it'll be great when like way in the future people who think transgender-ism is an awful thing won't exist because it'll be considered somewhat normal.

e:

people who can't tolerate others because of shit that REALLY doesn't matter or affect anyone really bothers me, sorry.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion and you're welcome to call me whatever you'd like. I don't particularly care whether or not you think I am being tactless. Do you think you are being tactless right now?

It costs next to nothing? It forces me to go against my belief system and it forces me to lie to myself and others. If you consider honesty and your beliefs to be 'next to nothing' then I feel sorry for you, but I value it much more highly.

It's not about politeness, respect, or courtesy. I can be polite and courteous to a transgender man. I can even be respectful to him.

I have at no point acted surprised that people argue about things of this nature. I hope calling me names makes you feel better, but it certainly doesn't make me feel worse.

So basically most people are telling Smaka to conform to their standards. I could so play something like "what if you conform to someone's religion" into this and get another 10 pages in this thread.

man world y u got 2 b so complex w/ people? if every1 had both dick n vag u nvr c thees problemz.

If everyone had a dick and vag there would still be people who claim that their sexual identity is that of a gay purple crayon.

I call black people niggers and gay people fags because it's a part of my belief system. Don't worry though, I'm totally being polite, courteous, and respectful towards them. I don't see the problem, I'm just being honest.

I guess the only issue I have with this is if you're talking about an MtF or FtM in this situation

then I'll stop lol

z

tl;dr respecting other's opinions isn't the same as believing other's opinions?

method that's an oversimplification of being polite and respectful. There's no special rules on how to be polite to anyone. Purposely trying to embarrass somebody is wrong. But... lying to people is also wrong. That's why this is a 13 page long thread... You can't expect people to lie for you about anything. You can complain about it, tell them they're dicks. Doesn't mean they're going to lie for you.

z

When you refer a transgender as the sex they have been changed to. You are lying. Feelings hurt or not it's a lie.

"I don't personally believe it's a lie" Well... It is, lying has nothing to do with opinion it's all about fact.

If a passable transgender could give birth to a newborn baby child go through menopause... We probably wouldn't be having this conversation.

well kinda

just like (i hope) u wouldnt yell at that guy whos always wearing tshirts to the public pool that hes a fat fuck or you wouldnt call out the guy in his early 20's that always wears a ballcap on tryinh to hide his huge ass bald spot. they _are_ fat & bald but if you did those things youd be a douchebag. just like you wouldnt call someone that looks female that has a highly stigmatized disorder that causes severe anxiety and is linked highly to depression and suicide a man its just basic sympathy. im not saying that its your responsiblity to prop up the self esteem of others but the decent thing to do is not tear it down

not that i even think calling someone thast ids as female a girl is even lying cus gender identity is a different thing than biological gender http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_identity

get off the cross rofl what goes against your belief system so much? adding an fe infront of male? calling someone what they want to be called? do you refuse to call muhammad ali anything but cassius clay? do you refuse to call marilyn monroe a blonde cause she was born a brunette and has the chromosomes and traits for brown hair? im wasnt just calling you names to call u names im trying to make a point: youre being honest to your opinions&beliefs(which go against popular psych. opinion atm btw)but opinions can make you an asshole. nothing makes your beliefs untouchable or unfalliable just because they're personal. especially since you claim to be nonjudgemental and empathetic but make statements that are implicitly insulting and demeaning.

#373

It's not about sex, it's about gender. The pronouns you use to refer to people are just as easily derived from gender as they are from sex, so why not use the up to date medium? It's not like there is any rule saying you must refer to people as their birth sex. If someone looks like a girl to you but was born a boy why not call them she/her? I don't understand what's so hard.

Also, you act as if me being a woman is a "lie". I can assure you that I am a woman. I use the women's restroom daily - nobody once has told me to get out because I'm a liar. I don't think they would tell me that, even if they knew I was trans. Should I use the mens room instead? Would that be more appropriate, in your opinion? Please consider these types of things before you go and consider me a man. I can assure you with certainty that I definitely do not belong in a masculine gender role, because I am not a man.

You may argue "Well, you have to use the womens room, but you're still a liar!". This would obviously be bullshit, because I don't have to lie to anyone in order to use it. All I do is walk in looking like a woman and everyone goes about their day. There is no rule requiring me to prove that I am of the female sex before I use the womens room - only that myself and others can judge that I am enough of a woman to use it.

z

I don't live in a part of the world where there are transvestites or up to date pronouns on gender. I wouldn't be able to tell them apart. It's a topic I really should not have even gotten into. I hope you understand that it can come across as being dishonest to some people.

z

#377, That is quite possibly the most bullshit excuse of not wanting to understand something I've ever seen. To be honest, I can't even fully understand your post. What do you mean, "tell them apart"? You can't tell the difference between a girl and a boy? The pronouns you use to refer to them? Maybe, it comes across as dishonest to you because your thought process on the matter is flawed.

You're putting words in my mouth, and making assumptions about my lifestyle. I live in a low population city and I work out of Norman wells... I highly doubt it.

I haven't said I dislike transgenders or hate them or think it's wrong in any way. Stop implying that I have.

The only point I'm here to make is that it can be misleading and easily confused as dishonest to call them the gender they do not prefer being called.

I call everyone I meet by their birth names. Samuel, Christopher, Maximillion, etc. Of course most of them want to go by shorter names like Sam, Chris, and Max, but their real names are clearly written on their birth certificates and legal documents, so obviously I must call them by those.

I'm sure they appreciate my honesty.

p.s. I am a robot.

379

I meant was I wouldn't be able to tell a transgendered female from an ordinary female.

your posts are leading me to believe that transgender people are inherently suicidal before they "transition." Is this true???

Pine you're rude as fuck bro

z

It's hard to talk to people about weight. Firstly, determining if someone's weight is a problem is often down to opinion. You get large figures who are very healthy, you get large figures who are very unhealthy but pretend they are healthy, you get skinny people who are role models for 'the healthy body', you get ridiculously skinny people who are borderline dying. Large rugby / football players etc... It confuses everyone as to what is acceptable and so there aren't any strict guidelines.

For some people, they know they are bigger than others, and probably bigger than they would like to be, but they do not see it as an actual problem because others are far worse than them. Others also have no motivation to lose any weight. It's simply not worth the effort involved for the 'small rewards'.

I think the key to persuading someone to lose weight is not to tell them to do it. They have to feel like their weight is preventing them from doing something they would like. Sure, people do not like to be insulted and so that in itself can be a motivation to lose weight, but you can try some more indirect methods.

Going to a theme park, getting denied entry onto a roller coaster.
Going swimming, they could feel too conscious to get into a bikini while their friends do.
Clothes shopping, you pick up a dress, they like it but it's not available in their size.
Participate with all your friends in a fun sport, cycling or just a hike up a mountain. They could struggle to keep up.

Of course all of this stuff would put a person down. You would just kind of have to hope it is enough to motivate them to do something about it rather than just make them sad / depressed. It really is a tricky road to navigate around. This can be made easier if you are in a similar situation to them as you can try to motivate both of you to go lose some weight together, but ultimately it's going to come down to how they feel about themselves, and their opinion is going to carry much more weight than yours.

I dunno why there is still a huge discussion about something that is 95% based on opinions.

thank you for being on-topic.

thats why its a discussion, opinions are always interesting even if you dont agree with them

people are classifying bigotry as some binary attribute. it makes more sense for it to be some scaling value. on some level the outright refusal to be attracted to someone due to x attribute is on some level bigotry right

someone that kills jews vs hating jews vs making jew jokes vs have no problems with jews all have different "levels" of bigotry. it makes the word have less meaning i guess but if everyone has different interpretations of what is or isnt bigotry then it seems like it's already hit that point anyways

let's not get carried away

Yea it kind of is, transgender people are some of the most emotionally unstable people around, first they feel "out of place" their whole life than they have a whole gender confusion problem, and most of them don't exactly accept it easily and right off the bat.

And when they actually do go into the hormone therapy shit just explodes they're already some of the most emotionally unstable people, and than they purposely bring in many times the amount of chemicals their body is producing( there's the whole hermaphrodite tans gender category that actually are producing both, and need to actually suppress one or the other but it's rarer).

Basically the transgender people in general(not all of them by any means) are a whirl wind of emotions and hormones for a long long period of time.

Which is generally why i avoid transgender people like wild fire, not because i have anything against the concept(hey it's your body do w/e you feel is natural..) but more so because the execution of it all is a large pain in the ass, and I'm "emotionally insensitive" a.k.a. an emotional potato and they get offended really easily.