), not that much more expensive (still within budget) and obviously better for everything where cores do matter.

Hey, so I want to try building a PC from scratch this holliday season, I've found a build on pcpartpicker, but I'd like some opinions on it. I already have an i7-3770 lying around, so I'd like to include that part in my build to avoid having to buy another CPU. Most I'm willing to spend is $1300 CAD (1024.92 US, 861.63 Euro, 760.20 British Pound) but I'd prefer to be spending less. With this PC graphics and streaming are important to me, while still being able to maintain a decent fps (don't need fps to be crazy high tho)

https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/b/3bHNnQ

Any other parts you're reusing, did you just search for an old partlist or is there any other reason why you're restricting yourself to 4+ years old parts?

Just searched for builds containing the one part I already owned and found one that fit my price range. Not commited to any of the other parts on that list.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel - Core i7-3770 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor (Purchased For $0.00)
Motherboard: Asus - B75M-Plus Micro ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($145.62 @ Amazon Canada)
Memory: Corsair - Vengeance LP 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($149.99 @ Amazon Canada)
Storage: Samsung - 850 EVO-Series 250GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($121.95 @ shopRBC)
Storage: Seagate - BarraCuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($55.25 @ Vuugo)
Video Card: EVGA - GeForce GTX 1070 Ti 8GB SC GAMING ACX 3.0 Black Edition Video Card ($604.99 @ Amazon Canada)
Case: Cooler Master - N200 MicroATX Mini Tower Case ($45.50 @ Vuugo)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - G 550W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($94.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Total: $1218.29
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-12-03 07:42 EST-0500

Get whatever case you like.
Also I'd recommend getting used RAM + mobo, really not worth paying 300$ for those.
Z77 if it's actually a 3770K.

Thanks Setsul! I have no idea what I'm doing when it comes to this stuff so I really appreciate the help!

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/sLGbPs

would this build be powerful enough to run gta v reasonably well and run tf2 well.

Depends on your definition of "reasonably well" and "well".
Also is that some kind of used build? 3.5 years old CPU.
And how high were they?
Overclocking chipset for a locked CPU.
Low profile cooler in a full ATX case.
850W PSU for a 330W build.

Reasonably well in that it doesn't go below 30 fps like it does now, and I would like to be able to run at least tf2 with at least 144 fps constant.

Since I am new at building computers, I picked out parts that weren't too expensive and seemed easy enough for me to install. I've mostly had problems with cooling my computer.

You still didn't answer whether it's a used build you're trying to make or are you looking to order new parts? Also what is your budget? Both of the titles you listed rely heavily on the cpu however gta needs a good graphics card too if you'd like to play on high settings however you should have no issues building a computer that can run both games well for around a 1150 bucks as that seems to be the price of your current build. https://pcpartpicker.com/list/kKF3KZ Here are the parts i'd suggest going for, decreased spending on the psu/motherboard and added it for better ram/gpu and changed cpu's from intel to ryzen (not the best for tf2 due to its lower clock speeds compared to intel however overclocking it a bit + the ram should give you 144 fps constant)

So I've been debating about whether to build a pc or buy a prebuilt. I'm interested in playing pubg, neir:automata, and shadow of war, in addition to lower spec stuff like overwatch and tf2, at ideally maximum settings 1080p, though I don't mind turning settings down a bit. The important part to me is a steady >= 60 fps. I've heard so many good things about 144 hz monitors, but the price is a little off putting. As well, in order to achieve that 144 fps would require even better hardware or lowering settings, at which point I think to myself I might want to just make do with 60 hz. I can comfortably budget around $1000, though I would need to purchase a monitor, keyboard, and the os; I have a mouse and headphones that I'm happy with, so I don't need those.

Basic stuff aside, I was heavily in favor of building my own, but then I came across a pretty tempting prebuilt that I wanted to get some feedback on. https://www.amazon.com/CYBERPOWERPC-GXIVR8020A4-Desktop-i5-7400-7200RPM/dp/B0747W15QL/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_bdcrb_top?ie=UTF8

The main criticism I've seen in reviews both on amazon and elsewhere is a potentially problematic power supply. There are some mentions of heat issues, but there are very few mentions in a great many reviews, so I can chalk that up to faulty fans or something similar which wouldn't be too hard to take care of. The power supply is apparently not a brand name, or even a specific model across all packages; one review I read cited a statement from the companies support that they use various generic parts for several of the components depending on what they have available to use for that build. One of the reviews mentions the power supply that they got specifically: ATNG POWER CO., LTD MODEL: ATM-500FB, which has no reviews I can find. On the plus side this build comes with a keyboard and mouse, wifi adapter, os, and seems to have quite competitive pricing.

Would you recommend any particular build over this prebuilt setsul? (Btw, thanks for remaining involved in this thread for so long. I feel like I remember lurking years ago and still seeing you here)

#2961
Answer the questions, #2692 is right.

#2693
For comparision purposes: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/DwPWVY
Feel free to guess what CyberpowerPC is actually paying for windows, PSU, RAM and mobo.

Anyway so you could get the same 4 cores / 4 threads and a bit higher clockrate with an i3-8100, which is cheaper, but Intel has only released the Z370, which would make the mobo more expensive compared to e.g. B250.
Of course feel free to doubt their claim that the sockets are physically incompatible, since it's the same pin count, same size, same layout except with some previously unused pins now used for power. Even if you do believe them that somehow they need more pins for power while at the same time they're claiming that the new 6 core SKUs don't need any more power than the old 4 cores SKUs it's obvious that 4 cores now won't magically need more power.
And as it turns out with a bit of fiddling in the BIOS Coffee Lake (8xxx) CPUs do run with 100/200 series chipsets on the "old version" of LGA1151. However that is still in the early stages (and will always be a bit messy) so I'd only consider this an option if you're a) willing to mess with the BIOS and b) not buying it right away.

Some more criticism of the prebuilt:
-Possibly single channel RAM
-Probably old HDD
-Probably shitty mobo
-no SSD

Also they have an exclusive "mixed realty headset", the next step up from virtual reality.

Other than that the usual questions:
When are you going to build it?
Overclocking yes/no?

That might be due to the fact that I have indeed been doing this for a little over 4 years.

I looking to make a new build and spend less than $1300.

I built my computer 2 years ago and besides upgrading the GPU every year, I haven't touched it.

Here's my current computer: http://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/5347635

An acquaintance of mine posted his userbenchmark, which made me want to upgrade to an 8700k. Since I need to replace my motherboard for an 8700k, I decided I should build an entirely new computer. I want the best gaming performance that I can get with my budget.

My budget is $4000. Here's the list I selected: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/F7q2tJ

#2695
When are you going to build it?
I'm assuming no overclocking since you're inexperienced and worried about cooling?

#2696
Only upgrade if you need more performance. This looks like upgrading for the sake of upgrading.
Also generally rather questionable part choices.
Either way you will be very sad once you realise how few games actually support SLI and that it barely does anything now even in those that do.
And next year when Intel moves up to 8 cores on the desktop socket probably you'll either "have to" upgrade again or you'll be in the same position you are in now.

By the way your GPU seems to be underperforming and the CPU doesn't seem to be overlocked all that high either.

Ah yes, I don't have any particular intentions of overclocking, though I won't say I absolutely want to rule it out. My understanding is that you get somewhat better performance but your components will have a shorter lifetime, which doesn't seem like a great trade to me. I'm planning to start building around the 17th or so this month.

It sounds to me like the reason this particular prebuilt is so cheap is because they're cutting corners on essentially every component aside from the graphics card and processor. Here are some of the particular parts amazon reviews mention getting.

CPU: Intel i5-7400
GPU: MSI Radeon EX 580 4GB
Motherboard: MSI B250M Bazooka
RAM: ADATA 8GB DDR4 2400
HDD: Western Digital 1TB
Power: APEVIA 500W
Case: CyberPower with APEVIA fans
OS: Windows 10

CPU: Intel core i5 7400
Motherboard: ASUS Prime B250M-A (MSI B250M bazooka is the one pictured as far as I can tell)
GPU: MSI RX 580 4GB ARMOR (pictured in ad as far as I can tell)
RAM: 2x4GB sticks of ADATA 2400
PSU: ATNG POWER CO., LTD MODEL: ATM-500FB (not specified in ad and I couldnt find any specs or reviews online)
HDD: Western Digital Blue 1TB 7200 RPM
Case fans: Apevia branded
Case: Aluminum (I believe) with acrylic front and side panels. Cooler Master: Master Box lite 5

I really don't know much about computer hardware, so I'm not equipped to assess whether or not the drawbacks/risks of this prebuilt are worth taking. If all of the parts perform their function it would seem to be adequate to my purposes, and with how long I've made my current computer last I don't think I would have issues waiting for upgrades to be significant improvements, I can see myself using whatever option I go with now for the next five years, and dealing with eventually having to turn down the settings to preserve smooth performance. The comparison build you posted looks fine, and even adding in the operating system and an inexpensive keyboard it doesn't come out to cost that much more. I'm not married to those particular gpu/cpu or any of the parts really, if there are alternatives that in your opinion would be better for my stated purposes I'm perfectly happy to go with them.

In the end, the build or prebuilt choice seems to come down to whether or not the reduced cost is worth the potential issues. When considering the included keyboard(even if quality will certainly be mediocre) and operating system, it seems hard to beat that price. What would you do in my position? I don't have the knowledge to make an informed choice on this, so if you tell me that the potential risks aren't worth it, I'll take your word for it.

I plan to build it late December/ early January. I'm not going overclock it

wish i saw this thread 3 months ago...

#2698
Yes, but considering the expected lifespan of a CPU at stock clocks is >10 years that shouldn't be a problem. Also apart from really high voltages that just kill it instantly the main effect is degradation, needing more voltage for the same clockrate. Which of course can be easily fixed by either lowering the overclock once it gets unstable after a few years or by upping the voltage a bit (which will speed the process up marginally).

Mobo and RAM are actually ok-ish (could be better, RAM probably not the best timings, but neither actually bad).
PSU is cheap low end 80+ (not even 80+ Bronze, just 80+). All assuming that steam profile you found is actually that pre-built, but the case doesn't match.
I'd actually argue that they cut corners on the CPU and GPU too. Lowest clocked i5 isn't really what you want for games since you're paying almost the same as for a faster i5, but depending on the game it might actually be slower than a much cheaper i3. And you really don't think the fact that the MSI Armor 4GB is the cheapest RX 580 is a coincidence? Especially with 4GB a higher clocked RX 570 would be more or less the same speed but significantly cheaper. Not so much cutting corners to get the same performance at the cost of lower quality, but to get the impression of higher performance at the lowest cost. RX 580 > RX 570 and i5 > i3 seems obvious, right?

Depending on how much you pay for windows it would cost more or less the same, with more work for you if you build it yourself. So you're definitely not getting ripped off.
The second problem of pre-builts however is do you really want/need those parts? If you want a better mouse and a mechanical keyboard then those included are of essentially no value to you.

Anyway there's multiple options:
1. The pre-built. Would just about do what you want. Maybe add an SSD. Replacing the PSU would add cost so building with the same specs should be cheaper.
2. Building with minor improvements (SSD + maybe different CPU/GPU).
3. Building with major improvements. Do you need a new monitor if you stick with 60Hz for now? Do you need SSD+HDD or can you get away with just an SSD?

Also can you get windows via school/college/university?

#2699
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel - Core i5-7600 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($218.77 @ OutletPC)
Motherboard: ASRock - B250M Pro4 Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($52.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: ADATA - XPG GAMMIX D10 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-2666 Memory ($145.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung - 850 EVO-Series 250GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($84.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Seagate - BarraCuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($49.56 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: MSI - GeForce GTX 1070 Ti 8GB Titanium Video Card ($459.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Cooler Master - N200 MicroATX Mini Tower Case ($34.98 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: Corsair - CXM (2015) 450W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($48.99 @ Amazon)
Total: $1096.25
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-12-08 07:40 EST-0500

Get any case you want.
If you insist on getting an aftermarket CPU cooler you can go for an i3-8350K + Z370 mobo. Due to only Z370 supporting it, it'll be slightly more expensive (albeit slightly faster as well) even though the 8350K is cheaper. The main difference is that 8350K doesn't come with a cooler so the end result would be significantly more expensive, but if you're buying one anyway then you might as well take that little bit of extra performance and the option of overclocking. Usually K CPU + Z mobo when you're not overclocking isn't worth it, but in this case if you buy a cooler anyway it's only a 10$ difference with a minor performance improvement, so definitely worth considering if only for the resale value.

I need a new monitor regardless of what I do, as I'm using a laptop right now and don't have a regular monitor. The only things that I can really reuse are my mouse and headphones. It seems I can get a free key for windows 10 education because I'm in college. In that case building does seem to be the better option; the main selling point of the prebuilt for me was the relative cheapness which in good part came from the included windows 10. With a student key for that building myself seems better.

I also think I'm gonna go with a 144hz monitor. What would major improvements entail? I doubt I can get away with just an ssd without going to prohibitive expense, and I have doubts about the worth of getting a small ssd just for the os, or even os plus a few games. I'm in the habit of starting up and then doing small things like brushing teeth, so the wait till it's booted isn't tedious. I can see how it'd be convenient, but honestly the smaller space feels like it would be more inconvenient to me than the time saved. From what I hear drive lifetime might be an argument, but overall it feels like a 1tb hdd would be all that I really need. If at some point down the line I decide an hdd alone just isn't good enough I can add in an ssd.