those aint EVER coming out

don't let sandblast in these pugs

BIG NEWS: RGL Pugs (pre-alpha version) Coming Soon™ since 2019

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/854974890426761230/885734364313436240/qdFmFanG.gif

What? what does that mean it's just a discord server

Yeah man, it's not like the point of RGL pugs was consolidating the entire community for better quality games. Just say that the RGL pugs site that was worked on for longer and was basically already done and has the exact same functionality/style of pugs considering you didn't bother to mention it having any different functionality/style of pug was somehow not capable of incorporating RGL api or possible to be given public updates on.

Why does this feel like typical, thinly veiled, petty TF2 beef/drama, when this is basically just the nicest rewording of "b4nny and nicell didnt do what we wanted to the point we felt like we had to start from scratch with people who are more cooperative"

This is like the manifestation of when I went to lans and had conversations with people in production and league management that would say they hated a different production/league management member. (this is natural human behavior dont get me wrong and you shouldnt feel bad about whatever reasons anyone might not like someone else) That isn't even me calling anyone out specifically at all because I've heard it an uncountable number of times from multiple people across the board.

I'm not even siding with either web development team, the entire situation just seems petty/pointless and I think reading this would be more well received in my own mind if it didn't read like someone not actually saying what they want to say in order to seem professional or appease.

lmk if im just utterly wrong as far as what this sounds like to me from a social standpoint. I've literally seen this type of stuff impede progress in the community before, it's like we're stuck in a fucking time loop.

edit: tldr; "Which site is b4nny going to choose to play on?" okay the higher level players will be there which means that there's a wall of separation and they're not playing on the same platform as the generalized pugging community and that's the entire reason I was excited for this project

back to square one forever i guess!

idk man seems like you nailed it. either the nicell/banny version isn't being finished quick enough (more likely imo) or rgl decided they wanted more control.

if the nicell pug system comes out in less than 2 months you'll know for sure

idk man i tried playtesting it MONTHS ago and it already had clean ui, got us in the server to be able to play, and had discord integration from what I remember. they were deadass doing polishing work MONTHS ago

Rain of light would sacrifice himself for B4nny.

has absolutely nothing to do with how i think of b4nny, if anything b4nny might be part of the reason why this is what the situation is. idk if you got the point of what i was saying

ive been friends with arcadia forever and dolphin is a cool dude dont act like my nerd essay was even related to some shit like that LOL

personally idgaf about manchildren fighting on the internet, I just wanna play my favorite video game with some cool people. if the thing stopping that from happening was some irreconcilable 3 year beef between a bunch of emotionally stunted internet goons, then I'm just happy that (new) RGL is committed enough to the idea that they're willing to give it another shot. If you or anyone else wants to air out the particulars then go ahead I guess, but it doesn't really matter to me. I'm just happy to see any evidence of progress at all.

I think it's dumb that nobody in RGL would be able to convince nicell to collaborate with someone to help him code the website or just do it faster or have any inside information on its progress to then recommunicate it through twitter or a public space over the course of 3 YEARS. And if it was simply a disagreement on what kind of a pug website they wanted it to be, how that was not established at the very beginning. From what I understand nicell worked on it in his limited free time so why not relinquish the RGL branding like a year ago? This community is way too small to section off ourselves, essentially just making it more dead. People who are good at the game have historically always just pugged where b4nny did and the more consolidation there is the easier it's gonna be for people like you to play the video game. It's possible that scrapping 2+years of work on a website to start a new one a couple months ago was the reversion of progress.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/930636538537181204/1055719519928201257/tftvusers.PNG

Yeah... this is an ouchy announcement. The announcements to come are much sweeter lol.

When I joined RGL, the first thing I thought was, "Where the fookin' hell were RGL PUGs?" I learned that B4nny was leading it, so I mistakenly thought that B4nny's project was under the RGL umbrella. After being a dick for a bit, I realized that they have taken the time out of their lives to develop a great pug system, and it's attachment to RGL just gets in the way. So, I wish them luck and am excited to play on the pug site when it comes out.

I agree that it's been a bit of a vague mess, and it sucks we don't have shit for you today. But, it's important to me to start on the right foot and accelerate the timeline. I just wanna pug, man

I appreciate the context taylor, i just dont like the assumption i have that b4nny would rather exclusively play on a site he helped develop and i was really looking forward to having a gigantic all encompassing of divisions due to being rgl officiated playerbase that included advanced and invite players

we tested something back in january 2020 and its about to be 2023 hahahaha

rains not even saying that, hes just saying that all it takes is a few people or group to not cooperate with eachother and there will be some new pug group dumped on top of an already existing one and so on all cause said people or group dont like eachother, sectioning and separating ourselves more and more for watever reason, hence the time loop which is absolutely right lmfao

also the release date for this is a meme at this point its been like 10 years.

If kyle is involved in managing the project this will be the best pug system to grace tf2.

I think we're all on the same page, I'm just saying that there's nothing to be gained by making more beef out of thin air. Regardless of whether top players play it or not, I think most people agree that having an integrated pug system with the league will be very good for lower level / new players, and that's what I'm excited about. If the state of the game is such that the top level is willing to fracture over stupid beef then so be it. Maybe eventually newer players can bring a more healthy & unified culture to the top of the game and this will stop being an issue. I'm not holding my breath, but a girl can dream :)

this problem wont end cause its a personnel thing, with a majority of ppl playing game being babies and refusing to play with x y and z person cause they dont like them or they find them annoying, or whatever other flimsy reason its hard for ppl to realize they r being dumb, cause thats the chief reason people make pug groups every other month, that or not getting picked

"i dont like (this group of people)/(this person) so come to my pug group/service i just made!"

it just feels like after waiting 2 and a half years for just a random date, you'd think we would be getting them yesterday like the date says. however, all they did was be vague as fuck and then just announce not even another date but a quarter deadline so people don't get mad again when it eventually gets pushed back for the 999999th time.

if we want to "push tf2 forward" like rgl says, division in community projects is not the answer and the fact that b4nny and nicell splintered off into their own pug service is a slap in the face for this. what's gonna happen to all the work put in to one project when eventually the entire community shifts from one pug service to another. it's not rocket science

we'll see you in 2025 when it's doa.
half jokes aside this isnt day 1 by far, and also how close to the mark is the idea that this announcement was a "o shit u guys see that tf2c thread we gotta grab the market share first make a post ASAP"

Day 1 as in Day 1 of the RGL Advent Calendar (announced before the TF2C thread)

It basically means improving our current Discord "RGL PUGs" system by moving from just a discord to something great with stuff like:

• Allowing to queue through the site instead of waiting for dedicated runners to run PUGs
  
• Further integration with your RGL profile to gauge elos and balance teams
  
• Specific class queues instead of fighting over roles in the server (AKA needing an M.2 SSD to play anything but med)
  
• Server map/config automation
  
• Show off your elo e-peen
  
• More to be announced

I definitely agree that it's really frustrating when people refuse to collaborate and the previous project team not wanting to collaborate with RGL devs/staff was one of the main reasons for this decision. Because of this, essentially the only tie to RGL was branding/usage of API. We simply weren't willing to take the gamble considering the alternatives. It sucks it took 3 years to come to this point, but thankfully Taylor brought the motivation and dedication we all needed to launch a better way forward that better incorporates community feedback, transparency, RGL integration, and long-term sustainable success.
(That being said, mid+ level web devs feel free to apply to work on the project! We are using mainly React/Express, but reach out to me(DolphiN#2754) or Taylor if you have any inquiries or skills that you think would be helpful! - Apply here!)

just watch
Not sure if it was conveyed effectively in the announcement, but this is essentially a whole new project/team under the same "RGL PUGs" title. I hope people can refresh their expectations, but we all know that's easier said than done and we still have a lot to prove.
I originally aimed to have PUGs available for testing on Dec. 22 when I made those teasers, but stopped showing the teasers when a combination of a couple things became apparent that threatened that completion date:

• Personal life stuff/work
  
• Dedicating more time to establish standards and paths for other developers to easily join the PUG development team (i.e. AWS permissions, finding other potential devs, and establishing/organizing those devs' roles in the project). This was pushed more by Taylor/arcadia with good reason for long-term sustainability/maintenance.

We agreed that officially announcing Q1 (Jan-Mar) of 2023 was the safest bet of a timeframe that allowed us to bear any further internal delays while not publicly pushing announced deadlines and disappointing the community every X weeks/months. I still pushed to release a statement on the date so that the community knows about this decision to switch dev teams, so better a few weeks later than an unofficial date than never ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. The good thing is that we will be posting updates to twitter/discord so nothing comes as a [bad] surprise.

Always feel free to ask me about the progress, I'd be happy to share!

abandoning pugchamp so we can wait 3 years to have two competing pugchamp clones

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/media/tumbleweeds-gif.50454/full