if you wanna test koth_warmfront alongside these I know hooky updated that to a3 (though i'm not sure what the last version we tested is so...)

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/31103105/Maps/koth_warmfront_a3.bsp.bz2 if you want the link again

Spotify unlimited for albums I haven't bought yet and a variety of different programs for ones I have. iPod for when I'm outside.
And of course an old record player for the dweeb in me that likes to go out and buy vinyls of my favorite albums. I can't get enough of that.

Ran through this one too (two!). Got some stuff for you, and yes, no screenshots. Sorry, you'll just have to interpret.

1. Your doorways feel too small. They should probably be at least 192 units high, that's a comfortable height. Yours feel like 168 or something shorter.

2. The sightline on B over the catwalk from the BLU exit door to the RED shutter door should be blocked. It will serve to mush any push BLU wants to have out of the door if they push without über.

3. A little more height difference please for the flat land in the RED building behind B and its catwalk that is the exact height as it. Look at GPit, its catwalks are varying heights and are interesting.

4. Fix yo missing textures.

5. B has no tertiary entrance from A for BLU, besides heading straight through spawn. This might not be a problem but is something to think about, as it isolates the points quite a bit.

6. BLU's routes leading up to A are very complex and almost unnecessarily varied. The height is all over the place with no clear direction, and the point is almost a U-turn from the direction you're sent initially.

7. Please use something other than those 2fort sniper fences for your barricades. Do something different, or varied. It would look nicer, and those things are really enormous anyways.

8. After investigating the routes, an iron man defense seems near impossible. This might not be a bad thing. It's just something to think about, as B is so off the beaten path and most of the paths exist between A and C.

9. Routes between A and C can get quite complex and all over the place, especially inside the building. The one-way drop on the right (RED-perspective) of C seems overpowered towards BLU.

10. C in general seems tricky to hold. BLU gets so many advantages. Give RED a few more, like spawn door protection and a few excellent sentry spots. Don't be afraid to make it hard to push like GPit's C, because one successful push is all a team will need to win the round.

11. You use a lot of shutter doors. Like, a LOT of shutter doors. I won't compare it with Edifice any more than this, but Edifice had only 4 shutter doors. All of them were in spawn. They are not a good thing and make routes unnecessarily chokey.

12. If BLU tries to leave A through the door far on the right, they're faced with a U-turn and a bridge where only jumping classes can get up towards C.

13. The one-way route also seems like it gives much too big of an advantage to BLU.

All in all, seems like an interesting map. It's small and also seems like it is hard for RED to hold, though. Here's to seeing the next fixed-textures version tested, hope it goes well.
If you need any help with A/D maps just ask me. I've had good and bad experiences with Edifice alike. The community is not kind towards them, trust me. Just take it easy and make tons of changes, maybe you can do something I failed to do with Edifice. Cheers.

Okay. I ran around. I noticed a few things that you should probably fix before this can get decent tests. I have no screenshots, so I will try to describe it the best I can.

1. The entire map renders at once, due to you not compiling with full vvis. You should absolutely recompile with vvis on, as it lags my computer to even run this much at once. Nothing is optimized at all due to this, so you should probably fix that.

2. Another thing is that on last, a demo can stand in either spawn door, even NEXT to the resupply cabinet, and directly spam stickies ONTO point. Put some sort of blocking area/zone/wall, something... no map in the ESEA rotation lets this happen, for good reason. Moving on...

3. The glass that you use doesn't look like it even exists from a distance, which is very, very confusing, especially in that entrance into last. I tried jumping through it numerous times as soldier before I realized it was actually glass and not an invisible wall.

4. I don't think you need the two shutter doors on the glass entrance into last either, makes it difficult to push in without immediately using über, guaranteed.

5. The right entrance to last (relative to initial spawns) seems much too open and doesn't seem like it would provide enough of a buffer between last and lobby.

6. The stair models in lobby are much too small, as well. Those were made for 2fort, just make your own brush-based stairs, at least three times thicker than those to provide for more traffic and a better flow.

7. Having second face towards last, not towards mid or just perpendicular to the line of the points seems counter intuitive, and feels like it breaks the flow of the map, particularly when pushing from mid to second. It's not the best fighting ground, and definitely feels like you're fighting over the ground in front of the point instead of the point itself.

8. Also stop using models for stairs. That weird double-model staircase on the left entrance to mid could easily be made with brushes, and made to fit exactly the space you desire.

9. The curved ramp down on the left side of mid is also odd, feels like it is cumbersome and could be easily replaced with a more efficient layout.

10. Mid also feels flat, and there are no entrances onto mid from second that would provide the attacking team the height advantage they would need to push that raised point. Either add an upper entrance like Granary has, or lower the point to ground level to null out the huge height advantage that mid gives to whomever's holding it.

11. There's also a couple sight lines on the map, one on the dirt path from second to mid, one in the sewer to last, one on mid. I can't take pictures right now, but whenever I can I'll try to. No guarantee anytime soon, though.

12. All in all, the map feels flat, which isn't necessarily a bad thing (Granary is pretty flat) although it lacks the interesting height variation that Granary has. Play around with displacements and more complicated routes, but don't go crazy, and try to make what you've got a bit smaller (especially mid.)

Seems like a decent start, like to see where you go with this.

thank you for confirming my beliefs, atmo. thank goodness last is the most simple place to redesign (since i didn't detail it too much), it won't take too long when i actually go back to it. i'll move stuff around and delete some props, trying to simplify the area... maybe open up the area to the right of point or back the point itself up to give more space.

yeah, i need a break. see you in a few weeks, then. i'll still reply to comments but i won't be posting any new versions until at least this month is over. i recommend using the time to test and find other flaws with the map. i need some time to just get other parts of my life under control and to calm my mind down. thanks. i might not be on steam for awhile. just post stuff here/pm me here if you want to talk.

the reason i haven't replaced them is i honestly have no idea what would be a better replacement. removing them is not an option. i'm up for ideas but i'm not about to invest even more hours than i already am planning out something that might not even end up being a problem with the map once people learn rollouts+positioning.

for one thing that picture is of grass that's rendering on one half of mid. no, you can't see the majority of objects on the opponent's second even from your second, i've tested. yes there are spots where things appear and i will have to attempt to fix them but i can't guarantee i can within a reasonable timespan.
the issue is not because of tall structures but because of low structures. my buildings are short and have open air above them that causes long LoSs in places that make you see lots of the other tall structures from many points in the map, like the lighthouses and the church-mid.
i have done as much as i can with the logistics of func_detailing but hint brushes are something i could think of working more with, i have already placed a lot in places but it's something, i guess.

looking ahead for b2:

- simplification of ground+wall geometry. generally making everything 'flatter' and hopefully smoothing everything out.

- make last bigger/more spacious on right! that's funny! i was told in previous versions with nearly the exact same geometry that last was too big! idk man maybe adding props made it feel different.

- definitely opening up some of the areas on second, trying to make it feel flatter and more simplified.

- simplifying prop usage

- generally leaving mid alone

- working a bit on last transitions. something has to be done with the sewer entrance i guess.

- detailing? any of ya getting framerate issues?

- tryin to get more pugs. idk. some people complain a lot about things that could be easily countered with more gamesense in the map itself but other people bring up really good feedback points. it's hard to find testing but i'll take what i can get.

- ugh i'm sorry this project has been consuming my life for the last three weeks and it's not been helping my already downhill mood please don't yell at me if it takes another three to get the next version out...

and here's a good question for when you want to critique the map:
ask yourself this: "Is this map worthy of being in the next season of ESEA?"
if no, tell me why! that's pretty simple!

much love you guys who help me with releasing+reevaluating+reediting. godspeed.

don't you worry droidy i will get that fixed up on every door for next version, and may or may not release it as b1a in the next few days with minor changes including that one and ones previously mentioned

if ya guys got any other suggestions/bugs throw em at me so i can fix em (you guys are super awesome)

this looks interesting, although the third screenshot looks really bare, flat and open; as well as much of the map, maybe go more variable with displacements for the ground idk that might be against what you're trying to do (the map overall seems pretty cool though)
i don't know if having the points on those little raised platforms will do good for splash damage/easy manouvering around the point
also be warned that soldiers will use/exploit that water to make huge rocket jumps out of it

i will download and run around in it to give better feedback

for the first one: there actually are signs, they're just overlays and you have them disabled in your config
for the second one: i will fix that, there isn't a light in the doorway like the opposite one
for the third one: ok i will flatten that out
for the fourth one: yes that is a spot
for the fifth one: i will figure something out for that

It's good that someone brought up this question. Being the map maker, and being experienced with making multiple different maps of varying environments, I feel like this is absolutely an issue I have to address, and an issue I have been considering since the start.

Let me begin with an explanation of what I wanted to do with the map. Sunshine is most likely going to be my final mapping project I work on for at least the next few months, as my workload is growing and I'm finding other interests that I want to sink time into besides mapping. As a result, I tested the map vigorously and wanted to try something that very few other mappers have tried: the maritime theme.

The theme itself is inherently busy, with a lot of brick textures and custom props that aren't default with TF2. Whether this is a problem or not is up to the players, but I personally recognize the business of some of these textures and I know exactly what you mean by this.

I will try my best to alleviate the problems you may have. I already plan en enormous clipping and blockbulleting pass for b2, in order to make the map less "catchy" and provide a better playing environment.

I will not, however, be making this map use any more concrete than it already does. I understand the positives of detailing in a sparse and simple concrete theme, as it is by far the easiest theme to detail and provides the most streamlined environment for play.

My problem with it is that it is very, very boring, and has been done many times. Metalworks is probably the most boring and plain ESEA map, due to its abundance of bland, grey textures. This is exactly what I don't like doing - making a map boring, under-reaching on its visuals. Unlike Scorpio, visual detailing is my favorite part of the entire mapping process, and I dedicate lots of time to making sure my maps look nice. Whether this is a detriment to the maps' chances of being in ESEA is up to you, but all I gotta say is that boring and bland detailing does, in fact, have impact on how the players feel when they play the map - as well as happy, bright detailing like I planned on Sunshine.

At the end of it all, I recognize and have been addressing the problems skeej and trog brought up. It is indeed a problem, and if you could maybe point out more textures you think are busy, that'd be great. I will try to tone down on prop usage in areas that aren't visually important as well. The doorways were a purely visual thing and most likely they'll be clipped off, block bulleted and/or simplified.

Thanks for the feedback!

cp_sunshine_b1 released!

DOWNLOAD (DROPBOX I'M SORRY!) https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/84556731/sunshine/cp_sunshine_b1.bsp.bz2

MEDIAFIRE DOWNLOAD http://www.mediafire.com/download/g955q660allnpnk/cp_sunshine_b1.bsp.bz2

If there are any problems at all that impact the play of the map, such as exploits, clipping errors or missing textures, please report them! Otherwise, have fun!

Yeah, there are probably a ton of little things that are a tad bit screwy - I just wanted this out the door tonight, though, and with all the problems packing I just decided to release what I got. Hopefully this'll be enough to satisfy, for now.

Thanks to nightwatch, benroads and obsidiian for helping with the damned packing. Couldn't have done it without you guys.

CHANGELOG:
- Detailed the entire map
- Rearranged various health pickups
- Added gully-like 'secret' area to last
- Expanded platform on side of last
- Changed geometry of lots of areas in general
- Tons of custom content (and deer)!

Screenshots:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/84556731/sunshine/2013-11-11_00004.jpg

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/84556731/sunshine/2013-11-11_00005.jpg

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/84556731/sunshine/2013-11-11_00006.jpg

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/84556731/sunshine/2013-11-11_00007.jpg

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/84556731/sunshine/2013-11-11_00009.jpg

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/84556731/sunshine/2013-11-11_00010.jpg

what should i put it on then because dropbox is what i'm used to using

i'm sorry
valve apparently broke all the easy and simple ways that i'm used to packing the custom content with (i haven't packed in 3 weeks so i didn't know that was a thing) and now i'm scrambling around trying to figure out how to pack the custom content into it aaaaa

technical difficulties guys, i've spent the last 2 hours trying to figure this out and it's been real difficult especially when compile times are 20min+ each,
i want to say i'll have it done in the next hour but i can't guarantee anything

gg valve, gg source engine

tonight, by 7pm EST the latest!!!
get hyped