I don't care if each match takes over an hour and I'm playing tf2 until 4 am I will do this thing. Just last night we were talking in mumble about the lack of weekend cups in tf2 lol.
Gauging Interest for an Idea
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TF2 General Discussion
I don't care if each match takes over an hour and I'm playing tf2 until 4 am I will do this thing. Just last night we were talking in mumble about the lack of weekend cups in tf2 lol.
Either way, Killing, you should probably just plan for only hosting one of these and then tweak it for the next one. Once you figure out a system that works, then you can plan out if you want to do it weekly, bi-weekly, monthly, etc. IMHO monthly/bi-weekly is just too infrequent. If we can find a system that can be organized on a weekly basis that is ideal. It's supposed to be casual anyways, right?
Either way, Killing, you should probably just plan for only hosting one of these and then tweak it for the next one. Once you figure out a system that works, then you can plan out if you want to do it weekly, bi-weekly, monthly, etc. IMHO monthly/bi-weekly is just too infrequent. If we can find a system that can be organized on a weekly basis that is ideal. It's supposed to be casual anyways, right?
MR_SLINWe might want to look at how the fighting games do it (i.e. Street Fighter) to find a way to condense it
a match in street fighter or marvel or any other fighting game takes a substantially shorter amount of time to play out than a match in tf2, they don't really need to worry about condensing their games
[quote=MR_SLIN]We might want to look at how the fighting games do it (i.e. Street Fighter) to find a way to condense it[/quote]
a match in street fighter or marvel or any other fighting game takes a substantially shorter amount of time to play out than a match in tf2, they don't really need to worry about condensing their games
a match in street fighter or marvel or any other fighting game takes a substantially shorter amount of time to play out than a match in tf2, they don't really need to worry about condensing their games
conductorMR_SLINWe might want to look at how the fighting games do it (i.e. Street Fighter) to find a way to condense it
a match in street fighter or marvel or any other fighting game takes a substantially shorter amount of time to play out than a match in tf2, they don't really need to worry about condensing their games
Yeah I edited it out because I realized that. The KOTH model that Blueberry is referring to is like playing using one machine at an arcade (i.e. 1 server). People line up and challenge the winner. But for this kind of more organized thing it might just be more fun to have a tourney like Killing suggests.
OP said play 1 half -- maybe just make it first to 3 or 30 minutes then instead of first to 5 or 30 minutes? First to 5 or 30 minutes is more of a PUG ruleset than a first-half ruleset. And then if you find that you have enough time in the night / teams want to play more games, you can have it be double elimination then so that the lower-level teams sort of find each other faster and the upper-level teams find each other.
[Edit] Like I think Killing is looking for something like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gZBITO5GwI&t=52m20s
[quote=conductor][quote=MR_SLIN]We might want to look at how the fighting games do it (i.e. Street Fighter) to find a way to condense it[/quote]
a match in street fighter or marvel or any other fighting game takes a substantially shorter amount of time to play out than a match in tf2, they don't really need to worry about condensing their games[/quote]
Yeah I edited it out because I realized that. The KOTH model that Blueberry is referring to is like playing using one machine at an arcade (i.e. 1 server). People line up and challenge the winner. But for this kind of more organized thing it might just be more fun to have a tourney like Killing suggests.
OP said play 1 half -- maybe just make it first to 3 or 30 minutes then instead of first to 5 or 30 minutes? First to 5 or 30 minutes is more of a PUG ruleset than a first-half ruleset. And then if you find that you have enough time in the night / teams want to play more games, you can have it be double elimination then so that the lower-level teams sort of find each other faster and the upper-level teams find each other.
[Edit] Like I think Killing is looking for something like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gZBITO5GwI&t=52m20s
a match in street fighter or marvel or any other fighting game takes a substantially shorter amount of time to play out than a match in tf2, they don't really need to worry about condensing their games[/quote]
Yeah I edited it out because I realized that. The KOTH model that Blueberry is referring to is like playing using one machine at an arcade (i.e. 1 server). People line up and challenge the winner. But for this kind of more organized thing it might just be more fun to have a tourney like Killing suggests.
OP said play 1 half -- maybe just make it first to 3 or 30 minutes then instead of first to 5 or 30 minutes? First to 5 or 30 minutes is more of a PUG ruleset than a first-half ruleset. And then if you find that you have enough time in the night / teams want to play more games, you can have it be double elimination then so that the lower-level teams sort of find each other faster and the upper-level teams find each other.
[Edit] Like I think Killing is looking for something like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gZBITO5GwI&t=52m20s
People need to show up to matches on time for the tournament to go smoothly. Otherwise it could drag on forever if a decent number of teams sign up.
People need to show up to matches on time for the tournament to go smoothly. Otherwise it could drag on forever if a decent number of teams sign up.
back when I was an admin for UGC we discussed hosting an ultiduo tournament.
Ultimately it's very easy to deal with teams that don't show up on time by being draconian about start times and handing down forfeits quickly, it's much less noticeable especially if there are oodles of teams wanting to play.
I'd say a 30 minute time limit wouldn't be that bad - lets say it's a 32 team single elim bracket thus: 32/16/8/4/2 for a total of 5 matches played. Assuming there's a 15 minute break between each match, you'd end up with something ~4 hours. If we just played standard matches you could potentially double that time, especially given half time breaks. I'd still be down though. 8 hours of tf2 would be sweet.
As far as the bracket goes killing and a 1-2 people would be all that would be needed; you'd just need a guy to procure communication between the various teams (as to who will play whom), servers (unless you just wanna have people use their own), and update the bracket (all pretty easy stuff).
I really like the idea of raffle tickets as a funding mechanism too - although that'd entail some work for a coder somewhere to get that all squared away quickly.
back when I was an admin for UGC we discussed hosting an ultiduo tournament.
Ultimately it's very easy to deal with teams that don't show up on time by being draconian about start times and handing down forfeits quickly, it's much less noticeable especially if there are oodles of teams wanting to play.
I'd say a 30 minute time limit wouldn't be that bad - lets say it's a 32 team single elim bracket thus: 32/16/8/4/2 for a total of 5 matches played. Assuming there's a 15 minute break between each match, you'd end up with something ~4 hours. If we just played standard matches you could potentially double that time, especially given half time breaks. I'd still be down though. 8 hours of tf2 would be sweet.
As far as the bracket goes killing and a 1-2 people would be all that would be needed; you'd just need a guy to procure communication between the various teams (as to who will play whom), servers (unless you just wanna have people use their own), and update the bracket (all pretty easy stuff).
I really like the idea of raffle tickets as a funding mechanism too - although that'd entail some work for a coder somewhere to get that all squared away quickly.
Ultimately it's very easy to deal with teams that don't show up on time by being draconian about start times and handing down forfeits quickly, it's much less noticeable especially if there are oodles of teams wanting to play.
I'd say a 30 minute time limit wouldn't be that bad - lets say it's a 32 team single elim bracket thus: 32/16/8/4/2 for a total of 5 matches played. Assuming there's a 15 minute break between each match, you'd end up with something ~4 hours. If we just played standard matches you could potentially double that time, especially given half time breaks. I'd still be down though. 8 hours of tf2 would be sweet.
As far as the bracket goes killing and a 1-2 people would be all that would be needed; you'd just need a guy to procure communication between the various teams (as to who will play whom), servers (unless you just wanna have people use their own), and update the bracket (all pretty easy stuff).
I really like the idea of raffle tickets as a funding mechanism too - although that'd entail some work for a coder somewhere to get that all squared away quickly.
Too much going on during the weekends already. We have newbie mixes and new map weekends; both can have trouble getting players. I don't really see this working out at another time though...
I like the idea, though.
Too much going on during the weekends already. We have newbie mixes and new map weekends; both can have trouble getting players. I don't really see this working out at another time though...
I like the idea, though.
I like the idea, though.
hookyToo much going on during the weekends already. We have newbie mixes and new map weekends; both can have trouble getting players. I don't really see this working out at another time though...
I like the idea, though.
As long as we can get people for Saturdays, I don't see this being a problem honestly. The plan was to cut down the play days because of the upcoming season anyway, and people don't even really get on until about 10 (which is why I moved it up to 10). We also don't have to have NMW PUGs every weekend - there were barren weekends even when we had maps to play back when simply because people had responsibilities or wanted to do other things.
[quote=hooky]Too much going on during the weekends already. We have newbie mixes and new map weekends; both can have trouble getting players. I don't really see this working out at another time though...
I like the idea, though.[/quote]
As long as we can get people for Saturdays, I don't see this being a problem honestly. The plan was to cut down the play days because of the upcoming season anyway, and people don't even really get on until about 10 (which is why I moved it up to 10). We also don't have to have NMW PUGs every weekend - there were barren weekends even when we had maps to play back when simply because people had responsibilities or wanted to do other things.
I like the idea, though.[/quote]
As long as we can get people for Saturdays, I don't see this being a problem honestly. The plan was to cut down the play days because of the upcoming season anyway, and people don't even really get on until about 10 (which is why I moved it up to 10). We also don't have to have NMW PUGs every weekend - there were barren weekends even when we had maps to play back when simply because people had responsibilities or wanted to do other things.
I've been wanting to try my hand at camera, so I'd be willing to do that for some tournaments.
I've been wanting to try my hand at camera, so I'd be willing to do that for some tournaments.
newbie mixes are awesome and all, but not everyone participates and this seems like a really cool idea. ive been wanting something like this for a long time now
newbie mixes are awesome and all, but not everyone participates and this seems like a really cool idea. ive been wanting something like this for a long time now
I'd think if a weekly cup was to come around, it would have to be done with a single elimination format for the sake of time constraints. Take a look at the ETF2L Metalworks Cup as an example of how to set it up. 16 teams, 4 matches at most for the team who would win it.
I'd think if a weekly cup was to come around, it would have to be done with a single elimination format for the sake of time constraints. Take a look at the ETF2L Metalworks Cup as an example of how to set it up. 16 teams, 4 matches at most for the team who would win it.
you dont' need to worry about overlap with newbie mixes. i know i pug team almost every friday night and there are always teams looking for scrims. you can fill an 8 man or 16 man bracket pretty easily
you dont' need to worry about overlap with newbie mixes. i know i pug team almost every friday night and there are always teams looking for scrims. you can fill an 8 man or 16 man bracket pretty easily
milehighmilitiaTypically the issues with these types of ideas are lack of organization and lack of a clear plan. If you nail those things and keep everyone informed well enough to where people actually show up on time, and not have everyone sit around for too long this could be great fun for players and viewers.
I'm amazing though so I can't see that being an issue.
potI think if possible (all 12 people have premium) this should be done through ESEA. That takes care of servers, configs, score reporting, and ESEA gives out prizes at the end of the month for TF2. The prizes are pretty shitty right now (Zowie Camade) but maybe if we do these tournaments for a while, they'll get better prizes and even servers.
I'm not wasting my time waiting weeks for shit to go up and down the ladder when I can just run it myself.
smakers Math
I feel like there's something wrong with your math. 16 teams makes for 4 rounds including grandfinals which would be bo3. 3 bo1 30 mins, 1 bo3 ~1 hour. 2 hours and a half + delays 3 hours. Each round adds 30 minutes. I've played in SC2 tournaments that have taken me 3 hours and have seen some that have taken 6. I don't mind putting in an extra 45 min for an extra 16 teams to play.
[quote=milehighmilitia]Typically the issues with these types of ideas are lack of organization and lack of a clear plan. If you nail those things and keep everyone informed well enough to where people actually show up on time, and not have everyone sit around for too long this could be great fun for players and viewers.[/quote]
I'm amazing though so I can't see that being an issue.
[quote=pot]I think if possible (all 12 people have premium) this should be done through ESEA. That takes care of servers, configs, score reporting, and ESEA gives out prizes at the end of the month for TF2. The prizes are pretty shitty right now (Zowie Camade) but maybe if we do these tournaments for a while, they'll get better prizes and even servers.[/quote]
I'm not wasting my time waiting weeks for shit to go up and down the ladder when I can just run it myself.
[quote=smakers] Math [/quote]
I feel like there's something wrong with your math. 16 teams makes for 4 rounds including grandfinals which would be bo3. 3 bo1 30 mins, 1 bo3 ~1 hour. 2 hours and a half + delays 3 hours. Each round adds 30 minutes. I've played in SC2 tournaments that have taken me 3 hours and have seen some that have taken 6. I don't mind putting in an extra 45 min for an extra 16 teams to play.
I'm amazing though so I can't see that being an issue.
[quote=pot]I think if possible (all 12 people have premium) this should be done through ESEA. That takes care of servers, configs, score reporting, and ESEA gives out prizes at the end of the month for TF2. The prizes are pretty shitty right now (Zowie Camade) but maybe if we do these tournaments for a while, they'll get better prizes and even servers.[/quote]
I'm not wasting my time waiting weeks for shit to go up and down the ladder when I can just run it myself.
[quote=smakers] Math [/quote]
I feel like there's something wrong with your math. 16 teams makes for 4 rounds including grandfinals which would be bo3. 3 bo1 30 mins, 1 bo3 ~1 hour. 2 hours and a half + delays 3 hours. Each round adds 30 minutes. I've played in SC2 tournaments that have taken me 3 hours and have seen some that have taken 6. I don't mind putting in an extra 45 min for an extra 16 teams to play.
RhetoricalAnarchistThis sounds like a great idea, I would definitely play in this. Could be lots of fun, especially because of the chance to play with players outside of your own division. I pocketed a drunk Hildreth once, and it was the funniest pug I've ever played, and I learned a little bit. I could see this system facilitating that, as well as giving some teams a chance to practice seriously.
Please tell me I kept my clothes on.
[quote=RhetoricalAnarchist]This sounds like a great idea, I would definitely play in this. Could be lots of fun, especially because of the chance to play with players outside of your own division. I pocketed a drunk Hildreth once, and it was the funniest pug I've ever played, and I learned a little bit. I could see this system facilitating that, as well as giving some teams a chance to practice seriously.[/quote]
Please tell me I kept my clothes on.
Please tell me I kept my clothes on.
The Newbie Mix team could lend up to 10 servers to this tournament if need arises. If you would like, you can add me and discuss it
The Newbie Mix team could lend up to 10 servers to this tournament if need arises. If you would like, you can add me and discuss it
LKincheloeI'm not exactly sure what could be offered as incentive since Invite teams get free Premium, but I have faith in the Kalkincoin.
Time to bring back Kalkinkash.
http://boards.fightingamphibians.org/images/KalkinDollar.png
[quote=LKincheloe]I'm not exactly sure what could be offered as incentive since Invite teams get free Premium, but I have faith in the Kalkincoin.[/quote]
Time to bring back Kalkinkash.
[img]http://boards.fightingamphibians.org/images/KalkinDollar.png[/img]
Time to bring back Kalkinkash.
[img]http://boards.fightingamphibians.org/images/KalkinDollar.png[/img]
The only issue I could think of is if new players want to join but don't have enough connections with people to make a team. Would there be random pug teams for them to join?
The only issue I could think of is if new players want to join but don't have enough connections with people to make a team. Would there be random pug teams for them to join?
cage-The only issue I could think of is if new players want to join but don't have enough connections with people to make a team. Would there be random pug teams for them to join?
I'd probably make an irc channel or some shit where you could advertise lf players or team.
[quote=cage-]The only issue I could think of is if new players want to join but don't have enough connections with people to make a team. Would there be random pug teams for them to join?[/quote]
I'd probably make an irc channel or some shit where you could advertise lf players or team.
I'd probably make an irc channel or some shit where you could advertise lf players or team.
You could always offer a free month of premium to the winning team
You could always offer a free month of premium to the winning team
Killingsmakers Math
I feel like there's something wrong with your math. 16 teams makes for 4 rounds including grandfinals which would be bo3. 3 bo1 30 mins, 1 bo3 ~1 hour. 2 hours and a half + delays 3 hours. Each round adds 30 minutes. I've played in SC2 tournaments that have taken me 3 hours and have seen some that have taken 6. I don't mind putting in an extra 45 min for an extra 16 teams to play.
wtf, ninja editing your post to change 'double bo3' into 'bo3' doesn't make my math bad, anusbreath.
[quote=Killing]
[quote=smakers] Math [/quote]
I feel like there's something wrong with your math. 16 teams makes for 4 rounds including grandfinals which would be bo3. 3 bo1 30 mins, 1 bo3 ~1 hour. 2 hours and a half + delays 3 hours. Each round adds 30 minutes. I've played in SC2 tournaments that have taken me 3 hours and have seen some that have taken 6. I don't mind putting in an extra 45 min for an extra 16 teams to play.[/quote]
wtf, ninja editing your post to change 'double bo3' into 'bo3' doesn't make my math bad, anusbreath.
[quote=smakers] Math [/quote]
I feel like there's something wrong with your math. 16 teams makes for 4 rounds including grandfinals which would be bo3. 3 bo1 30 mins, 1 bo3 ~1 hour. 2 hours and a half + delays 3 hours. Each round adds 30 minutes. I've played in SC2 tournaments that have taken me 3 hours and have seen some that have taken 6. I don't mind putting in an extra 45 min for an extra 16 teams to play.[/quote]
wtf, ninja editing your post to change 'double bo3' into 'bo3' doesn't make my math bad, anusbreath.
I'm pretty set on hosting the first one on the 4th. I think I have everything pretty much figured out except casting and prizes. Casting will probably take 5 seconds as I'm sure there's plenty of independent casters that would love to cast but I'll also pm enigma or something in the next couple of days.
What I really want to talk about is prizing:
I, personally, really like the idea from FFF. They get free shit and then host a raffle where the the money from the raffle goes to the winning team. This allows people to donate to a big prize pot, win cool shit and also contribute to a fun night. If we start getting a fair amount of money for each tourney, I wouldn't be surprised to see some higher level teams put their try hard pants on.
Some people have talked about an entry fee of refined or some shit but I'm not sure how many people care to win metal and wouldn't want to discourage people from playing because of a entry fee. Even worse would be a monetary entry fee. I'm also against giving out freemium since it's not ESEA affiliated.
Questions I have:
1. Where does Cbear and ruwin get all their free shit? Is there a free shit tree where free shit grows that I have not heard of?
2. How much would you be willing to pay for a raffle ticket if it were what they normally give out during Fully Charged episodes? If I somehow got a unusual (do they give those out?), how much would you be willing to pay?
I'm not sure how relevant the cost would be but more so the total you would pay. 5 tickets for 2 bucks vs 1 ticket for 10 bucks.
3. Do you have any better ideas?
I'm pretty set on hosting the first one on the 4th. I think I have everything pretty much figured out except casting and prizes. Casting will probably take 5 seconds as I'm sure there's plenty of independent casters that would love to cast but I'll also pm enigma or something in the next couple of days.
What I really want to talk about is prizing:
I, personally, really like the idea from FFF. They get free shit and then host a raffle where the the money from the raffle goes to the winning team. This allows people to donate to a big prize pot, win cool shit and also contribute to a fun night. If we start getting a fair amount of money for each tourney, I wouldn't be surprised to see some higher level teams put their try hard pants on.
Some people have talked about an entry fee of refined or some shit but I'm not sure how many people care to win metal and wouldn't want to discourage people from playing because of a entry fee. Even worse would be a monetary entry fee. I'm also against giving out freemium since it's not ESEA affiliated.
Questions I have:
1. Where does Cbear and ruwin get all their free shit? Is there a free shit tree where free shit grows that I have not heard of?
2. How much would you be willing to pay for a raffle ticket if it were what they normally give out during Fully Charged episodes? If I somehow got a unusual (do they give those out?), how much would you be willing to pay?
I'm not sure how relevant the cost would be but more so the total you would pay. 5 tickets for 2 bucks vs 1 ticket for 10 bucks.
3. Do you have any better ideas?
What I really want to talk about is prizing:
I, personally, really like the idea from FFF. They get free shit and then host a raffle where the the money from the raffle goes to the winning team. This allows people to donate to a big prize pot, win cool shit and also contribute to a fun night. If we start getting a fair amount of money for each tourney, I wouldn't be surprised to see some higher level teams put their try hard pants on.
Some people have talked about an entry fee of refined or some shit but I'm not sure how many people care to win metal and wouldn't want to discourage people from playing because of a entry fee. Even worse would be a monetary entry fee. I'm also against giving out freemium since it's not ESEA affiliated.
Questions I have:
1. Where does Cbear and ruwin get all their free shit? Is there a free shit tree where free shit grows that I have not heard of?
2. How much would you be willing to pay for a raffle ticket if it were what they normally give out during Fully Charged episodes? If I somehow got a unusual (do they give those out?), how much would you be willing to pay?
I'm not sure how relevant the cost would be but more so the total you would pay. 5 tickets for 2 bucks vs 1 ticket for 10 bucks.
3. Do you have any better ideas?
Killing
1. Where does Cbear and ruwin get all their free shit? Is there a free shit tree where free shit grows that I have not heard of?
Cbear gets his stuff from people that want to give it to him.
[quote=Killing]
1. Where does Cbear and ruwin get all their free shit? Is there a free shit tree where free shit grows that I have not heard of?
[/quote]
Cbear gets his stuff from people that want to give it to him.
1. Where does Cbear and ruwin get all their free shit? Is there a free shit tree where free shit grows that I have not heard of?
[/quote]
Cbear gets his stuff from people that want to give it to him.
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