You have no idea...

https://steamcommunity.com/app/440/discussions/0/1369506834142621312/?ctp=13

This guy is the gift that just keeps on giving. Holy fuck.

.

These threads, good lord

It may have been beneficial for valve to clarify that when they refer to "goals" and "problems" that they are within the context of competitive play, specifically 6s. I've made that mistake myself, on a video discussing the learning curve of TF2 i neglected to really articulate that it was in reference to competitive and a lot of people took that information as if it was universal. Though I'd be willing to guess it was their intention to talk about weapons in a more universal sense than I am (especially since they refer to players of all skill ranges)

bbbut this balance will remove market garden trolldier... why would they do that D:

blog post also didn't mention pyro, i guess the tftv meme is becoming reality and they're removing pyro too

they did clarify when the problems were specific to competitive play

most of the ones they listed are universal though, do you really think the dds hasn't always been cancerous in pubs as well? is critacola fun and balanced in pubs too? lol

https://image.ibb.co/dXo505/Screenshot_2017_06_23_08_25_48.png

expected

why are there so many people with bad opinions about the game in the tf2 community, like im genuinely curious

I love this guy's reasoning on why the BASE Jumper isn't used in comp...

http://i.imgur.com/Y6D6hCi.png

this guy is my spirit animal tho

It's a game that attracts people new to arena shooters and the fps genre in general due to the way Valve has marketed it in the past decade.

They're unable to understand why their opinions are less than beneficial towards the game because to them this is a wacky and crazy game where a bunch of funny random shit happens. They don't know anything about weapon balancing or class balancing.

They just want to play and have a good time, and to them, the big bad 6s players are taking away their fun for what they see as no reason whatsoever.

I could have sworn there was one complaining about how he hated the changes because it "ruined the economy of the game" or something to that effect. But i can't find it right now...

http://imgur.com/a/Cn5FV

I got you.

Has got to be a troll.

,

that sub reddit is a real thing. why

satire

https://www.reddit.com/r/hlmasterrace/comments/4tzkuq/why_highlander_is_unequivocally_better_than_6s_in/

https://i.gyazo.com/0d1608aa96fd2447559377862777f237.png

FUCKING LOL

It seems like the Sandman and Flying Guillotine are now next to useless. Heavies are now almost unbeatable to any scout that isn't amazing or facing a really bad Heavy, and I know that Heavy is supposed to counter scout somewhat, but that doesn't mean the counter to a class should be unbeatable to the class. Scout is already a really hard class to play for most people, and having the Sandman as a way to actually be a challenge to scout's counters (heavy, pyro, decent soldiers and demomen) was brilliant. Now that scout has been nerfed, despite not being very powerful to begin with, it seems like scout is now underpowered.
Now, I understand that Scout is easy to some people, and I understand there are other ways to beat classes (particularly soldier and pyro), but ultimately, for the enjoyment of the game, I think it's helpful to keep the sandman as it is instead of giving into people who whine about OP weapons they don't really know how to counter. This is like me complaining about the Scorch Shot (which I do frequently, it's slightly OP) and then getting my way, despite just being angry at the time because I died to a weapon I'm not very good at countering.
Team Fortress 2 is not meant to be a game where one guy can solo the entire other team, it's meant to be a team game. When you win a game, that means you and your team were either better than or countered the other team. Winning a game of Team Fortress 2 does not mean you were better than the entire other team, it means you and your team worked together to obtain the objective while competing with another team working against you.
The point is this: while it is important for scout to be balanced, it's also important to note that people will become less rational when mad, and thus make accusations about unbalanced weapons. The Sandman can sometimes get a hit in randomly, but there are only certain spots where this happens often, and people using those spots at the right time should learn to be careful as opposed to making the game change for them. Other times when the Sandman gets random hits, it most often fails to help the scout that did so (because they shot into a crowd and can't reach their target).\
The Sandman's lack of disabling weapons is also troublesome, as it leaves no point whatsoever to using the Sandman as a combat equalizer (not the pickaxe). If a Heavy can defend himself while stunned, he is no more disabled that he already is. My proposition: slow down the pivoting speed of a stunned player or don't nerf the Sandman at all.
On to the Flying Guillotine, or the cleaver. The cleaver adds the ability to critically hit stunned players, usually stunned through the use of the Sandman, or minicrit players at long distance. The goal of this weapon was stated as this in the blog:
Goal: Remove the feeling of randomness, and reward accuracy
The best way to accomplish the above goal is to remove long-range minicrits as opposed to removing the critical hits versus stunned players. If you wish to remove randomness, long-range minicritical hits should be removed because a scout can just fire into a crowd and get lucky with an enemy having low health. However, as the cleaver does fairly low damage, and only has a bleeding effect that is easily remedied by any size health kit or a friendly medic/dispenser, the cleaver is now inadequate for most people as a replacement for the stock pistol. The cleaver takes the pistol slot on the scout, and the pistol is used to pick off low-health enemies from medium to long range, or to finish off a low-health enemy that the user is currently fighting. The loss of this ability leaves a big gap in scout's usefulness that is only remedied by something new that can effectively replace the pistol by providing a sufficiently useful effect that is not entirely part of the same niche that the pistol is. The cleaver, pre-nerf, did this, as it provided a scout also wielding the Sandman compensation for the lack of a pistol slot.
Additionally, the goal stated that it wished to reward accuracy, despite the fact that the slightly reduced recharge on hit is barely useful. It's hardly a reward to get my cleaver back 25% faster if I'm now down to two weapons. The cleaver, if nerfed, needs to better compensate its user for the lack of a pistol. My proposition: add a buff to the thrower or debuff to the victim upon hit.
Overall, I think this update reduces the effectiveness of an already difficult class to the point of being slightly underpowered, as while not all decent scouts use the Sandman or cleaver, the ones that do will now have to learn different weapons as their functionalities have been changed completely or removed. Some of the listed changes, such as the changes to the B.A.S.E Jumper or to the Vitasaw, are useful and helpful, the two changes to the scout listed have actually reduced balance as opposed to increased.

This is easily the most egregious example. Is it satire or nah? Can I have a link pls.

https://www.reddit.com/r/tf2/comments/6j7s0z/why_did_they_nerf_bonk_atomic_punch/

http://i.imgur.com/WJClJqo.png

TBH I don't see what's wrong with half of his sentiment. I would much rather have fun pub weapons and disallow them in 6s because they are annoying/op rather than water them down to encourage their use in 6s where they will be underpowered/annoying.

https://www.reddit.com/r/tf2/comments/6ihqaw/balance_changes_discussion_megathread/djbv4j8/

i actually agree, but banning weapons is a barrier to entry for competitive, so ideally no weapons should be banned.

you can have weapons that are fun and balanced. very few things are inherently overpowered in this game. take the soda popper for example, its a hilariously fun weapon to use in pubs because infinite jumps makes you unhittable, but the concept of "scout charging up his gun to gain extra jumps" isn't overpowered on its own. the weapon is overpowered right now because it does comparable damage to stock while also giving scout a major benefit on a short charge. if a few of those values were tweaked, then you would still have a weapon that is fun for random pubbers to use but could be balanced in competitive.

https://www.reddit.com/r/tf2/comments/6ihqaw/balance_changes_discussion_megathread/dj9ushm/